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President Bush Issues 48 Hr. Ultimatum....Please Pray For Our Soldiers

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  • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Janeway:
    _Save the French Fries!_

    I have to say that all of this anger towards France and Germany is nothing short of childish. It makes me sick to read about it.

    France and Germany are not the only countries in the world to have benefited from middle eastern oil, nor will they be the last. And to all those people protesting that France makes money off of Sadam Hussein et al and may have made them missiles or whatever, just think about how many armies/groups/whathaveyou that the US has also provided money and arms to.

    Nothing here is new. Most of the large countries in the world have sold weapons to other countries at some point.

    So to cast all this anger at France is just terrible and serves no purpose. Some of those European countries that are being bashed just might want to settle things peacefully, or wait for proper UN approval, and what is wrong with that?

    I for one am glad that my country is not giving military aid without UN support, because I think going ahead now is very wrong.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Do your homework and find out how many BILLIONS in debt Saddam's regime owes the French. Find out how many billions in contracts the French have with his regime. Find out how many nuclear components the French have and are still supplying Saddam with. The French don't give a hoot about UN support.

    Comment


    • And sallylou, I beg to disagree with anyone who refers to Muslims as "towelheads." It's incredibly sad to think that people can still be so closed-minded in this day and age.

      Comment


      • Thank you, Lily. Well said and in total agreement.

        "I can justify anything!"
        \"Riding a horse is not a gentle hobby, to be picked up and laid down like a game of solitaire. It is a grand passion. It seizes a person whole and, once it has done so, he will have to accept that his life will be radically changed.\" -- Ralph Waldo E

        Comment


        • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Eomer:
          B_lilly, What's the rush. Are you afraid he'll get away? Wait, that's what we want him to do. Maybe, just maybe IF we gave him a safe place to go ... he would. Doesn't it strike you ... at least a little bit wierd that we told him to leave ... but nobody mentioned ... where he's supposed to go. We've already determined he doesn't give a $#!+ about his people so, IF I were him, why not use them as sheilds ... he has nothing to loose. Actually he has no choice. We've boxed him up, now were going to batter and fry him. Plus or minus a few "rag heads".

          "The fool on the hill"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

          Not sure what your point is. He probably will use them as shields. That's President Bush's fault? And I think he's said he won't leave. No, we didn't make reservations for him at a spa, but I'm thinking the French would take him in

          Comment


          • I was referring to your previous post, Lily. But, I agree with this one too.

            I agree with parts of your post, Jumphigh, but this inference is beyond the pale.

            "I can justify anything!"
            \"Riding a horse is not a gentle hobby, to be picked up and laid down like a game of solitaire. It is a grand passion. It seizes a person whole and, once it has done so, he will have to accept that his life will be radically changed.\" -- Ralph Waldo E

            Comment


            • Course, according to Eomer, I'm full of bluster and talking out of my ###, so don't anyone listen to me.

              "I can justify anything!"
              \"Riding a horse is not a gentle hobby, to be picked up and laid down like a game of solitaire. It is a grand passion. It seizes a person whole and, once it has done so, he will have to accept that his life will be radically changed.\" -- Ralph Waldo E

              Comment


              • I am not even going to begin on my "liberal tree hugging luv fest" opinion. Instead I am going to let Mittens and Snowdrop do it for me... If Mittens Ruled the World

                ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
                I hope life isn't a big joke, because I don't get it.
                Jack Handy

                Comment


                • What's rash about it, shall I start a poll.

                  How many here know what death smells like.

                  How it feels to have someones life eb from them, and you were the one that took it.

                  Who remembers the gurgling gasp of last breath

                  How many have fallen sick to their stomach at the sight of battle.

                  Who watched a friend die when it should have been you.

                  Shall we have that poll? Fools rush in where angles fear to tread. War is fun, lets us all go. You don't know what you're missing.

                  "The fool on the hill"

                  [This message was edited by Eomer on Mar. 18, 2003 at 08:07 PM.]
                  \"The fool on the hill\"

                  Comment


                  • And on a more positive note:

                    Oxfam, Americares, DWB etc. need $$ to help the projected 1 million refugees. Show you care- send them some

                    I wanted mine to go to an organization that will operate under the auspices of the UN and not the military so I sent it to Oxfam and to an Irish organization.

                    Comment


                    • Actually reading that part I would not refer to Muslims as "towelheads" either. I have nothing against the religion itself, only the fundamentalists.
                      visit us at www.levremont.com

                      Comment


                      • good suggestion maggymay, do you have links?
                        See those flying monkeys? They work for me.

                        Comment


                        • I have to admit that I'm in doubt as to the UN's politics these days.

