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Fella is turning out to be a very reactive horse

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  • If work was that much fun, we'd be doing it for free!

    That said, there's nothing wrong with saying you're not the right trainer for a particular horse. No one gets along with all of them. There's not even anything wrong with deciding that the compensation's not high enough (or will never be high enough) to deal with a particular problem. It's the unprofessionalism that bugs me.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by JoZ View Post
      In a nutshell: beware of the "rapport". I used to talk in that kind of terminology -- soulmate, rapport, bond, etc. It's a dangerous thing. Maybe after one is a competent horse(wo)man relying on experience and skill instead of something fluffy, it might be ok to mention certain horses with which one has/had a special relationship. But at the OP's level which is pretty much mine, it's a slippery slope. Chances are what you see as a great bond the horse sees as a human with "SUCKER" stamped on her forehead. Or a human that is a blast to be around because as long as there are some soulful gazes, horsie doesn't really need to DO anything.

      I never thought I'd say this but I'd rather have a horse respect me than loff me. Paula, give this just the teeniest bit of thought.
      THIS

      Comment


      • Just a couple of thoughts as I read the last couple of pages of this thread:

        Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post

        Sithly, the thing is Fella wasn't this way when I got him. His issues were balking (I fixed that), hard to catch (I fixed that), he didn't know how to use himself, he had no bend, and was behind the leg. The spookiness on a scale of 1-10 was a 3. He led, he loaded, and he did not bolt. Those were AFTER.
        The first thought that comes to mind is that you have a clever horse. You've figured out his old tricks, so now he's going to try some new ones. Of course his handling/nutrition/exercise regimen are all variables, but he could simply be finding new ways to challenge you.

        Originally posted by Long Spot View Post
        Like Burbank said, you may "click" and I'd agree with that idea.
        Consider carefully what it means to "click" with a horse. Does it mean that you truly love the animal and appreciate his positive attributes while he enjoys your non-work-related adoration, or that you respect one another in all aspects of your relationship (ground and mounted) and he, at the most, tries his best for you, or, at the very least, submits to your requests with little "backtalk"?

        I admire your devotion to your horse. Best wishes for a positive outcome!
        "We need a pinned ears icon." -MysticOakRanch

        Comment


        • What JoZ said.

          In spades.

          Crowd Offering.

          Comment


          • I've been kind of following this, from the "extinction outbursts' to the trainer meltdown.

            I've been through a few trainers. I have to agree with those who said that most trainers don't take well to suggestions to use other methods.

            I also agree with those who'd rather have a horse's respect than love. Life is safer that way, and they just work better that way. My old mare is my mother's soul mate - she's never asked her to do a darn thing. Me, I've gotten the evil eye more than I can count - I expected her to do SOMETHING.

            Having left a trainer in a hurry, with a horse who wasn't working at all well, I would suggest that Fella spend the next 30 days out in a field. Maybe 60. The heat of summer is here, just let him chill in the heat. It's really hard, but forgetting about him for a month or 2 can really help.

            Take that time and find different trainer. Or use my method and start cold calling trainers, and use the first one who has space. That's worked best for me. Really. Personally, I'd find someone over 50 with very LOW estrogen levels. JME.
            Visit my Spoonflower shop

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              Sithly, I'm sorry to tell you, I love my job. I teach and it's alot of fun. I come home with a grin on my face, I remember something from class and it makes me laugh out loud. It's probably why we make peanuts -they know we're suckers because we love what we do so much we'll do it for a song.

              I'm thinking he needs to de-frag too, Red Mares. That's pretty much what's going to happen.

              Regarding respect and love; I don't think they are mutually exclusive. I'm all for having both.

              Paula
              He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

              Comment


              • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                Sithly, I'm sorry to tell you, I love my job. I teach and it's alot of fun.
                No reason to be sorry for that.

                I doubt you would boot a student out of class because his parent bruised your ego, though.

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  You got it!

                  Paula
                  He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                    Sithly, I'm sorry to tell you, I love my job. I teach and it's alot of fun. I come home with a grin on my face, I remember something from class and it makes me laugh out loud. It's probably why we make peanuts -they know we're suckers because we love what we do so much we'll do it for a song.

                    I'm thinking he needs to de-frag too, Red Mares. That's pretty much what's going to happen.

                    Regarding respect and love; I don't think they are mutually exclusive. I'm all for having both.

                    Paula
                    Remember that horses are, just like people, individuals and not all march to the same drummer.

                    Some horses, as some people, really don't care for "love" if it inconveniences them.

                    Be sure to achieve respect first, then negotiate for love.
                    Love without respect may get you run over again.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      I'm going to check out a trainer whom I only know by reputation through two of my friends who ride with her. They love her. I can pick her horses out at shows because they seem so relaxed, and I can pick her riders out at shows because they don't look like passengers when they're running barrels. She teaches both English and Western and I've seen her horses cross over -do a Western competition and then an English competition at the same show.

                      My old BO doesn't care much for her because she heard her methods were harsh. Great, I'm back to having to make some kind of leap. I'll swing by her place this afternoon. I'll ask her about this harsh stuff. I have a questionnaire I made up.

                      I do know she rehabs drafts and draft crosses for Gentle Giants draft rescue so she's not going to be intimidated by Fella's size.

                      Paula
                      He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Bluey View Post
                        Remember that horses are, just like people, individuals and not all march to the same drummer.

                        Some horses, as some people, really don't care for "love" if it inconveniences them.

