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New slaughter plant application makes mockery of unwanted horse theory?

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Nojacketrequired View Post
    In a well-run slaughter plant, the kill operators are rotated into other jobs frequently, so the worker doesn't begin to get jaded to what they are doing.

    There is a ton of science behind the way that slaughter is done and the importance of being as humane a death as possible is always forefront in the companies mind. Not only because it's the law, or because it makes for higher yields, but because it's the right thing to do and the great majority want to do the right thing by the animals.

    NJR
    That goes against all that animal rights propaganda tells us.

    What most don't realize is that AR propaganda takes some out of context, against regulations videos and then tries to pass that as "how all slaughter is done", even on the face that it could not be so, would not even be sensible that such happened all the time, every place, was the standard.
    Why? Not only would that be inhumane, it damages the meat the slaughter plant is after, without which it would not have anything to sell of enough value to stay open.

    Common sense tells us plants are operated as they should, just as we know all school teachers are not molesting children all the time, just because they had some on the news that did, shame on them.

    We need to keep animal rights extremists from clouding the issues with their propaganda, if we want to keep the rights to have animals at all.

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by Nojacketrequired View Post
      In a well-run slaughter plant, the kill operators are rotated into other jobs frequently, so the worker doesn't begin to get jaded to what they are doing.

      There is a ton of science behind the way that slaughter is done and the importance of being as humane a death as possible is always forefront in the companies mind. Not only because it's the law, or because it makes for higher yields, but because it's the right thing to do and the great majority want to do the right thing by the animals.

      NJR
      SHs have an 80% employee turnover rate every 2 yrs. Hard to have a well trained person, if they are constantly having to hire new ones.

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by jetsmom View Post
        SHs have an 80% employee turnover rate every 2 yrs. Hard to have a well trained person, if they are constantly having to hire new ones.
        Have you ever managed employees?

        Fast food places have a 100% turnover rate and yet people eat there and don't get poisoned regularly.

        Why? Management and regulations/inspections help keep even new employees working as they should.

        ---Employee turnover
        In some business contexts, churn rate could also refer to high employee turnover within a company. For instance, most fast food restaurants have a routinely high churn rate among employees. For larger companies, such as Fortune 500 companies, the attrition rate tends to be much lower compared to a Fast Food franchise. The company size and industry also play a key role in attrition rate.
        An “acceptable” attrition rate for a given company is relative to its industry. It would not likely be useful to compare the attrition of Fast Food employees with a Fortune 500 company in a corporate setting. Regardless of industry or company size, attrition rate tends to be highest among the lowest paying jobs, and lowest for the highest paying jobs."---

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by JumpingPaints View Post
          The horse meat lobby is trying to buy a facility in MO to set up a horse slaughter plant. Apparently the application to the local board says the proposed facility will breed horses on site in addition to trucking in. What?? Breeding?? I thought the whole point of horse slaughter was to 'take care of the unwanted horses.'

          I bet the plant owners are grateful to all those who endlessly perpetuated that talking point to help get the defunding overturned and pave the way for them to breed the ultimate Frankenhorse for European dinner plates.
          Where did you get this info?
          http://www.clarkdesigngrouparchitects.com/index.html - Lets build your dream barn

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by Meredith Clark View Post
            Where did you get this info?
            Good question indeed.

            There was so much wrong with that OP that it was like a porcupine, didn't know how to approach it, like "Frankenhorse for european dinner plates"?

            Comment


            • #66
              Here's the article that was on Facebook this am. I took the liberty of adding my own comments to this article.

              I've stated before that I'd be OK with slaughtering horses in small local plants the same as other species now are. I can see no reason that a horse specific processing plant is needed at all...just use the multispecies plants, keep the lines slow, restrain the horses properly and do it humanely. Of course doing that will prevent Wallis' outfit from making money and would actually put the money into the hands of horse owners...so don't think they will push for that anytime soon...

              I just find this sort of article so ridiculous to believe when it's so full of contradictions and propaganda.

              [I]MOUNTAIN GROVE, Mo. -- A company called Unified Equine wants the Ozarks to be home to its first processing plant for horse meat for human consumption. The proposed plant would be just east of Mountain Grove near the Wright-Texas County line in the Twin Cities Industrial Park.

              Unified Equine has been working on its business model for two years. When federal legislation in November brought back the ability for the USDA to inspect horse slaughter plants, the Wyoming company got serious about finding its flagship location.

              "We wanted a state that was supportive of our efforts, and the folks in Missouri are 100 percent on board with what we're trying to do and how we're trying to do it," said Sue Wallis, chief executive officers of Unified Equine, as well as a Wyoming state legislator.

