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PETA's 10 Commandments of Horse Care/edit post #1

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  • Originally posted by jenm View Post
    Please provide the link.
    What you cannot look up What Misty Blue posted?? Seriously?
    Oh gee, Sorry, I already did my home work!

    Comment


    • Bluey, no one is defending PETA. Go back and look at my posts on this thread. I can find nothing ON THE FBI WEBSITE that says they are on a watch list. Just lots of other links that say so.

      The New York Post said that 12 people died in the Boston bombing and put the photos of innocent people on their front page and I was horrified. That doesn't mean I sympathize with the bombers...that means that I'm looking for the truth.

      Just show me the link where the FBI says they are on a watch list. Not some blog, not activistcash, a FBI link.

      Comment


      • http://www.justice.gov/oig/special/s1009r.pdf

        Pages 108 through 117 address PETA specifically. They were under a preliminary investigation for about 15 months. The investigation was closed.

        So show me the link where they're on a terrorist watch list now.

        I have no use for PETA, but I also have no use for people who spread rumors and lies. If it's true, post the FBI or government link.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by LauraKY View Post
          http://www.justice.gov/oig/special/s1009r.pdf

          Pages 108 through 117 address PETA specifically. They were under a preliminary investigation for about 15 months. The investigation was closed.

          So show me the link where they're on a terrorist watch list now.

          I have no use for PETA, but I also have no use for people who spread rumors and lies. If it's true, post the FBI or government link.
          Coming from a Liberal who supports nothing but rumors and lies that is rich!

          Comment


          • As a compulsive fact checker, I poked around FBI's website. I couldn't find a "list" per se -- they did give ALF and ELF as examples of two groups that had been considered as domestic "terrorist" groups due to property damage caused (burning developments under construction, releasing lab animals, damaging research labs). Also listed as examples are sovereign citizen movements, such as TX secessionists, right wing Christian extremist groups who bomb clinics and shoot doctors and seek to impose their version of "religion" by any means necessary, anarchy groups, militia extremists stocking up on guns and explosives, and the KKK. So...pick your poison? But a little context would be appropriate. No illegal actions are justifiable by the presence of others, but to verbally equate these groups as synonymous would be misleading.

            Oh, and no, a website list is not ACTIONABLE in any way, no matter how much red font you use, it is not legislation.

            Terrorist seems a word very casually thrown around these days, used to incite paranoia and fear. There are enough people hurting each other and animals who continue to suffer without enforcement of existing legislation and entire species that I am trying to keep from going extinct that it seems rather callous to bandy about such a loaded term just to try and fluff up rage. There is enough going on within PETA itself to sink their own ship -- as others have pointed out, misleading information, exaggeration, etc, have no merit.

            So, back to your huffing and you are welcome to call me what you like, LOL (can we beat horsekiller?), but Laura and jen are correct -- I don't think anyone here supports PETA's counterproductive tactics, but creating your own oppositional propaganda just brings you down to their level.

            As you were.
            Life doesn't have perfect footing.

            Bloggily entertain yourself with our adventures (and disasters):
            We Are Flying Solo

            Comment


            • Originally posted by wildlifer View Post
              As a compulsive fact checker, I poked around FBI's website. I couldn't find a "list" per se -- they did give ALF and ELF as examples of two groups that had been considered as domestic "terrorist" groups due to property damage caused (burning developments under construction, releasing lab animals, damaging research labs). Also listed as examples are sovereign citizen movements, such as TX secessionists, right wing Christian extremist groups who bomb clinics and shoot doctors and seek to impose their version of "religion" by any means necessary, anarchy groups, militia extremists stocking up on guns and explosives, and the KKK. So...pick your poison? But a little context would be appropriate. No illegal actions are justifiable by the presence of others, but to verbally equate these groups as synonymous would be misleading.

              Oh, and no, a website list is not ACTIONABLE in any way, no matter how much red font you use, it is not legislation.

