At the risk of sounding "nutty" to some...

[erniewalker]

I believe in the hereafter, and I also believe in spirits or ghosts or whatever, though I try to keep a very pragmatic head on what people consider "proof." I used to be in a paranormal research society, and you get a feeling for things that are actually unexplainable, and things that just freak you out.

That being said, my first horse's ghost is the reason I got back into horses at all. I sent him to a retirement home after he recovered from his second bout of EPM, because I was not financially set to take care of any horse, much less a medically needy one. He was 21 at the time, and I lost touch with his former owner (who was paying the retirement bills- hooray for first right refusal working out!). That was in 2003. After I gave him up, I was so heart-broken that I got out of everything horse. I literally sold everything I could find, right down to the Breyers. I ignored everything horse- didn't even touch them at the petting zoo.

Around 2008, out of absolutely nowhere, having barely even considered horses in five year, he started showing up in my dreams. Sometimes I'd be riding him, and it was strange, because we only cantered in these dreams. He and I had an accident (which led to his second EPM diagnosis) wherein he fell out from under me while cantering. Anyway, the dreams became so intense and so frequent, I found myself obsessing over horses all over again. I ended up hopping on the internet and finding my way back into horses.

When I gave him up, I was wracked with guilt. I had stood in his stall, sobbing on his neck, pleading him to get better, and then I basically abandoned him, due to some really bad stuff going on in my personal life. He was well cared for under the board agreement, but I just disappeared to him. Then I wrapped him up, put him in a trailer, and sent him off to retirement, where I understand he was super, super happy. The guilt is what kept me away from horses for five years... but then, having those dreams, where he was my partner again, and we were super-besties again? It made me feel like he was telling me it was ok.

One could argue that it's my own internal coping mechanism, and I could see that, except I'm not built that way. I'm the sort to torture myself with guilt. And why I should start obsessing over horses out of nowhere after five years of barely acknowledging them is just bizarre to me. I know it sounds nutty. But then last year, after my grandmother passed, I started having dreams about her and my grandfather as well, and... well, to keep this novel from growing, let's just say "coincidence" just isn't the right word!

OP- I guess the main part is how the cardinal makes you feel. There no real way of proving whether it's your mare or not, but if it makes you feel better to see the cardinal, and you feel in your soul it's your mare, who does it hurt? I think it's perfectly rational to find comfort in a sign, and to interpret that sign with your soul, regardless of what other people's brains say.

[goodhors]

Well Dear Abbey gets letters all the time from folks about finding pennies in unique places, that they think are signs from folks who are gone now. Often brand new pennies that should never have been in that place. They think finding the pennies are a message and look at the incidents as happy moments, reminders that they are still being looked over, cared about. Totally day brighteners.

There have been a LOT of those letters in her columns over the years, with a big variety of stories in them.

So if seeing Cardinals makes you feel good, I hope you keep seeing a LOT of them. Seeing any Cardinal makes me feel good, they are so cheery looking all the time!

Feelings are special to each person. You can't explain them, they just are. If you have had a special experience with such feelings, then you should feel rewarded by the one who left you. Lots of things happen that never can be explained with science, still doesn't mean they didn't happen to you or others.

[FlashGordon]

The cardinal reference is interesting. Right before I had my son, I was seeing cardinals left and right, multiple times a day. The day before I went into labor I was sitting in a restaurant and a cardinal literally spent an hour fluttering right outside the window next to our table. It was bizarre. I often equate them with my Grandpa, not sure why, maybe cause he was a bird guy.

My daughter is 5 and talks often about her "next life." No idea where she came up with it, and she is very matter-of-fact about it. She told me once that her, my son, myself and my husband were altogether in a "before life." It was weird at first but now I kind of welcome it and find it oddly comforting. When my beloved horse died in 2008, she was 2. Out of the blue one day, months later, she told me not to worry because he was happy and safe in a barn, eating grass and drinking milk. How she could have even known he had died I am not sure, as it is not something we discussed with her nor did she have the capacity to understand it at that age.

I'm not sure what I believe about life, death and thereafter. All I know is there have been people and animals in my life with which I have a different sort of connection... almost an innate familiarity. Couldn't tell you why or how, it is just different.

Also, who is to say that a horse you once loved will come back as a horse? Maybe it would return as a dog or, a person!

I can't necessarily say there is an order to the universe, how does that explain all the horrible, tragic things that happen? But I do think there is more to it than what we see, hear, touch every day.... something more intangible and transcendent.

[Bayou Roux]

The day after we put the Rouxster down, the first "repatriated" Bald Eagle flew directly over the riding arena, on a straight line from A-C and over my head.

Sign from her or the divine, I know not; I only knew I took great comfort in it. Eagles are a weekly occurrence now, and every time one cruises the farm, I think of Roux and am, again, comforted.

