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Horse Slaughter Ban Lifted by Oklahoma Senate -- Needs Gov Signature -- YOU can help!

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  • I realize that I am coming in at the tail end here, but what is it about horses that make some people lose touch with reality?

    Every year millions and millions of cats and dogs are routinely slaughtered in almost every town in the US.

    Millions of children are slaughtered around the world each year.

    But the killing of horses whether or not it is done for food, creates a great foaming at the mouth in some people.

    I just dont get it
    www.headsupspecialriders.com

    Comment


    • Originally posted by 7HL View Post
      Slaughter - killing - butchering. Blood and guts. Prove what, that you sensitivities won't get bruised? Get real. The horse ends up dead, that is the end of the story.
      Apparently you haven't been alive long enough to realize there are far worse things than death. Show me it can be done.

      Comment


      • Apparently you don't understand the part 'undisturbed by humans". Meaning they are DOMESTIC. Jeez you guys are totally out of your league here.

        No I have not seen any footage from farm to plate that wasn't awful. Show me.

        I don't have to prove anything we already know the system is broken. You want the "right" to slaughter? Show us how it will work. From farm to plate. We already know how it doesn't work within MOST folks ideas of humane.

        If they want to slaughter all those penned up wild horses I don't have a problem with it. But it should not be used as a free pass to dump crap from your crappy breeding programs that only end up with 10% of their stock being worth a crap. That is a terrible business plan when roughly 90% of your product is crap.

        Let the 'new" economy adjust. Breeders are dropping like flies. Don't expect a change without it's collateral damage.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by sunridge1 View Post
          Apparently you don't understand the part 'undisturbed by humans". Meaning they are DOMESTIC. Jeez you guys are totally out of your league here.

          No I have not seen any footage from farm to plate that wasn't awful. Show me.

          I don't have to prove anything we already know the system is broken. You want the "right" to slaughter? Show us how it will work. From farm to plate. We already know how it doesn't work within MOST folks ideas of humane.

          If they want to slaughter all those penned up wild horses I don't have a problem with it. But it should not be used as a free pass to dump crap from your crappy breeding programs that only end up with 10% of their stock being worth a crap. That is a terrible business plan when roughly 90% of your product is crap.

          Let the 'new" economy adjust. Breeders are dropping like flies. Don't expect a change without it's collateral damage.
          You are entitled to your opinion, but not to your own facts.

          No matter how often you repeat your opinion, it is still not 'fact'
          Originally posted by BigMama1
          Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
          GNU Terry Prachett

          Comment


          • A most tempestuous teapot . . . as usual.

            COTH loves drama. Since few things inspire more dread, horror and paradoxical voyeuristic attraction than The Slaughter Thread, this subject is sorely overplayed here. Boys who would put "Faces of Death" on the box at keg parties just to see who could sit through it definitely come to mind.

            In all these myriad threads enumerating the vast, swilling sinkhole of horses' sad fate in America, I have never seen:

            (1) A single person here who admits having sold to a KB;
            (2) A single person here who admits to BEING a KB;
            (3) A single person here who has had to abandon a horse;
            (4) A single person who has starved one to death.

            Now, we are a pretty good cross-section, I would think, of the horse owners of America. Some of us struggle mightily and sacrifice many other possibilities in our lives in favor of keeping our horses healthy, fed, and shod. I would expect that most non-COTH owners are probably doing likewise.

            In my part of the world there have been several very high profile neglect cases recently. In every one, the usual suspects: "Menagerie" collectors who got old and senile and stopped "seeing" what they were looking at. Well, society no longer tolerates these situations. These people are NOT getting a Mulligan anymore because they're mentally, physically, or financially incompetent to properly maintain the animals they own. They are given a reasonable period of time to fix the situation--if they do nothing or make it worse, the State will divest you of your animals and you lose the right to own more.
            I do not see this as a RARA agenda or infringement on my rights. I see it in the same category as the laws that likewise protect innocent children or helpless senior citizens. A civilized society must take care of those who cannot care for themselves.

            Now if this is not the case in other parts of this country, it sounds like what we REALLY need instead of the kill-box is:

            (1) Education supporting responsible horse ownership;
            (2) Intelligent humane treatment laws for all animals;
            (3) The desire, funding and personnel to ENFORCE those laws;
            (4) Community pressure to see that all of the above happens.

