• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

WWYD - boarding situation **update**

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • WWYD - boarding situation **update**

    I am dealing with a situation and would like advice. Sorry this is long.

    I found an opportunity to work off board, facility was located close to home, barn owner seemed nice at initial meeting. (I recently moved and have no relationships in the horse world near this area.) We signed an agreement/contract stating the set amount that each hour of work was to be valued at in writing towards board. Expectations included working alongside barn owner to do basic cleaning type chores; BO was not looking for one individual to do the entire facility but rather an additional body to help with the work as the facility is rather large (this was made clear). Perfect - I had the time available and would rather make use of it!

    I have never been late, never missed a scheduled day, and am extremely organized in tracking hours/communicating scheduling. I always put 110% effort into my work and would pick up hours whenever asked.

    Eventually barn owner started to show up late, or not show up at all with various excuses. I would be left to do the entire facility alone, with increased chore requests. I understand life happens and things come up, and I am more than willing to accommodate and work harder if necessary for an unexpected reason. However, this has turned into a daily occurrence. The number of days and amount of hours has continually increased, and physically I am not able to do it anymore. I am exhausted, and often feel unable to function well at my "real" job.

    I expressed this in a very professional and neutral manner, and explained that I will be limiting my hours to reduce the physical stress. Barn owner is now acting out in an unacceptable manner towards me, suggesting that I should not go to the barn to see MY horse on MY time.

    At this point the barn owner is completely reliant on me to run the facility. I am not happy with the arrangement or the way I am now being treated. Financially, working off board is my best option and it is not something that all barns will offer. However, at what expense do I continue to do that?! There is no indication of duration in the agreement regarding me leaving or stopping the work. I have already worked off over a month in advance of full care stall board.


    Question is this: How would you approach this situation to either try to improve it, and maintain the working relationship.. OR, how would you approach ending the working agreement and moving the horse? I absolutely do not want to leave with bad feelings/drama. I appreciate the ability to work off my board and have always worked hard to show that appreciation. I would have to give 30 days written notice to move my horse from the facility, and I fear that those 30 days would be absolute hell if I do not continue to work off board during that time. (However, I have over a month worked off in advance and would like to use that credit!)
    Last edited by wwyd_alter; Jul. 21, 2012, 05:11 PM.

  • #2
    I would do two things
    1) Spend at least 1 day per week checking out other facilities in your area and within your budget. Look at this as a contingency in case (2) doesn't work out (see below)

    2) I would start with the phrase you used in your last paragraph:
    "I appreciate the ability to work off my board", then continue with something like this "and I am happy to continue with the financial arrangements that we agreed upon in writing. I am currently able to provide X number of hours per week. As it seems there is more work to do then there are people to do the work, please let me know which tasks should receive priority on a given day".

    This is short and focuses on the positive aspect of the arrangement. With people like the BO, you can't say anything remotely negative because they won't handle it well. The last sentence gets at the heart of the matter without criticizing the barn owner. You would simply be expressing an interest in helping and in being conscientious, but without killing yourself in the process.

    If you do (1) in parallel, then you'll have some options should the BO make life miserable.

    Is something going on in the BO's personal life that caused this change in behavior? (ie dropping work at the barn) or does this person having a drinking habit or some other such thing?

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      Originally posted by SnicklefritzG View Post
      Is something going on in the BO's personal life that caused this change in behavior? (ie dropping work at the barn) or does this person having a drinking habit or some other such thing?
      BO had one incident that was completely understandable and lasted a relatively short period of time. That is why I mentioned that I understand life happens and am willing to work around that. However, that incident was resolved in BO's life, and the excuses that are now being used are absolutely unreasonable. My gut feeling is now that BO knows I can handle everything on my own, will do it right, and get it all done on my own if I have to - BO now EXPECTS that all the time and makes excuses to continue avoiding work.

      When I have a personal commitment that is communicated well in advance (VERY rare), it is a different story. The world is ending.

      Not very equitible.

      Comment


      • #4
        It sounds as if the BO has decided that you can be trusted to carry the work load on your own. It might be time to either give up working any board off and becoming a full pay boarder, or move to another barn.
        Sheilah

        Comment


        • #5
          I'd be looking for a new barn, if I were you. But then I have a pretty low tolerance for unprofessional people, especially when they try to take advantage of me.

          You already have a full month of board worked off, so there's your 30 days' notice paid for, right there. You can move your horse the day you give notice, and in your notice letter, remind BO of your work agreement and indicate how much board you currently have worked off in advance. Include a copy of the written agreement if necessary.

          Life is too short to deal with crazy people. Go find a different barn.
          Full-time bargain hunter.

          Comment


          • #6
            I have to agree with snicklefritz.

