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Paying someone to hit your horse in the face!? Training?

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  • #21
    There are a few NH type trainers that I respect. I have seen them hit a horse in the face with the flag or bump them seriously with the halter, but it was for a reason. It would never be "practiced" and in fact I sort of abandoned the self-training aspect of these trainers when I realized that my whole problem was that I didn't know what was appropriate when! So I'd have no trouble sending a horse to one of these (select) trainers, and I'd ride in a clinic with one, but no way do I think it's something you can learn that way.

    I had a young horse, draft cross, that I spoiled unintentionally. I think she was dealt with fairly severely to stop what I had started. She doesn't run me over any more. You've got to have FEEL though. If you don't do it right, and at the right time, it IS abuse. And if you are conducting a clinic where the majority of the students end up whacking their horses in the face, you're doing something wrong.
    Shall I tell you what I find beautiful about you? You are at your very best when things are worst.
    Starman

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    • #22
      I guess they all like head shy horses? I don't like anyone hitting a horse in the face since if the eyes are damaged, the horse can end of blind.

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      • Original Poster

        #23
        Originally posted by Aggie4Bar View Post
        So what was the point of hitting the horse in the face with a flag? Was there some specific objective?
        I'll be damned if I can figure out what his schtick was meant to do....I think it was a macho problem and making the horse crumble to his will. His students hung on his words for 8 hours each day...with a one hour break for lunch. No horses were untacked all day long, even when they were tied to trailers during lunch. Even more telling, the students sat on their horses during the hours of "wisdom". Nice for the horse's back. Very sad...I wouldn't let my students just sit on their horses during shows, "give em' a break!", GET OFF! Your horse isn't a couch.

        This trainer was quite insulting if you didn't see training his way and made comments about ignorant riders (he really had a thing against women and dressage).

        I'm a guy, I'll protect my horses from anyone who even thinks about hurting one. I knocked one jerk on his butt when he grabbed my aforementioned big Shire mare and he took a handfull of feather to pick her foot up. A lot of profanity followed...how dare he touch my horse and cause her pain! I just showed up at this disaster to check on my guy and stick a few apples in his face...and to make sure my saddle was still there. went to get a donut in the lounge and saw this stupidity going on. Very pathetic and a true lack of horsemanship and no love of one's horse...hell, any horse. It's why I wasn't quietly watching but being a heathen.
        "Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc"

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        • #24
          Care to tell who the asshat was?
          America dialed 911. Donald Trump answered the phone.

          Stop pumping money into colleges and start getting ready to earn money in the projected tradesman shortage of 2024. Make Trades Great Again!

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          • #25
            Originally posted by Bluey View Post
            Well, you can see where that started, when you see the old Parelli 7 games videos that started much of this.

            Yes, I did mention that to them and the response, mind you that was decades ago now, was that you start rough and finesse is learned all along and comes in the later levels.

            Why not start teaching right from the start, why start with the roughness, that should never be there to start with, if the training is done right?

            One of the things that has made my life so much easier, with horses and sometimes without, is to offer the best deal or lightest feel first. Always. I first heard it from Buck Brannaman some years back, I think he heard it from Ray Hunt. It clicked and it is the most awesome way to do things.

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            • #26
              Originally posted by JoZ View Post
              There are a few NH type trainers that I respect. I have seen them hit a horse in the face with the flag or bump them seriously with the halter, but it was for a reason.
              There are times when smacking a horse's face with your hand is quite appropriate, mainly when they're being disrespectful. I don't see a reason to hit a horse in the face with ANY object, unless you feel your safety is at risk. Even then, I would much rather apply a kick or a knee to the belly - it gets the point across and there's no chance to cause any actual damage, even by accident.
              Yes, I smell like a horse. No, I don't consider that to be a problem.

              Originally posted by DottieHQ
              You're just jealous because you lack my extensive koalafications.

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              • #27
                I wish you had taken a quick video so we could know exactly what we're reacting too.
                I have a Fjord! Life With Oden

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                • Original Poster

                  #28
                  Originally posted by Cindyg View Post
                  I wish you had taken a quick video so we could know exactly what we're reacting too.
                  I won't give the guys name...don't want to start problems for the barn owner. The "act" people are reacting to is very simple. This cowboy-hatted idiot had a long crop with a flag on the end (they made fun of people with plastic bags on the end of a lunge whip as clueless...but had his own "speshul" technique training aid with a flag...big difference. Anyway, he was happily hitting a horse with his speshul stick in the face, the eyes, the neck etc. The horse hadn't done anything (e.g. biting/striking out with teeth exposed) and this was the technique for breaking a horse....hit it in the face. All the while, the Kool Aid minions sat on their horses and nodded at the sage's wisdom and abusive techniques.
                  "Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc"

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                  • #29
                    I liked the Kool Aid people better when they were just role playing with their toy horses...
                    Yes, I smell like a horse. No, I don't consider that to be a problem.

