• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Virtual Horse Shopping is a very bad addiction -Don't do it!

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #41
    Paua, as I recall Fella was basically just trail broke and you had several issues with his ground manners, steering, brakes, and his canter. I think the people that critiqued his video when you bought him were very honest about what they saw and what you got was what we saw. I'm sure you realize the challenges of a rider inexperienced with green (in particular big, strong, and green) horses now that you've gone through it.

    This percheron is not broke, he is older and worn, and he will get you hurt. He is not the horse for you.
    http://weanieeventer.blogspot.com/

    Comment


    • #42
      Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
      Really. Sometimes you're so close to a thing that you lose perspective. So really please remind me of the Fella issues you're referring to.

      Aaah, you thought I was being a smart ass. No, that was not my intention.

      Paula
      Paula he had ground manners issues at the first barn then you had a couple of months there where you didn't ride him at all, right? And now he's in Wonderbarn with Wondertrainer and magically all is well.

      I wish you no harm but you either wax poetic to amp up the responses or you grossly overstate(d) your little flower's 'issues' in the interest of...interest. You've made Fella a center of attention with your many, many stories of his 'issues.'

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #43
        Ah yes. At Barn 1 we had no problem, we just had no training and I didn't have the skills to train him beyond getting him not to balk. He rode like a 2-legged horse being closely pursued by another 2-legged horse. And his canter was typical of a horse that couldn't use his hind end -he'd run into it. Barn 1 was where I'd ridden and worked for years. The trainer I'd intended to use because incapacitated with an injury.

        Fella at Barn 1

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=HDEgDlTkpJ0

        I found a dressage trainer and he went into full training at Barn 2. Barn 2 had a rule that you didn't ride the horse while she installed the buttons, but you rode her horses to learn the buttons. Within a couple of months Fella was basket case who bolted out of hand, and pulled down the trainer. I hadn't ridden him in months by then. This trainer convinced me to try calming supplements. However, when I suggested that perhaps he needed another trainer she kicked us out.

        Barn 3 was where we were heading, just not as precipitously. My friends rode there and whenever they were at shows their horses were lovely and all the student representatives rode well. The owner/trainer was an eventer and barrel racer who rehabbed draft horses for Gentle Giants. Her partner was also a barrel racer and trainer. She took us in and we waited for the explosion -because boy howdy he was hot and high when Ricky went with me to get him from Barn 2.

        No explosion. We figured he was drugged and gave him a couple of days to come down. Nothing. No explosion. It's like he took a breath. My new trainer Jessica rode him indoors, outdoors, and hacked him out. The first time I got on him at her barn after month and months of not riding him I rode like a crab and was wary of the ground. Nothing happened. I ride this horse indoors, outdoors, and on the trail. We did start conditioning with an eventer there. I did have an unscheduled dismount 2 Fridays ago! But I have my old horse back.

        It is like a miracle, but they say they've seen this before. I do not think those issues came from the seller -she (the woman who sold him to the broker) was as perplexed as I about his apparent nuttiness. I think, especially as I hear more and more stories about Barn 2 (including one observation that the horses this person had seen from that barn seemed a little wound up) that it was barn 2.

        Barn 2 trainer told me he was dangerous and I'd eventually sell him at auction and he'd end up in a can of dog food.

        I did not amp it up, and am not waxing poetic. These are the issues we went through. He's currently at Sunset Valley Farm in Union Bridge, MD with Jessica Millard. She is brilliant with man and beast. I had gotten so afraid to ride my horse that on our second lesson with her I froze with one foot on the mounting block and one foot in the stirrup (Fella standing still).
        "Oh, Jessica" was all I could say -stricken as I was.
        She smiled at me in her calming way and said, "That's okay, just take your time" and just like that I got on my horse.

        When we were having issues with saddle fit I started riding him bareback and hacked out bareback! This same horse that was such a terror. I'm sure someone here on the Chronicle knows this trainer and can attest.