            We are not living in the caves any more, or on the wild nineteenth century frontier, or in some anarchic East European dystopia. The vast majority of us are not so desperate we cannot spare a bullet or write out a month's board to the vet and the rendering guy. We CAN make it a better day for horses by starting NOW to police our own industry through the most powerful tool of all--PEER PRESSURE.

            Begin tomorrow to reach out to those around you who might need some tactfully constructive suggestions, a link to the Cooperative Extension Service, or the phone number of a good vet. Network with the vets, farriers, dealers and owners to help place useful horses in suitable jobs--even if that job is "pet." Start a hay bank in your trail club or Pony Club or 4-H so that one day when somebody loses their job and is up Sh*t's Creek, they don't HAVE to send Tony the Pony to the KB's.

            This part is not the Government's job, people--it is OURS.

            Comment


            • I try not to respond to these threads but I will today.

              Unless you have worked in a slaughter house of some sort you really have no idea of how the bolt works. Grainy video is not a good source of information.

              No reason not to eat a horse, herbivore, large, naturally lean, sounds like a good solution as poosed to starving to death.

              Comment


              • Yes there is a study (online, google it, one has to do with halal slaughter) that shows that the bolt gun not only do not render a horse unconscious for bleeding out (they have to be ALIVE but should be unconscious), and in fact they suffer terrible pain (more so than the other animals that the gun was you know, DESIGNED for) and regain consciousness within 30 seconds. Plenty of time for the horses to realize they were being hung up and bled out and Heaven forbid someone was in a hurry and started to skin them out before the bleeding out is done. (course that happens in regular animal plants too)

                Temple Grandin did quite a bit recently (i.e. last few years) on horse slaughter plants, how it SHOULD be done (but wasn't), how it could be done but would require constant monitoring, literally with monitors! by people not making money off the process. Canada's plants, new and old, pretty much failed her evaluation. Nowhere does it say that NEW plants will be built, in fact most plants are just retrofitted beef plants. Which makes them STILL unsuitable for horses. Anyway, all this is out there on the net.

                As far as what people will do when they can no longer feed their horses, well they can jolly well do what the rest of us do. Sell them, Give them away, euthanize them, shoot'em in the head and feed 'em to the crows. The choice is not starvation vs. slaughter, never has been. Horses not being fed out in the field are also NOT GOING TO SLAUGHTER. If they are not rescued by someone they end up dying out in the fields.

                The horse slaughter industry (and the transporters and auction houses that run it) has shown that they have no interest in obeying laws for handling, transporting, killing, or humanely treating horses in any way. They have equal disdain for environmental laws and paying their fines for past indiscretions. This is like for all of horse slaughter history. Who said when someone tells or shows you who they are, you need to believe them? The horse slaughter people have shown us. Why do so few people believe them! How many undercover videos and USDA photos and reports have to be seen before people realize these people are not here to do a public service by getting rid of "unwanted" horses (so why aren't they ALL FREE?), they are here to make as much money with as little cost as they possibly can. And how that happens apparently is not of great concern to them.

                For such a tiny niche market the pain and suffering per head is just way out of proportion.
                Every mighty oak was once a nut that stood its ground.

                Proud Closet Canterer! Member Riders with Fibromyalgia clique.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Lady Eboshi View Post
                  COTH loves drama. Since few things inspire more dread, horror and paradoxical voyeuristic attraction than The Slaughter Thread, this subject is sorely overplayed here. Boys who would put "Faces of Death" on the box at keg parties just to see who could sit through it definitely come to mind.

                  In all these myriad threads enumerating the vast, swilling sinkhole of horses' sad fate in America, I have never seen:

                  (1) A single person here who admits having sold to a KB;
                  (2) A single person here who admits to BEING a KB;
                  (3) A single person here who has had to abandon a horse;
                  (4) A single person who has starved one to death.

                  Now, we are a pretty good cross-section, I would think, of the horse owners of America. Some of us struggle mightily and sacrifice many other possibilities in our lives in favor of keeping our horses healthy, fed, and shod. I would expect that most non-COTH owners are probably doing likewise.