FWIW

[Kwill]

I am in agreement that birds can be a sign from another world/existence/plane whatever -- and I am totally upset when it happens, because it's usually not a good thing in my experience.

Although I agree cardinals are usually a happy thing.

Sometimes I dream of animals that have passed, but just cats usually. I think you have to be open to these things, though. I believe you can also shut yourself off from them, if you don't feel like dealing with it. =)

I should add that many people in my family have premonition dreams, see dead people ... I just do not want to go there.

[Kim]

Bayou, How awesome about the eagle! I have never seen an eagle in "real life," only in photos. That must be an incredible experience.

[PRS]

I often have dreams about my Sasha who was murdered by a neighbor (see my post #9 above). They are not nice dreams though. While they are better than the nightmares I suffered that first year these dreams are wrenching. I dream that I am feeding the dogs....I have had as many as 6 at a time....when I suddenly remember that I hadn't fed Sasha in a long, long time. I go to her kennel and she is there but she's nothing but skin and bones and starved, sometimes she's actually dead. I feel sure that it is my mind awash in guilt for not protecting her better as the dog never missed a meal while she was alive. It's been 17 years and the dreams still crop up from time to time.

[RedHorses]

Yes. My first horse was my heart horse (I know we all think the first horse is special, but he really was "The One" for me) and after he was euthanized I used to see him in the pasture out of the corner of my eye. When I turned there was either nothing there, or some other horse (once the horse was white! my guy was chestnut).

The following spring a foal was born on the farm. I met him about 36 hours after he was born and he recognized me. It was the weirdest thing ever. He was all over me demanding to know where I'd been, and why had I taken so long to come, and didn't I know he'd been waiting FOR EVER!! Yeah - weird, but incredibly distinct. I've never experienced anything like it before or since. Anyway I bowed to the inevitable and bought him a couple of weeks later. And he is without question "The One" for me. I do think the spirit that is my horse is the spirit that was my first horse. And it's not like my horse behaves much like my first horse either. It's something else.

[susanne]

When our mini gelding, Thelonius, died, our vet helped us move his body next to the corral so the other horses would know what happened to their friend.

Mingus (who was Thelonius' devoted buddy and protector) and Scarlett (who is totally self-centered) stood at the open gate, heads down, gazing upon Thelonius' body. They did not move a muscle for about 10 minutes, then in unison they lifted their heads and looked off in the same direction. They then went back to their normal routine.

I'm a skeptic, but this incident raised goose bumps.

[Kwill]

I realize a peep of reason here is probably not too welcome, but there are a few different belief systems being voiced here ...one is, that animals can come back in spirit after they die, right away or shortly afterwards, or come to us in dreams. The second is that animals can be reincarnted again, as themselves, as a different animal or as the same kind of animal, and thirdly, that they can remember past owners. Or perhaps the animal's spirit can inhabit another animal's spirit to send a message to us? Not really clear.

I don't see ghosts/spirits as the same as reincarnation/past lives. Of course, my church doesn't believe animals have souls at all, which makes animal ghosts problematic! Let alone past lives...but I think they do have souls, so we all have to believe what we think is right.

I think the logician in me just wants some kind of cohesive belief system that makes some kind of sense ... probably not going to happen when we are discussing the paranormal.

Doesn't matter -- carry on!

[PRS]

I realize a peep of reason here is probably not too welcome, but there are a few different belief systems being voiced here ...one is, that animals can come back in spirit after they die, right away or shortly afterwards, or come to us in dreams. The second is that animals can be reincarnted again, as themselves, as a different animal or as the same kind of animal, and thirdly, that they can remember past owners. Or perhaps the animal's spirit can inhabit another animal's spirit to send a message to us? Not really clear.

I don't see ghosts/spirits as the same as reincarnation/past lives. Of course, my church doesn't believe animals have souls at all, which makes animal ghosts problematic! Let alone past lives...but I think they do have souls, so we all have to believe what we think is right.

I think the logician in me just wants some kind of cohesive belief system that makes some kind of sense ... probably not going to happen when we are discussing the paranormal.

Doesn't matter -- carry on!

Here's my take on "cohesive belief systems".....some religious groups believe in reincarnation, some believe in spirits, some believe in dreams and past lives etc. Why should I believe that only one of them can be right? Why can't I believe what I've seen and experienced myself? No matter that the religious beliefs I was taught as a child told me that animals have no souls, I've always believed that they do. Why, when I was taught that ghosts don't exist, have I seen one? I think it is more logical to not follow one set of beliefs because someone says that is what is to be believed if you want to "belong" in a certain group. While my beliefs lean towards Christianity, I believe that all religions in the world have something of value to offer, which is why I don't worship in a church.

