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After a Lull, Another Horse Is Butchered in Miami

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  • #41
    Originally posted by Fairfax View Post
    I find this rude and hurtful. Maybe the person has an alcoholic in their family and that could cause them personal pain. Perhaps this thread should be closed down and perhaps you should be given a moderator warning due to your choice of words. Worse than name calling.
    Get a grip. What does this have to do with the thread?? The person in question was yacking about fake vaginas, and has a proud to be a member of not too klassy for boxed wine in her signature.
    "Anti-intellect and marketing, pretty, pretty, who needs talent
    Crying eyes, we're so outnumbered, fight for the right to remain silent" Buck 65

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    • #42
      Oh PLEASE Fairfax - maybe we should flag this post:

      Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
      I am sure the passengers of those rides have fake vaginas at hand as well...
      But other than prejudice and such, it isn't related.
      WHAT?!?!?! What does that have to do with horses being stolen and slaughtered. What in the world is she talking about?! It is a bizarre statement - really leaves one scratching their head.

      Better start flagging posts - I am sure mine is terribly rude, and very hurtful to you. Maybe you have skeletons in the closet, or other family issues that leave you very emotional and prone to feeling hurt, therefore we should all walk on eggshells and be very careful not to hurt feelings.....
      APPSOLUTE CHOCKLATE - Photo by Kathy Colman

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      • #43
        Originally posted by Fairfax View Post
        I find this rude and hurtful. Maybe the person has an alcoholic in their family and that could cause them personal pain. Perhaps this thread should be closed down and perhaps you should be given a moderator warning due to your choice of words. Worse than name calling.
        I have an alcoholic in the family, and the only way he would ever post something about fake vaginas on a thread about horses being butchered in the owners yard, would be if he were drunk. That statement is so off the wall, and just plain wacked, that it is the only thing that makes sense. There have been many instances of "drunk posting" in the past, and it struck me as this possibly being another example.
        I didn't say "You are drunk". I asked if she was. She has posted insulting things to other people quite often. So I think if she were insulted, it would be a fake statement considering some of her other posts. You seem to being falsely offended, just to defend your slaughter cohort.
        Did you ask her if she was drunk? Maybe she was, and that would explain it. Or maybe you understand why someone would make such a weird inappropriate remark about fake vaginas on a horse thread...If so, please tell. On 2nd thought, please don't. There is no reason for a comment on a horse thread about them, period.

        Comment


        • #44
          Originally posted by Appsolute View Post
          Oh PLEASE Fairfax - maybe we should flag this post:



          WHAT?!?!?! What does that have to do with horses being stolen and slaughtered. What in the world is she talking about?! It is a bizarre statement - really leaves one scratching their head.

          Better start flagging posts - I am sure mine is terribly rude, and very hurtful to you. Maybe you have skeletons in the closet, or other family issues that leave you very emotional and prone to feeling hurt, therefore we should all walk on eggshells and be very careful not to hurt feelings.....
          It has nothing to do with the horses being stolen, it was however a remark about the off topic mentioning of 'trunking': I am sure the perpetrators get off on the knowledge of what is going on behind them...

          and trust me: You can't hurt my feelings. Not if you tried.

          Comment


          • #45
            Yes you are correct in that there is no legal market for horse meat. There is also no legal market for dog meat, if someone really wants it.
            Why do "we" as Americans have to cater to other people's tastes???
            Would India for example change its beliefs about cows???
            Somehow I don't think so.

            Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
            Except for the people stealing the horses, we are in 100% agreement.

            But hand wringing and crying won't fix the problem.

            And it serves as reminder to some fols that there is indeed a market for horse meat in the US. Just no legal supply....
            The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
            H. Cate

            Comment


            • #46
              Originally posted by up-at-5 View Post
              Get a grip. What does this have to do with the thread?? The person in question was yacking about fake vaginas, and has a proud to be a member of not too klassy for boxed wine in her signature.
              I find it offensive and if a person is going to report after they are called a rara..I think this too, is actionable

              Also it is against the rule to call people old man, a liar, and any other names..or so I have been told..There is a group who have bent the report button out of shape..but what is good for the gander is also good for the goose.

              I am just doing and reflecting what others are doing on all the threads.

              Fun isn't it...

              Now..back to the topic.
              The Elephant in the room

              Comment


              • #47
                Originally posted by JGHIRETIRE View Post
                Yes you are correct in that there is no legal market for horse meat. There is also no legal market for dog meat, if someone really wants it.
                Why do "we" as Americans have to cater to other people's tastes???
                Would India for example change its beliefs about cows???
                Somehow I don't think so.
                you are incorrect. Semantics, I know.
                I stated there is no legal supply. a slight but ever so important difference.