                  In my part of the world there have been several very high profile neglect cases recently. In every one, the usual suspects: "Menagerie" collectors who got old and senile and stopped "seeing" what they were looking at. Well, society no longer tolerates these situations. These people are NOT getting a Mulligan anymore because they're mentally, physically, or financially incompetent to properly maintain the animals they own. They are given a reasonable period of time to fix the situation--if they do nothing or make it worse, the State will divest you of your animals and you lose the right to own more.
                  I do not see this as a RARA agenda or infringement on my rights. I see it in the same category as the laws that likewise protect innocent children or helpless senior citizens. A civilized society must take care of those who cannot care for themselves.

                  Now if this is not the case in other parts of this country, it sounds like what we REALLY need instead of the kill-box is:

                  (1) Education supporting responsible horse ownership;
                  (2) Intelligent humane treatment laws for all animals;
                  (3) The desire, funding and personnel to ENFORCE those laws;
                  (4) Community pressure to see that all of the above happens.

                  We are not living in the caves any more, or on the wild nineteenth century frontier, or in some anarchic East European dystopia. The vast majority of us are not so desperate we cannot spare a bullet or write out a month's board to the vet and the rendering guy. We CAN make it a better day for horses by starting NOW to police our own industry through the most powerful tool of all--PEER PRESSURE.

                  Begin tomorrow to reach out to those around you who might need some tactfully constructive suggestions, a link to the Cooperative Extension Service, or the phone number of a good vet. Network with the vets, farriers, dealers and owners to help place useful horses in suitable jobs--even if that job is "pet." Start a hay bank in your trail club or Pony Club or 4-H so that one day when somebody loses their job and is up Sh*t's Creek, they don't HAVE to send Tony the Pony to the KB's.

                  This part is not the Government's job, people--it is OURS.

                  actually there have been in the past people here and their who said they they sold horses to the trader with explicit direction to only sell the horse to the plant, because said horse was outright dangerous.

                  however, those incidents were said to have happened in the days when the plants were more local and plentiful.


                  sure, we can network in finding homes for those critters.

                  but we can't create them.

                  and that has been a growing problem.

                  More and more people get out of horses, because the pressure is increasing.
                  You have to have this, and that, and under 6 month contingency, 5k emergency vet money, 2k (in some areas) after death funds, blankets, smart pak, farrier, barns....
                  fly spray and masks (but if you do, you blind fold them...) mud free range all year round, pastures, the bigger the better...

                  oh, money got scarce lately, and the old guard is dieing out.

                  So less homes for more horses.

                  hey, it is no skin of my nose if you decide to keep Dobbins around forever, lame and all. But he is then taking up a home a more useful horse could occupy. Also a facet of the problem: horses live much longer than they used to, even 20 years ago.

                  If you don't sell Dobbins to the KB, that is your right.
                  but there are growing problems disposing of large carcasses. backhoes are not the answer all the time - matter of fact probably never, really. We like the idea, but it is a danger to the ground water, some places more than others.

                  And I cannot find the appeal in tossing my horse into the landfill, along with soiled diapers, dead batteries and the rest of the refuse.
                  Originally posted by BigMama1
                  Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
                  GNU Terry Prachett

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
                    I realize that I am coming in at the tail end here, but what is it about horses that make some people lose touch with reality?

                    Every year millions and millions of cats and dogs are routinely slaughtered in almost every town in the US.

                    Millions of children are slaughtered around the world each year.

                    But the killing of horses whether or not it is done for food, creates a great foaming at the mouth in some people.

                    I just dont get it
                    I could not agree more!!!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
                      I realize that I am coming in at the tail end here, but what is it about horses that make some people lose touch with reality?

                      Every year millions and millions of cats and dogs are routinely slaughtered in almost every town in the US.

                      Millions of children are slaughtered around the world each year.

                      But the killing of horses whether or not it is done for food, creates a great foaming at the mouth in some people.

                      I just dont get it
                      Dogs and cats are not generally slaughtered in the US. They are euthanized. Hopefully correctly. Some places still operate in the dark ages and gas them or shoot them but they are not slaughtered. It would be great if there were more places that owners COULD take old or injured (or dangerous) animals and have them humanely euthanized and disposed of without taking out a loan at the bank!
                      Every mighty oak was once a nut that stood its ground.

