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Made a purchase with my heart

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  • #41
    Originally posted by nikelodeon79 View Post
    Had a talk with my trainer. She advised to wait until the end of the month and re-evaluate his progress then. She will help me try to place him (if the original seller doesn't want him back she works closely with several rescues) if I decide to do that.
    The longer you wait the less and less likely it is that the original owner will take the horse back even with you letting them keep the purchase money.

    Have you even contacted them about returning the horse and letting them keep the money?

    Sorry but I'm starting to think you're living in a fantasy land.

    Comment


    • #42
      Originally posted by Laurierace View Post
      OMG. "Thoroughbreddy?!?!" Now I really question your trainer's qualifications as well.
      I dunno. I call some Appaloosas, "Appaloosasally" and some Saddlebreds, "Saddlebreddy". Breeds do have their breed characteristics.

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      • #43
        Every horse we buy is a gamble.
        We increase the odds in our favor by due diligence, but it is still a gamble that the horse will be as described, not everyone has the same idea of what a horse is or is not and if he will be the same horse under your management as he was previously.

        That is not even taking into account sellers with fuzzy ethics not quite being honest about the horse.

        Now, if you can't or won't return the horse you really can't use as intended, then you are becoming that horse's seller if you decide to let him go, the rest is moot question now.

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        • #44
          Originally posted by showhorsegallery View Post
          I dunno. I call some Appaloosas, "Appaloosasally" and some Saddlebreds, "Saddlebreddy". Breeds do have their breed characteristics.
          Agree!
          And few object to using breed charactoristics and/or stereotypes as a description until it is their breed.

          I took it as meaning a high-energy, forward horse.

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          • Original Poster

            #45
            Originally posted by showhorsegallery View Post
            The longer you wait the less and less likely it is that the original owner will take the horse back even with you letting them keep the purchase money.

            Have you even contacted them about returning the horse and letting them keep the money?

            Sorry but I'm starting to think you're living in a fantasy land.
            Honestly? I don't think the original owner wants him back. I'm not banking everything on her taking him back. If I do sell him, I'll give her the first opportunity, since she has first right of refusal. She's currently on a vacation somewhere (I'm FB friends with her and she posted yesterday about boarding a plane) so it's not like she can take him back now even if she wants him.

            I wanted a project horse to work with over the winter, and I have one. He's not as far along as I thought... that's my bad. If he's sound, I don't think it's a terrible thing to consider training him and seeing what kind of horse he turns out to be.

            Really, was it necessary to put in that "dig" at the end of your post? Just because I don't run out and immediately take YOUR advice means I'm living in a "fantasy land?" I absolutely rushed into this purchase... but that doesn't mean I should rush out of it. I'm going to take my time, consider my options, and decide where to go from there.

            I'm going to trust my trainer, and I'm going to take her advice over faceless people on the 'net who enjoy hurling insults. (That's your cue to start the "why did you post this thread if you weren't going to listen to us" posts).

            I DO appreciate all of the advice and will be taking everything into consideration. I'm just not in a huge rush to unload this horse today.

            Originally posted by MoonoverMississippi View Post
            Agree!
            And few object to using breed charactoristics and/or stereotypes as a description until it is their breed.

            I took it as meaning a high-energy, forward horse.
            Yes, exactly. Sorry if the TB people took offense. She just meant "different than a quarter horse," since that's mostly what I grew up with.

            I find it funny that people automatically question my trainer's qualifications based on false assumptions over terms she uses. BTW I found her based on recommendations on COTH.

            Comment


            • #46
              OP - Are you having the vet out to make sure he will be sound for riding in the future? I'd just make sure the vet is pretty sure he will be able to handle the training. There's a big difference between a sound project and a possibly lame one.

              If the vet is reasonably convinced he'll stay sound, then you might as well stick with him, but if there is some uncertainty I'd try to rehome him now before you spend too much.
              Southern Cross Guest Ranch
              An All Inclusive Guest Ranch Vacation - Georgia

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              • #47
                Originally posted by Laurierace View Post
                OMG. "Thoroughbreddy?!?!" Now I really question your trainer's qualifications as well.
                Stereotypes exist for a reason. I certainly don't get offended when one of my instructors shakes her head and says "red headed thoroughbred mare" when my, well, sorrel throwback QH mare with lots of TB blood, acts like an opinionated, stubborn, strong mare. Or when bringing in on a windy/stormy night at our boarding barn, every single Arabian is uppity and snorting and spooky, while most of the QHs are still calm and just ready for their food. Every breed has characteristics, both positive and negative, that you can see show up often enough to become stereotypes.
                If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude.
                ~ Maya Angelou

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                • #48
                  Is this horse an OTTB? If so....he's not throwing rodeo fits because he's not used to being ridden. If anything, a horse who's been raced is going to be better at accepting a rider--he's already had a job, he has carried weight and worn tack, he knows full well that a bucking fit is not appropriate.