                          "I can justify anything!"
                          \"Riding a horse is not a gentle hobby, to be picked up and laid down like a game of solitaire. It is a grand passion. It seizes a person whole and, once it has done so, he will have to accept that his life will be radically changed.\" -- Ralph Waldo E

                          Comment


                          • Eomer, I will answer your question. No, I have never seen those things you write so heartfeltly about, and I hope I never do see them. My heart breaks because I have a feeling that you have.

                            I checked your profile, and I guess it had to be 'Nam. If I am right, then I was off waving my little protest placards at about the same time. I quit the movement though because I couldn't stomach the hatred that most of those people had for those who fought. I couldn't figure out why we kept screaming that we had the right to say and do whatever we wanted because we were Americans, yet we wouldn't grant that same right to those who chose a different and much more horrifying path. Quitting the movement didn't change my feelings about the war itself, however.

                            Do you remember those days? Do you remember the anger and the hatred that lurked in every corner, and on every street at times? Do you remember the polarization of America? Do you remember when at times the "War in America" seemed more important than the war in Vietnam?

                            I'm still undecided about this war, being one of those who are blessed (or cursed) with the ability to see both sides of most questions. As much as I hate the thought of war, I can't help thinking about the times when we could have saved millions of lives, by going to war earlier.

                            My greatest fear, however, is that this war will bring another great polarization in this country. And that, because of that, all of the fine young men and women who are marching off to this war will have to feel the same pain and anger that the young people who went to Vietnam felt when they heard of the problems at home. I want so much for us all to stand behind these young people, and tell them that we are proud and grateful for their bravery. We can't do that when we are shouting angry words at one another.

                            Do you remember Kent State? Do you remember the picture of the young girl crying over the body of one of the students that died? Americans shot Americans over a difference of opinion that day. And, I hope and pray that it will not come to that again.

                            I don't know if I made any sense or not. I guess it all comes down to a plea to all of the people in the US to not let anger, for whatever reason, take over your lives. We are still living with the effects of the last time that happened.

                            OK Louise, close your eyes and post.

                            ---------------------------
                            This too, shall pass.
                            If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor.
                            Desmond Tutu

                            Comment


                            • No, Louise, don't close your eyes. That was beautifully said. Let us pray that we learned our lesson from Viet Nam, at least regarding our need to respect and care for the men and women who are sent to fight.

                              You made me remember something I had nearly forgotten about -- in the mid to late '60s, my parents inviting sailors (I was raised in San Diego) who were away from home over to our house for Thanksgiving and Christmas, just so they could be with a family, even if it wasn't their own. And they were so grateful.

                              Then, in the late 70's, my old boyfriend, who had served on a carrier off of Viet Nam and whose father was career Navy, breaking down and sobbing as we watched a documentary from WWII showing families saying good-bye as the men shipped out.

                              God bless and keep all those who are in harm's way, tonight and for the future.
                              "I don't want to sound like a broken record here, but why is it that a woman will forgive homicidal behavior in a horse, yet be highly critical of a man for leaving the toilet seat up?" Dave Barry

                              Comment


                              • This marks the first time America has gone to war without being attacked first.

                                Without an ally or neutral nation being attacked first.

                                Without the support of a majority of the superpowers.


                                ****

                                Real Americans Don't Shoot First
                                you got that right!


                                ****

                                Back in 1776 this young country decided to throw off the chains of oppression held by Great Britain. In the 1800's the French revolted against their monarchy. In the early 1900's the Russians led by Marx revolted against the Czar. In the 1980's the Poles decided they'd had enough, and rallied behind Lech Walesa and revolted against communism.

                                Hundreds of thousands died in these revolutions. They did not die easily. Many were tortured. But the people believed that their sacrifice was needed and they went willingly to their deaths believing their deaths would make a difference.

                                Now back to Iraq. The people are routinely tortured, killed, raped, disappear. I do not belittle this, believe me. I'm just asking where is the underground movement our operatives could've aided (like we've done before) to help the Iraqi people take charge of their own destiny. Where are the Iraqi martyrs shouting down Hussein as they're killed in a storm of Republican Army bullets? There are reporters there, there are news leaks. But where are the martyrs?

                                Answer: Nowhere. Why? BECAUSE IT'S THE CULTURE. This is not a region that has ever experienced democracy because for democracy to work, you must first accept people as equals each entitled to basic civil rights. The culture of the Middle East from time immemorial has followed warlords, sheiks, Kings, Princes. Slavery still exists although many of the well-to-do Arab families have educated their children in Europe and America. This culture says, "HE (yes, HE) with the most power, largest army, better horses, better soldiers, better weapons, commands the most fear (grusome tortures) is by rights the ruler." Any American, who thinks when Saddam et famile leaves that there will be an American style democracy installed is fooling themselves. This is a country where women are still property. First you have to convince the men they don't own their wives, and then you have to convince the women they can survive without a husband! That is NOT going to happen in my lifetime. IMHO.