                      Proud Closet Canterer! Member Riders with Fibromyalgia clique.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by summerhorse View Post
                        Yes there is a study (online, google it, one has to do with halal slaughter) that shows that the bolt gun not only do not render a horse unconscious for bleeding out (they have to be ALIVE but should be unconscious), and in fact they suffer terrible pain (more so than the other animals that the gun was you know, DESIGNED for) and regain consciousness within 30 seconds. Plenty of time for the horses to realize they were being hung up and bled out and Heaven forbid someone was in a hurry and started to skin them out before the bleeding out is done. (course that happens in regular animal plants too)

                        Temple Grandin did quite a bit recently (i.e. last few years) on horse slaughter plants, how it SHOULD be done (but wasn't), how it could be done but would require constant monitoring, literally with monitors! by people not making money off the process. Canada's plants, new and old, pretty much failed her evaluation. Nowhere does it say that NEW plants will be built, in fact most plants are just retrofitted beef plants. Which makes them STILL unsuitable for horses. Anyway, all this is out there on the net.

                        As far as what people will do when they can no longer feed their horses, well they can jolly well do what the rest of us do. Sell them, Give them away, euthanize them, shoot'em in the head and feed 'em to the crows. The choice is not starvation vs. slaughter, never has been. Horses not being fed out in the field are also NOT GOING TO SLAUGHTER. If they are not rescued by someone they end up dying out in the fields.

                        The horse slaughter industry (and the transporters and auction houses that run it) has shown that they have no interest in obeying laws for handling, transporting, killing, or humanely treating horses in any way. They have equal disdain for environmental laws and paying their fines for past indiscretions. This is like for all of horse slaughter history. Who said when someone tells or shows you who they are, you need to believe them? The horse slaughter people have shown us. Why do so few people believe them! How many undercover videos and USDA photos and reports have to be seen before people realize these people are not here to do a public service by getting rid of "unwanted" horses (so why aren't they ALL FREE?), they are here to make as much money with as little cost as they possibly can. And how that happens apparently is not of great concern to them.

                        For such a tiny niche market the pain and suffering per head is just way out of proportion.
                        You are parroting that right out of animal rights groups propaganda, you don't know that.

                        There are some here that have told you, from personal experience, that what you believe is not so at all.
                        Sure, there have been cases of abuse, no one denies that and that abuse should never happen and that abuse was against laws and regulations already existing.

                        You are bringing the abuse card to the table again, when you ought to know by now that is a cop out, because abuse happens where there are abusers, not just in slaughter, the abuse here is animal rights extremists abusing the gullible public by making all believe is all abuse.

                        Fairfax is one that has been in plants.
                        I know the local horse trader that would put a load together and then take them to the plant.
                        Those horses were treated very well, hauled very carefully and so were those of practically all that were doing so when the plants in the USA were open.
                        All but those few abuse cases, already gone over that, abuses that should not happen, that today would not be as apt to happen because we have better surveillance.
                        The better surveillance also helps keep the animal rights extremists from faking videos, as some I have seen, that were clearly well edited for their propaganda goals.

                        As I said, you don't know, you are going by the words and stories and edited videos of people that are after eliminating all uses of animals.
                        Of course they want you to believe slaughter is all about abusing horses.
                        Just remember, you are only getting one side of the story there.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by summerhorse View Post
                          Dogs and cats are not generally slaughtered in the US. They are euthanized. Hopefully correctly. Some places still operate in the dark ages and gas them or shoot them but they are not slaughtered. It would be great if there were more places that owners COULD take old or injured (or dangerous) animals and have them humanely euthanized and disposed of without taking out a loan at the bank!
                          Who made you judge and jury to take the rights of horse owners to do what they want to do with their horses, now demand they don't sell to slaughter, just because that is what you decided they should do with their horses?

                          Some people may just think that it is very wasteful NOT to make that one last use of their horses and it is no business of yours to tell them they can't.