[RedHorses]

I realize a peep of reason here is probably not too welcome, but there are a few different belief systems being voiced here ...one is, that animals can come back in spirit after they die, right away or shortly afterwards, or come to us in dreams. The second is that animals can be reincarnted again, as themselves, as a different animal or as the same kind of animal, and thirdly, that they can remember past owners. Or perhaps the animal's spirit can inhabit another animal's spirit to send a message to us? Not really clear.

Your first and second and third points are not mutually exclusive. Reincarnation doesn't necessarily mean the spirit (I must be using a different meaning for spirit than you - by spirit I mean the individual energy that animates the body) instantly zips into another body the moment it leaves the current shell.

As far as the recognition of past owners goes, it's not that the reincarnated spirit says "oh hi RedHorses I'm your first horse, remember me?" but more of the reincarnated spirit recognizes the energy that animates my body and knows that our spirits have a connection, that we fit together. I'm sure you've heard of people meeting (other people, horses, other animals) who just had an instant click/connection/fit even if you haven't experienced the phenomena yourself. Who's to say the animating energy hasn't had special relationships in past lives and recognizes the "friend" feeling?

Whether animated by my first horse's spirit or not, my horse and I have a connection and he is his own unique character shaped by his body and experiences in this lifetime.

[Kwill]

Your explanation does assume you believe that the "spirit" or unique lifeforce comes back again and lives another corporeal life at some point or other, and can remember a past life/prior spiritual connection, which isn't universally accepted by all.

As to who is "right" or "wrong," well, either you are open to the idea that whatever animates living beings can live another corporeal life, or you are not ... and some religious people, probably a lot of them, would consider that to be a belief that isn't true (also athiests, of course). Once you are done, you're done.

However, I have no doubt everyone here has experienced a special connection with an animal, especially a horse, however that develops or the reason for it. Does no harm to believe either way, and I assume no one cares what other people believe or don't believe in terms of this subject.

I am not trying to be disrespectful to your beliefs, just pointing out that I don't share all of them and there are some very specific beliefs or worldviews at work here, as we try to explain the unexplainable.

[jumpingmaya]

I had to put my heart horse down 3 years ago... Very very hard day... took me a LONG time to get out of that funk.

Anyways, ever since- every time some life decision comes up where I am unsure on what to do (relationship issues, job, whatever stress you may think of...)- I literally "feel" like she is there- checking up on me.

I know... sounds nuts... but really, the comforting feeling that I use to get going in her stall when things were tough... is exactly how I feel at these times..

Come to think of it, it hasn't happened lately..

An animal psychic last year told me that she would come back in the next year and a half to 2 years as a grey warmblood colt.. and that "she" wanted to do the jumpers again! Seems like she wanted to be "free" and roam around a bit before coming back.

Also gave me some serious details of the last couple hours of her life, what had actually happened and how much she loved me (plus many more details that I had never told her).

Freaked me out...

[jumpingmaya]

es, it's not that the reincarnated spirit says "oh hi RedHorses I'm your first horse, remember me?" but more of the reincarnated spirit recognizes the energy that animates my body and knows that our spirits have a connection, that we fit together. I'm sure you've heard of people meeting (other people, horses, other animals) who just had an instant click/connection/fit even if you haven't experienced the phenomena yourself. Who's to say the animating energy hasn't had special relationships in past lives and recognizes the "friend" feeling?

I like this explanation!!!

[lilitiger2]

I totally believe this. Many, many people have had these experiences-thankfully we are not limited by our tiny, logical empirically-based senses of logic!!!

for some reason, I had been thinking about my ex, wondering why he hadn't called on my birthday,just really thinking of him. I finally started tracking him down and discovered he had died three days prior. I was very torn up about it, would not accept that I could not communiate with him any more, just KNEW I could find him-we had a lot of unfinished business. He came to me in a dream one night and we spoke, exactly as we would have in real life. I showed him my wedding ring and said,"Im married now". The whole dream was a real relief, but when I awoke, my wedding ring, which fit snugly on my finger and which I NEVER took off, was gone! Months later, a friend of mine told me I needed to ask him for my ring back (I had torn up the house looking for it). Not sure I really believed this, I nonetheless did ask him for my ring back, and sure enough, while cleaning the house I lifted a couch cushion and there was my ring! I actually found it very comforting...

I put my old kitty down this winter (she was 17) while in Vermont. Her long time, best buddy, had been put down and laid to rest out here in montana three years ago. Afterwards, my husband, who was in Montana, called to tell me that he saw her, walking the fencepost up to her friend's grave out here, just like she was going to join him. She made a point of giving him a long, long look,saying good bye.

My husband has a medicine lodge and works in the realm of powerful animal spirits all the time. We know so little about the spirit realm but there are far too many people who have had events-like Sasha showing up, like the boy seeing his grandfather, like the cardinal, like the eagle-to discount!!

I think that boundary between our life and spirit can be very very shadowy and is probably much more transparant than we think! And love for sure can transcent it.