              "Oh, I think it would be horrible. People would be moving out," said Mountain Grove resident Danita McCaig.

              Many shudder at the idea of horse meat production in their back yard, but others in the agricultural area are showing support.

              So much for 100% support. I can only imagine the politics behind pushing this through on a small town like this

              "If they got a problem with it, they can go somewhere else, I guess," said Nathan Kelly, owner of Wright County Livestock Auction.

              At the monthly horse auction, Kelly says horses often go for only about $50. He believes a meat market would increase their value and lead to fewer horses living neglected and malnourished.

              Considering that horses are still being slaughtered at over 100,000 a year across the border, I think this assumption is pretty shaky. As for neglect and abuse being presented, that is negated below clearly by Wallis and is not their intent.

              "If you have an owner who can't give an animal away, can't afford to feed it, if they're working for $10 or $12 an hour, they can barely afford to feed their own family, much less their horse, so they're going to take care of their family first," Kelly said.

              If the plant does come to the spot between Mountain Grove and Cabool, the horses would be slaughtered and processed all at the same location, about 200 a day in one shift, or up to 400 a day if there were two shifts of workers.

              So they will kill a horse in less than a minute. At those line speeds, I find it incredulous to think that there will be any accuracy at all unless they can get the horses to hold still. There are plenty of examples that show where this is just plain impossible to do humanely

              "The horses that are processed -- it's just like cattle or hogs or sheep. You don't want starving, abused horses. You want horses that are in good shape," said Wallis.

              In other words...forget the skinny or starving ones..we really have no intention of reducing abuse and neglect as stated above. We only want fat ones... She neglects to mention that unlike cattle or hogs, horses are not raised for slaughter in the US. Duh...no brainer. She also neglects to mention drugs and residues which are a MAJOR issue with the EU market.[/I]

              "Everywhere you go, everybody's talking about it, the slaughter plant coming in. It's sad they picked Mountain Grove to do something like that in, because basically, we have a good little town here, and I'm not originally from here. I'm a transplant, but I still have pride in the town, and I don't want it abused," said McCaig.

              Wallis says the plant would initially bring 40 to 55 jobs to the area, with possible expansion to more than 100. Some welcome the jobs, but others can't stomach the idea.

              "I don't want it to be produced anywhere," said McCaig.

              This little town needs to talk to Kaufman TX before they go through with this.

              Unified Equine and Unified Meats would distribute the horse meat to domestic, ethnic, specialty and gourmet markets here in the United States and across the world. In some countries in Europe, Asia and South America, horse meat is commonly used for human consumption. Kelly says some American horses are currently purchased for slaughter and trucked to Mexico or Canada.

              Since when it is legal to sell horsemeat in the US for human consumption domestically? It's not...so this is a major lie.

              Unified Equine is in a feasibility study now, but Wallis says, so far, all indications are the plant will be a go, and she hopes it will open this year. KY3 received no comments Thursday from the Chambers of Commerce in either Mountain Grove or Cabool, or the owner of the industrial park where the plant would be established.

              Comment


              • #67
                SHs have an 80% employee turnover rate every 2 yrs. Hard to have a well trained person, if they are constantly having to hire new ones.
                As someone involved in the slaughter industry, I'm sure our employees, the great majority of whom have been there since we opened 15 years ago, would be surprised by that statistic.

                Again, having seen the process, albeit on other types of animals, I don't see how 2.5 minutes is so little time to slaughter an animal. That 2.5 minutes represents the actual kill time. I'd think people would be happy with a shorter kill time than a longer one.

                If Temple Gramdin is going to design the plant...and industry sources say she is....I'm sure that the design will be such that it will be the most humane possible. To suggest, as the previous poster does, that we just use existing plants for other species is asinine when the opportunity to have a dedicated plant is being presented.

                NJR
                Your beliefs don't make you a better person, your behaviour does.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by Daydream Believer View Post
                  Here's the article that was on Facebook this am. I took the liberty of adding my own comments to this article.

                  I've stated before that I'd be OK with slaughtering horses in small local plants the same as other species now are. I can see no reason that a horse specific processing plant is needed at all...just use the multispecies plants, keep the lines slow, restrain the horses properly and do it humanely. Of course doing that will prevent Wallis' outfit from making money and would actually put the money into the hands of horse owners...so don't think they will push for that anytime soon...

                  I just find this sort of article so ridiculous to believe when it's so full of contradictions and propaganda.

                  [i]MOUNTAIN GROVE, Mo. -- A company called Unified Equine wants the Ozarks to be home to its first processing plant for horse meat for human consumption. The proposed plant would be just east of Mountain Grove near the Wright-Texas County line in the Twin Cities Industrial Park.

