• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

This is a post from a COTH member and it would destroy the horse industry

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • This is a post from a COTH member and it would destroy the horse industry

    It would be in violation of the Constitution...but ya have to laugh at the young lady (whos Mom was with PETA and is a total self confessed vegan) who does not understand RIGHTS

    Is this due to the education system?
    Do others think this way?

    Here it is..and I am reprinting it because I believe it is a dangerous path..but one that THIS poster actually believes is a solution.



    Well jenm, that doesn't seem very fair considering the fact that no one on the ban everything side was willing to brainstorm my way. But, since I'm not necessarily the type to cry foul and take my toys home, here are some off the cuff thoughts:

    Breeding: in order to further the quality of the American horses while ensuring that every horse has a home, we could institute rigorous in-utero testing of the resultant mix of genes to see if it is exactly what we want. If not, the foal is pinched off or aborted at an early stage. We'd have to do a lot of research into how those genes manifest, and that doesn't necessarily account for personality, so breeders would need to be willing to euthanize at any moment when a horse is not amateur friendly or develops an environmental issue or other injury, as one would not be able to be sure that a horse would end up in amateur hands.

    We could institute breeding licenses, and anyone found breeding horses without one would face the possibility of jail and the horses immediately euthanized.

    Racehorses could be immediately euthanized when they were done at the track unless inspected to be "genetically superior" or "perfect for an amateur" in which case they would be placed with an adopter that had been fully vetted.

    We could require that each horse owner have land to bury old horses on, and that the horse be euthanized on the property when it's useful life is over. You'd have to fund some sort of inspector so that you could be sure it wasn't sold to a black market abbatoir, operating illegally. They'd have to see proof of ownership and they would track where each horse goes.

    The Amish would have to leave the country. I don't see many solutions for them unless the government subsidized large farms where the Amish horses could go to retire.

    We could, if we did the above, institute zoo ranges or hunting where those well fed horses are "taken care of".

    We could make every horse owner support 1/9 of an unwanted horse via an equine tax. That would work out to about $50 per year per horse. Not sure what we'd do with those horses. Suppose they could live out their lives on large farms out west. But then we'd have to pay for labor and "opportunity cost" on the land, so that would cost more. Let's say $100 per horse per owner.

    We could require anyone who wants to be a horse owner to take lessons, be certified and have their facilities inspected quarterly for any type of neglect or subpar feeding. This would also ensure that the horses stayed where they were supposed to be.

    We could require that all horses be microchipped and their movements tracked by a giant database. If a horse ceases to move for awhile, crosses a border and doesn't come back, we could immediately dispatch a humane officer to the owner's last known location.

    I have to throw my horses some more hay. But these are some initial thoughts. Now remember, in brainstorming you aren't supposed to shoot down any ideas at first, but instead to contribute your own. Since I've been so kind as to provide my solutions, howabout you play the game my way and answer my original questions - then you are welcome to chip in and add to my list.
    The Elephant in the room

  • #2
    Originally posted by Fairfax View Post
    It would be in violation of the Constitution...but ya have to laugh at the young lady (whos Mom was with PETA and is a total self confessed vegan) who does not understand RIGHTS

    Is this due to the education system?
    Do others think this way?

    Here it is..and I am reprinting it because I believe it is a dangerous path..but one that THIS poster actually believes is a solution.



    Well jenm, that doesn't seem very fair considering the fact that no one on the ban everything side was willing to brainstorm my way. But, since I'm not necessarily the type to cry foul and take my toys home, here are some off the cuff thoughts:

    Breeding: in order to further the quality of the American horses while ensuring that every horse has a home, we could institute rigorous in-utero testing of the resultant mix of genes to see if it is exactly what we want. If not, the foal is pinched off or aborted at an early stage. We'd have to do a lot of research into how those genes manifest, and that doesn't necessarily account for personality, so breeders would need to be willing to euthanize at any moment when a horse is not amateur friendly or develops an environmental issue or other injury, as one would not be able to be sure that a horse would end up in amateur hands.

    We could institute breeding licenses, and anyone found breeding horses without one would face the possibility of jail and the horses immediately euthanized.