        Fella and Me at Sunset Valley bareback http://www.flickr.com/photos/5296733...in/photostream

        Sunset Valley http://www.facebook.com/pages/Sunset...m/237409739198

        Does that clarify?
        Paula
        Last edited by paulaedwina; Nov. 5, 2012, 09:20 PM. Reason: fixing video link
        He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

        Comment


        • #44
          Yes, it clarifies that this percheron is not an appropriate horse for you. Pass.
          http://weanieeventer.blogspot.com/

          Comment


          • #45
            I see some very bad behavior in that video. I would pass. With a big horse like that, barn sourness (remember, he's worked as part of a team, and is not used to going by himself, either) is difficult to get around. He's reactive, pissy, and NOT happy about going away from the barn. Don't you think there's a reason he's not shown going happily up and away down the road but is instead being worked right there next to it? It's not because the camera man doesn't want to walk, I'd wager.

            Comment


            • #46
              I'll be the voice of reason here, not by critiqueing the new horse, but by simply pointing out that for folks working full time it's really difficult to accomplish your goals with one horse, never mind two! It sounds as though you're making progress toward your goals with Fella and your current trainer, and all of that slows down greatly when you're working two...especially two that are green, or at least not finished.
              When I had two horses, it was a constant struggle to find enough time for each of them. And my pony is insanely jealous!
              So admire from your monitor, dream away, and go back to ride your one horse

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #47
                Originally posted by Houndhill View Post
                I don't get it, OP.....what do you find appealing about this animal? Nothing about him spoke to me, so I am genuninely curious.
                I think he reminds me of Lily somehow. I think I look at him move and remember riding Lily the perch/qh http://www.flickr.com/photos/5296733...in/photostream

                And I like his neck and his comfy curvy body. I like riding drafts alot and he's like a compact truck at 15.3. He sort of reminds me of a Haffie cross at the barn -another compact couch. That's the best I can say -there's something in the way he moves that attracts me like few other horsies.

                Hinderella, you're right of course. I only have the one butt and I do work for a living. Sigh.

                Thatmoody, you have an eye (or objectivity ).


                Paula
                He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                Comment


                • #48
                  So you had no recollection and now it came flooding back.


                  Ok

                  Comment


                  • #49
                    I absolutely support your dreams . But Hinderella has a good point. What if something happens to Fella that you need the cash you're putting into jerky horse to pay for? THAT is what I worry about, so I try to stay a bit under budget. If I want a project horse, trust me, they are easy enough to find and you don't have to PAY to ride them! I currently am riding a very nice Morgan who acted (at first) just like this horse, so it's one reason I recognize the behavior. But he was neither so big nor so old, nor so solidified in the behavior. He was easier to get out of it, but still is not quite safe to ride. You HAVE to ride him in an enclosed arena, and he is a PITA. NOT something I'd recommend for even an experienced amateur.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #50
                      Yes, Katarine. I was driving home from my evening class thinking about it and couldn't wait to post. I gave it weighty and serious consideration.

                      Thatmoody, you're absolutely right. It makes no sense does it? Sigh. It's that time of year for this kind of squishy thinking too. And you guys are right too -Fella and I have come a long darned way so why mess with a good thing now right?

                      Paula
                      He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        He's a $700 horse at a broker who appears to typically price horses at $2-3,000. That's not "affordable," that's a red flag.

                        He clearly has training issues, and if you are honest with yourself based on your history with Fella, you're not in a position to work through training issues on your own yet.

                        So can you afford board + training and/or board + very regular lessons?

                        Can you afford spending double on basic horse care and still weather a major financial crisis?

                        Do you have a plan if he turns out just not to be suitable for you -- not sound enough, not able to stay sound enough, not the type of ride you enjoy, whatever? And be honest here; "I'll sell him" is easy to say, but you're talking about an older, green draft horse with training issues. What's the market for him really?

                        I say this as someone who made an impulse buy early this year. And then immediately had vet bills on my first horse and two surgeries on me in less than six months. I am grateful every day that I bought Dexter, and even more grateful that I ran the numbers, ran the numbers, made multiple contingency plans with my head instead of my heart, and ran the numbers again.

                        Stop the "squishy thinking." It's time to move beyond thinking with your heart and start thinking with your head.

                        If you take a hard (and realistic) look at him and decide you can make it work, more power to you. But for both your sakes, make sure you ARE taking a hard and realistic look at the situation.