                          Comment


                          • Who are these "some people?" In my area, quite frankly they are bottom-of-the-barrel d-bags, the sort that someone above described as out to make a profit totally without regard to the suffering of the animals involved. I have seen it with my own eyes. These are people who can't make it legitimately in the mainstream part of the horse business. They are jackals, both as horse people and as human beings, and you would not invite any of them in to dinner.

                            One was an animal collector with a revolving door of acquire, starve, fail to provide proper vet/farrier, then dump in sale again, a revolving-door more of the same. For 25 years, and in plain sight! At least the State finally put this guy out of business.

                            Another is an intinerant bottom-feeding dealer with a stock trailer who makes up stories to the CraigsListers about the "happy home," their horse will have with children, then runs 'em straight into New Holland as soon as the rig is full.

                            The last is a very wealthy woman who ran her fabulous but older WB broodmares "through the sale" when they failed to catch; in spite of my offer to place them with someone who'd value and take care of them. We are no longer on speaking terms.

                            None of these people were penniless and desperate. Far from it! All you slaughter proponents are doing is playing enabler to a class of people who don't give a sh*t about their horses. BTW, we have no "carcass disposal" problem whatsoever in one of the smallest states in the Union with a population of over 60,000 horses.

                            Those arguments just don't hold water at all.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by LauraKY View Post
                              There are worse things than dead.
                              Yes, listening to the anti-slaughter crowd.
                              The ultimate goal of farming is not the growing of crops, but the cultivation and perfection of human beings.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by summerhorse View Post
                                Yes there is a study (online, google it, one has to do with halal slaughter) that shows that the bolt gun not only do not render a horse unconscious for bleeding out (they have to be ALIVE but should be unconscious), and in fact they suffer terrible pain (more so than the other animals that the gun was you know, DESIGNED for) and regain consciousness within 30 seconds. Plenty of time for the horses to realize they were being hung up and bled out and Heaven forbid someone was in a hurry and started to skin them out before the bleeding out is done. (course that happens in regular animal plants too)

                                Temple Grandin did quite a bit recently (i.e. last few years) on horse slaughter plants, how it SHOULD be done (but wasn't), how it could be done but would require constant monitoring, literally with monitors! by people not making money off the process. Canada's plants, new and old, pretty much failed her evaluation. Nowhere does it say that NEW plants will be built, in fact most plants are just retrofitted beef plants. Which makes them STILL unsuitable for horses. Anyway, all this is out there on the net.

                                As far as what people will do when they can no longer feed their horses, well they can jolly well do what the rest of us do. Sell them, Give them away, euthanize them, shoot'em in the head and feed 'em to the crows. The choice is not starvation vs. slaughter, never has been. Horses not being fed out in the field are also NOT GOING TO SLAUGHTER. If they are not rescued by someone they end up dying out in the fields.

                                The horse slaughter industry (and the transporters and auction houses that run it) has shown that they have no interest in obeying laws for handling, transporting, killing, or humanely treating horses in any way. They have equal disdain for environmental laws and paying their fines for past indiscretions. This is like for all of horse slaughter history. Who said when someone tells or shows you who they are, you need to believe them? The horse slaughter people have shown us. Why do so few people believe them! How many undercover videos and USDA photos and reports have to be seen before people realize these people are not here to do a public service by getting rid of "unwanted" horses (so why aren't they ALL FREE?), they are here to make as much money with as little cost as they possibly can. And how that happens apparently is not of great concern to them.

                                For such a tiny niche market the pain and suffering per head is just way out of proportion.
                                89,000 shipped to Canada in 2011 (reference already stated here) Then there are the Canadian Horses. Couple that in with Mexico and Europe and it amounts to a BILLION dollar industry per year. This is according to the E.U.

                                Horsemeat is a higher priced meat in Europe over Pork, Chicken and Lamb.

                                This nonsense of ....you can sell your horse...I can guaranty you hundreds of thousands of dollars in commisions if you can sell very well bred horses of all breeds that are listed on every forum from Dream Horse to Craigs list.

                                It has been stated over and over...Slaughter is ONLY ONE PIECE of the puzzle.

                                I have been involved on a volunteer basis at a Canadian slaughter plant. The old information that is recycled is no longer relevant. Period. Tapes showing "abuse" at Canadian plants are NOT within the past 5 years. The reason we know that is the plants have be3en changed and the photos and videos do not reflect that change.