              Terrorist seems a word very casually thrown around these days, used to incite paranoia and fear. There are enough people hurting each other and animals who continue to suffer without enforcement of existing legislation and entire species that I am trying to keep from going extinct that it seems rather callous to bandy about such a loaded term just to try and fluff up rage. There is enough going on within PETA itself to sink their own ship -- as others have pointed out, misleading information, exaggeration, etc, have no merit.

              So, back to your huffing and you are welcome to call me what you like, LOL (can we beat horsekiller?), but Laura and jen are correct -- I don't think anyone here supports PETA's counterproductive tactics, but creating your own oppositional propaganda just brings you down to their level.

              As you were.
              Ah, while I have to agree, the information put out is not in any shape or form illegal, however questionable it may be, one cannot lay down and count on PETA imploding any time soon. They have not done so for thirty years, but have succeeded in subversively changing much of our language and expectations that comes with it.
              Just try to wear fur anywhere these days!

              Or even sell/put down an animal you no longer need or want.

              It has come to the point were certain aspects of what we do with animals has become suspect (just listen to our handful of specialists here on the forum, who keep harping on the evils of breeding as root cause for all that ails you!)

              They are not going away. They keep undermining the culture like a bunch of termites gnaw away on the foundation of a house, unseen and in darkness, until one fine day the roof caves in.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by wildlifer View Post
                As a compulsive fact checker, I poked around FBI's website. I couldn't find a "list" per se -- they did give ALF and ELF as examples of two groups that had been considered as domestic "terrorist" groups due to property damage caused (burning developments under construction, releasing lab animals, damaging research labs). Also listed as examples are sovereign citizen movements, such as TX secessionists, right wing Christian extremist groups who bomb clinics and shoot doctors and seek to impose their version of "religion" by any means necessary, anarchy groups, militia extremists stocking up on guns and explosives, and the KKK. So...pick your poison? But a little context would be appropriate. No illegal actions are justifiable by the presence of others, but to verbally equate these groups as synonymous would be misleading.

                Oh, and no, a website list is not ACTIONABLE in any way, no matter how much red font you use, it is not legislation.

                Terrorist seems a word very casually thrown around these days, used to incite paranoia and fear. There are enough people hurting each other and animals who continue to suffer without enforcement of existing legislation and entire species that I am trying to keep from going extinct that it seems rather callous to bandy about such a loaded term just to try and fluff up rage. There is enough going on within PETA itself to sink their own ship -- as others have pointed out, misleading information, exaggeration, etc, have no merit.

                So, back to your huffing and you are welcome to call me what you like, LOL (can we beat horsekiller?), but Laura and jen are correct -- I don't think anyone here supports PETA's counterproductive tactics, but creating your own oppositional propaganda just brings you down to their level.

                As you were.
                PETA was at one time, as per the USDA releases we received, in their domestic terrorist list.
                Guess that the animal rights extremists, that have now been in positions to determine what is in those lists, have eliminated said lists, as they are not on their links any more.
                I have provided the link where it used to be and there are references to that in several places on the internet, posted when those links were still there.

                That they are not now doesn't mean they were not there at one time and not so long ago.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by D_BaldStockings View Post

                  "We quickly purchased the smallest number of shares necessary to give us the right to attend and speak at annual meetings and to submit shareholder resolutions asking for policy changes. Our first order of business as part owners of SeaWorld? Getting the orcas out—including Corky, who has been enslaved by SeaWorld for 44 years..."

                  It all starts with one flea on the dog.
                  You think it is a good thing for their fiercest enemy to have the opportunity to be present and attempt to disrupt their Policy decisions and shareholders meetings?

                  Now how could a little flea be dangerous? Fleas are just too funny aren't they.
                  OMG...have you ever been to a shareholders meeting?! Probably not, based on the assumptions you allude to. Wanting to be present at a meeting is NOT the same as having the power to initiate changes. There is so much more involved and PETAs miniscule purchase won't make one difference. They can "try" to disrupt, but there is NOTHING they can do to take over and make changes with a piddly 80 shares...Really.
                  Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                  Did you even click on any of those links?! I'm guessing you didn't, otherwise you wouldn't be so smug.


