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  • #21
    Too sick to comment, but not too sick to wish ill on the driver of the rig???

    Things like this happen. They are called accidents. There is no need to send bad wishes to anyone. You don't know the driver or the impact this ACCIDENT may have on him! Shame on you!
    "You can't fix stupid"- Ron White

    Comment


    • #22
      Originally posted by Anne FS View Post
      Ahhh, you're right.

      Oh, god, I hope none of those horses were stolen: https://www.harnesslink.com/www/Article.cgi?ID=95289
      Oh yes...these people in the slaughter industry are just businessmen, and really do care about animal welfare, and are honest, upstanding citizens...

      Poor horses. Godspeed.

      Comment


      • #23
        Sorry Alagirl but the people involved in this "accident" that I know of personally are absolute f**king scumbags. I have been to the farm of one of the kill buyers, Arlo Kiele, and saw horses with my OWN eyes living in double deckers waiting for his next trip to Canada...yes living in them. Several have convictions of illegal transport of horses to slaughter. This is not a witch hunt. These people will continue to operate their nasty business as long as people are willing to look the other way and just say, "it happens" or "they have to make a living" etc... Isn't it time to shut this miserable bottom feeder crap down? Have you ever been to a kill auction? Just curious. I have...Unadilla, NY...it was vile.

        How many trucks full of kill horses have to wreck, burn, overturn, be found violating humane transport laws, laws regarding health papers, or have related disasters before people figure out that they guys are totally uninterested in the welfare of the "meat horses" they are hauling? This is one HUGE reason that I cannot support horse slaughter as it is done now with horses jammed into these transports and hauled long distances. We have all these laws to "protect" horses and the authorities are absolutely unable or unwilling to do anything to stop these people from repeated breaking the laws.

        Comment


        • #24
          Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
          I would like some references and citation about the legality or lack there of.
          I wasn't stating a fact, I was basically asking a question. I can't stand reading all of the slaughter threads so I honestly don't know - is it legal to transport horses to slaughter? If not, why should they be compensated by their insurance? It wasn't legal last I knew, but again, I haven't kept up on it since it's mind numbing weeding through all of the arguments.

          Comment


          • #25
            Legal to transport but not legal to slaughter in the US. So all the trucks head to Canada or Mexico.
            Kerri

            Comment


            • #26
              Originally posted by Daydream Believer View Post
              Sorry Alagirl but the people involved in this "accident" that I know of personally are absolute f**king scumbags. I have been to the farm of one of the kill buyers, Arlo Kiele, and saw horses with my OWN eyes living in double deckers waiting for his next trip to Canada...yes living in them. Several have convictions of illegal transport of horses to slaughter. This is not a witch hunt. These people will continue to operate their nasty business as long as people are willing to look the other way and just say, "it happens" or "they have to make a living" etc... Isn't it time to shut this miserable bottom feeder crap down? Have you ever been to a kill auction? Just curious. I have...Unadilla, NY...it was vile.

              How many trucks full of kill horses have to wreck, burn, overturn, be found violating humane transport laws, laws regarding health papers, or have related disasters before people figure out that they guys are totally uninterested in the welfare of the "meat horses" they are hauling? This is one HUGE reason that I cannot support horse slaughter as it is done now with horses jammed into these transports and hauled long distances. We have all these laws to "protect" horses and the authorities are absolutely unable or unwilling to do anything to stop these people from repeated breaking the laws.
              Seriously, do google truck fires. the one in the OP didn't even make the first two pages. Yes, even bad people can have accidents that are not their fault.

              We have discussed the logistic of hauling.
              There is a way of doing things, that don't seem right to the outsider, but are essential for the safety, like keeping horses from moving around.

              There is this thing where a few people have a huge disconnect with reality: They may dislike a person's occupation, but as long as the laws are not broken there is not a lot they can do but grin and bear.