                                The new bolt is supposed to be 100%. I will wait until it is in use but the tests are very positive.

                                Anti slaughter trot out the old...they know of a guy who knows a lady who saw a video etc...showing a horse killed alive.

                                Does not happen in Canada and no need for it to happen with new plants and new rules in the U.S.A. American plants will be subject to inspections by Europeans and others on a regular basis. There is a LOT OF MONEY in the sale of horse meat and it may be considered niche here..but not in the rest of the world.

                                Please show me where Temple stated Canadian plants failed in the past five years. Her information stated in Dedc 2011 was proven wrong. There ARE videos on the kill floors. ...with the exception of one Quebec plant.

                                Funny how her misinbformation turns her into an authority but when she supports slaughter she is accused of accepting money from the industry for her statements.

                                This is a time for the U.S. plants to be set up properly and have very specific guidelines in place. It is also a time for individuals such as yourself to volunteer to oversee the kills.

                                I did...and so have so many others here in Alberta...expenses...we paid our own..we received a "free lunch"...nope...not horse meat.
                                The Elephant in the room

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                                • Originally posted by Bluey View Post
                                  Why would you think it is your place to tell others what to do with their horses?
                                  If someone feels that using THEIR horse thru slaughter is what they want to do, it really is no business of anyone but the horse owner.

                                  Would you like it if, now that people are learning it is not ok to just bury a carcass willy nilly, not very good for the environment, water, etc., now we ask there be laws to make EVERYONE send their unwanted/needing euthanizing horse to slaughter.

                                  Exactly.
                                  You're not seriously suggesting that a horse slaughterhouse is better for the environment than composting or burying a horse? Have you ever heard of the town of Kaufman? Or the numerous environmental violations that having a SH there had? 100k horses is about 2.5 horses per county. Burying or composting 2.5 horses per county will not cause the damage that a SH does.

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                                  • Originally posted by jetsmom View Post
                                    You're not seriously suggesting that a horse slaughterhouse is better for the environment than composting or burying a horse? Have you ever heard of the town of Kaufman? Or the numerous environmental violations that having a SH there had? 100k horses is about 2.5 horses per county. Burying or composting 2.5 horses per county will not cause the damage that a SH does.
                                    ah, yes, we are back to a 30, 40 year old plant that went offline 5 years ago....
                                    Yes, slaughter is better for the environment than burial. In many parts of the country it is not permitted to bury a dog, much less a horse.

                                    And that does not even take into account the contamination from chemical euthanasia.

                                    Composting...considering that we are also running into big problems with keeping enough manure on hand to do it properly, are you seriously suggesting that the above mentioned methods are always available?

                                    You have no idea what burying one horse per county can do to the environment.

                                    btw, the 'Kaufman' problem is hardly a problem of the horse industry...it had been reported a while back that similar environmental infractions were perpetrated by a pig packing plant. oops?

                                    It is a problem of lacking environmental conscience. It is stronger in some parts of the country than others.
                                    Originally posted by BigMama1
                                    Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
                                    GNU Terry Prachett

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                                    • Originally posted by Lady Eboshi View Post
                                      Who are these "some people?" In my area, quite frankly they are bottom-of-the-barrel d-bags, the sort that someone above described as out to make a profit totally without regard to the suffering of the animals involved. I have seen it with my own eyes. These are people who can't make it legitimately in the mainstream part of the horse business. They are jackals, both as horse people and as human beings, and you would not invite any of them in to dinner.

                                      One was an animal collector with a revolving door of acquire, starve, fail to provide proper vet/farrier, then dump in sale again, a revolving-door more of the same. For 25 years, and in plain sight! At least the State finally put this guy out of business.

                                      Another is an intinerant bottom-feeding dealer with a stock trailer who makes up stories to the CraigsListers about the "happy home," their horse will have with children, then runs 'em straight into New Holland as soon as the rig is full.

                                      The last is a very wealthy woman who ran her fabulous but older WB broodmares "through the sale" when they failed to catch; in spite of my offer to place them with someone who'd value and take care of them. We are no longer on speaking terms.