                  Unified Equine has been working on its business model for two years. When federal legislation in November brought back the ability for the USDA to inspect horse slaughter plants, the Wyoming company got serious about finding its flagship location.

                  "We wanted a state that was supportive of our efforts, and the folks in Missouri are 100 percent on board with what we're trying to do and how we're trying to do it," said Sue Wallis, chief executive officers of Unified Equine, as well as a Wyoming state legislator.

                  "Oh, I think it would be horrible. People would be moving out," said Mountain Grove resident Danita McCaig.

                  Many shudder at the idea of horse meat production in their back yard, but others in the agricultural area are showing support.

                  So much for 100% support. I can only imagine the politics behind pushing this through on a small town like this

                  "If they got a problem with it, they can go somewhere else, I guess," said Nathan Kelly, owner of Wright County Livestock Auction.

                  At the monthly horse auction, Kelly says horses often go for only about $50. He believes a meat market would increase their value and lead to fewer horses living neglected and malnourished.

                  Considering that horses are still being slaughtered at over 100,000 a year across the border, I think this assumption is pretty shaky. As for neglect and abuse being presented, that is negated below clearly by Wallis and is not their intent.

                  "If you have an owner who can't give an animal away, can't afford to feed it, if they're working for $10 or $12 an hour, they can barely afford to feed their own family, much less their horse, so they're going to take care of their family first," Kelly said.

                  If the plant does come to the spot between Mountain Grove and Cabool, the horses would be slaughtered and processed all at the same location, about 200 a day in one shift, or up to 400 a day if there were two shifts of workers.

                  So they will kill a horse in less than a minute. At those line speeds, I find it incredulous to think that there will be any accuracy at all unless they can get the horses to hold still. There are plenty of examples that show where this is just plain impossible to do humanely

                  "The horses that are processed -- it's just like cattle or hogs or sheep. You don't want starving, abused horses. You want horses that are in good shape," said Wallis.

                  In other words...forget the skinny or starving ones..we really have no intention of reducing abuse and neglect as stated above. We only want fat ones... She neglects to mention that unlike cattle or hogs, horses are not raised for slaughter in the US. Duh...no brainer. She also neglects to mention drugs and residues which are a MAJOR issue with the EU market.[/I]

                  "Everywhere you go, everybody's talking about it, the slaughter plant coming in. It's sad they picked Mountain Grove to do something like that in, because basically, we have a good little town here, and I'm not originally from here. I'm a transplant, but I still have pride in the town, and I don't want it abused," said McCaig.

                  Wallis says the plant would initially bring 40 to 55 jobs to the area, with possible expansion to more than 100. Some welcome the jobs, but others can't stomach the idea.

                  "I don't want it to be produced anywhere," said McCaig.

                  This little town needs to talk to Kaufman TX before they go through with this.

                  Unified Equine and Unified Meats would distribute the horse meat to domestic, ethnic, specialty and gourmet markets here in the United States and across the world. In some countries in Europe, Asia and South America, horse meat is commonly used for human consumption. Kelly says some American horses are currently purchased for slaughter and trucked to Mexico or Canada.

                  Since when it is legal to sell horsemeat in the US for human consumption domestically? It's not...so this is a major lie.

                  Unified Equine is in a feasibility study now, but Wallis says, so far, all indications are the plant will be a go, and she hopes it will open this year. KY3 received no comments Thursday from the Chambers of Commerce in either Mountain Grove or Cabool, or the owner of the industrial park where the plant would be established.

                  Aight, why talk to Kaufman? because they had a breaking down old facility?

                  http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow...155450010.html
                  Ah, too bad, not horse blood.
                  So maybe yes, talk to Kaufman...ask them how the heck they let people in Texas get away with stuff like that.

                  As for the legality of selling horsemeat for human consumption.
                  The law is somewhat open for interpretation in Texas, it's prohibited in California (brought to light by some guy explaining how he broke state law by mail ordering it from Canada) as for the rest of the nation, I don't think it's illegal, just not offered.
                  And as the sad events in Florida have showed, there is a market in the US.

                  So what is it about the plant that has people up in arms?
                  Right, it's horses.....
                  We got a plant that processes pigs, not to far from here. Smallish place, right next to the major highway leading into town. The plant disrupts nothing, bothers nobody - well maybe the RARAs, a few years back they were closed for a while after a fire....hmm, I wonder.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Daydream Believer View Post
                    Unified Equine and Unified Meats would distribute the horse meat to domestic, ethnic, specialty and gourmet markets here in the United States and across the world. In some countries in Europe, Asia and South America, horse meat is commonly used for human consumption. Kelly says some American horses are currently purchased for slaughter and trucked to Mexico or Canada.