              Now, when they gt that wild hair that they need to lobby for a change, like that horses are only permitted to be hauled in a 2 horse bumper with air ride, they owe it the community to double and triple check, as to how the fallout will affect the rest of us. Because it will!
              Plenty of COTHers haul their horses in stock trailers, etc...do you want to outlaw stock trailers as legal means to transport your horse?

              origination and destination has nothing to do with the accident.
              Like I said. if the driver had said 'farm' he would have still been on the most hated list. Because nobody ever hauls more than a few horses.

              If the owner is a KB outfit...so what. Offer more money than he has invested, feed them all for the rest of their natural life.

              If the destination was the plant...same here. (and I don't mean you personally, just our usual vocal suspects) put your money were the mouth is!

              The outrage reminds me more of huffy preteens, decrying the evils of slaughter on the way to McDonalds.

              But it's Conclusion Jumping season again on COTH. Tally Ho.
              Originally posted by BigMama1
              Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
              GNU Terry Prachett

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #27
                Originally posted by cutter99 View Post
                Too sick to comment, but not too sick to wish ill on the driver of the rig???

                Things like this happen. They are called accidents. There is no need to send bad wishes to anyone. You don't know the driver or the impact this ACCIDENT may have on him! Shame on you!
                whatever.... I am not ashamed of it... any of these people sure do not deserve any sympathy from me and I do hope this will have a very strong impact on the driver... and many sleepless nights.
                My sympathy goes to the horses, not to any "human" involved.
                Sorry if that bothers you.

                Comment


                • #28
                  Looks like 30 is a magic number

                  if I really wanted to find Thoroughbreds, I needed to go to Bruce Rotz's farm in Shippensburg Pennsylvania. He told me "Rotz will take any kind of horse, he don't care what shape their in." I asked him why. He said because he has a contract with the Canadian slaughterhouse. He told me that Rotz ships three to five loads a week to Canada. I asked him how many horses in a load and he told me thirty.
                  http://www.justsaywhoa.org/FalconFury.asp

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    Well bless your heart FalseImpression! I feel very sorry for you and the lot in life you must have endured to feel this way. Again, this is a person you do not know or know nothing about. At least he is employed.

                    How would you like it if others wished the same for you?
                    Last edited by cutter99; May. 7, 2013, 04:19 PM.
                    "You can't fix stupid"- Ron White

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Originally posted by kasjordan View Post
                      Legal to transport but not legal to slaughter in the US. So all the trucks head to Canada or Mexico.
                      If only things were this simple.
                      There are various transport regs already on the books in NY state [dividers every 10' of trailer, various egress points on trailer, no DDs, etc] as well as a proposed ban on shipping through the state to slaughter that I am unsure of the status of.

                      So, sorry, but it's not that simple.
                      Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

                      http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        I don't imagine the driver of this rig that caught fire gives a rats ar$e what anyone on this forum wishes upon him
                        "Anti-intellect and marketing, pretty, pretty, who needs talent
                        Crying eyes, we're so outnumbered, fight for the right to remain silent" Buck 65

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          Yes, there are regulations- but it IS legal to transport in the US. She was questioning if it was legal.
                          Kerri

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #33
                            If I worked in this industry, I'd be prepared for any ill wishes headed my way...
                            As if I care about your opinion anyway.

                            Originally posted by cutter99 View Post
                            Well bless your heart FalseImpression! I feel very sorry for you and the lot in life you must have endured to feel this way. Again, this is a person you do not know or know nothing about. At least he is employed.

                            How would you like it if other wished the same for you?

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Originally posted by Laurierace View Post
                              Hard to imagine which is worse, dying in a trailer fire or a slaughterhouse. Godspeed.

                              You must be kidding?

                              Burning to death is a horrible and painful way to die.
                              Crammed in a truck with dozens of also burning horses; I can't imagine -!

                              And I doubt this was as fast as a bolt to the head.

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                According to the examiner article, these were Rotz's horses on the way to slaughter.

                                http://www.examiner.com/article/slau...r-trailer-fire

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  I have to agree that burning in a fire, is probably worse than the slaughter house....I mean, comparing evils . It's horrible either way, no matter where they were going.