                                      None of these people were penniless and desperate. Far from it! All you slaughter proponents are doing is playing enabler to a class of people who don't give a sh*t about their horses. BTW, we have no "carcass disposal" problem whatsoever in one of the smallest states in the Union with a population of over 60,000 horses.

                                      Those arguments just don't hold water at all.
                                      I know people like that, in RESCUE from all places, people that don't have anything to do with slaughter.

                                      Abusers and idiots are all over the place, in all we do in life, slaughter is not exempt either, neither is any other place you care to look.
                                      It is a continuous struggle to keep such people at bay, if they are day care workers, there was just some such come out in the local news, doctors, teachers, priests, policemen, your neighborhood show trainer, the local rescue lady, you name it, you can find such people we call here "not worth killing".

                                      Animal rights extremists use those to brand all.
                                      Imagine there were some of the richest non-profits in the world with the agenda of destroying all teachers, wanting all kids to be free, no more schools, kids should be running around playing until they are old enough to work.
                                      That is what animal rights extremists groups are doing to all we do with animals, slaughter just the low hanging fruit and YOU ARE FALLING FOR IT.

                                      Don't follow bandwagons, use some common sense, think what you are saying thru before you try to tell what slaughter is or is not, because it is obvious you are going by myths and propaganda, don't really know.

                                      YOUR arguments are not holding water.

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                                      • Originally posted by jetsmom View Post
                                        You're not seriously suggesting that a horse slaughterhouse is better for the environment than composting or burying a horse? Have you ever heard of the town of Kaufman? Or the numerous environmental violations that having a SH there had? 100k horses is about 2.5 horses per county. Burying or composting 2.5 horses per county will not cause the damage that a SH does.
                                        Everything we do has consequences, no one is denying that.
                                        BUT, you are not being honest there, bringing the case of one plant that had a partially malfunctioning system to process water before being discharged, a plant that was where real estate was becoming pricey, or would if they could run industrial business out of there, like, horror, a slaughter plant.

                                        I agree, the plant was old and needed to go somewhere else and they knew that and were trying their best to run with what they had.

                                        Any other time, other place, they would have modernized, get their system replaced and stayed in business.
                                        With the city fighting them, with mega animal rights groups and their millions behind them pushing from all fronts to get them closed, they didn't have a chance, so they were not going to spend a penny they didn't need to before closing, paying the fines when the recycling failed was much cheaper.

                                        THAT is the way many plants work and yes, many pollute at times and are fined and that keeps on and on, until they shut them down or they modernize.

                                        I have explained that to you before and much else, but repeating animal rights extremist propaganda is what you want to do, not listen to history as it really happened, I guess.

                                        I sure hope some day someone does a good story on the animal rights extremists groups and all they do.
                                        There would be some eyes opened out there.
                                        I am glad the one circus decided to fight back and had a judge that would help them stand for justice and present how the HSUS paid people off to lie about how the circus mistreated their animals.

                                        Animal rights extremists groups made millions in donations to "save the poor circus animals" with false propaganda.
                                        Those are the people you are listening to about what slaughter was supposed to have been, on a few videos of abuse and some plant's broken regulations.

                                        I already explained to you time and again, all plants, restaurants, feed mills, you name it, are inspected.
                                        All inspectors find and write up what is not up to standard and come back to check again that it is fixed, or fines the business or eventually closes it.
                                        Slaughter was no different, but other business don't have mega million non-profits making their living of trying to shut them down, using that to ask for donations.
                                        That is what you fail to understand.

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                                        • Originally posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
                                          I realize that I am coming in at the tail end here, but what is it about horses that make some people lose touch with reality?

                                          Every year millions and millions of cats and dogs are routinely slaughtered in almost every town in the US.

                                          Millions of children are slaughtered around the world each year.

                                          But the killing of horses whether or not it is done for food, creates a great foaming at the mouth in some people.

                                          I just dont get it
                                          I don't get it either. Do they think they're not terrified when they're walked down the hall to the gas chamber? Do they think they're pain free when they're put down with a heart stick?

                                          Millions of cats and dogs are killed each year...yet we hear crickets.

                                          And Bluey, circuses are disgusting.
                                          Last edited by LauraKY; Mar. 3, 2013, 08:53 AM.

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