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Tennessee Walking Horse Soring Issue *Update post 1*

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  • Original Poster

    ROOD & RIDDLE RELEASES STATEMENT ON TENNESSEE WALKING HORSES

    "As recently correctly reported on the Internet Dr. Scott Hopper of the Rood and Riddle Equine Hospital was recently in attendance at the 2012 Tennessee Walking Horse Show in Shelbyville, Tennessee as a volunteer observer and consultant. Contrary to Internet reports Dr. Hopper was not paid, did not call a press conference, and did not repeat the examination on all of the horses examined by the USDA inspectors.

    Dr. Hopper and the Rood and Riddle Equine Hospital enthusiastically support the efforts of the AAEP and the AVMA to eliminate the use of painful means to affect a horse’s gait in training or performance.

    Dr. Hopper’s presence is testament to our belief that there is value in the restoration of the horses of the Tennessee Walking Breed to their original, once proud, plantation heritage, and in the reformation of the municipal celebration of Shelbyville, Tennessee to its seventy four year old roots of showing horses in their best light, not in some aberration of their strengths. It is our belief that active veterinary involvement is paramount in bringing about positive change in the care of all breeds of horses for all uses
    from sunridge1 Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2...rse-tennessee/

      This link also provides a link to download the entire sentencing memorandum
      Last edited by WalkInTheWoods; Sep. 8, 2012, 08:05 AM. Reason: added info
      from sunridge1 Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by walknsound View Post
        Nope, as much as abusers would like for us to away, not happening.
        LIKE
        Yes, I smell like a horse. No, I don't consider that to be a problem.

        Originally posted by DottieHQ
        You're just jealous because you lack my extensive koalafications.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by WalkInTheWoods View Post
          ROOD & RIDDLE RELEASES STATEMENT ON TENNESSEE WALKING HORSES

          "As recently correctly reported on the Internet Dr. Scott Hopper of the Rood and Riddle Equine Hospital was recently in attendance at the 2012 Tennessee Walking Horse Show in Shelbyville, Tennessee as a volunteer observer and consultant. Contrary to Internet reports Dr. Hopper was not paid, did not call a press conference, and did not repeat the examination on all of the horses examined by the USDA inspectors.

          Dr. Hopper and the Rood and Riddle Equine Hospital enthusiastically support the efforts of the AAEP and the AVMA to eliminate the use of painful means to affect a horse’s gait in training or performance.

          Dr. Hopper’s presence is testament to our belief that there is value in the restoration of the horses of the Tennessee Walking Breed to their original, once proud, plantation heritage, and in the reformation of the municipal celebration of Shelbyville, Tennessee to its seventy four year old roots of showing horses in their best light, not in some aberration of their strengths. It is our belief that active veterinary involvement is paramount in bringing about positive change in the care of all breeds of horses for all uses
          Blowin smoke!

          Comment


          • i would like to hope its not a case of cover our butts. there are key words that make you think it may be a save face news release. words like Efforts, painful means. one part of the statement seems to be a good thing restoration of the TWH to its original ONCE PROUD plantation heritage.

            that heritage did not use STACKS PADS CHAINS SCREWS PUTTY GOLF BALLS MARBLES BOLTS period.

            Comment


            • the words return to the original plantation heritage,may have some very concerned, i do believe that the gaits of Strolling Jim could be seen again.

              Strolling Jim :by Wilson Allen was 1939 WGC,thats the Heritage that is talked about,thats what the TWH needs to become again.

              Comment


              • If the presence of R and R Dr. was a testament to their support of Tennessee Walker without "aberration" of the natural gaits, then the Dr. did them no favor by stating that all was well at the event and no problems noted. The statement by R and R was very careful not to mention pads/stacks creating "aberration", so their carefully worded statement really says nothing at all except to give a nod to business as usual.

                Comment


                • Rood and Riddle sucked back as they say. I agree - not much credibility in that statement either. They need to clarify "aberration" and "roots."

                  Furthermore, Dr Hopper needs to give Monte Roberts a call. They each were caught in a very similar trap and are going to be pawns in this awful game.

                  The HPA laws need changing - limit the pads, the shoe and do away with chains in the show ring. Quit the tail cutting and limit those bits and spurs.

                  Come on USEF - get into this ring please.
                  from sunridge1:Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.it is going to be good until the last drop!Eleneswell, the open trail begged to be used. D Taylor

                  Comment


                  • http://books.google.com/books?id=CFE...page&q&f=false

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by hurleycane View Post
                      Gnali - the post was directed at Fairfax and saddlebreds. It is an e.n.t.r.e.l.y. different movement without the weighted shoe. If the movement were natural and trained:
                      WHY OH WHY would they lament the potential loss of action devices?
                      I use training devices i.e. rollers and chains and also stretchies however the big line is...no amount of build up in the shoe will make the horse move higher.

