• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

New slaughter plant application makes mockery of unwanted horse theory?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • New slaughter plant application makes mockery of unwanted horse theory?

    The horse meat lobby is trying to buy a facility in MO to set up a horse slaughter plant. Apparently the application to the local board says the proposed facility will breed horses on site in addition to trucking in. What?? Breeding?? I thought the whole point of horse slaughter was to 'take care of the unwanted horses.'

    I bet the plant owners are grateful to all those who endlessly perpetuated that talking point to help get the defunding overturned and pave the way for them to breed the ultimate Frankenhorse for European dinner plates.
    "There's something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man" ~ Sir Winston Churchill

  • #2
    What's that noise? A train?


    Lemme toss some coal in the engine:

    I've said it before and I'll say it again; you better be a vegetarian if you're whining about slaughtering horses or raising them for meat. I care for several pet cows, and most days I actually prefer them to most horses. All three of them have their own personalities, quirks, and likes and dislikes. There is NO difference between one animal and another, which is why I choose to eat none of 'em.

    Comment


    • #3
      well, you breed them you kill the 'OMG the chemicals' argument.
      Originally posted by BigMama1
      Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
      GNU Terry Prachett

      Comment


      • #4
        Well, there's always steroids and antibiotics.

        Comment


        • #5
          but they are in cows, pigs and chicken, too....

          I am going vegetarian: Have Girl Scout Cookie!
          Originally posted by BigMama1
          Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
          GNU Terry Prachett

          Comment


          • #6
            I will be interested to see where this goes.....I don't know enough about it but it seems to me that breeding and raising horses for meat would not be a reasonable thing to do financially....if someone were to try it, I will join the picket line.

            Comment


            • #7
              Dude, we are animals too. Breeding an animal for slaughter is cruel. I mean, we don't do this to humans, do we? If they are going to slaughter horses, slaughter the ones with really bad conformational/temperamental issues. The ones that cant be used for anything. Same goes for cows and chickens and pigs and every other animal on the planet.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by skippy60 View Post
                Dude, we are animals too. Breeding an animal for slaughter is cruel. I mean, we don't do this to humans, do we? If they are going to slaughter horses, slaughter the ones with really bad conformational/temperamental issues. The ones that cant be used for anything. Same goes for cows and chickens and pigs and every other animal on the planet.



                Let me see....
                Oh, right:
                Without the meat demand there would be hardly a big, cow or chicken in sight.

                A quick history of the horse:
                Up until the 1950s horses were heavily used in agriculture. Then - after WWII - tractors started to make their mark and many farms replaced their horses with machines.
                This caused the following:
                Many warmblood horses went to the packer. Especially the heavy blood lines.
                many draft breeds went nearly extinct. It is no accident that Percherons and Belgians are so strong in numbers: The appetite for horse meat in France demanded comparatively large herds t be kept around. By the 1960s the domesticated in Europe was in danger of becomeing a thing of the past.
                What saved their bacon was the increased amount of spare time and money that allowed people to pick up the hobby of riding.

                Food for thought, pun not intended.
                Originally posted by BigMama1
                Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
                GNU Terry Prachett

                Comment


                • #9
                  I don't see the money in this. When slaughter horses can be had for a few hundred dollars, how can you breed and raise a horse to even break even. After the 11 months it takes to carry the foal at meat prices. Would hate to see the standard of care of the broodmares there.
                  And how many months to grow the foals until they are big enough to slaughter? Unless they are going to try and promote foal as the next veal, good luck to them.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by jolise View Post
                    I don't see the money in this. When slaughter horses can be had for a few hundred dollars, how can you breed and raise a horse to even break even. After the 11 months it takes to carry the foal at meat prices. Would hate to see the standard of care of the broodmares there.
                    And how many months to grow the foals until they are big enough to slaughter? Unless they are going to try and promote foal as the next veal, good luck to them.
                    Really, why go to the expense of breeding them when you could just hire Kelsey Lafever to dupe people out of them?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      "Mockery" you say?

                      Ever gave a thought to what is to demand horses be euthanized by animal control shelters like we do dogs and cats, euthanizing clinics and then dispose of that poisoned carcass?

                      We are so terribly wasteful already, guess that also rich enough to just throw away all that a horse can be once we can't use it any more alive.
                      All that food and other products SOME horses can be for us thru slaughter, have been for centuries for us, as the natural, renewable resource they are for us in ALL the uses we make of them.

                      Not only that, why would anyone else but those running the slaughter plant and regulating the slaughter plant have a say in this?
                      If it is not YOUR horse, you don't really have anything to say about it.

                      There are plenty of animal rights extremists, some posting right here, that think horses should not ever be trained and used in any way, not for carriage horses, not to show, not to trail ride, not even as pasture ornaments.

                      There are always some with little to do trying to tell others what they can and can't do, is there.


                      I do think anyone wanting to open a horse slaughter plant today, in the midst of all those real, seriously crazy, deranged animal rights extremists out there, that will try to blow the plant and the vehicles of anyone working there, as they just did in CA, I think anyone wanting to take those chances, well, are a bit foolish:

                      http://agricultureproud.com/2012/01/...cattle-trucks/

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Does anyone else remember when this BB wasn't an emotional trainwreck? When discussions could get heated and there was disagreement but at least the information was intelligent, well thought out and from experienced folks.


