• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Tennessee Walking Horse Soring Issue *Update post 1*

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally Posted by WalkInTheWoods
    Address your letter to Dear Judge Mattice. This is fine for emails - (snail mail envelope and letter instructions below)

    WItW: As for the letter contents, would it be productive to include comments such as "the whole world is looking at us (usa) to resolve this issue once and for all," "O'Connell should receive jail/prison time to set an example to other TWH abusers," bring up the fact that there was no remorse shown by the perp(s); "please don't let these horses slip through the cracks."

    I want to make an impression but don't want to bog the judge down or insult/question his intelligence or inherent judgment.

    Don't get me wrong, I can be convincing--I wrote a letter once to a judge/prosecutor--darn I can't recall which, but it was in re the Montana horse abuse case where the perps left a horse on the trail to die and the horses' saddles were not removed for days. I was hot! I was respectful but implored them to nail the guys responsible--no slaps on the hands at all. I implored them to send a message!

    For that case, snail mail was the only choice; so is it productive to send both snail and e-mail in this case or would that be overkill? Any and all comments are welcome.

    Comment


    • >>>Be careful that all horse owners and breeders in Tennessee are not painted with the same brush.<<<

      That won't happen here--we have the intelligence to know who's who. And Tennessee is only where the whole big lick thing is "centered" and "celebrated" (not necessarily only happening). There are so many people, TWH owners and all, who don't tolerate soring and the big lick. In fact, I have a new appreciation for the TWH--so many great qualities--just mind boggling what a great breed this is. Why would we allow/tolerate it to be abused?

      Comment


      • And the State did respond by passing an abuse law that specifically EXCLUDES the type of abuse they've become internationally famous for...

        That sends a great message to the world.

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          greygirls - i remember that case up in the Bitteroots and werent the perps fined and jailed ? Followed the aftercare of the horses for a while but never saw if that one horse Able and the other three fully recovered.

          Good suggestions about what to say in the snail/e mails. I know a form letter isnt effective and people need to put things in their own words.

          Re: snail and e mails. Some ppl might be more inclined to send one than the other. Its hard to say what will be more effective. Will they read snail mail or put them in the circular file? Will they read emails or click delete? I dont know. It depends on who handles both types of correspondence. I just feel better sending the message both ways. JMO
          from sunridge1 Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            Cant wait to see what Roy Exum has to say about the new anti-cruelty law.
            from sunridge1 Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.

            Comment


            • we can not be fooled,in this State the # of HPA violations was /is 200+

              a guy just over the knoll has 7 violation and he is on the Board of the TWHBEA.

              Please don't believe that there is not a Big Lick horse in a dark barn in your State being hurt and abused just to get that owner"s or trainer"S name on the wall of FAME.

              Think about this WE ARE PAVING THE WAY TO STOP SORING.making a change in the rules. shinning a bright LIGHT on the abusive practices of some people in the world of TWH showing.

              lets keep holding hands in this FIGHT,Keeping our VOICES LOUD,letting those that ABUSE hear US coming.

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                Roy's views on recent events.

                Roy Exum: Justice’s Walking-Horse Victory
                Saturday, May 26, 2012 - by Roy Exum

                http://www.chattanoogan.com/2012/5/2...e-Victory.aspx
                from sunridge1 Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by greygirls View Post
                  >>>Be careful that all horse owners and breeders in Tennessee are not painted with the same brush.<<<

                  That won't happen here--we have the intelligence to know who's who. And Tennessee is only where the whole big lick thing is "centered" and "celebrated" (not necessarily only happening). There are so many people, TWH owners and all, who don't tolerate soring and the big lick. In fact, I have a new appreciation for the TWH--so many great qualities--just mind boggling what a great breed this is. Why would we allow/tolerate it to be abused?
                  I would respectfully disagree with your statement. A previous post listed the number of DQ'a state by state and there were quite a few.

                  There was also a previous post from a person yesterday who stated that after this is cleared up they can start to go after other breeds. Comments such as that do not garner support from other breeds or their owners. That is not to say there are not other problems but I do not think a witch hunt will prove to help the horse..it will help the coffers of HSUS however.

                  When you MAIL a letter to a politician (more effective than emails as it takes an effort and therefore they claim that EACH LETTER represents over 100 individuals) be prepared to present 1. the complaint 2. the impact on the horse industry 3. the impact on the community i.e. where shows "featuring" big lick are held 4. the impact on Tennessee which also is a hub for C & W music and does not need negative or boycotting publicity and 5. Stress that the solution should come from those involved in the industry NOT HSUS, Peta or other groups.

                  If the solution is left up to the government they will willingly turn it over to a group that will provide legislation AND anti horse show and ownershipp solutions.
                  The Elephant in the room

                  Comment


                  • Well said

                    Originally posted by aarpaso View Post
                    we can not be fooled,in this State the # of HPA violations was /is 200+

                    a guy just over the knoll has 7 violation and he is on the Board of the TWHBEA.

                    Please don't believe that there is not a Big Lick horse in a dark barn in your State being hurt and abused just to get that owner"s or trainer"S name on the wall of FAME.

                    Think about this WE ARE PAVING THE WAY TO STOP SORING.making a change in the rules. shinning a bright LIGHT on the abusive practices of some people in the world of TWH showing.

                    lets keep holding hands in this FIGHT,Keeping our VOICES LOUD,letting those that ABUSE hear US coming.
                    Well said, and so very true.