                                And whoever derided me for saying it was all about oil, I suggest you read the fine posts here that will explain it to you. Beyond what's been said is this fact. Follow: We bomb, we invade, we win. US forces take control of Iraq (remember we're doing this *without* UN support so to USA will go the initial task of mopping up) and voila! US Forces will control the oil fields of Iraq. Only until the Iraqi people can do it themselves of course, projected timetable 20 years. The French will learn a new form of @ss kissing - already they've opened the door for joining the battle (if any chemical weopons are used - duh a no-brainer ). Having a US puppet on the OPEC council is not out of the question.

                                To paraphrase a past US president and a failed republican presidential candidate:

                                Read my lips, it's the (oil-based) ecomomy, stupid.

                                ~Kryswyn~
                                "Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo"
                                ~Kryswyn~ Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo
                                Check out my Kryswyn JRTs on Facebook

                                "Life is merrier with a terrier!"

                                Comment


                                • Good grief, maggymay. I never said I was an expert. What I posted was JMHO. I wasn't under the impression that anyone needed a degree in political sciences, or 24 hours a day of CNN, to be allowed to post an opinion here.

                                  I am saddened by the prospect of war. I am also saddened by Americans who think it's up to them to convince others that war is wrong. This is my country. I support our leader. I support our armed forces. But you, and others who are against war, want to tell me that I am misinformed, naive, and blind. How do you know if I am? Are you experts on war and peace? How can you be so certain that you know more about the state of affairs than I do? Do any of us know something about this situation that the President doesn't know?

                                  ~Sara
                                  *Member of the Dirt Divers 78th Airborne Unit, ATH Squadron*
                                  *T-Minus 4 Weeks Until My Beval Devon Arrives!*

                                  Comment


                                  • No matter what your stance is on this war, it's probably a waste of oxygen to berate the French and Germans for "behaving as they do" because they have economic commitments with the country in question. Surely you don't think the US missed being painted by that ugly brush? And quite possibly when some of the most hideous genocides known to mankind were the outcome. This sort of argument works best if you never occupied the same (low) road. It's a given we own some serious mileage on the low road, and everyone knows it.

                                    And I have no doubt that we will do it again. As will France, Germany, England, and any other country that engages in any kind of economic growth. Economic survival also comes with some tricky moral questions. However, persuading the participants in such economic moral crises to take a higher road does involve diplomacy. And as MO'C pointed out, you generally need skill, finesse and luck to succeed at diplomacy. Or at least one out of three. 41 had it in spades. Apparently it isn't genetic.

                                    As for Saddam using biological weapons against his people, I tend to believe he has, if for no other reason than I watched the interview with Tariq Aziz where he stated they had. Since he speaks English fluently (unlike some world leaders), it wasn't something screwed up in the translation.

                                    "Speak yer mind. But ride a fast horse"
                                    Your crazy is showing. You might want to tuck that back in.

                                    Comment


                                    • It all comes down to faith and conviction. I think for the most part we've become a divided nation and no one is going to convince the other side differently. Louise said it very eloquently. We need to remain united at times like these. I also believe that the US won't be a superpower forever. History has taught us that there is always the downfall. This war won't be it but eventually our division may be.

                                      "The World is not dangerous because of those who do harm but because of those who look at it without doing anything." Albert Einstein

                                      Comment


                                      • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tyedyecommando:
                                        I am not even going to begin on my "liberal tree hugging luv fest" opinion. Instead I am going to let Mittens and Snowdrop do it for me... http://www.matazone.co.uk/kitty7.html

                                        <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                        Another vote for Mittens and Snowdrop. Note for those w/ slow modems: if you let it load in a closed window and open it at "The End" click on the 3 leafy thing to watch again.

                                        Go see Mittens and Snowdrop!

                                        ~Kryswyn~
                                        "Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo"

                                        [This message was edited by Kryswyn on Mar. 18, 2003 at 11:56 PM.]
                                        ~Kryswyn~ Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo
                                        Check out my Kryswyn JRTs on Facebook

                                        "Life is merrier with a terrier!"

                                        Comment


                                        • As far as Mittens and whatshisface, I just checked it out. Wow...I'm zipping my lips so I don't offend anyone.

                                          "The World is not dangerous because of those who do harm but because of those who look at it without doing anything." Albert Einstein

                                          Comment

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