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HELP: Is anyone on here a lawyer? :/

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  • HELP: Is anyone on here a lawyer? :/

    I need some advice.
    First off, I'm in Canada. I don't know how much the laws vary from the US and here.

    We found out a while back that there's a bunch of drama around Shylo.
    Names
    "D" - Lady who owned Shylo. She is from the UK. She got ill and had to go back to the UK for the healthcare.
    "K" - Lady who "D" entrusted Shylo to while she ("D") was gone. "D", at some point, told "K" to find a home for Shylo, specifically on a free-lease only. (Unless "D" decided she liked the leasor and gave Shylo to them)
    "B" - Lady I bought Shylo from.

    THIS IS ALL HEARSAY

    "K" Free-leased Shylo to "B". "D" says that "B" refused to have contact with her. "D" says she told "K" not to give papers to "B". "B" somehow got a hold of papers, and we aren't sure what happened but somehow "D"s signature was forged. We don't know who by, but "D" has confirmed that the signature on the papers are not hers.
    "B" sold Shylo to me on June 26th, 2012.
    I had a feeling something was up. Stories just didn't match up, so I did some research and found "D"s facebook page. Messaged her. A few weeks later, I got a message back. I called her.
    "D" said Shylo was never supposed to be sold. She was supposed to be given away after a test free-lease. However "D" said she tried contacting "B" multiple times, and "B" refused to talk to her. "D" then told "K" not to give "B" papers.
    "D" said she would sign Shylo over to me, and she just wanted to talk to "K" and, try to talk to, "B" and figure out what happened.

    Didn't hear from "D" for a few weeks, so we called again. "D" said she hadn't had time. She said I could use her saddle. Gave us more information about Shylo's past. "D" said she would email me the next morning.

    It's now been 2 or 3 weeks. I have sent 3 emails asking how she is, and giving updates on Shylo. Still no response.
    Now "K" has messaged me and wants to come see Shylo. I don't trust anyone involved in this right now, and I certainly don't want to show "K" where Shylo is, for fear of Shylo going missing in the middle of the night.

    My question is this:
    Since "D" Has been gone for so long, and I have been providing for Shylo for almost 5 months, would it be considered abandonment? Is Shylo legally mine? Can I refuse having "K" come see her?

    I just want this over with. I want my horse to be my horse, and I want to be able to relax and not worry about this entire thing.

  • #2
    You need to talk to an actual lawyer in your area. There is no substitute for that.

    Do not take any action based on legal advice received from strangers on the internet.

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      I won't be taking any action until I talk to some real lawyers, I just want to know if 1. there are any lawyers on here. and 2. what people think I should do.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by SuaveShylo View Post
        I won't be taking any action until I talk to some real lawyers, I just want to know if 1. there are any lawyers on here.
        yes there are several. I am one

        and 2. what people think I should do.
        My advice is for you to contact a Canadian attorney if you have a legal question.

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          Originally posted by LMH View Post
          My advice is for you to contact a Canadian attorney if you have a legal question.
          What type would I contact? Like, what would the case be under? I've tried to talk to an online lawyer, just to get an idea, and there are so many options on what it's about, and none of them seem to fit. ><

          Comment


          • #6
            You need someone who has experience with Canadian "abandoned property" laws.
            I realize that I'm generalizing here, but as is often the case when I generalize, I don't care. ~ Dave Barry

            Comment


            • #7
              Your best bet is to consult someone experienced with equine law. A quick search finds some in BC- looks like you are from BC?.

              Don't discuss with any of the people involved until you consult a lawyer. Ask what a half hour or one hour consult would cost and start there.

              Comment


              • #8
                What about talking to the police about it?

                "I bought a horse that may technically be considered stolen, I have been in contact with the legal owner, and she says she is willing to sign her over to me, but the person who sold her won't give up the papers. To add to that, the person who the owner trusted to place her horse is now trying to come see her, but I am worried there is more to the story and that this horse may end up missing".

                Really, anytime you knowingly come into possession of stolen property you NEED to either contact a lawyer or the police, and by the sounds of it your horse is stolen property. Coming into possession of something stolen will not give you the right to keep it just because you have been paying to keep it.

                It sucks, but it is the right thing to do, and yes, you may loose the horse...because the seller had no right to sell her as they didn't OWN her.
                Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  I have her papers. My name is on them. (Yes, she is registered). However "D"s signature was forged.

                  "D" wanted to give the horse to a good home. She asked "K" to free lease her to someone, and it was a test to see if they were a good home. "B" free-leased her, got her hands on the papers, and someone (not sure if "K" or "B") forged "D"s signature.

                  "D" has said numerous times that she will sign over to me, but nothing has happened.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by SuaveShylo View Post
                    I need some advice.
                    First off, I'm in Canada. I don't know how much the laws vary from the US and here.

                    We found out a while back that there's a bunch of drama around Shylo.
                    Names
                    "D" - Lady who owned Shylo. She is from the UK. She got ill and had to go back to the UK for the healthcare.
                    "K" - Lady who "D" entrusted Shylo to while she ("D") was gone. "D", at some point, told "K" to find a home for Shylo, specifically on a free-lease only. (Unless "D" decided she liked the leasor and gave Shylo to them)
                    "B" - Lady I bought Shylo from.