                    Comment


                    • what is the post # you are eluding 2 FAIRFAX could it be 995,when i stated that the problem at hand was the abuse of the TWH and not the banter about pads on other breeds. if abuse is happening in other breeds that brake the Law of the state or country,they need to be stopped. period

                      For decades the STATE of Tennessee has turned a blind eye to the ABUSE of this breed of HORSE.and i for one do not care who turned on that BRIGHT LIGHT of TRUTH. i'm here to help it stay lite until the Law has more teeth,and those that brake it are held accountable. the rules that govern the showning of the TWH are changed,and the BIG LICK is NO MORE.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by WalkInTheWoods View Post
                        Roy's views on recent events.

                        Roy Exum: Justice’s Walking-Horse Victory
                        Saturday, May 26, 2012 - by Roy Exum

                        http://www.chattanoogan.com/2012/5/2...e-Victory.aspx
                        ??? He kind of lost me in that one. Not sure who this article is directed to.

                        It also looks as if he may not have carefully read the "rigid new law" just passed by the state legislature.

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          i wondered that too - i emailed him to take a closer look at it in particular (d) which expempts animals in training from (b) and (c)
                          from sunridge1 Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.

                          Comment


                          • For those of you that think this current incident is "paving the way" or something new let me assure you it is NOT. If anyone should get any credit for paving the way it is surely the Tennessean which has not missed any opportunity to do huge exposés at various times over the last 15-20 years and probably the USDA.

                            This is just one in a long line of bright lights on the sport. At the end of the day what will change things--really change things--will be the industry itself wanting to change. That will and IS happening at a local level. Knowledge is power and the expansiveness of social media is putting the knowledge in places it's never been. As I said earlier there are still communities here where shame and what your neighbors think of you play a very important role. What your hairdresser, your preacher, and your next door neighbor thinks counts. If THEY think the TWH industry is systematic abuse the Big Lick will die.

                            Just a word to the wise about your "broad brush," telling people who are solid horseman and/or who are working to change things that they are scum because they live in this state will NOT help your cause. Insulting people as a campaign strategy to win their support is ineffective as well as stupid.

                            A little prediction: Watch Sunday's (tomorrow) Tennessean. I'll be surprised if there isn't a long well researched front page piece.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by subk View Post
                              This is just one in a long line of bright lights on the sport. At the end of the day what will change things--really change things--will be the industry itself wanting to change. That will and IS happening at a local level. Knowledge is power and the expansiveness of social media is putting the knowledge in places it's never been. As I said earlier there are still communities here where shame and what your neighbors think of you play a very important role. What your hairdresser, your preacher, and your next door neighbor thinks counts.
                              As a helpless feeling outsider, this is is what I've been hoping for.

                              Comment


                              • For change to happen, it's going to take trainers telling owners, "I don't care how much you want to win; I won't sore." And it's going to take owners telling trainers, " I don't care how much you want to win; don't sore my horse."

                                People are capable of change. Let's just hope it happens.
                                It's 2017. Do you know where your old horse is?

                                www.streamhorsetv.com -- website with horse show livestream listings and links.

                                Comment


                                • Originally posted by pony4me View Post
                                  For change to happen, it's going to take trainers telling owners, "I don't care how much you want to win; I won't sore." And it's going to take owners telling trainers, " I don't care how much you want to win; don't sore my horse."

                                  People are capable of change. Let's just hope it happens.
                                  I am totally ignorant about TWH (and I have not read all 51 pages so this question has probably already been asked and answered) so this will seem a very dumb question to most of you but can judges tell if a horse has been sored? If so the judges need to say "If you sore you will not win." As long as this behaviour is rewarded it will continue.
                                  where am I, what day is it, am I still having a good time?

                                  Comment


                                  • HWNN-- The Judges ARE part of the problem. Most of them are also Big Lick trainers or exhibitors/ owners or FORMER BL trainers and exhibitor/ owners.

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by bayou_bengal View Post
                                      HWNN-- The Judges ARE part of the problem. Most of them are also Big Lick trainers or exhibitors/ owners or FORMER BL trainers and exhibitor/ owners.
                                      Exactly. The Tennessee Walking Horse industry is clearly not capable of solving its own problems. There is no will to do so. It is too bad, but clear, that animal rights groups have demonstrated the only desire to solve this problem. The media steps in from time to time, to their credit, but the cruelty persists.

                                      If the State of Tennessee continues to respond by writing animal cruelty laws that allow soring, electrocuting, etc., for the purpose of training, the only recourse is the Federal Government.
                                      "Random capitAlization really Makes my day." -- AndNirina

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by bayou_bengal View Post
                                        HWNN-- The Judges ARE part of the problem. Most of them are also Big Lick trainers or exhibitors/ owners or FORMER BL trainers and exhibitor/ owners.
                                        where am I, what day is it, am I still having a good time?

                                        Comment


                                        • http://www.twhbea.com/association/bod.php

                                          email the board of directors of the TWHBEA and ask them to review the whole purpose of the Big Lick division. What is it judging?
                                          Groom to trainer: "Where's the glamour? You promised me glamour!"

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X