                      He got it or he (she) ain't

                      As a participant in active sports when I was young....I used resistence training. That is how muscles grow...and strength becomes a norm so one does not tear muscles (hopefully) when they have to stress them during competition.

                      I had an Arab stud I had built up...thinking it would make him move like a whiz... NOPE...I learned early on...if they can't do it...shoeing is not going to help them.

                      I have only ridden a TWH a couple of times.

                      Plantation...never rode a BL and never saw one until the 70's.

                      All I am saying is once you start to demand EVERYONE ban chains, rollers, stretchies for TRAINING..you are opening a pandora's box.

                      I support NO chemicals and reduced weighted chains in the ring..also no chemicals PERIOD for training.

                      One of the Arab men stated his bad back had stopped him from riding. His wife purchased him a TWH..and he now is very active.
                      The Elephant in the room

                      Comment


                      • Very good addition to this thread. It definitely gives a much needed perspective on why the laws need to be improved.
                        from sunridge1:Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.it is going to be good until the last drop!Eleneswell, the open trail begged to be used. D Taylor

                        Comment


                        • Fairfax - IMO you are backwards on your thinking on these devices/attachements etc. The so called "training" you refer to is not really training at all. You can stretchie and chain them to death and it will not make a horse trot up.

                          Here is a link to a horse I owned. TRUST me he only trotted like this with the weighted shoe. No "training" necessary. No chain necessary. And no stretchies or house slippers needed.

                          http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/i.../buddyTROT.jpg

                          No way has anyone seen a baby in a field or any unshod horse trot like that. It just does not happen. You see all the action is in the ironwork of the shoe! You and I and everyone else on Gods green earth knows you can take the best bred saddlebred in the world and he will not fling his leg up like that without the right shoe.

                          What my horse had in the picture is ALL shoe and done purely with the momentum and arc caused by the farrier who made the shoe.

                          Just a shoe.

                          SO you better get on board and fight for some limits on the TWH - get those chains out of the show ring, get those stacks under an inch and a shoe under a pound. Anything more than that IS abuse and a horror to watch.
                          from sunridge1:Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.it is going to be good until the last drop!Eleneswell, the open trail begged to be used. D Taylor

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by hurleycane View Post
                            Fairfax - IMO you are backwards on your thinking on these devices/attachements etc. The so called "training" you refer to is not really training at all. You can stretchie and chain them to death and it will not make a horse trot up.

                            Here is a link to a horse I owned. TRUST me he only trotted like this with the weighted shoe. No "training" necessary. No chain necessary. And no stretchies or house slippers needed.

                            http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/i.../buddyTROT.jpg

                            No way has anyone seen a baby in a field or any unshod horse trot like that. It just does not happen. You see all the action is in the ironwork of the shoe! You and I and everyone else on Gods green earth knows you can take the best bred saddlebred in the world and he will not fling his leg up like that without the right shoe.

                            What my horse had in the picture is ALL shoe and done purely with the momentum and arc caused by the farrier who made the shoe.

                            Just a shoe.

                            SO you better get on board and fight for some limits on the TWH - get those chains out of the show ring, get those stacks under an inch and a shoe under a pound. Anything more than that IS abuse and a horror to watch.
                            Try again.
                            This baby-5th picture down-in front of the pond-HUGE trot.http://www.shiningstarsaddlebreds.com/2011-foals.php

                            Really man-made huh.

                            oh and scroll down to the Big Red filly-2nd video and the pics of her in front of the pond. Lots of hock and knee action. I realize these are Saddlebreds, but this is in response to your Saddlebred remark.
                            Last edited by Gnalli; Sep. 9, 2012, 12:58 AM. Reason: added
                            http://community.webshots.com/album/548368465RfewoU[/url]

                            She may not have changed the stars from their courses, but she loved a good man, and she rode good horses….author unknown

                            Comment


                            • the article in the 1969 LIFE,speaks volumes to what needs to be done with the HPA LAW.it sure proves that this battle to get SORING stopped has been a long haul 43 YRS.

                              NOW its in court,never before,fines are bein leveed never before.its has come along way BABY.i knew that man settin on the porch.been around along time folks. i may just see the END of all aspects of SORING in my life time

                              PTL

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Gnalli View Post
                                Try again.
                                This baby-5th picture down-in front of the pond-HUGE trot.http://www.shiningstarsaddlebreds.com/2011-foals.php

                                Really man-made huh.