                    THIS IS ALL HEARSAY

                    "K" Free-leased Shylo to "B". "D" says that "B" refused to have contact with her. "D" says she told "K" not to give papers to "B". "B" somehow got a hold of papers, and we aren't sure what happened but somehow "D"s signature was forged. We don't know who by, but "D" has confirmed that the signature on the papers are not hers.
                    "B" sold Shylo to me on June 26th, 2012.
                    I had a feeling something was up. Stories just didn't match up, so I did some research and found "D"s facebook page. Messaged her. A few weeks later, I got a message back. I called her.
                    "D" said Shylo was never supposed to be sold. She was supposed to be given away after a test free-lease. However "D" said she tried contacting "B" multiple times, and "B" refused to talk to her. "D" then told "K" not to give "B" papers.
                    "D" said she would sign Shylo over to me, and she just wanted to talk to "K" and, try to talk to, "B" and figure out what happened.

                    Didn't hear from "D" for a few weeks, so we called again. "D" said she hadn't had time. She said I could use her saddle. Gave us more information about Shylo's past. "D" said she would email me the next morning.

                    It's now been 2 or 3 weeks. I have sent 3 emails asking how she is, and giving updates on Shylo. Still no response.
                    Now "K" has messaged me and wants to come see Shylo. I don't trust anyone involved in this right now, and I certainly don't want to show "K" where Shylo is, for fear of Shylo going missing in the middle of the night.

                    My question is this:
                    Since "D" Has been gone for so long, and I have been providing for Shylo for almost 5 months, would it be considered abandonment? Is Shylo legally mine? Can I refuse having "K" come see her?

                    I just want this over with. I want my horse to be my horse, and I want to be able to relax and not worry about this entire thing.
                    Just for posterity
                    Michael: Seems the people who burned me want me for a job.
                    Sam: A job? Does it pay?
                    Michael: Nah, it's more of a "we'll kill you if you don't do it" type of thing.
                    Sam: Oh. I've never liked those.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yes, there are lots of lawyers on here, but none of them are going to give you legal advice. You're going to have to hire someone local to deal with this.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        It doesn't matter if you have the papers if you didn't get them signed over to you from the legal seller. You are in possession of property that was unlawfully sold and you need to contact law enforcement or a lawyer.

                        When you first got the horse you WERE innocent, and thought you were legally buying a horse. Now that you know otherwise you can no longer plead that same innocence.

                        Consider it also possible that "D" is staying on your good side so her horse doesn't go "poof" again. It is what people here on COTH would advise someone to do if their horse was unlawfully sold and they were out of the country.

                        You are in possession of stolen property. Do the right thing. Report it and be prepared to return to the legal owner.

                        Originally posted by SuaveShylo View Post
                        I have her papers. My name is on them. (Yes, she is registered). However "D"s signature was forged.

                        "D" wanted to give the horse to a good home. She asked "K" to free lease her to someone, and it was a test to see if they were a good home. "B" free-leased her, got her hands on the papers, and someone (not sure if "K" or "B") forged "D"s signature.

                        "D" has said numerous times that she will sign over to me, but nothing has happened.
                        Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I sense a trainwreck...could be wrong....

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            I'm awaiting a phone call from my Aunt, who is a lawyer. She's going to try and find someone who can help.

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #15
                              Originally posted by CHT View Post
                              It doesn't matter if you have the papers if you didn't get them signed over to you from the legal seller. You are in possession of property that was unlawfully sold and you need to contact law enforcement or a lawyer.

                              When you first got the horse you WERE innocent, and thought you were legally buying a horse. Now that you know otherwise you can no longer plead that same innocence.

                              Consider it also possible that "D" is staying on your good side so her horse doesn't go "poof" again. It is what people here on COTH would advise someone to do if their horse was unlawfully sold and they were out of the country.

                              You are in possession of stolen property. Do the right thing. Report it and be prepared to return to the legal owner.
                              She's in the UK and has already said she cant afford to get her back and just wants a good home for her.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                You are in possession of property that was unlawfully sold and you need to contact law enforcement or a lawyer.

                                When you first got the horse you WERE innocent, and thought you were legally buying a horse. Now that you know otherwise you can no longer plead that same innocence.

                                No. She is not necessarilly in possession of stolen property just because someone said so. Too many possibilities. Please get legal advice.

                                Comment

                                • Original Poster

                                  #17
                                  As I stated, I will be getting legal advice. Mum's not very happy that she has to help with all of this (I'm 5 months from turning 18, so mum has to do everything until then since she signed the bill of sale and such), but she understands.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Im a lawyer but um I'm a marine finance lawyer qualified in the UK so I cant give you advice but I know from my law exams many yrs ago that in the UK there is similar case law about cars where documents were forged on title and people purchased them without knowing they were stolen - while they were "buyers in good faith" so not guilty of wrong doing they ultimately were held not to own the car and it was returned to its original owner and then they had to try and go after the seller for return of funds (not easy if that person has no money or is in jail)... whether this would apply in your situation I have no idea but there is certainly a possibility you do not own the horse so I would get legal advice asap. The best solution for you would be if the original owner officially signs him over.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      PM Blugal;
                                      she's a lawyer in BC. If she can't help, I'm sure she'd steer you towards someone who can.

                                      Comment

                                      • Original Poster

                                        #20
                                        Messaged her! Thank-you Fanfayre!

                                        Comment

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