                You do not cater to 'other people's' tastes when they live and work ,etc right here in the US of which Southern Florida is still a part.

                And horses are not sacred in the US, another slight error on your part.

                And as far as national tastes go, the native Americans - some tribes of it - did certainly consume dog, and what's more so, as part of a religious ceremony.

                And if someone wants dog, all they need to do is go on CL, 'free to good home' always a lot of large breed dogs available, almost all the time for free.

                Which reminds me, not sure if this group is still operating, but there used to be warnings passed around, about this guy and his family/cult, responding to those ads and picking up dogs and cats 'free meat' he was reported to call it.

                Comment


                • #48
                  Originally posted by JGHIRETIRE View Post
                  Yes you are correct in that there is no legal market for horse meat. There is also no legal market for dog meat, if someone really wants it.
                  Why do "we" as Americans have to cater to other people's tastes???
                  Would India for example change its beliefs about cows???
                  Somehow I don't think so.
                  However they do serve beef at the major hotels and restaurants. The better the restaurant..the higher the cost due to the country of origin. Smaller restaurants have a shredded Bramha dish as it is tough.

                  Jews don't eat pork..but they do not asked for it to be banned..

                  Cubans do eat horse. When the revolution hit a major importation of Arabian Horses from Sunny Acres and Travellers Rest had just been made. There were many American breeders there with their show horses for the Havana Championship. It was a lot of work to get all of those horses out and my Father was happy to be of service in getting one of the imported Arabs back to the U.S. (A Raffles son).

                  There was no food and since the island was cut off those glorious Arabians imported by a Cuban were butchered according to the man who imported them . He lost his land and his horses. And everything else.

                  All the TBS that were there for the racing season were butchered.

                  Starving people do not care about the species nor pedigree.

                  We may find certain foods distasteful but that does not mean other cultures do.

                  If you allow their religion and culture to be in the U.S. then certain things are going to happen. Consumption of dog by many Koreans and other Asian countries. (black market). Consumption of the horse.

                  If they are stealing the horse to be killed..that is another point and they should be held accountable. Law makers and Presidents hate to become involved as they want the votes..
                  The Elephant in the room

                  Comment


                  • #49
                    Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                    you are incorrect. Semantics, I know.
                    I stated there is no legal supply. a slight but ever so important difference.

                    .
                    There most certainly IS a legal supply of horses that can be killed for horse meat. There are free and cheap horses on CL in every state. They can get one of those or buy one and slaughter it legally for their own consumption in most every state. So the fact that there is no commercial horse slaughter for human consumption in the US has nothing to do with what these people are doing in FL.

                    Comment


                    • #50
                      Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                      you are incorrect. Semantics, I know.
                      I stated there is no legal supply. a slight but ever so important difference.
                      True

                      You do not cater to 'other people's' tastes when they live and work ,etc right here in the US of which Southern Florida is still a part.

                      Do other countries cater to our tastes etc. when we live and work in other countries. Do we expect to have our expectations met when we are over there. In my experience and yes it was more than a week ago - you got along on what was available in that country. Aside from the fact that now Mickey D's is everywhere - except for maybe the Forbidden City at this point.
                      And horses are not sacred in the US, another slight error on your part.

                      And as far as national tastes go, the native Americans - some tribes of it - did certainly consume dog, and what's more so, as part of a religious ceremony.

                      And if someone wants dog, all they need to do is go on CL, 'free to good home' always a lot of large breed dogs available, almost all the time for free.

                      Which reminds me, not sure if this group is still operating, but there used to be warnings passed around, about this guy and his family/cult, responding to those ads and picking up dogs and cats 'free meat' he was reported to call it.


                      That still applies - up here as well as being careful where your horse goes.
                      The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                      H. Cate

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        Having never been to India - I don't really know.
                        The starving argument - I get - I'm sure I'd eat whatever if I were hungry.
                        Right now in the US - that argument does not apply. We can afford to be picky and choosey and yes wasteful.

                        Originally posted by Fairfax View Post
                        However they do serve beef at the major hotels and restaurants. The better the restaurant..the higher the cost due to the country of origin. Smaller restaurants have a shredded Bramha dish as it is tough.

                        Jews don't eat pork..but they do not asked for it to be banned..

                        Cubans do eat horse. When the revolution hit a major importation of Arabian Horses from Sunny Acres and Travellers Rest had just been made. There were many American breeders there with their show horses for the Havana Championship. It was a lot of work to get all of those horses out and my Father was happy to be of service in getting one of the imported Arabs back to the U.S. (A Raffles son).