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          But don't feel bad - I just sold my current horse and am NOT browsing. But only because my trainer and good friend is sitting on me. I have something else to ride, so no more projects for me for right now!

                          Comment


                          • #53
                            Originally posted by Sempiternal View Post
                            If I can sell my gelding there is a weanling filly that I have been drooling over for months now. More than likely she will be long since sold by the time I get my boy going (and with enough show experience) to get what I want for him. Oh well, I can still dream!
                            I thought my filly would be gone by the time I was ready to buy her. Since the time I first saw her, I "inherited" my mom's horse and we built a 6 stall barn very close to my work, with 3 horses in it. Two years later, somehow she was still available and I have constantly looked around and found nothing which suits my particular needs as well. She's in the age range I wanted as a next dressage horse, since I want to have more than one going at a time given how long training takes, especially for those of us who aren't pros, and the tendency horses have to self-injury.

                            Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                            Really. Sometimes you're so close to a thing that you lose perspective. So really please remind me of the Fella issues you're referring to.

                            Aaah, you thought I was being a smart ass. No, that was not my intention.

                            Paula
                            It was about the ground issues, the not riding, etc. You are inexperienced enough and interested in diversity of what you do enough that you should buy a horse you can happily jump on and go hack through the woods alone or with a friend, bareback with a halter if you want. Fella's heading the right direction for you now, but it doesn't always work out that well if you're buying a horse who doesn't already have the training and attitude down. And it can take years - which are not what a 15 year old who has lived a hard life is likely to have too many of.

                            As for the type of horse - the ones you love and find comfy are painful for me. But I absolutely think if you wanted a second horse there are plenty of the type you love who can perform, show, hack through woods and take care of you so you don't have to wait for someone else to get the horse trained for you. Probably some of them 15 and ready to "retire" from a harder competitive life but with the training you want already. You DESERVE that.

                            Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                            {snip}
                            I had gotten so afraid to ride my horse that on our second lesson with her I froze with one foot on the mounting block and one foot in the stirrup (Fella standing still).
                            "Oh, Jessica" was all I could say -stricken as I was.
                            She smiled at me in her calming way and said, "That's okay, just take your time" and just like that I got on my horse.
                            He is clearly a good citizen at heart. With a horse with less training and possibly less manners, you're likely to have that kind of fear again - but less likely to get as lucky a second time with a horse who will be there for you and help you work it out even after he was in a situation which for whatever reason made him nutty even as he was too untrained to really know what was expected. Folks think that the draft crosses are calmer, but really all being a draft cross means is they're typically physically capable of dragging you for longer if you get hung up. Beyond that, they are individuals and Fella's a good egg who needs training but has the right mind, but I'm not sure we've seen reason to believe that's from your knowledge vs. your luck.

                            As for the falling off? Meh, happens to everyone. If you posted the circumstances I missed them, but without knowing them I don't even give that a second thought.
                            Originally posted by Silverbridge
                            If you get anything on your Facebook feed about who is going to the Olympics in 2012 or guessing the outcome of Bush v Gore please start threads about those, too.

                            Comment


                            • #54
                              He does not look sound to me. Left hind is stiff. I would pass.

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #55
                                Thank you so much for talking me out of the tree! You're right -many of you

                                1. I can't afford 2 horses without a real squeeze.

                                2. I was very lucky with Fella in choosing him and the trainers I fell in with for the most part. He's a good boy, and kind and forgiving, and coming along very nicely. Spinning the barrel again may not result in good fortune a second time, and I am not skilled enough on my own to have two unfinished horses.

                                3. Yes, it's definitely my trainers skills not my own that have gotten me this far and so aside from purchasing a second horse, I should, right up front, figure in a few months training!

                                4. The unscheduled dismount. It was after a lesson and we were out on our second conditioning ride with the eventer who graciously allows us to go with her as she brings a new horse along. There are lots of hills and a hacking trail at Sunset Valley so much room for WTC. We were galloping up one one hill, I was in two point, it was amazing, and then we started veering into the rough (still no big deal) and then he bucked. If I were sitting it wouldn't have been an issue, but in 2 point -a position I hadn't seriously assumed in years so it was probably not balanced anyway -I went right over his left shoulder.

