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ColoredCowHorse's horses seized?

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  • Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
    LOL, I am certain there are aspects that make money for a rescue, or there would not be so many scam artists in the business.
    I think the ones scamming to make money aren't putting anything into the horses (vet care, training, sometimes even feed), are charging insanely high fees and playing on people's emotions (this horse will DIE DIE DIE if you don't come up with this money RIGHT NOW!), and are moving horses in and out quickly.

    It used to be that our adoption fees equaled are vet bills. But with the crash of the horse market, our adoption fees are way less but vet expenses have gone up. So it has probably been 5-6 years since our vet bills didn't far exceed our adoption fees. (I would have to look at financials to give the exact year, just going on memory).
    Visit us at Bluebonnet Equine Humane Society - www.bluebonnetequine.org

    Want to get involved in rescue or start your own? Check out How to Start a Horse Rescue - www.howtostartarescue.com

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    • Originally posted by Chester's Mom View Post
      Just jumping in here to note... I work in dog rescue and it is so often the breeders who end up taking in animals seized. Not because of something rare/expensive/etc but because

      1) they know the breed and can more intelligently evaluate what they have and what it needs in terms of placement

      2) have the space & connections to handle the animal's medical needs, rehab, etc (existing relationships often with scale discounts with vets, etc)

      3) love their breed and "give back" by doing rescue work

      Horse rescue of course is different by far, they are much larger and don't (typically) live in your house but I would imagine in at least some cases the drive to rescue is the same.

      In this case, those feet by themselves show how long there has been a problem. Added to continued breeding, at least for 2011 foals when the market was already down, shows CCH was not seeing reality.

      It is so much easier on oneself to blame others covetousness (sp?) for your horses being gone. They didn't sell at her prices because she over-valued what she had. Period. Sounds like she continues to overvalue them by deciding that is why they are now gone.....

      CGJ I know you have to have heard it: you got that dog/horse for free! Why does the rescue charge so much money for adoption?!

      And the answer is, NO ONE makes money in rescue. No one. If you truly are vetting the animals and checking out the adopters you lose time, money and sometimes your hair (as you pull it out).

      I'm not defending this rescue specifically, it certainly sounds like there are many reasons to be worried about their being over-horsed, underfunded possibly understaffed and maybe on their way to being a problem but I personally do not think (after seeing the pictures and reading her own words) that CCH can complain about her horses being seized. Their feet alone and the time it took for them to get that bad show she should have been prepared for their seizure for a long, long time. Perhaps even before the July 1st date noted previously where she got her first "written warning"....
      The IRS records for GG and DEFHR would dispute your "no rescue" makes money and they are NOT the exception. That is why they train others how to set up rescues (one doesn't offer that type of service unless if is profitable)
      The Elephant in the room

      Comment


      • This part all by itself is just "off".

        Originally posted by Iron Horse Farm View Post
        Again, I have NEVER heard of a rescue that doesn't want to be contacted - that it "takes away from the horses".

        A rescue with this type of mentality will NEVER get the meaning of "reputable".
        The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
        H. Cate

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        • Originally posted by sketcher View Post
          And I call bullshit on the need to have a 30 day quarantine on horses that look pretty healthy to the naked eye.
          Naked eyes can be deceiving and why deadly diseases such as Strangles (which was reported on her farm) keep infecting horses year after year. Most reputable places quarantine horses with unknown or suspect health histories for at least three weeks.

          If you are a rescue, you should be able to evaluate horses quickly and take advantage of homes offered as soon as possible unless the horse is in poor enough condition to require stabilization.
          Apparently, you have no experience with infectious diseases. Horses that look to be in perfect condition can be harboring infections. Why do you think most rated horse shows require health certificates less than 30 days old, in addition to a Coggins? Not that it stops all spread of infection but every bit of precaution helps.

          No way I'd take on this dipshiit's horses without quarantining them for at least 30 days. Good grief. There's a very high probability most of them have never had any shots or seen a vet in their entire lives (or farrier either). The owner herself said there had been Strangles at her place. Ever watch a horse die from that or one of the many complications?

          Comment


          • Okay, so the horse herd had strangles within the past year at least. So, these horses have been hauled h*llandgone all over NV, exposed the horses in the sale barn and NOW, have exposed the huge herd at the rescue. People seem to want these horses...which brings up another thought...where the h*ll were these people when CCH was trying to sell for $1-$750?? You really think this *ahem* rescue is gonna let them go so cheaply??...anyway, back to my original thought (hello, ADHA again), people now seem to want these horses and they are going to be hauled all over creation whenever the quarantine is up. But what about the horses which show up at the sale barn from now on?? Sounds like a cluster is either going on or may be in the making...
            GR24's Musing #19 - Save the tatas!!

            Comment


            • Yes, the need for quarantine is important. (sorry, I haven't been following the whole thread but this caught my eye.)

              Most places I've seen quarantine, like rcloisonne says, for at least three weeks.

              Heck, because my horse trailered down overnight with a commercial shipper, even though I know his health history everything, my current barn quarantined him for a couple weeks just to be on the safe side.
              The Trials and Jubilations of a Twenty-Something Re-rider
              Happy owner of Kieran the mostly-white-very-large-not-pony.