                  What you're describing isn't "Thoroughbredy" (which is why people are questioning your trainer's use of that term). A stereotypical TB might be up and responsive (though there are always slugs like mine in the mix) but not violent. Bucking fits, refusal to relax, and the hip injury all sounds like he is in pain. If this ISN'T pain, and he really was on the track and thinks this is appropriate behavior...you got a bad one, not a typical one.

                  I'm not sure-you say he was "kept" at a rescue-was he owned by them? If so, and they're a legitimate rescue and not just calling themselves that, they should have no problem taking a bad fit back, even if it means you lose the deposit. And I think the one poster said "fantasy land" because you have said you're a timid rider with confidence issues, you admit you made a mistake picking this horse, he is showing dangerous tendencies and isn't remotely what you thought you needed, and...you're considering making him a light riding horse? From one person with confidence issues to another: that is a train wreck waiting to happen.
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                  • Original Poster

                    #49
                    Originally posted by OveroHunter View Post
                    OP - Are you having the vet out to make sure he will be sound for riding in the future? I'd just make sure the vet is pretty sure he will be able to handle the training. There's a big difference between a sound project and a possibly lame one.
                    Yes, the vet is coming out today. I also have the vet records from the prior owner and the massage therapist checked him out yesterday. He said he was sore in the whither area which could definitely account for his uneasiness with the saddle.

                    Originally posted by danceronice View Post
                    Is this horse an OTTB?
                    No, he's not an OTTB. He's a paint that looks like he has Thoroughbred blood.

                    If anyone wants to see the videos the former trainer took, they are here: http://www.youtube.com/user/Dogandponyshow711

                    What you're describing isn't "Thoroughbredy" (which is why people are questioning your trainer's use of that term). A stereotypical TB might be up and responsive (though there are always slugs like mine in the mix) but not violent.
                    I'm sorry.. I'm just really finding it difficult to be clear.

                    My trainer wasn't describing the bucking, etc. as being Thoroughbred-like. I think what she was referring to is the difference in responsiveness... and possibly the "reaction time" difference between a "stereotypical" laid back QH and a TB. She thinks he's going to end up being a fun ride, but not a dead broke QH type.

                    Bucking fits, refusal to relax, and the hip injury all sounds like he is in pain.
                    Yes, and that's what we're going to rule out first. And honestly the "rodeo bucking" is something I've seen in paints/QH's before so I wouldn't classify that as "a TB thing" and I don't think my trainer would, either.

                    I'm not sure-you say he was "kept" at a rescue-was he owned by them?
                    No, he was not owned by the rescue. The owner has a friend who runs a rescue and she was simply boarding him there.

                    And I think the one poster said "fantasy land" because you have said you're a timid rider with confidence issues, you admit you made a mistake picking this horse, he is showing dangerous tendencies and isn't remotely what you thought you needed, and...you're considering making him a light riding horse? From one person with confidence issues to another: that is a train wreck waiting to happen.
                    I would only consider him for a light riding horse if AFTER all of his training, he is okay behaviorally but not sound enough for heavy riding. I would never just take him home now, without a trainer's assistance, and expect him to be a pasture puff with a part time job.

                    Here's a bit about my background: I started riding/got a pony at the age of 11. I pretty much lived in the saddle. When I was in high school I had a job as a trail riding guide and trainer for a private riding stable. My second horse was a very green QH and I did all his training myself. My third horse was an abused Arab that had been a stud for 17 years and had recently been gelded. He had no saddle training whatsoever. I trained him myself.

                    During college, I didn't do a lot of riding, just occasional stuff when I'd get home for weekends. After college I did a bit of training for a few local clients... ended up giving that up because I didn't like dealing with the people.

                    After I retired my old geldings I didn't ride for about four years. Recently I started riding again with lessons. I want to learn to ride English.. almost all of my prior experience has been Western.

                    I now find myself unsure in the saddle and have a lot of bad habits... I guess that's to be expected for someone who was basically self taught. I think some of my uncertainty has to do with the fact that I have a one year old son... in my trainer's words I "have a lot to live for." Back when I was young I thought I was unbreakable but I guess we all realize that we're not superman at some point.

                    In reality I have the ability to stay on and control a difficult horse... but I'd rather pay someone to do it and to do it BETTER. My trainer has loads more experience than I do and is a fantastic rider. In short... she knows what she's doing and I only THOUGHT I knew what I was doing back when I was "training."