                  Originally posted by Bluey View Post
                  All that posting by certain posters trying to defend PETA, from all things, on a horse forum and they keep insisting they are not animal rights extremists?
                  I don't know who you think is defending PETA, but it's certainly not me, or LaurayKY. You have already tried to post this inane comment before. Asking for PROOF of statements made is NOT the same thing as defending or supporting something. As someone who has criticized both my education and critical thinking skills, you should know better than to make a comment like this.

                  Originally posted by Sannois View Post
                  What you cannot look up What Misty Blue posted?? Seriously?
                  Oh gee, Sorry, I already did my home work!
                  Obviously you didn't or you would understand why I'm asking.
                  Proud owner of a Slaughter-Bound TB from a feedlot, and her surprise baby...!
                  http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/Jen4USC/fave.jpg
                  http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...SC/running.jpg

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by jenm View Post
                    OMG...have you ever been to a shareholders meeting?! Probably not, based on the assumptions you allude to. Wanting to be present at a meeting is NOT the same as having the power to initiate changes. There is so much more involved and PETAs miniscule purchase won't make one difference. They can "try" to disrupt, but there is NOTHING they can do to take over and make changes with a piddly 80 shares...Really.

                    Did you even click on any of those links?! I'm guessing you didn't, otherwise you wouldn't be so smug.




                    I don't know who you think is defending PETA, but it's certainly not me, or LaurayKY. You have already tried to post this inane comment before. Asking for PROOF of statements made is NOT the same thing as defending or supporting something. As someone who has criticized both my education and critical thinking skills, you should know better than to make a comment like this.



                    Obviously you didn't or you would understand why I'm asking.
                    don't be so lazy. I pointed you to some link, you do your own homework.

                    and yes, you do defend them. You and your little sisterhood.

                    But it's ok. We know what you are.

                    Comment


                    • Crazy PETA-ness aside, it's a decent VERY vague and general outline of care. It really doesn't say anything like "sweet feed MUST be fed twice daily to ALL horses", or anything along those lines.
                      Tell a Gelding. Ask a Stallion. Discuss it with a Mare... Pray if it's a Pony!

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                        don't be so lazy. I pointed you to some link, you do your own homework.

                        and yes, you do defend them. You and your little sisterhood.

                        But it's ok. We know what you are.
                        I did my homework, you didn't. All you did was show the same Google search others have done, which show NOTHING. If you have time to be nasty to others, certainly you have time to do some research. Never mind, I'm not sure why I even bother. It's not like you would ever admit you were wrong.

                        Like others, when you can't prove something, you just attack.
                        Proud owner of a Slaughter-Bound TB from a feedlot, and her surprise baby...!
                        http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/Jen4USC/fave.jpg
                        http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...SC/running.jpg

                        Comment


                        • Hmmm, bluey, I've worked in fed and state government -- PETA cannot, even in their wildest dreams, make watch lists go away. Or have any effect on FBI investigations in any way, LOL. They can sue all they want, but then, so can you or anyone else. Again, I am not advocating their support in any way, but, and maybe it's just the scientist in me, facts are facts and hearsay and misinformation are meaningless.

                          And Alagirl, while I have no issues with people having more respect for animals, wildlife and domestic alike, I haven't seen that much culture undermining. Perhaps it depends on one's location, but in multiple states I have lived in, livestock is still livestock -- educated and thoughtful farmers/owners/etc have remained such, idiots have remained such.

                          I have no interest in skinning anything SOLELY to wear its fur nor have I ever, that is just wasteful and ridiculous -- nothing to do with PETA, that's just ethics for me. I was raised with more resource respect than that.