                    Originally posted by DottieHQ
                    You're just jealous because you lack my extensive koalafications.

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                    • #30
                      I am totally clueless as to what possible purpose this "technique" has.
                      The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                      H. Cate

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                      • #31
                        Originally posted by Trakehner View Post
                        I won't give the guys name...don't want to start problems for the barn owner. The "act" people are reacting to is very simple. This cowboy-hatted idiot had a long crop with a flag on the end (they made fun of people with plastic bags on the end of a lunge whip as clueless...but had his own "speshul" technique training aid with a flag...big difference. Anyway, he was happily hitting a horse with his speshul stick in the face, the eyes, the neck etc. The horse hadn't done anything (e.g. biting/striking out with teeth exposed) and this was the technique for breaking a horse....hit it in the face. All the while, the Kool Aid minions sat on their horses and nodded at the sage's wisdom and abusive techniques.
                        Sounds like the barn owner could use a few people problems before all the horses become problems.
                        America dialed 911. Donald Trump answered the phone.

                        Stop pumping money into colleges and start getting ready to earn money in the projected tradesman shortage of 2024. Make Trades Great Again!

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                        • #32
                          Originally posted by JGHIRETIRE View Post
                          I am totally clueless as to what possible purpose this "technique" has.
                          In my opinion? To weed out the people in the crowd who might not be able to be suckered in for more abusive training and spehshul goodies only HE can provide.
                          America dialed 911. Donald Trump answered the phone.

                          Stop pumping money into colleges and start getting ready to earn money in the projected tradesman shortage of 2024. Make Trades Great Again!

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                          • Original Poster

                            #33
                            Originally posted by RubyTuesday View Post
                            In my opinion? To weed out the people in the crowd who might not be able to be suckered in for more abusive training and spehshul goodies only HE can provide.
                            Hmmm...don't know if the guy had a speshul sale on his training stuff or even a video...I was very sad to see all these people willing to hurt their horse because he said to and fitting in with group-think. There were no boarders attending his clinic...a bunch actually from out of town. Amazing. Only saw one english saddle, all western stuff and "wanna-be's", lots of appys and QH looking horses.

                            Glad he's gone, they left the barn a mess...no surprise there.
                            "Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc"

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                            • #34
                              Originally posted by Trakehner View Post
                              /Guano Pony Boy magikal stuff.
                              BWHAHAHAHA
                              If i'm posting on Coth, it's either raining so I can't ride or it's night time and I can't sleep.

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                              • #35
                                Trakehner, do you think the trainer's actual goal was to punish the horse, make the horse do something, or desensitize the horse?
                                I have a Fjord! Life With Oden

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                                • #36
                                  That Linda Parelli video made me angry. I'm not a trainer and would never pretend to be one, although apparently I could make big bucks faking it. I hope she comes to me for a mammogram. I'll be sure to squeeze her in tight and smack her in the face with a women's magazine.

                                  Groundwork is not my thing, and I will admit it. But I know there's more to it than wildy flailing a rope around or shaking a flag at a horse, or smacking him with it. The horse in the Parelli video is extremely tolerant. My Morabs would not have put up with that.

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                                  • #37
                                    Brings to mind the quote:

                                    "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

                                    Voltaire
                                    "When life gives you scurvy, make lemonade."

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                                    • #38
                                      By any chance was this "trainer" out of Tennessee?
                                      Originally posted by Trakehner View Post
                                      I won't give the guys name...don't want to start problems for the barn owner. The "act" people are reacting to is very simple. This cowboy-hatted idiot had a long crop with a flag on the end (they made fun of people with plastic bags on the end of a lunge whip as clueless...but had his own "speshul" technique training aid with a flag...big difference. Anyway, he was happily hitting a horse with his speshul stick in the face, the eyes, the neck etc. The horse hadn't done anything (e.g. biting/striking out with teeth exposed) and this was the technique for breaking a horse....hit it in the face. All the while, the Kool Aid minions sat on their horses and nodded at the sage's wisdom and abusive techniques.
                                      Be kind to the animals for they are the True Innocents!
                                      True Innocents Equine Rescue: www.tierrescue.org
                                      Join us on Facebook!

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                                      • #39
                                        I'm quite sure Trak made his views heard - in an unambiguous way!

                                        Horse training starts with trust.

                                        Hunt horses handle whips all around them, working cow horses do, too, with ropes, but hopefully not after being treated like this yahoo.

                                        Poor horses.
                                        Proud member of People Who Hate to Kill Wildlife clique

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                                        • #40
                                          Originally posted by cloudy18 View Post
                                          I hope she comes to me for a mammogram. I'll be sure to squeeze her in tight and smack her in the face with a women's magazine.
                                          Best. Line. Ever.
                                          Shall I tell you what I find beautiful about you? You are at your very best when things are worst.
                                          Starman

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