                                  Comment

                                  • Original Poster

                                    #37
                                    At least this article is more accurate... does not promote the myth that all horses are old and sick.. I don't want to imagine the panic of these poor horses...

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      Originally posted by kasjordan View Post
                                      Yes, there are regulations- but it IS legal to transport in the US. She was questioning if it was legal.
                                      Originally posted by kasjordan View Post
                                      Legal to transport but not legal to slaughter in the US. So all the trucks head to Canada or Mexico.
                                      Well it's actually also still legal to slaughter in the US.
                                      Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

                                      http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        Originally posted by Angela Freda View Post
                                        Well it's actually also still legal to slaughter in the US.
                                        Good Lord.
                                        There are no legally opened slaughter houses in the US.
                                        It is legal to transport horses to the slaughter houses in Canada and Mexico.
                                        There are regulations regarding the transport.
                                        Good?
                                        Kerri

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          All this.Pretty much says it all.

                                          There are regulations in place. But people like this will ALWAYS find ways to get around them. They don"t care about the horses. They would not be in that business of they did - meaning the two usually don't go hand in hand.

                                          No - you can't make excuses for them.

                                          There will always be a dirty, horrid underbelly in the horse slaughter culture - it's the nature of the business. Like it or not horses in this country are considered companion animals, whether they are technically livestock or not.

                                          The slaughter culture MUST by it's nature nullify the companion animal aspect to justify the need for and acceptability of slaughter.

                                          Why is humane euthanasia (NOT SLAUGHTER) not more acceptable?

                                          We will never change everyone. There will always be people who want to dump horses. So be it. Simply stop the financial incentive to do so.

                                          I wonder if the horse slaughter advocates would be screaming necessary evil if it was such that you could take your horse to a slaughterhouse, or give him to someone to take to the slaughter house, but you received no money in return?

                                          I once spoke to a vet who was absolutely against "convenience euthanasia", but agreed that there are horses that go to slaughter that people have no other way other than euthanasia. Nice.

                                          Or how about that woman (can't remember where I saw this, sorry) who was complaining - she runs a dude ranch out west somewhere. She turns her stallions (she had a handful) out with the mares in the off season.
                                          She keeps the good babies, then sells the "culls" to slaughter to help "cover her costs" - yes, I can see how slaughter is just a necessary evil to help prevent cruelty. Please.

                                          Is it hateful? Yes. Do we wish all horses had a home? Yes. But. Better a humane death, then mass shipments over hours and days in dreadful conditions for slaughter and that culture that goes along with it.

                                          So. unfortunately, the necessary evil of humane euthanasia by a vet(be it gun or needle), or a huntsman, or other qualified individual, would seem far more acceptable than slaughter as it exists.
                                          Whew. Rant over .



                                          Originally posted by Daydream Believer View Post
                                          Sorry Alagirl but the people involved in this "accident" that I know of personally are absolute f**king scumbags. I have been to the farm of one of the kill buyers, Arlo Kiele, and saw horses with my OWN eyes living in double deckers waiting for his next trip to Canada...yes living in them. Several have convictions of illegal transport of horses to slaughter. This is not a witch hunt. These people will continue to operate their nasty business as long as people are willing to look the other way and just say, "it happens" or "they have to make a living" etc... Isn't it time to shut this miserable bottom feeder crap down? Have you ever been to a kill auction? Just curious. I have...Unadilla, NY...it was vile.

                                          How many trucks full of kill horses have to wreck, burn, overturn, be found violating humane transport laws, laws regarding health papers, or have related disasters before people figure out that they guys are totally uninterested in the welfare of the "meat horses" they are hauling? This is one HUGE reason that I cannot support horse slaughter as it is done now with horses jammed into these transports and hauled long distances. We have all these laws to "protect" horses and the authorities are absolutely unable or unwilling to do anything to stop these people from repeated breaking the laws.
                                          My big man - April 27, 1986 - September 04, 2008-
                                          You're with me every moment, my big red horse.

                                          Be kinder than necessary, for everyone is fighting a battle of some kind.

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