                    Since when it is legal to sell horsemeat in the US for human consumption domestically? It's not...so this is a major lie.
                    I don't think it is illegal. It just has to be USDA inspected.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                      Aight, why talk to Kaufman? because they had a breaking down old facility?
                      So this is going to be better how?

                      Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                      url]http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/drone-pilot-finds-river-blood-outside-dallas-meatpacking-155450010.html[/url]
                      Ah, too bad, not horse blood.
                      So maybe yes, talk to Kaufman...ask them how the heck they let people in Texas get away with stuff like that.
                      Yup, a great example of a state of the art modern plant...
                      Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                      As for the legality of selling horsemeat for human consumption.
                      The law is somewhat open for interpretation in Texas, it's prohibited in California (brought to light by some guy explaining how he broke state law by mail ordering it from Canada) as for the rest of the nation, I don't think it's illegal, just not offered.
                      And as the sad events in Florida have showed, there is a market in the US.
                      I'm talking about selling it to "domestic markets" not slaughtering in a state and shipping the meat overseas. Where is the legislation that makes that legal anywhere in the US? If it was legal, I think we'd already be seeing it in supermarkets all over.

                      Originally posted by Alagirl View Post
                      what is it about the plant that has people up in arms?
                      Right, it's horses.....
                      We got a plant that processes pigs, not to far from here. Smallish place, right next to the major highway leading into town. The plant disrupts nothing, bothers nobody - well maybe the RARAs, a few years back they were closed for a while after a fire....hmm, I wonder.
                      Actually we have a hog plant around here too..Smithfield...they are always in trouble for breaking the laws on pollution in the local area. Remember this plant would be for 1000 horses a week if it's 200 a shift with potential for 2000 if a second line is run. That's a crapload of horses and waste disposal to deal with...not a "smallish place" by anyone's standards. Consider also the increase in trucking traffic over their roads...lots to consider with adding a plant that size.

                      Now, if the local plants already in existence across the US were to slaughter say 5 horses a week on top of the dozen or so beef, several dozen hogs, etc....then you'd have no waste issues, no excess traffic, no humane issues, shorter rides for ALL horses...not just those close to MO, money would go directly to horse owners, all carcasses could be tested for residues and safety, USDA inspectors are available already....I can't see a downside unless it's collecting up the horsemeat to get it to Europe and at least it's 50% less weight to move (figuring meat versus a live animal) and you are moving dead horses for greater distance and not live ones. Win win...but I notice Slaughterhouse Sue is not pushing for that since it won't make her rich. Not a surprise there.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Daydream Believer View Post
                        I'm talking about selling it to "domestic markets" not slaughtering in a state and shipping the meat overseas. Where is the legislation that makes that legal anywhere in the US? If it was legal, I think we'd already be seeing it in supermarkets all over.
                        I think you've got that bass-ackwads.
                        If there isn't a law prohibiting something, it's legal.
                        "It's like a Russian nesting doll of train wrecks."--CaitlinandTheBay

                        ...just settin' on the Group W bench.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          OK, fine..thanks so much for the clarification Ghazzu...then just where in the US is it legal to sell horsemeat for HUMAN consumption? Does anyone know? If it is legal currently anywhere in the US, than why isn't it on the shelves if there is a "domestic market?" Why isn't it regulated domestically like beef, pork, and poultry and other meats eaten here?

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Which is the better option?

                            A. Local facility meaning less transport but also less "equine specific" means of handling?

                            B. A central facility meaning longer transport times but a more equine-specific method of slaughter?

                            G.
                            Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raça, Uma Paixão

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              I vote for A. The horses will actually be handled one at a time and not pushed through on a fast line speed of less than a horse a minute as proposed in the MO plant. It can be done humanely when time is taken to restrain the horses and not have to rush to keep the line moving. I have my doubts of the other as there has been plenty of complaints and failures of the so called modern state of the art plants to take the time to do it right. I suspect if the actual process was made humane, you'd lose a lot of the opponents also.

                              Most local plants that do multispecies process a very small number of animals a day..ours does about 12 cattle. You could process just as many horses in small numbers across the US in these small plants at that rate as one central plant doing hundreds and do it way more humanely. You'd also support local economies and local farmers which again is a win/win scenario.