                                oh and scroll down to the Big Red filly-2nd video and the pics of her in front of the pond. Lots of hock and knee action. I realize these are Saddlebreds, but this is in response to your Saddlebred remark.
                                Gnali (and Renae) - LOOOOOK at my horse's picture.

                                He is not in tall grass or going up hill nor heaving into his first trotting step(the babies and their stills). He is moving out, far above level with his knee AND slapping his forearm on his chest AND his foot is completely curled under. THAT is THE SHOE.

                                He trotted much like those babies with an open high leg when THAT shoe was NOT ON.

                                If you can not give the shoe props, well it is you two who really do not have a clue.

                                All that resistance "training" Fairfax mentioned had nothing to do with that pic - it was THE SHOE. Shoe off - Buddy no trot like that. And my point is neither do the TWH.

                                And more importantly in the case of the TWH you will find without all those devices (pads chains etc) they have no high step at all in gait. The walking gait is a sweeping pushing pulling gait. No knee or foot above the rail.
                                from sunridge1:Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.it is going to be good until the last drop!Eleneswell, the open trail begged to be used. D Taylor

                                Comment


                                • Originally posted by aarpaso View Post
                                  the article in the 1969 LIFE,speaks volumes to what needs to be done with the HPA LAW.it sure proves that this battle to get SORING stopped has been a long haul 43 YRS.

                                  NOW its in court,never before,fines are bein leveed never before.its has come along way BABY.i knew that man settin on the porch.been around along time folks. i may just see the END of all aspects of SORING in my life time

                                  PTL
                                  It really is a travesty that the same story is being told all these years later. Let's see how jail time and expulsion from the show ring AND a hefty fine hits this group.
                                  from sunridge1:Go get 'em Roy! Stupid clown shoe nailing, acid pouring bast@rds.it is going to be good until the last drop!Eleneswell, the open trail begged to be used. D Taylor

                                  Comment


                                  • The Running Walk is a centered gait. It is, in essence, the dog walk at a faster cadence. Look at the films of horses like Strolling Jim and you'll see what the correct form of that way of going should be.

                                    The running walk of the TWH is a distance gait, not a speed gait. It was designed to allow the rider to cover distance comfortably.

                                    The Walker should have two, distinct "gears" in the intermediate gait: the flat walk at 5-6 mph and the running walk at 9-10 mph. If a rider "over drives" the running walk the horse will most likely either enter a soft lope (a Good Thing, IMO) or some form of pace (a Bad Thing, IMO).

                                    Note that most Walker judges will not agree with me.

                                    If you watch the progression of gait through the '40s it moves farther and farther away from Strolling Jim's way of going. By the time you get to Midnight Sun and Merry Go Boy you are no longer seeing that true running walk. The step from there to Talk of the Town is but a short one. Now the standard is not a true running walk, but the Big Lick gait.

                                    Remember that this progression cannot be understood out of context. WWII, drought, recession, and trainer unemployment drove this change. The Walker morphed from a good, honest working horse (for which there was no market) to a circus horse (which could earn big money) over a 15 year period. There was some resistance to this move, but it was feeble and ineffective.

                                    If folks want to go back to Strolling Jim's way of going all you need is about 50 years of good quality breeding.

                                    G.
                                    Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raça, Uma Paixão

                                    Comment


                                    • Thought I'd put up these videos so people can compare.

                                      Strolling Jim
                                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ug-ltUolhQw


                                      WGC
                                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7C6_FQhcoLQ

                                      Not even close.
                                      In memory of Apache, who loved to play. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjZAqeg7HyE

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by Malda View Post
                                        Thought I'd put up these videos so people can compare.

                                        Strolling Jim
                                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ug-ltUolhQw


                                        WGC
                                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7C6_FQhcoLQ

                                        Not even close.
                                        Excellent comparison. Thanks for posting.

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by WalkInTheWoods View Post
                                          If you were into TWHs, you would understand and be glad to see the interest in this thread.
                                          I've owned 2 TWHs...both natural movers with regular shoes. I have a gaited mule right now who's mom was a TWH. So, I am into TWH and hate the old school idiots abusing this lovely breed.

                                          BUT...you are making noise these people don't care about. You're preaching to the choir and they don't care. Look at the recent nationals...still ghastly shoeing and abused horses, these ghastly things still being placed by the judges. Look at Clydes with the horrid Scoth Bottom shoes...just as stupid and ridiculous as the walker shoeing...but judges keep awarding this "look" in shows so they keep on doing it.

                                          Until judges have the balls to stop placing these poor horses, nothing is going to change.
                                          "Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc"

                                          Comment

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