            Time to have a sit down with the BO. And for sure be complimentary in the process. You are thankful and appreciative that she trusts you enough to do the whole barn yourself and if only you could physically do that you would continue but it is limiting your ability to get your full time job done so you need to go back to the original agreement.

            Comment


            • #7
              So you have a job that you have to go to after you get done the barn work correct? You are finding it difficult to function in your "real" job and on top of that the barn owner is "acting out" and "suggesting you should not go to the barn to see your horse on your time." This is after you rationally tried to talk to BO about the issue. I would find another barn. There is possibly a slight chance the BO might wake up if you "quit" and relent and step up but I don't know BO sounds pretty bad. I am betting you are not getting to enjoy your horse between the barn work and your real job so what is the point in the end?

              Comment


              • #8
                I am afraid that you are a victim of your own success. As a BO, I actually like working on my farm and will do all sorts of manual labor, but I realize that not everyone is like that.

                Bravo to the OP for having an agreement delineating everything. That's a place to start. It is time to sit down with the BO and review it. Personally, I would ask to be paid cash when I had more than one month's board prepaid in advance. If the rate that you are working is quickly outstripping the value of board, carrying a large balance is going to be hard to collect if you leave. Keep it to one month and you have your 30 days notice covered, as it as already been pointed out.

                This is business and that's how it should be approached. The BO should know that, but if not, then you know it is time to go. If I were the BO, I would be grateful to have competent help for any period of time and I would treat that help accordingly. I do have a work off board situation at my farm and that boarder is extremely competent. I am lucky to have her and she is treated with a great deal of respect, particularly for her time. So it can work. Sorry that you don't live near me, OP, because I would love to have your help at my barn, too. You can't have enough good people.
                Where Fjeral Norwegian Fjords Rule
                http://www.ironwood-farm.com

                Comment


                • #9
                  You already have a full month of board worked off, so there's your 30 days' notice paid for, right there. You can move your horse the day you give notice, and in your notice letter, remind BO of your work agreement and indicate how much board you currently have worked off in advance. Include a copy of the written agreement if necessary
                  right. good advice.

                  Barn owner is now acting out in an unacceptable manner towards me, suggesting that I should not go to the barn to see MY horse on MY time.
                  No point trying to fix this. Time to leave.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    You were looking for a barn when you found that one. Just saying.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Thank you everyone, for your suggestions and support.

                      My concern in giving notice and leaving is minor events/conversations have set off unreasonable reactions in BO. What kind of reaction will I get when I say I am leaving and no longer working, when they are literally depending on me to run the place at this point? Is giving a two week notice fair and reasonable to stop working? I fear I may compromise my horse's care if I piss them off, but I have earned that full month of board in advance and would like to use it! I honestly think BO may not realize how much board I have already worked off above the monthly value. I have tracked hours diligently, but wouldn't be suprised if BO does everything possible to avoid giving those extra hours as credit.

                      What is the most constructive way to go about that? Give two week notice and 30 day notice at once - just lay it all out? Give two week notice then 30 day notice? Best way to word it to avoid an unreasonable reaction or make the situation worse?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Make it very clear in writing how much you have worked off, etc. so there are no surprises. As far as the care of your horse sounds like you are doing all the care? If you fear they BO might hurt your horse guess that is another story.

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          #13
                          Originally posted by IronwoodFarm View Post
                          I am afraid that you are a victim of your own success. As a BO, I actually like working on my farm and will do all sorts of manual labor, but I realize that not everyone is like that.

                          Bravo to the OP for having an agreement delineating everything. That's a place to start. It is time to sit down with the BO and review it. Personally, I would ask to be paid cash when I had more than one month's board prepaid in advance. If the rate that you are working is quickly outstripping the value of board, carrying a large balance is going to be hard to collect if you leave. Keep it to one month and you have your 30 days notice covered, as it as already been pointed out.

                          This is business and that's how it should be approached. The BO should know that, but if not, then you know it is time to go. If I were the BO, I would be grateful to have competent help for any period of time and I would treat that help accordingly. I do have a work off board situation at my farm and that boarder is extremely competent. I am lucky to have her and she is treated with a great deal of respect, particularly for her time. So it can work. Sorry that you don't live near me, OP, because I would love to have your help at my barn, too. You can't have enough good people.