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              • Anyone who buys from the sale barn from now on, better have a good quarantine spot for just in case.
                GR24's Musing #19 - Save the tatas!!

                Comment


                • Originally posted by goneriding24 View Post
                  Anyone who buys from the sale barn from now on, better have a good quarantine spot for just in case.
                  Anyone who buys from any sale barn should have a good quarantine spot set up regardless. Why risk finding out your "good eye" was wrong? It only takes one horse in the wrong place at the wrong time.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by MoonoverMississippi View Post
                    Anyone who buys from any sale barn should have a good quarantine spot set up regardless. Why risk finding out your "good eye" was wrong? It only takes one horse in the wrong place at the wrong time.
                    Heck, I expect any decent BO would quarantine a new arrival. My mare was quarantined for 2 weeks after moving to her new barn, and she had Coggins, was up to date on everything and had a vet exam within 30 days (as she was shipped across the border).
                    Proud Member Of The Lady Mafia

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                    • Anything coming onto my property without a full vaccination and travel history gets quarantined. Time of quarantine depending on history.

                      Anything coming from a rescue, auction or sales barn/dealer get 30-45 days quarantine automatically.

                      Quarantine doesn't mean "Comes from a disease-ridden cess pool." It just means, "came into contact with many animals and locations without vaccination records." IMO it's SOP to quarantine. Strangles alone is such a royal pita to deal with. Separation is MUCH easier than dealing with that.
                      You jump in the saddle,
                      Hold onto the bridle!
                      Jump in the line!
                      ...Belefonte

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                      • Not just strangles, didn't at least one horse in the herd have pigeon fever also? That's contagious too, and can't a horse be a carrier for a good length of time without showing symptoms? That's my understanding at least. Sounds like a high-risk situation and quarantine should definitely be in order.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by GaitedGloryRider View Post
                          Not just strangles, didn't at least one horse in the herd have pigeon fever also? That's contagious too, and can't a horse be a carrier for a good length of time without showing symptoms? That's my understanding at least. Sounds like a high-risk situation and quarantine should definitely be in order.
                          From what I read it was more of a soil born deal.
                          However, the vets might have to chime in.
                          Originally posted by BigMama1
                          Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
                          GNU Terry Prachett

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by cowgirljenn View Post
                            I think the ones scamming to make money aren't putting anything into the horses (vet care, training, sometimes even feed), are charging insanely high fees and playing on people's emotions (this horse will DIE DIE DIE if you don't come up with this money RIGHT NOW!), and are moving horses in and out quickly.

                            It used to be that our adoption fees equaled are vet bills. But with the crash of the horse market, our adoption fees are way less but vet expenses have gone up. So it has probably been 5-6 years since our vet bills didn't far exceed our adoption fees. (I would have to look at financials to give the exact year, just going on memory).
                            COTH was wonky a little while ago and ate my reply.

                            I did not mean to imply that most rescues are crooked.

                            A reputable place ought to be run like a business, with less expenses than income. Reserves are always a good thing!

                            However, for every good organization we come across, thee is easily one or two of that other kind, and they garner all the attention.
                            I think the place is out west, basically brokering dealer horses, and the outfit with the similar battle cry out east: Buy or it ships to Canada!

                            Then of course there is the lovely Lady from Virginia (or was it West Virginia? I don't want to get it wrong) who's escapades could fill a library by now.

                            And if Fairfax is right, there are by now a number of places that seem to have sold their soul to the Devil and support agenda over mission statement. He seems to be positive that he has proof to it.....
                            Originally posted by BigMama1
                            Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
                            GNU Terry Prachett

                            Comment


                            • Boy howdy, FB is alight right now. Didn't somewhere CCH say she wanted anywhere from $1 to $750 for her horses?? Did I read that right??
                              GR24's Musing #19 - Save the tatas!!

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                                From what I read it was more of a soil born deal.
                                However, the vets might have to chime in.
                                Yes, soil born from my understanding too (and carried by birds? if I'm remembering correctly? Maybe, maybe not, if I weren't so lazy I'd google it). But infected horses develop abscesses (like with strangles) and when those are lanced or burst on their own, the drainage and the horse it's coming out of are contagious.

                                I also vaguely remember my vet telling me (hopefully I'm remembering correctly else I'm just going to end up sounding like a moron) that a horse can be a carrier of pigeon fever for several weeks or so before developing the actual abscesses thus becoming contagious. I seem to remember her saying because of that it can take a while to run its course through a herd, and horses coming from a herd where it's been a problem should definitely be quarantined. I also remember something about it dying off in the winter (in my area at least, we have cold winters but it can be a year-long problem in warmer climates).

                                There was a big breeding/sales barn in my area that had an outbreak early one summer years ago. Guy sold tons of horses, mostly to noobs and many of them would up in boarding stables. As an aside, he had lots of strangles outbreaks in his herd also. Got to the point with the pigeon fever nobody would board horses coming from his property, that summer we got a few desperate calls from newbie horse owners who had purchased from him and were getting turned down everywhere they went trying to get a stall. It was back then we got the low-down on the whole pigeon fever thing from our vet, haven't heard of it in my area before or since hence the fuzzy memory. Side note, we didn't let any horses from that guy on the property that year and haven't since. Every year I still hear about strangles coming from that place.

