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  • quick question

    OK, some searching here on the board shows me this is an infamous topic so let me say up front I'm just looking for an explainer as a newb rider. Hopefully no bottles need be opened for that...

    What exactly is Parelli and 'natural horsemanship'? Just in a nutshell, what is it? Clearly it isn't liked around here and I didn't start this to argue it's merits. Just to find out what it is without having to read their materials.

    This weekend the wife and I went to look at a potential lease horse so I could get some saddle time and we met a really beautiful but amazingly spoiled horse. My wife was longeing him and he bucked when asked to trot, then did a threat-display kick in her direction. The owner said she uses 'natural horsemanship' and Parelli. Said something about a carrot stick.

    Any go I was unimpressed to say the least. She did offer to free lease him to my wife so he could be trained to finally be rideable.

    What is NH supposed to be, and does it involve letting the horse always have their way?

  • #2
    NH is a huge umbrella term that encompasses everything from commonsense training that's based on what's known about natural horse behavior/herd dynamics, to gimmicky brand name techniques like Parelli and various other high-profile practitioners of differing levels of...efficacy? Sanity?

    I think Parelli might be the biggest brand name out there.
    Proud Member Of The Lady Mafia

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      There are plenty of nuts out there in dog training, which is where I come to horses from. Lot's of good (and bad, and awful) ideas about pack mentality.

      Carrot and stick - I know them.

      The carrot stick - that was a head scratcher.

      Comment


      • #4
        It's like an orange lunge whip, kind of, but stiffer. So I've read. Carrot because orange. Stick because stick.
        Proud Member Of The Lady Mafia

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          Well, the description I got of the horses temperament was that it "tried to eat the plastic bag at the end of the carrot stick when we were testing his sensitivity". I guess he wasn't very sensitive.

          Comment


          • #6
            Sensitivity, or Horsenality? Parelli horses can be categorized into Horsenalities!
            Proud Member Of The Lady Mafia

            Comment


            • #7
              The Parelli's are far and away the most successful teachers of separating soft hearted people from their hard earned money.
              "I'm not strange, weird, off, nor crazy. My reality is just different from yours."
              ~Lewis Carroll

              Comment


              • #8
                It's called a carrot stick because it is used to both reward and put pressure (punish is a bad work in NH) on the horse.
                "I am sorry, I lead a bit of a complex life, things don't always happen in the right order" The Doctor

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Coanteen View Post
                  Sensitivity, or Horsenality? Parelli horses can be categorized into Horsenalities!
                  Holy crap, I googled that and it's actually used. It's like a MMPI for horses. Wow.

                  It's a shame. The owner lady was a very nice sweet person. I assumed she was misapplying a mainstream technique till I started looking this up and saw some of the previous threads.

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Paks View Post
                    It's called a carrot stick because it is used to both reward and put pressure (punish is a bad work in NH) on the horse.
                    In dog land also. Hunters using e collars often say pressure too now to avoid drama.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Please...do not drink the koolaid
                      the NOT!! Spoiled!! Arabian Protectavest poster pony lives on in my heart

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by wrybosome View Post
                        does it involve letting the horse always have their way?
                        No, it doesn't as properly taught. You remind me of a friend, riding with a Parelli practitioner, whose horse just decided to lie down while they were moseying along on the trail. The rider shrieked and screamed and said 'oh, help, what do I do?' Friend got off her horse, booted the recumbent nag in the butt, and he promptly got up. The 'P' fan was 'shocked' at the 'violence,' and my friend said well, you asked for my help, and the horse is now standing, isn't he?

                        A big part of the problem is that the target demographic for the P's especially (it seems) is middle aged women with no prior horse experience. Customers who are afraid to ride but can get into playing games and buying the trainer's 'must have' equipment.

                        I like Buck Brannaman, myself (who really, really dislikes the term 'natural horsemanship'). And there are a few others among the 'famous' that are decent. But your experience pretty much matches mine, except for friends and acquaintances who already had a good bit of knowledge, who can look at Parelli or anyone else and sensibly use or adapt what they see that will work in their own toolbox.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Carrot sticks were covered on Saturday morning cartoons
                          http://i.stack.imgur.com/Ie2uP.gif

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I second the recommendation to look at Buck Brannaman to see a more sensible application of that genre of training techniques (sans the cult-like trappings and incessant product placement. The documentary "Buck" is really, really good, worth seeking out on Netflix.

                            Any training method is only as good as the person using it. A good trainer could surely turn out a very nice horse using PP's methods -- but she or he would produce a nice horse using any number of training methodologies. It's the trainer and not the system. PP preys on novices, esp. emotionally needy types who feel validated by having a quasi-mystical "connection" with their horse's spirit. Unsurprisingly, these people are not turning out very good horses.
                            Last edited by HungarianHippo; Jul. 21, 2014, 11:04 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Beverley View Post
                              I like Buck Brannaman, myself (who really, really dislikes the term 'natural horsemanship'). And there are a few others among the 'famous' that are decent.
                              I like Buck Brannaman. I also like Monty Roberts quite a bit, although my instructor HATES him. (We love to razz each other about it, so it's all good. )

                              If you're into dogs then you're probably already good with animals. I've learned that horses have a MUCH different way of viewing the world than dogs do though (being prey as opposed to predators). I've had to learn to assert myself more "quietly" with them, if that makes any sense.

                              I think when it comes to this stuff you just need to trust your gut. If something feels right, great! But if something seems "off," it probably is.
                              Last edited by Gidget; Jul. 23, 2014, 06:12 PM. Reason: typo

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Buck Brannaman has already been recommended. Warwick Schiller is another one I would recommend. He has some videos on youtube that are worth watching. Both are exceptional horsemen that seek to teach and create horsemen, not just sell a bunch of product to unsuspecting newbies.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Buck Brannaman is the real deal, and so are the people that follow him -I do not usually use Monty Roberts in the same sentence.
                                  Proud member of People Who Hate to Kill Wildlife clique

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by Foxtrot's View Post
                                    Buck Brannaman is the real deal, and so are the people that follow him -I do not usually use Monty Roberts in the same sentence.
                                    Agree- I once saw a video of Roberts where the horse was "a wild previously untouched by human hands filly". With sparkling white socks and a beautifully brushed out tail.

                                    Comment

                                    • Original Poster

                                      #19
                                      Thanks for the recommendation, I watched Buck last night. Interesting stuff.

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