                          I would have loved to set-up a cash balance for remaining board. However, in this situation BO could not afford to pay direct cash and I was not expecting to be working beyond the monthly value. I can't change the agreement now, but this is noted for any potential future agreements I sign in similar situations. The rate we agreed upon is extremely reasonable, and is the going rate in this area. I am not overpaid by any stretch of the imagination - the excess board saved is literally due to the amount of hours I have worked ( ALOT! )

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            Originally posted by bizbachfan View Post
                            Make it very clear in writing how much you have worked off, etc. so there are no surprises. As far as the care of your horse sounds like you are doing all the care? If you fear they BO might hurt your horse guess that is another story.
                            I chose not to detail those concerns in this thread because it is a separate issue from the work agreement. I put in about 95% of my hours in the morning so only a portion of my horse's care is in my hands. For example, horse came in with injury one night. I was not notified. I asked BO about it next morning and I was blown off. It was significant enough that it should have been tended to the night before IMO.

                            I minimally expect BO's to take 15 seconds to look over my horse after turnout and send me a text or call about it. I am not expecting care - I am willing to do that on my own. But if I do not know about it, I cannot treat it if I am not there.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Another reason to move your horse then if you don't feel you are getting the care even before you have given notice. Sorry! It is a bad situation.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Just leave and on the way out give her the written notice detailing that you have worked off a months board in advance and that is your payment for one month's board in lieu of notice. If you have not actually worked off a full month, write a check for the balance.

                                In this situation, if as you describe, forget about staying around after giving notice. She managed before you arrived and she will manage after you leave.

                                Perhaps you don't understand this- PAYing one month's board ( whether by financial means or through working it off in advance) is equivalent to giving 30 days notice which is standard unless otherwise spelled out in boarding contract..

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Whew. The more you add the more it just sounds like a hot mess.

                                  Not calling you about an injury that requires vet care gives you some insight as to the level of care BO thinks is acceptable. So is not even noticing that type of injury if she tries to use the old "well I didn't see it" excuse. What would happen if your horse was down with colic? Would she just wait and see if he got back up on his own? Must not be too bad if he isn't thrashing? Blase about potential injury/illness is NOT a good quality in a BO and a mighty hard one to overlook.

                                  Add to that you already know how she treats her employees and her true character when dealing with discussion of problems? Well I think she's made her confrontational nature no secret.

                                  What's more important to you, the money or your peace of mind? Honestly I'd GTFO. As soon as I could find something more suitable. Since you are new to the area maybe you could have some luck asking around local feed and tack shops for some boarding recommendations; those places always seem to have the scuttlebutt on who's great and who to avoid, also who is in need of a little help around the property and might be willing to exchange labor for board.

                                  Sounds like you've got everything documented on paper with a signed agreement. If you cant' get her to pay up when you leave and you still want to pursue the money issue well there is always small claims court.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by wwyd_alter View Post
                                    Thank you everyone, for your suggestions and support.

                                    My concern in giving notice and leaving is minor events/conversations have set off unreasonable reactions in BO. What kind of reaction will I get when I say I am leaving and no longer working, when they are literally depending on me to run the place at this point? Is giving a two week notice fair and reasonable to stop working? I fear I may compromise my horse's care if I piss them off, but I have earned that full month of board in advance and would like to use it! I honestly think BO may not realize how much board I have already worked off above the monthly value. I have tracked hours diligently, but wouldn't be suprised if BO does everything possible to avoid giving those extra hours as credit.

                                    What is the most constructive way to go about that? Give two week notice and 30 day notice at once - just lay it all out? Give two week notice then 30 day notice? Best way to word it to avoid an unreasonable reaction or make the situation worse?
                                    First of all, have a place to bring your horse in case things don't go very well when you give notice and you have to move immediately. This happened to me years ago when I gave my 30-days notice and it was a very ugly scene that resulted in me leaving that same day instead.

                                    Then, offer to go onto full board for the 30-day notice so that you don't end up leaving there with $$$ owed to you. If BO is very short-staffed, then you can offer to work for cash. If BO doesn't have cash to pay you and is being reasonable about you moving on, I'd do a weekly work-for-board agreement instead of a monthly while BO finds a replacement - less likely you'll get screwed out of lots of hours of labor that way. Bottom line, ultimately the BO is responsible for his/her barn, not you. The responsible thing to do is to honor the contract and/or give 30-days notice, but if your horse is in jeopardy all bets are off.
                                    JB-Infinity Farm
                                    www.infinitehorses.com

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      OP, the BO was running the barn before you came so she can run it again when you leave. Don't buy into the "I'm indispensible" argument. You are not.
                                      Where Fjeral Norwegian Fjords Rule
                                      http://www.ironwood-farm.com

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        I have the feeling that no matter how well reasoned your arguments, or how reasonable you are. And you sound very. This is not going to end well. The BO sounds like a user.

                                        Before you consider any discussion, make sure you have an alternative. Also I'd very carefully hang on to that written agreement. It's worth a month's free board.
                                        Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

                                        Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X