[SwampYankee]

Not "nutty" at all--COOL!

In pre-industrial times, before we filled our days and our heads with so much busyness and noise, these experiences went without saying and nobody thought it was weird. In fact, in 19th century America lots and LOTS of very well-off and educated people were seriously into "spiritism"--trying to make contact with the dead. I live in an old, old part of the country where there are many local sites reputed to be haunted.

Christianity, of course, just tells you all-that is "of the devil" and to be afraid of it, which isn't very helpful at all. But investigate the old Celtic and Norse beliefs if you want a good read some dark and stormy night in the winter, before a crackling fire. The familiarities will jump off the page, and make your hair stand on end; and such experiences and beliefs were nearly universal, all over the preindustrial world.

Now out in Asia, where no one scoffs at spirit matters, it is believed that karma has ramifications. More "chain-reaction" than "mumbo-jumbo," the web of causality is too big to be knowable; all we can do is manage what we can see and act upon to the best of our ability, in full awareness that anything we do--both good or bad--will have consequences in ways we can't yet imagine. American "popular" Buddhism has greatly dumbed this down and made it very literal; the original is a very elegant and demanding way of seeing one's actions in the world. Responsibility for the life of another, even an animal, binds you together karmically and should be entered into with full mindfulness of what it entails. . . nothing is black and white, it is situational and paradoxical and always a moving target!

Closely related, the Shinto animism of Japan holds that one who was a strong spirit in life may be asked upon death to watch over one from the other world as a "kami," and this assumption is also made of ancestors. Horses were frequently kept at shrines as messengers of the kami, a loose assemblage of gods, ghosts, and agricultural spirits both protective and malevolent. Some of them like to mess with you . . .

I've seen enough "signs" and unexplainable things, some of them quite dramatic, surrounding horses dead and living over the years that I take these ideas very seriously now. I reject clients who don't have an attitude of commitment to stewardship. Recently, I've also tightened up the parameters under which I'll allow one of my owners to euthanize a horse on my premises --pretty much chapter and verse of the AAEP Guidelines now--and financial reasons or convenience just don't cut it. I've been known to board a horse at MY cost long-term to keep someone from having to do that when they fall upon hard times, because I don't want them to suffer from the spiritual fallout that results.

A "good death," where we merely second Nature's intent, is to "send them onwards" only when their time has truly come; when they can no longer live in their present body in any reasonable way. This decision is about them, not so much us, and should not be made arbitrarily or selfishly. For as well as "protective" kami, there are in the same traditions "hungry ghosts," infesting one's mind with regret and guilt and thereby wreaking havoc as they seek revenge for wrongs from their past lives . . . now who wants to have one of THOSE around?

The "sword that takes life" can indeed be the freeing "sword that gives life;" but be sure, be mighty, terribly, finally, AWFULLY sure--that you're really right! What you put your horses and people through--and this includes bad training, unneeded angst and wrongful procedures--you can't take back again!

Because if they're "out there," you surely want them on your side . . .

[Lauruffian]

I have no animal stories, but I have one about my father. I hope I can share this one without it being too OT and NHR.

Now, I'm very much my father's daughter, which means I am empirical and logical, which can cause conflict when faced with the unexplained. And in this case, the unexplained was my father.

The day after my father's death, we (my mom, sister, husband, and myself) were all scrambling about the house. Packing up, cleaning up where he'd last been ( ), going through paperwork, trying to find his wallet, that whole thing. In the middle of the day--wide awake and alert--I was walking from one wing of the house to the other when I clearly and distinctly heard my father's talking. He had a unique tenor voice, and he was speaking in his very familiar long-winded-story lilt. I froze in my tracks when I realized what I was hearing. No, that is NOT him. He is GONE now. I analyzed my environment: the TV was not on, the radio was not on, the only other male in the house was my very deep-bass-voiced husband... Still, I could still hear Dad. NO, I told myself, that is NOT possible. I shook my head and walked on, refusing to believe what I'd heard.

I only wish I had stopped to listen more carefully to what story he was telling, instead of to discredit him. But, my scientist father would appreciate why I didn't.

[carla54]

I had to have Moe, my best buddy, 35 year old gelding put down in November, then in December, we had to put down his 32 year old mare friend, Brandy. Two days after she was gone, I went to grain two of my toothless grey oldies in the standing stalls, and saw one of the young bay or chestnut horses in the end stall, I went around the door to lead the sneaky grain eater out and found that stall empty, no chestnut or bay in sight! I'd like to think it was Moe or Brandy coming to visit.

[TheJenners]

I don't believe in spirits or an afterlife, which is why losing Aisha was so very hard for me. I dream about her sometimes, which is nice for me. If I had any sort of belief system, it would lean more towards reincarnation I suppose.

In the meantime I just enjoy the time I have with those who are present.