    Racehorses could be immediately euthanized when they were done at the track unless inspected to be "genetically superior" or "perfect for an amateur" in which case they would be placed with an adopter that had been fully vetted.

    We could require that each horse owner have land to bury old horses on, and that the horse be euthanized on the property when it's useful life is over. You'd have to fund some sort of inspector so that you could be sure it wasn't sold to a black market abbatoir, operating illegally. They'd have to see proof of ownership and they would track where each horse goes.

    The Amish would have to leave the country. I don't see many solutions for them unless the government subsidized large farms where the Amish horses could go to retire.

    We could, if we did the above, institute zoo ranges or hunting where those well fed horses are "taken care of".

    We could make every horse owner support 1/9 of an unwanted horse via an equine tax. That would work out to about $50 per year per horse. Not sure what we'd do with those horses. Suppose they could live out their lives on large farms out west. But then we'd have to pay for labor and "opportunity cost" on the land, so that would cost more. Let's say $100 per horse per owner.

    We could require anyone who wants to be a horse owner to take lessons, be certified and have their facilities inspected quarterly for any type of neglect or subpar feeding. This would also ensure that the horses stayed where they were supposed to be.

    We could require that all horses be microchipped and their movements tracked by a giant database. If a horse ceases to move for awhile, crosses a border and doesn't come back, we could immediately dispatch a humane officer to the owner's last known location.

    I have to throw my horses some more hay. But these are some initial thoughts. Now remember, in brainstorming you aren't supposed to shoot down any ideas at first, but instead to contribute your own. Since I've been so kind as to provide my solutions, howabout you play the game my way and answer my original questions - then you are welcome to chip in and add to my list.
    Where did this come from?

    Comment


    • #3
      Is she joking???
      Impossible is nothing.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by chillydc View Post
        Is she joking???
        I can think of no other answer, especially when I got to the line about the Amish having to leave the country.

        Comment


        • #5
          Obviously a joke.
          What's wrong with you?? Your cheese done slid off its cracker?!?!

          Comment


          • #6
            Coming to that message with ONLY logic, the solutions, outrageous as they look, are legitimate suggestions. Of course, impossible to make into laws given the Constitution etc etc, nearly impossible to enforce, not very realistic given human nature ... but taking out all those limitations, I can see the thread of simple cause/effect.

            However, [re: We could institute breeding licenses, and anyone found breeding horses without one would face the possibility of jail and the horses immediately euthanized] my dark side takes over and thinks "hmn ... we'll need bigger sewer drains than China"
            *=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=

            Comment


            • #7
              Just another attempt at pot stirring. It's best to ignore.

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #8
                No..she is very serious that these are discussable alternatives ..ALTERNATIVES to slaughter

                Does she believe in them..I do not know..but her Mom was very involved with PETA

                This is on the Slaughter thread regarding Canada.

                She presents herself as a compassionate young lady..respectful and thoughtful

                and I am sure deport the Amish was a tongue in cheek..or was it?

                Not that it was doable.. but that it was considered..and presented..as an alternative solution

                Sadly, this is indicative of how people regard ownership of property..and rights.
                The Elephant in the room

                Comment


                • #9
                  You're a dirty piece of work, Fairfax, to harangue and harass. As she said, and she's right, the rule in Brainstorming is to throw out ideas, no matter how outrageous, and once there are a bunch on the table, you examine each idea and throw out the dumb ones. Yes, she has a few real stinkers here -- let's hope some were in the vein of A Modest Proposal. Why don't you "play the game," and contribute rather than set a bait trap and start shooting?

                  But these are some initial thoughts. Now remember, in brainstorming you aren't supposed to shoot down any ideas at first, but instead to contribute your own. Since I've been so kind as to provide my solutions, howabout you play the game my way and answer my original questions - then you are welcome to chip in and add to my list.
                  "Random capitAlization really Makes my day." -- AndNirina

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Fairfax View Post
                    No..she is very serious that these are discussable alternatives ..ALTERNATIVES to slaughter

                    Does she believe in them..I do not know..but her Mom was very involved with PETA

                    This is on the Slaughter thread regarding Canada.