                          And as far as euthanizing animals, I and many many others are free to make that decision (yourself included) every day (and I have as I'd guess most of us have). If someone gives you flak, so what? Rescue organizations now have humane euthanasia clinics open to the public, which I think is a big step forward, so I can't agree with that one either. I see people on here discussing openly putting down sound, healthy horses because they are dangerous, etc, and getting support, also a big step!

                          I guess it's just that I don't much care what PETA does and, working in an animal related field for quite some time, I have seen little to no change I could attribute directly to them without some pretty big unfounded leaps of imagination. I've heard screaming for decades about how "they" are coming to take our animals away...and...it's just not going to happen. The "slippery slope" logic so often used is simply and completely false (and well-documented as such). There will always be crazy people who do crazy things and giving that credence just feeds right into the crazy. I'd rather converse about issues on a rational, logical level; should the conversation get dragged back down to crazy, it's generally not even worth the effort beyond stepping out.

                          For now, I've got way bigger and more immediate fish to fry with far more certain and dire implications for the near future. Normally, I wouldn't even argue, but dammit, y'all sucked me in by my weakness for misinformation. IT'S A TRICK!
                          Life doesn't have perfect footing.

                          Bloggily entertain yourself with our adventures (and disasters):
                          We Are Flying Solo

                          Comment


                          • Thank you for an informative post. I appreciate the information.

                            Originally posted by wildlifer View Post
                            Hmmm, bluey, I've worked in fed and state government -- PETA cannot, even in their wildest dreams, make watch lists go away. Or have any effect on FBI investigations in any way, LOL. They can sue all they want, but then, so can you or anyone else. Again, I am not advocating their support in any way, but, and maybe it's just the scientist in me, facts are facts and hearsay and misinformation are meaningless.

                            And Alagirl, while I have no issues with people having more respect for animals, wildlife and domestic alike, I haven't seen that much culture undermining. Perhaps it depends on one's location, but in multiple states I have lived in, livestock is still livestock -- educated and thoughtful farmers/owners/etc have remained such, idiots have remained such.

                            I have no interest in skinning anything SOLELY to wear its fur nor have I ever, that is just wasteful and ridiculous -- nothing to do with PETA, that's just ethics for me. I was raised with more resource respect than that.

                            And as far as euthanizing animals, I and many many others are free to make that decision (yourself included) every day (and I have as I'd guess most of us have). If someone gives you flak, so what? Rescue organizations now have humane euthanasia clinics open to the public, which I think is a big step forward, so I can't agree with that one either. I see people on here discussing openly putting down sound, healthy horses because they are dangerous, etc, and getting support, also a big step!

                            I guess it's just that I don't much care what PETA does and, working in an animal related field for quite some time, I have seen little to no change I could attribute directly to them without some pretty big unfounded leaps of imagination. I've heard screaming for decades about how "they" are coming to take our animals away...and...it's just not going to happen. The "slippery slope" logic so often used is simply and completely false (and well-documented as such). There will always be crazy people who do crazy things and giving that credence just feeds right into the crazy. I'd rather converse about issues on a rational, logical level; should the conversation get dragged back down to crazy, it's generally not even worth the effort beyond stepping out.

                            For now, I've got way bigger and more immediate fish to fry with far more certain and dire implications for the near future. Normally, I wouldn't even argue, but dammit, y'all sucked me in by my weakness for misinformation. IT'S A TRICK!
                            The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                            H. Cate

                            Comment


                            • I would say that, in the name of fairness, when there is a steady, well documented many years long record of PETA paying for lawyers, bonds and helping terrorists that were convicted eventually, like those from ALF and such and promoting what they do as good for the cause, as their mouthpiece, that alone would be reason enough to consider them also terrorists to add to anyone's list.

                              Comment


                              • Well Bluey, it looks like the FBI didn't agree with you and closed the case after 15 months of investigation. Maybe they should have talked to you first.