                                Okay, I'll stop rambling about pigeon fever now. Strangles I'm not so scared of, we vaccinate all ours for it and know what to look for. Pigeon fever though not so much (don't even think there is a vaccine, is there?), would make me a little more nervous.

                                Comment


                                • Yep.


                                  Originally posted by goneriding24 View Post
                                  Boy howdy, FB is alight right now. Didn't somewhere CCH say she wanted anywhere from $1 to $750 for her horses?? Did I read that right??
                                  The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                                  H. Cate

                                  Comment


                                  • Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                                    I did not mean to imply that most rescues are crooked.
                                    No worries, I didn't think you were. I was just pointing out how I think the scamming happens. I've dealt with/been involved with seizures from some of the bad ones. I'm more jaded than most anymore!
                                    Visit us at Bluebonnet Equine Humane Society - www.bluebonnetequine.org

                                    Want to get involved in rescue or start your own? Check out How to Start a Horse Rescue - www.howtostartarescue.com

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by rcloisonne View Post
                                      Naked eyes can be deceiving and why deadly diseases such as Strangles (which was reported on her farm) keep infecting horses year after year. Most reputable places quarantine horses with unknown or suspect health histories for at least three weeks.


                                      Apparently, you have no experience with infectious diseases. Horses that look to be in perfect condition can be harboring infections. Why do you think most rated horse shows require health certificates less than 30 days old, in addition to a Coggins? Not that it stops all spread of infection but every bit of precaution helps.

                                      No way I'd take on this dipshiit's horses without quarantining them for at least 30 days. Good grief. There's a very high probability most of them have never had any shots or seen a vet in their entire lives (or farrier either). The owner herself said there had been Strangles at her place. Ever watch a horse die from that or one of the many complications?
                                      Wrong. I have had plenty of experience. I understand you can't tell by looking with your naked eye. I understand the history of strangles. I also understand that this rescue seems to have an awful lot of horses and that if they have people stepping up to the plate and the horses are not outwardly unhealthy enough to require some type of stabilization then the most efficient thing to do is to provide the potential home with information and suggestions on quarantine. A horse that has serious or chronic long term issues typically show it. Any horse can carry a disease onto your farm and it is up to you to decide how long to quarantine them after their arrival. Anyone who doesn't, takes their chances. I'm sorry, that is not a reason to have a blanket policy on a boat load of horses who really do not appear to look that bad in general.

                                      And I have to say, I would prefer to do my own quarantine rather than relying on a rescue to do so. The only experience I have had with a "rescue" is that they got good money to toss a horse into a field which I later found out continually had horses from the auction thrown in on a regular basis, fed her craptastic sweet feed and sent me a foundered cushings pony. So much for quarantine.

                                      Comment


                                      • Hey, can someone help me out here. I read the first few pages of this thread and saw none of the videos y'all talked about. I found a nice video on youtube of "Mares at Colored Cow Horse Ranch" made just a year ago and the animals looked good although I cannot imagine how expensive it must be to keep horses on such land. Obviously, that is one of the problems. But in skimming his or her posts, Colored Cow Horse seemed a knowledgeable horseperson and never mentioned problems....again I skimmed..... did things just suddenly go south very quickly and if so, aren't some of you being pretty hard on him/her. I am very judgemental about people not caring for horses and I agree that euthanasia is better than suffering or chancing a poor home. I also thought there were too many excuses in her FB post. I couold not find a FB page BTW. But does anyone know the real story here? It is so sad for everyone, animal as well as human.

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by rcloisonne View Post
                                          Naked eyes can be deceiving and why deadly diseases such as Strangles (which was reported on her farm) keep infecting horses year after year. Most reputable places quarantine horses with unknown or suspect health histories for at least three weeks.


                                          Apparently, you have no experience with infectious diseases. Horses that look to be in perfect condition can be harboring infections. Why do you think most rated horse shows require health certificates less than 30 days old, in addition to a Coggins? Not that it stops all spread of infection but every bit of precaution helps.

                                          No way I'd take on this dipshiit's horses without quarantining them for at least 30 days. Good grief. There's a very high probability most of them have never had any shots or seen a vet in their entire lives (or farrier either). The owner herself said there had been Strangles at her place. Ever watch a horse die from that or one of the many complications?
                                          Uggg, I kept looking for my reply which was apparently eaten in the Chronicle computer bug that existed yesterday.

                                          FIRST, I never suggested that horses NOT be quarantined, I just found it a bit ridiculous that one of the rescue's FB quotes was that the horses have "been here for two weeks and are about to begin their 30 day quarantine". WTF? What were they doing for those two weeks?

                                          SECOND, health certs are an absolute joke. I have known MANY vets over the years that will simply write one on any animal with a current Coggins, just stop in and pick it up. THat protects no one at all.
                                          Holly
                                          www.ironhorsefrm.com
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