                        There was no food and since the island was cut off those glorious Arabians imported by a Cuban were butchered according to the man who imported them . He lost his land and his horses. And everything else.

                        All the TBS that were there for the racing season were butchered.

                        Starving people do not care about the species nor pedigree.

                        We may find certain foods distasteful but that does not mean other cultures do.

                        If you allow their religion and culture to be in the U.S. then certain things are going to happen. Consumption of dog by many Koreans and other Asian countries. (black market). Consumption of the horse.

                        If they are stealing the horse to be killed..that is another point and they should be held accountable. Law makers and Presidents hate to become involved as they want the votes..
                        The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                        H. Cate

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          The fact that this topic turned so quickly into an argument about slaughter is unfortunate.

                          The facts are that a ghastly crime was committed and the appropriate response is to increase security around your barn and watch for suspicious vehicles. I will also find out more about the legalities of selling non-USDA so called "beef" out of coolers in the back of some guy's pickup. Perhaps there are laws regarding food safety that are being violated. If so, I will report the next one I see. BTW, the sellers were clearly not of Cuban ancestry (we know the family). The rumor is that it was horsemeat. Was it their own horse? Was it done legally? I have no idea.
                          “Pray, hope, and don't worry.”

                          St. Padre Pio

                          Comment


                          • #53
                            Originally posted by microbovine View Post
                            The fact that this topic turned so quickly into an argument about slaughter is unfortunate.

                            The facts are that a ghastly crime was committed and the appropriate response is to increase security around your barn and watch for suspicious vehicles. I will also find out more about the legalities of selling non-USDA so called "beef" out of coolers in the back of some guy's pickup. Perhaps there are laws regarding food safety that are being violated. If so, I will report the next one I see. BTW, the sellers were clearly not of Cuban ancestry (we know the family). The rumor is that it was horsemeat. Was it their own horse? Was it done legally? I have no idea.
                            well, when an animal is butchered, slaughter is naturally the the topic. Not sure how that is surprising.

                            There are huge regulations regarding how, when and where you can sell your farm product to the end consumer. The regulations are stifling, matter of fact it's a major complaint by homesteaders.

                            But if it's not beef, it's not legal to sell it as such.

                            Comment


                            • #54
                              We slaughter our own cattle at a non-USDA facility and that is legal here in Florida. The laws regarding selling are not clear to me. In addition, while it might be illegal to claim it is beef, we are a long way from Miami and I'm not sure our local deputies want to go through the expense and trouble to test the meat. I will find out so I know what to do the next time I see one of the trucks. They were everywhere for awhile. Both my husband and I were asked if we wanted beef in two separate parking lots within a week. Uh, no thanks.

                              Has anyone else seen this in your state?
                              “Pray, hope, and don't worry.”

                              St. Padre Pio

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                Originally posted by microbovine View Post
                                We slaughter our own cattle at a non-USDA facility and that is legal here in Florida. The laws regarding selling are not clear to me. In addition, while it might be illegal to claim it is beef, we are a long way from Miami and I'm not sure our local deputies want to go through the expense and trouble to test the meat. I will find out so I know what to do the next time I see one of the trucks. They were everywhere for awhile. Both my husband and I were asked if we wanted beef in two separate parking lots within a week. Uh, no thanks.

                                Has anyone else seen this in your state?
                                We had several times guys with cooled trailers stop by. One time the neighbor bought a box and shared it with us. Some of the cuts my husband, the grill master was very suspicious about. 'that's not like any beef I ever had'
                                We declined subsequent purchases. (they seem to only come around every few years, too, wonder why...)

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  Maybe all of us in SoFla should just pump our horses full of bute, soak them with as many strong pesticides as we can, etc., and hope that if someone does butcher our horses, they will die because of it. And/or anyone who buys the meat dies because of it. I mean, if you're dumb enough to buy meat out of a cooler from someone going door-to-door, you're clearly a candidate for the Darwin Award, so you deserve what you get. Especially when you know from the news/paper that the meat probably came from a stolen horse that was butchered alive. (And I believe I remember reading in the paper that the meat was clearly being sold as horsmeat, not beef--although, I'm sure there have been many incidents, so both scenarios are certainly possible).

                                  And, Alagirl, these people are pretty lax about cleaning up the carcasses. They just leave them lying wherever. I suppose it's possible that they could chop them up and throw them in a canal or something, but their MO seems to be to get the meat and go, and who cares about cleaning up the mess. So, while I can't prove that only these horses are butchered, you also can't prove that other horses are butchered.