                    She presents herself as a compassionate young lady..respectful and thoughtful

                    and I am sure deport the Amish was a tongue in cheek..or was it?

                    Not that it was doable.. but that it was considered..and presented..as an alternative solution

                    Sadly, this is indicative of how people regard ownership of property..and rights.
                    Son, I think you have been had.

                    But I do agree, putting the idea of 'regulating the breeders' into words like this, you know, how some have demanded in the past, it makes it painfully obvious where such regulations would lead.

                    Just a thought in passing: if 1% of the total horse population go for meat (for human consumption), I do believe we are far from 'over breeding'. The department for labor considers 4% unemployment rates as full employment.

                    Just saying.

                    But I believe the above statement - I laughed at the original - is driving the point home rather eloquently: It IS communism, it would never fly in the US....even the most pacifistic breeder would be offended. of course, I am sure the usual suspects will pop up and claim it as the next best thing since bute...


                    But yeah, I am thinking it's a provocative suggestion.
                    Originally posted by BigMama1
                    Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
                    GNU Terry Prachett

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I can't understand, for the life of me, how Fairfax gets away with it. Others have been banned for less.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by LauraKY View Post
                        I can't understand, for the life of me, how Fairfax gets away with it. Others have been banned for less.
                        Others are still around, having done worse. Deal with it.
                        Originally posted by BigMama1
                        Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
                        GNU Terry Prachett

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Did we need another slaughter debate thread? Was the other one getting boring or something?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by trubandloki View Post
                            Did we need another slaughter debate thread? Was the other one getting boring or something?
                            Thank you, Voice of Reason.
                            "Random capitAlization really Makes my day." -- AndNirina

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I'm with PeteyPie. My impression was that she threw out the most outrageous suggestions to get the ball rolling and to have others try to think outside the box. Actually, I was going to throw in a few of these myself when I had a bit more time.

                              Exaggeration, distortion, omission of facts, and overall me-ism doesn't have any place here.

                              FF, you're such a fan of the slaughter industry, who not add to the list yourself? When you're not indulging yourself in the above or haranguing PETA/HSUS ad nauseum, sometimes you actually can make sense.

                              P.S. Back to the original thread.
                              Last edited by betonbill; Jun. 5, 2013, 11:19 AM. Reason: adding to above

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Oh for crissakes Fairfax.

                                Did you miss where in EVERY OTHER POST in that thread I have advocated for local plants, making the process safer and more humane?

                                Once again, what I had asked the anti-slaughter group to do was to come up with ideas that flipped the problem on it's head. To design a system as though every horse was going to be slaughtered at the end of its useful life.

                                NO ONE. Not ONE poster was willing to do so.

                                Jenm then said - ok, do it as though slaughter was banned, so I did.

                                Please note that I don't actually believe that ANY of those things should be done as I don't believe that banning slaughter is a good idea.

                                But until y'all can read for comprehension, I'm just going to stick to -

                                Y'all are freaking nuts.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by trubandloki View Post
                                  Did we need another slaughter debate thread? Was the other one getting boring or something?
                                  Agreed
                                  Horses aren't our whole life, but makes our life whole

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    I already support three "unwanted" that were on their way to be a hamburger horses. I already have enough of unresponisible peoples problems that have been fixed and are now useful riding animals. Besides that I have placed one in a safe home and put one down who was in too bad of shape to make it. I will take another in when the time is right. I think I do enough to help horses without having to pay a tax. And the Amish? Excluding people based on religion? No, not acceptable. However, we are in line to take one of our Amish neighbors retired drivers when its time. Maybe if more people did that there would be fewer in the pipeline. Maybe this young lady should start walking the walk and actually save a few if she feels so strongly, I don't like slaughter so I work to save the few I can and give them the best life possible. I hope this is a joke article though, its so extreme it almost has to be.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      IMO that post will destroy nothing.

                                      - a "total self confessed vegan"

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        I mean come on, really? You think this is going to destroy the horse community? Really? Do you honestly think any of this would happen? What's the point of the thread, really?
                                        Horses aren't our whole life, but makes our life whole

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X