                        Be sure to achieve respect first, then negotiate for love.
                        Love without respect may get you run over again.
                        I'd settle for respect, then trust.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post

                          My old BO doesn't care much for her because she heard her methods were harsh. Great, I'm back to having to make some kind of leap. I'll swing by her place this afternoon. I'll ask her about this harsh stuff. I have a questionnaire I made up.
                          Watch her work with some horses then draw your own conclusions.

                          Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                          I do know she rehabs drafts and draft crosses for Gentle Giants draft rescue so she's not going to be intimidated by Fella's size.
                          Your horse is not particularly big so if a trainer is intimidated by him, you have a problem right there.
                          Equine Ink - My soapbox for equestrian writings & reviews.
                          EquestrianHow2 - Operating instructions for your horse.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                            My old BO doesn't care much for her because she heard her methods were harsh. Great, I'm back to having to make some kind of leap. I'll swing by her place this afternoon. I'll ask her about this harsh stuff. I have a questionnaire I made up.

                            Paula
                            I don't know your old BO from Adam, but anymore, I don't put much stock in any one's description of "harsh." So many now consider simply saying "no" and reinforcing it with a stud chain or whip "harsh". Just because a horse may end up with scrape or two doesn't mean the trainer is "harsh". I've only known one horse that died from a scrape.

                            The BO where my old mare lives could easily be called "harsh" - and at first glance things often appear ugly - horses throw themselves quite often. Reality is he's not harsh or mean, the horses are (often older, unbroke, and just plain TOUGH). Just saying, warm and fuzzy hasn't worked for you thus far. I wouldn't discount someone because of one person's opinion.

                            I would still suggest an Old Guy for an 8 yr old with a bad work ethic.
                            Visit my Spoonflower shop

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                              My old BO doesn't care much for her because she heard her methods were harsh. Great, I'm back to having to make some kind of leap. I'll swing by her place this afternoon. I'll ask her about this harsh stuff. I have a questionnaire I made up.
                              Oh, I'd tread carefully there if I were you. Like Bogie said, I think it'd be better if you watch her work with some horses and draw your own conclusions. If she also gives riding lessons, sign up for one.

                              And talk to your friends, who have first-hand experience with her.

                              Did your old BO tell you what methods, exactly, she felt were harsh?

                              I sympathize with you - it is an arduous journey finding someone to successfully work with you and your horse. I'm very grateful I stuck it out during the initial difficult months with my new trainer and my horse.
                              I'm not ignoring the rules. I'm interpreting the rules. Tamal, The Great British Baking Show

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by red mares View Post
                                I don't know your old BO from Adam, but anymore, I don't put much stock in any one's description of "harsh." So many now consider simply saying "no" and reinforcing it with a stud chain or whip "harsh". Just because a horse may end up with scrape or two doesn't mean the trainer is "harsh". I've only known one horse that died from a scrape.
                                I met some people just recently that think a harsh word is abuse. Yes, it's getting to that point, even around here. These folks horses rub on them and don't respect space and I turned down one of their horses they wanted to give me. Holy cow, they must have a Saint watching over them because somehow they don't seem to get hurt.
                                GR24's Musing #19 - Save the tatas!!

                                Comment


                                • Have you considered that Fella may have a mild form of EPSM, and ruled out ulcers?

                                  Comment


                                  • i would say he needs way less feed and then take a look at how he is being handled.

                                    i can always tell who is handling my horses because of how the start reacting to various stimuli.... both are sensitive and it really boils down to each and every interaction with them needs to be calm, fair and understandable to them.

                                    if one of mine gets overly correctly she will melt down.... perhaps something similar is happening with your guy? perhaps his bigness fools folks into thinking he is a dud and they over handle him (over correct etc) ....

                                    Comment


                                    • Are you permitted to just board there without hiring the trainer until you've gotten a chance to see her work, or is it a full-training barn only? Can you take some time to get his ground manners back, and worry about the rest later?

                                      Given that you have only a day or two to place your horse, I'd Seriously tread carefully. From the trainer's POV, she's interviewing a potential new client with a horse that is so ill-behaved (I know, I know, he didn't use to be-- but he is at the moment) that he has just been booted out of his barn. You won't have 11 pages of posts to communicate the nuances of the situation, she's going to form her impression pretty much on the spot. And trust me, that impression will be mostly based on "how much risk / hassle / heartache would I be bringing into my program" -- and only a little based on "how can I help this woman and horse".
                                      Going in with a questionnaire that is designed to ferret out whether the trainer is overly harsh is probably going to set off alarm bells in the part of her brain that's thinking about the risk/hassle/heartache equation.

                                      Comment

                                      • Original Poster

                                        The questions were things like; how much is training, how big are your turnout herds, who will be working with the horse, how many horses do you have in training, what methods do you use. She answered all of them on the phone.

                                        I contacted Gentle Giants and she got a ringing endorsement from them. That says alot.

                                        BTW I told her everything -what he was like before and what he is like now. I am very blunt (as you can probably tell). She says she'll spend the first couple of weeks re-educating him on the ground.

                                        I'm feeling pretty hopeful.

                                        Paula
                                        He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                                          The questions were things like; how much is training, how big are your turnout herds, who will be working with the horse, how many horses do you have in training, what methods do you use. She answered all of them on the phone.

                                          I contacted Gentle Giants and she got a ringing endorsement from them. That says alot.

                                          BTW I told her everything -what he was like before and what he is like now. I am very blunt (as you can probably tell). She says she'll spend the first couple of weeks re-educating him on the ground.

                                          I'm feeling pretty hopeful.

                                          Paula
                                          That sounds like one of the best things you've posted about this. Blunt is good. Now just get that way with the horse.
                                          Visit my Spoonflower shop

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