                                  As for the whole Cuban angle, I've been told by a few Cuban friends that this is a Cuban thing. Believe me, Miami has a HUGE Cuban population, and while I'm sure many of them don't condone these acts (my friends included), it's widely-known that Cubans (some, not all) do eat horsemeat. That's not racist or prejudiced or culturist (is that a thing?), it's just how it is.
                                  Topline Leather -- Bespoke, handwoven browbands & accessories customized with Swarovski crystals, gemstones, & glass seed beads. The original crystal braid & crystal spike browbands!

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                                  • #57
                                    Originally posted by jetsmom View Post
                                    I have an alcoholic in the family, and the only way he would ever post something about fake vaginas on a thread about horses being butchered in the owners yard, would be if he were drunk. That statement is so off the wall, and just plain wacked, that it is the only thing that makes sense. There have been many instances of "drunk posting" in the past, and it struck me as this possibly being another example.
                                    I didn't say "You are drunk". I asked if she was. She has posted insulting things to other people quite often. So I think if she were insulted, it would be a fake statement considering some of her other posts. You seem to being falsely offended, just to defend your slaughter cohort.
                                    Did you ask her if she was drunk? Maybe she was, and that would explain it. Or maybe you understand why someone would make such a weird inappropriate remark about fake vaginas on a horse thread...If so, please tell. On 2nd thought, please don't. There is no reason for a comment on a horse thread about them, period.
                                    I believe this is a personal attack on Alagirl and I am requesting the thread be closed and a warning be issued.
                                    The Elephant in the room

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      "Trunking" most likely refers to selling stuff out of the back of your car, not something sexual, which is where A seems to have gone with it.

                                      Selling meat out of the trunk of your car is really sketchy. We process and sell our small animals legally and we have to use an approved facility to do it, spend the money to rent it etc, and go through 16 hours of training half of which is hands on. Then we sell them at the Farmer's Market and to restaurants directly. We used to sell whole fish out of the back of the car direct to restaurants, with the appropriate paperwork in hand - we were NOT allowed to process the fish apart from cleaning them.

                                      We process our pigs at two places, one is not USDA approved, it's a local butcher and he processes the animal that you own for you to use - all the packages even say NOT FOR RESALE on them. He is required by law to separate his species so during deer season you can forget processing beef or pork.
                                      The other one is USDA approved and is a high end butcher so they have a lot of rules about how your animals are to be kept, what they are to be fed, they won't purchase an animal that you buy from the auction house and fatten. They don't conduct spot checks but they did inspect our place before we signed a contract, and they have a relationship with a feed supplier that gets us a slightly lower price so they can if they choose check up on our purchases vs how many pigs we bring to market.

                                      Horse theft used to be related to the value of the horse, sort of like auto theft. If your auto is destroyed by the thief you have insurance to give you back part of the value. Nowadays our relationship with horses has blurred, for a lot of people they are companion, athletic partner, highly anticipated hobby time and so there is an emotional component - more like losing a unique restored auto or even a loved one. Good attorneys know that if you want a higher award from a jury in a wrongful death case you bring in the loss of companionship, of quality time, and the sense of loss of a unique individual - grief.


                                      There are horse available for sale on CL, but speaking as someone who had a permit to harvest a sought after type of seafood, which we would occasionally hold on the boat and kept well locked up because theft of product was known to happen, if the value is high enough people will steal from an easy source - why purchase some thin horse from CL when a nice fat QH is kept confined and fed and housed by someone else?

                                      It's theft. Rustling if you will, and on top of that violating all the food safety laws that the rest of us have to abide by. I agree that increasing security is the only way to slow it down.
                                      ETA Shutting down the unapproved slaughter facilities would help too, there are loads of statutes on the books for that.
                                      Courageous Weenie Eventer Wannabe
                                      Incredible Invisible

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                                      • #59
                                        Originally posted by jetsmom View Post
                                        You can get free horses on CL. Do you really think the thugs that would steal a horse and slaughter it rather than go get a free horse, would buy a horse/get a free one and take it to an abattoir to be humanely put down and slaughtered?
                                        I doubt they have a horse trailer to go get a free horse. Which is why they will steal one, lead it off and slaughter it right there, taking the meat they want.

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          Did you get spanked by the Mods, Leo, and now you're peeved?

                                          Back to the original topic, I don't think it matters what the ethnicity is in regards to whoever did/does these types of crimes. Fact of the matter is, sickos are out there and will probably do this again. Very sad.
                                          "Anti-intellect and marketing, pretty, pretty, who needs talent
                                          Crying eyes, we're so outnumbered, fight for the right to remain silent" Buck 65

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