                    After discussing this with my trainer, I'm seeing this more as an opportunity for me to also learn a lot more about training a horse the way it should be done.

                    I still haven't completely ruled out rehoming the horse sooner rather than later but I haven't ruled out keeping him and seeing what happens, either. It's definitely a risk but nothing in horses is a sure thing, I guess.

                    I should also note that if I want a horse just to ride, I can take a lesson on any of my trainer's school horses, or even on the OTTB rescue she's helping to rehab for one of the local rescues.

                    Comment


                    • #50
                      The horse in those videos looks green but not difficult...so if you are seeing a lot of bad behavior now, like bucking and such, I would not attribute it to nastiness or even a lack of experience on his part. He has clearly been tacked up and ridden, so this isn't new to him. He's been handled. What you've got going on now is most likely either pain or him not being handled properly by you/your trainer (I don't mean that to be insulting...heck, I've discovered to my dismay more than once that something a horse is doing is MY fault!).

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        Wow...I see a lot of folks on this thread over-dramatizing things and not reading for comprehension.

                        Let me see if I have this right: OP is regretting a purchase she made in haste with her heart instead of her head based on pics/video of a cute TB. She bought him cheap. He was purchased from a private seller, NOT a rescue - the rescue happens to be working out of the same barn.

                        Upon bringing horsey home and attempting to start working him, discovered he was way greener than thought previously, and possibly in pain.

                        Scheduled the vet, and started to think about a plan B in case horsey doesn't work out, which is looking likely as OP has some confidence issues.

                        Seller will not take horse back. Responsible OP doesn't want to dump him somewhere, and is willing to have vet look at horsey as well as invest some training time in him. OP has already talked about either getting him sold once he is a little easier to handle/ride, OR sending horsey to her parent's farm AFTER he spends time in training if it looks like he will not be sound enough to do more than light riding.

                        In the mean time, OP has already identified another horse that may he more suitable for what she wants. She cannot afford to board two horses, so dealing with her purchased horse comes first.

                        Now, because she is not great at how she phrased a few things in her posts people are jumping her. Without referring to subsequent posts where she clears up a lot of the questions/confusion if people would slow down and read what she is saying.

                        Some of the things being assumed or asserted:

                        OP is in a hurry to ride said very green horse and will get hurt.
                        Horse is dangerous and OP will be hurt just handling him.
                        OP should dump horse back on seller even though seller doesn't want/won't take horse back.
                        OP is going to take horse to parents farm and leave him but try to ride him in the future without any further training.
                        OP's trainer is a whack job for trying to get the horse to drop its head and relax under saddle.
                        OP's trainer is a whack job for saying the horse looks/acts like its breed which may stand out to people more used to dealing with another breed.
                        OP is too stupid to figure out it isn't a good match and needs us to vehemently insist she push horse back on the seller.

                        I think the OP fully realizes the horse isn't a good match for her, thus the origin of the thread. I believe instead of being treated like an idiot, maybe she was hoping folks would chime in with times they have made a mistake in purchasing (as many have)so she doesn't feel so alone. Sounds to me like she already has a plan of action as far as having the vet look at the horse and then putting some training into him to either get him sold or moved to the farm once he is suitable for light riding.
                        Bolter Bolter Bolter!!

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                        • #52
                          Really, if you're switching disciplines, I would cut my losses now and get a horse who's a solid quiet packer in the style I want--QH from the HUS ring? Especially if you have a kid and are worried about that. Or, if it turns out he's injured, pasture-puff him if you have somewhere to do that cheaply, and get a horse with fewer issues. If I could do something over again in my horse career, I'd start out with a horse who wasn't green and learn to jump on that instead of dealing with 'building' one.
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                          • #53
                            Originally posted by alittlegray View Post
                            Wow...I see a lot of folks on this thread over-dramatizing things and not reading for comprehension.
                            Please don't try to be a voice of reason. It's way more fun to spin things out of control. #BecauseCOTH

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                            • Original Poster

                              #54
                              Originally posted by alittlegray View Post
                              Wow...I see a lot of folks on this thread over-dramatizing things and not reading for comprehension.

                              Let me see if I have this right: OP is regretting a purchase she made in haste with her heart instead of her head based on pics/video of a cute TB. She bought him cheap. He was purchased from a private seller, NOT a rescue - the rescue happens to be working out of the same barn.

                              Upon bringing horsey home and attempting to start working him, discovered he was way greener than thought previously, and possibly in pain.

                              Scheduled the vet, and started to think about a plan B in case horsey doesn't work out, which is looking likely as OP has some confidence issues.

                              Seller will not take horse back. Responsible OP doesn't want to dump him somewhere, and is willing to have vet look at horsey as well as invest some training time in him. OP has already talked about either getting him sold once he is a little easier to handle/ride, OR sending horsey to her parent's farm AFTER he spends time in training if it looks like he will not be sound enough to do more than light riding.