                              Like I said, it doesn't enrich Wallis and her company that way so she'll never push for it. It's all about money and not equine welfare as was clearly stated in that article in a quote by her.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Originally posted by Daydream Believer View Post
                                Like I said, it doesn't enrich Wallis and her company that way so she'll never push for it. It's all about money and not equine welfare as was clearly stated in that article in a quote by her.
                                Bingo !!!!!!!
                                ************************
                                \"Horses lend us the wings we lack\"

                                Comment


                                • #76
                                  A slaughter plant for animal welfare... NOT! Don't think anyone would expect that.

                                  This is going to be an ongoing subject as long as there are those that don't like the idea that humans kill animals and use them. We eat them, all kinds of animals, so it's not going to stop.

                                  The purpose of a slaughter house is to kill animals, and process them. They all are in it to make money, no matter what the animal is.
                                  The ultimate goal of farming is not the growing of crops, but the cultivation and perfection of human beings.

                                  Comment


                                  • #77
                                    So what would make this plant any different than Dallas Crowne/Beltex/Cavel? All had thousands of EPA violations, Humane handling violations. Transport to MO will not be shorter than it was to any of the 3 previously. The person in charge of Unified has never owned a horse, and has been involved in fraud/lies. I can't imagine anyone with half a brain would trust her for anything.

                                    Sue Wallis has claimed that TG would be involved with things before, and TG venehmently denied it.

                                    And lets not forget the 5 million dollars a yr needed to fund inspections, that we taxpayers would be paying for.

                                    And the numerous violations that even a state of the art SH in Canada recently had during 2 days of nonstop filming.

                                    Same parent group owners as Dallas Crowne, and some of you are thinking it will be better than they were in Kaufman re EPA violations/handling?

                                    Comment


                                    • #78
                                      Originally posted by jetsmom View Post
                                      So what would make this plant any different than Dallas Crowne/Beltex/Cavel? All had thousands of EPA violations, Humane handling violations. Transport to MO will not be shorter than it was to any of the 3 previously. The person in charge of Unified has never owned a horse, and has been involved in fraud/lies. I can't imagine anyone with half a brain would trust her for anything.

                                      Sue Wallis has claimed that TG would be involved with things before, and TG venehmently denied it.

                                      And lets not forget the 5 million dollars a yr needed to fund inspections, that we taxpayers would be paying for.

                                      And the numerous violations that even a state of the art SH in Canada recently had during 2 days of nonstop filming.

                                      Same parent group owners as Dallas Crowne, and some of you are thinking it will be better than they were in Kaufman re EPA violations/handling?
                                      Right, no sense in doing anything in the USA.

                                      No one will ever be satisfied.
                                      Why? For some, especially the animal rights extremists and their followers, this is not about how to slaughter.
                                      The battle is about banning slaughter outright.
                                      Much they protest, they know that nothing else will ever be acceptable.

                                      Lets just keep sending them to CA and Mexico, as their closing the previous plants accomplished.

                                      Comment


                                      • #79
                                        Originally posted by Bluey View Post
                                        Right, no sense in doing anything in the USA.

                                        No one will ever be satisfied.
                                        Why? For some, especially the animal rights extremists and their followers, this is not about how to slaughter.
                                        The battle is about banning slaughter outright.
                                        Much they protest, they know that nothing else will ever be acceptable.

                                        Lets just keep sending them to CA and Mexico, as their closing the previous plants accomplished.
                                        Can you not ever address the questions asked/issues without avoiding them, by going off on a tangent about ARA people. As far as I can tell, everyone on this BB is involved with riding/owning horses, and is not looking to ban ownership/riding/showing, etc. Most of us (against commercial horse slaughter) are even ok with local abbatoirs slaughtering horses for their owner's consumption/disposal, but are against the commercial horse slaughterhouses for human consumption, due to the inhumane practices as evidenced by the Beltex FOIA docs, Court cases involving Baker, Kaufman EPA violations, and videos of 60%/40% miss rate at the state of the art SH in Canada.

                                        But if you want to just evade the issue by saying everyone against commercial horse slaughter is an ARA out to take away people's horses, then carry on.

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                                        • #80
                                          Originally posted by 7HL View Post
                                          A slaughter plant for animal welfare... NOT! Don't think anyone would expect that.

                                          This is going to be an ongoing subject as long as there are those that don't like the idea that humans kill animals and use them. We eat them, all kinds of animals, so it's not going to stop.

                                          The purpose of a slaughter house is to kill animals, and process them. They all are in it to make money, no matter what the animal is.

                                          well, not in the direct line, no.
                                          But it cuts travel time and provides a stronger bottom line for horse prices, thus keeping people out of ownership who can't afford to pay 500 bucks for a horse.

                                          I am very sick of hearing of starved herds. I really rather see them go to the packer before they have to die like that.

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