                                I lay there a while contemplating the sky and WTF just happened why Alyssa held Fella (he didn't run off or anything that). Apparently I was loud about coming off and heard through the valley by man and horse, because my trainer came flying up on her gator. Bless her heart, she made me get back on and finish my course This was probably the very best thing since I am prone to being a bit neurotic

                                Analysis: Not sure what happened. I am riding treeless so I wonder if 2-point put pressure any particular place on his back? But I've been riding treeless and I've been in 2 point on his back in this situation before.

                                Exuberance -it was a cold, crisp, Fall day?

                                I think maybe it was my spurs (short POWs). I'd worn them in lesson for the first time in a while. I thought about taking them off before going out, but didn't. Perhaps in 2 point I inadvertently spurred him -might explain the veer to the right.

                                Things to do differently the next time out.

                                1. No spurs
                                2. I'm buying an eventer vest because I don't bounce like I used to. Dang.

                                So disaster averted. I am not going to pursue Randy.

                                Thanks, guys!

                                Paula
                                Last edited by paulaedwina; Nov. 6, 2012, 07:30 AM. Reason: Clarity
                                He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  In a nutshell you get what you pay for...$700. horse is a $700. horse....

                                  Comment

                                  • Original Poster

                                    #57
                                    LOL! My problem is I admire people like Carl Hester who cut his dressage eyeteeth on cheap horses. I conveniently forget him talking about being mashed and chucked in the process

                                    Paula
                                    He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      Yeah, I just sold my cheap horse, but I deliberately didn't talk about all the times I came off him - those are just part of the process. Besides, don't want to hurt his sales chances, and by the time he's prepped for sale, those times should be well over. He's off to his eventing home, and is VERY talented, so all's well that ends well, eh? BUT, those talented horses, what they don't tell you is that athletic usually equals some shennanigans at the beginning.

                                      Comment


                                      • #59
                                        Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                                        4. The unscheduled dismount. It was after a lesson and we were out on our second conditioning ride with the eventer who graciously allows us to go with her as she brings a new horse along. There are lots of hills and a hacking trail at Sunset Valley so much room for WTC. We were galloping up one one hill, I was in two point, it was amazing, and then we started veering into the rough (still no big deal) and then he bucked. If I were sitting it wouldn't have been an issue, but in 2 point -a position I hadn't seriously assumed in years so it was probably not balanced anyway -I went right over his left shoulder.
                                        Meh, still doesn't really bother me. Very likely exuberance, even if the spur was involved, too. I think most horses not used to getting to go very forward (or encouraged to) forget themselves a little, but sounds like he had a very honest reaction rather than intending misbehavior.

                                        If you really think you want a second horse, I think 15 and on his way down from a higher performance career could be exactly what you could use. And I say this as the woman whose first horse tried to kill me regularly. I was simply too stubborn (and young) to let her win!

                                        My VERY athletic TB I have now has done all kinds of shenanigans with me including scaring a few years out of a clinician who thought his aerials would make me hit the ground and more than one ride where my trainer said she would have gotten off and not tried to ride him through it. And I came off him when he half passed too steeply.... Yes, I was asking for the half pass. ;-)
                                        Originally posted by Silverbridge
                                        If you get anything on your Facebook feed about who is going to the Olympics in 2012 or guessing the outcome of Bush v Gore please start threads about those, too.

                                        Comment

                                        • Original Poster

                                          #60
                                          You know, I thought it was exuberance too. Basically I aimed him at the hill and got out of his way and he was having a blast (it felt like such a surge of power -it was awesome). My anthropomorphic interpretation was, "Woohoo this is great! Hey, where'd ya go? Whatcha doin' down there?"

                                          Yes, I think if I do get a second horse for competitive trail and fun it would be an older smarty coming down from an intense career. That would be what I needed; smart, seasoned, and happy to just fart around in the woods, around barrels and the like. Sort of a home for a happy-but-sound retirement. Thank you; that gives me context.

                                          Paula
                                          He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X