                              In the mean time, OP has already identified another horse that may he more suitable for what she wants. She cannot afford to board two horses, so dealing with her purchased horse comes first.

                              Now, because she is not great at how she phrased a few things in her posts people are jumping her. Without referring to subsequent posts where she clears up a lot of the questions/confusion if people would slow down and read what she is saying.

                              Some of the things being assumed or asserted:

                              OP is in a hurry to ride said very green horse and will get hurt.
                              Horse is dangerous and OP will be hurt just handling him.
                              OP should dump horse back on seller even though seller doesn't want/won't take horse back.
                              OP is going to take horse to parents farm and leave him but try to ride him in the future without any further training.
                              OP's trainer is a whack job for trying to get the horse to drop its head and relax under saddle.
                              OP's trainer is a whack job for saying the horse looks/acts like its breed which may stand out to people more used to dealing with another breed.
                              OP is too stupid to figure out it isn't a good match and needs us to vehemently insist she push horse back on the seller.

                              I think the OP fully realizes the horse isn't a good match for her, thus the origin of the thread. I believe instead of being treated like an idiot, maybe she was hoping folks would chime in with times they have made a mistake in purchasing (as many have)so she doesn't feel so alone. Sounds to me like she already has a plan of action as far as having the vet look at the horse and then putting some training into him to either get him sold or moved to the farm once he is suitable for light riding.
                              THANK YOU!!!

                              I think you have everything straight.

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                Too much, too fast, the horse doesn't know you from Adam, he is in a different place...


                                What I would recommend you do is step back and choose with your mind...
                                Have a vet out right away to give him a post purchase exam and check his old injury if it is likely to ever give a problem again or there are other factors that may affect his soundess in the future cut your losses and send him back.
                                If he passes and you can afford to train and board him until he is broke enough to meet your riding goals keep him.
                                A pussycat of a horse with a chewed off tail won the triple crown, The Cubs won the world series and Trump won the Presidency.
                                Don't tell me 'It can't be done.'

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                                • #56
                                  Originally posted by 5 View Post
                                  What I would recommend you do is step back and choose with your mind...Have a vet out right away to give him a post purchase exam and check his old injury if it is likely to ever give a problem again or there are other factors that may affect his soundess in the future cut your losses and send him back.
                                  Of course the seller doesn't want him back. Wonder why. And that's not a question!

                                  You need to grow a pair and act on this faster. The terms of the sale went far beyond simply buyer's remorse.

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                                  • Original Poster

                                    #57
                                    Originally posted by babecakes View Post
                                    Of course the seller doesn't want him back. Wonder why. And that's not a question!

                                    You need to grow a pair and act on this faster. The terms of the sale went far beyond simply buyer's remorse.
                                    What on earth do you know about "the terms of the sale?"

                                    What exactly do you want me to "act" on? Shall I turn the horse loose? Give him to the kill buyer? (Wait, I forgot, that's not an option any longer, is it).

                                    I am "acting" by getting the horse vetted, evaluating him with a qualified trainer, and keeping my options open.

                                    But maybe I should just "grow a pair," track down the seller wherever she may be at the moment and force her to take the horse back. Shall I demand my money back while I'm at it? On an "as is" sale for a $600 horse?

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                                    • #58
                                      Obviously, I cannot know the whole story just by watching the videos, but it appears to me that the horse was started using Parelli-esque techniques. If so, that could explain why he has barely been ridden. Did they give you any more explanation of his training besides "ground work"? Like what exactly they did?

                                      I would get a vet out and give the horse a little more time to settle with your trainer. He may be totally inappropriate or he may be reacting to a new place, trainer, training style, etc.

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                                      • #59
                                        So, you bought a horse with questionable soundness with an as is agreement. And then you posted this publicly and you take offense when people react.

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          I am just curious as to how long he was at your place before you rode him for the first time?

                                          FYI my horse who is 8 and I have had her for over 7 years will buck like a lunatic on the lunge ( as in feeling good) if I haven't ridden her for a couple of days. I usually always lunge her a bit ( no arena here) before I ride to assess her personality and energy level before we head out. She is a high energy girl. I would encourage you to do some free lunging( saddled) in the arena before you mount your boy, for the same reasons at first.

                                          You said they hadn't ridden this horse in a month or more. I think you should just relax, work him lightly at least 5 days a week , have your trainer ride him ( you fill in the other days on him) get to know each other and see where you are at the end of Winter. Even if you feel he isn't a good match by that time your extra work might make him easier to sell and will give you needed experience in the saddle.

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