                                Comment


                                • I have an honest question. Is it illegal to donate money or services to a U.S. group considered to be a domestic terrorist ? I know it is if it is foreign, but can't find anything addressing domestic.

                                  That would apply, not just to PETA (and if you own animals you'd be a fool to donate to PETA in any case), but also to the right wing militia groups, Christian and Muslim extremist groups, animal extremist groups, anarchists, sovereign citizen groups, white supremacy groups, etc. I'm talking terrorists here, not RARAs. You know, blowing things up, killing people, terrorists.

                                  In other words, is it illegal for PETA (or any group or individual) to fund a group like ALF or KKK? And, do they have to be indicted or just on the watch list? I actually really curious. I'm guessing it's not illegal since the FBI closed the case against PETA, but I just don't know the answer.

                                  Now I'm probably being investigated because of my search history.
                                  Last edited by LauraKY; Apr. 25, 2013, 03:33 PM.

                                  Comment


                                  • PETA replace with Psycho

                                    These PETA people are just nutters, Ok I said what we are all thinking. Firstly they know nothing about horses or any other animal. They are radicals and in some countries are classed as Terrorists. None of the previous statement is bogus and can all be varified if you would like to look. They class animal keeps, as in Farmers, and Horse/Barn owners as Nazis and inliken us to running concentration camps. Need I say more! Horses, at some point in the year will need to eat poop, usually not their own, to replenish the flora in their gut. Muck heaps should not be directly in front of the barn because the Ammonia MAY waft into the stalls and damage the breathing. By directly I mean FEET from the barn. The DOA in most states do not allow muck heaps as they may contaminate the ground water .... lets face it we could all write volumes as to what they have wrong. Some people will do anything for 15 mins of fame!

                                    Comment


                                    • Right from the 'horse's mouth'
                                      http://www.peta.org/about/faq/Why-do...-violence.aspx

                                      "Why do PETA members sometimes throw tofu pies at animal abusers—isn’t that a form of violence?

                                      Vaudeville pie-throwing à la The Three Stooges can hardly be considered violent in this day and age. Nobody gets hurt, and better-natured recipients laugh it off and crack jokes. ..."

                                      So I advocate all carriage drivers carry 'pies' and gleefully chuck them on protesters, just as PETA recommends; what FUN!!

                                      Another gem:
                                      http://www.peta.org/about/faq/Would-...00-people.aspx
                                      "...Most people will agree that it is wrong to sacrifice one human for the "greater good" of others because it would violate that individual’s rights. There is no logical reason to deny animals the same rights that protect individual humans from being sacrificed for the common good."

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by LauraKY View Post
                                        Now I'm probably being investigated because of my search history.
                                        I was thinking the same of me!
                                        Proud owner of a Slaughter-Bound TB from a feedlot, and her surprise baby...!
                                        http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/Jen4USC/fave.jpg
                                        http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...SC/running.jpg

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by LauraKY View Post
                                          I have an honest question. Is it illegal to donate money or services to a U.S. group considered to be a domestic terrorist ? I know it is if it is foreign, but can't find anything addressing domestic.
                                          I am fairly certain the answer to that is no, it is not illegal (don't ask me why!). People give money all the time to radical right wing groups, supremacy, etc who are actually hurting and killing people and no one goes out and arrests all the people who ever made a donation. Perhaps there are legal loopholes through which the parent organization can launder actual terrorist activity. Shoot, our own country has been selling arms and funding all types of terrorists all over the world for decades, we like it when they want to kill the same people that "we" do, but it backfires an awful lot -- I'm not that old but I still remember Reagan and Iran, so perhaps you just have to phrase it right.

                                          It's a good question though -- if we know, for example, that a religious hate organization is endorsing explosives, physical assault, murder, tacitly or not, where does that place the people who give them money?
                                          Life doesn't have perfect footing.

                                          Bloggily entertain yourself with our adventures (and disasters):
                                          We Are Flying Solo

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