                        I miss that.
                        You jump in the saddle,
                        Hold onto the bridle!
                        Jump in the line!
                        ...Belefonte

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by MistyBlue View Post
                          Does anyone else remember when this BB wasn't an emotional trainwreck? When discussions could get heated and there was disagreement but at least the information was intelligent, well thought out and from experienced folks.


                          I miss that.
                          Well, some complained to me that COTH was anti rescues, so they were not posting any more.
                          All I could think, when some rescues have been questioned, as some were questionable, some that supported them, rather than fact finding and coming back with answers, got huffy about it and left.

                          Maybe I was wrong, maybe it was, as you say, the "emotional wrecks" gushing over every rescue story, they were missing.
                          Seems to me there are plenty of rescue threads anyway, no one is anti rescue at all.

                          Interesting thought.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            YEA!!! another slaughter thread!!!
                            The ultimate goal of farming is not the growing of crops, but the cultivation and perfection of human beings.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Bluey View Post
                              "Mockery" you say?

                              Ever gave a thought to what is to demand horses be euthanized by animal control shelters like we do dogs and cats, euthanizing clinics and then dispose of that poisoned carcass?

                              We are so terribly wasteful already, guess that also rich enough to just throw away all that a horse can be once we can't use it any more alive.
                              All that food and other products SOME horses can be for us thru slaughter, have been for centuries for us, as the natural, renewable resource they are for us in ALL the uses we make of them.

                              Not only that, why would anyone else but those running the slaughter plant and regulating the slaughter plant have a say in this?
                              If it is not YOUR horse, you don't really have anything to say about it.

                              I disagree. Do you think it is also the case that we shouldn't "interfere" if children are being abused? Is it okay to starve a horse to death, as long as it is not mine?

                              There are plenty of animal rights extremists, some posting right here, that think horses should not ever be trained and used in any way, not for carriage horses, not to show, not to trail ride, not even as pasture ornaments.

                              I must have missed the post where someone here said that horses should not be kept confined? Or ridden?

                              There are always some with little to do trying to tell others what they can and can't do, is there.


                              I do think anyone wanting to open a horse slaughter plant today, in the midst of all those real, seriously crazy, deranged animal rights extremists out there, that will try to blow the plant and the vehicles of anyone working there, as they just did in CA, I think anyone wanting to take those chances, well, are a bit foolish:

                              http://agricultureproud.com/2012/01/...cattle-trucks/
                              The pro-slaughter rationale has always been based on the fact that we have an unwanted horse population. Breeding more horses seems to negate that arguement.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                The Breton Horse in France is raised for both draft and meat use (I'd bet meat use is primary, today). IIRC there are other breeds used for that purpose, also.

                                For most of human history the horse more a source of protein than a tool of transport. That changed about 10,000 years ago with domestication. Still, in places like France, Iceland, and Japan there remains a market for horsemeat.

                                Since we don't have many breeds in the U.S. that could be economically successful as "meat horses" I don't see anybody doing that beyond someone who is going for some "high end" niche market (like Kobe Beef).

                                That somebody puts raising horses for slaughter in an application for a license doesn't make a mockery of anything.

                                G.
                                Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raça, Uma Paixão

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by MistyBlue View Post
                                  Does anyone else remember when this BB wasn't an emotional trainwreck? When discussions could get heated and there was disagreement but at least the information was intelligent, well thought out and from experienced folks.


                                  I miss that.
                                  Me too.

                                  If this is just an application to a local board, it's normal to toss in everything except the kitchen sink. Most development applications are like that. Doesn't mean anything. It's just part of the process.

                                  Certainly something for county residents to monitor and be involved in if they are interested.
                                  Brothers and sisters, I bid you beware
                                  Of giving your heart to a dog to tear.
                                  -Rudyard Kipling

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by katyb View Post
                                    The pro-slaughter rationale has always been based on the fact that we have an unwanted horse population. Breeding more horses seems to negate that arguement.
                                    Wrong, just means they want to be profitable and have a regular supply. Doesn't mean they won't take other horses.
                                    The ultimate goal of farming is not the growing of crops, but the cultivation and perfection of human beings.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by skippy60 View Post
                                      Dude, we are animals too. Breeding an animal for slaughter is cruel. I mean, we don't do this to humans, do we? If they are going to slaughter horses, slaughter the ones with really bad conformational/temperamental issues. The ones that cant be used for anything. Same goes for cows and chickens and pigs and every other animal on the planet.
                                      I breed meat goats. They have a very good life until one day they are taken for a ride.
                                      I wasn't always a Smurf
                                      Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
                                      "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
                                      The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by katyb View Post
                                        I disagree. Do you think it is also the case that we shouldn't "interfere" if children are being abused? Is it okay to starve a horse to death, as long as it is not mine?
                                        -
                                        -
                                        The pro-slaughter rationale has always been based on the fact that we have an unwanted horse population. Breeding more horses seems to negate that arguement.
                                        Nope, there are many good reasons to have horse slaughter, not just one you happen to object to there.

                                        As so many do, you assume that somehow abuse has something to do with slaughter, which it doesn't, any more than abuse in any other place, be it some backyard or rescue.

                                        The antis use the abuse card all the time.
                                        Shame on them for following animal rights propaganda.
                                        Divided we will all fall, AR will win, no more domestic animals and you know what, that happens to include ... horses.

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X