ASPCA/Humane Society-Your Donation Dollars At Work

[xeroxchick]

Hey Swan - keep fighting the good fight. I, for one, agree 100%.

[carolprudm]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Erin:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by carolprudm:

I NEVER said they were soliciting funds fraudulently. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And I never said you did. Since J Swan's post was about 2 up, I kind of figured most people's attention spans were long enough that they'd know who I was referring to.&lt;SNIP&gt;
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>
You refered to her by name.
Then you refered to me by name.
Then you refered to fraudulent solicitation. Please forgive me for not realizing that you were not refering to me.

[vineyridge]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">There are none so blind as those who will not see. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Erin, on this we have to disagree. Both HSUS and ASPCA are prime federal contractors to handle the organization of animal handling during disasters. If the two of them are so badly organized that they spend more time fighting over who is charge and wasting donations that could be used for another looming disaster (let's just say "Rita")for which they will again be designated by FEMA as prime contractors, how seriously do you think people should take the bound to come, post Rita pleas for donations?

If you didn't already know from reading Guidestar and their tax returns, they received over half a million dollars in government grants in 2003. I'm sure a significant part of that was for disaster planning and relief.

You think HSUS is a worthy donation recipient. Just remember that every dollar that goes into their disaster pocket frees up a dollar (mostly in publicity and administration) for their animal <span class="ev_code_RED">RIGHTS</span> agenda.

I'm sorry, but there is just no excuse for throwing away usable items, even if donated, when Rita is and has been on the horizon.

[BLBGP]

I can back Old Lady - the politics going on at Lamar-Dixon are out of control and no one is truly in charge right now. There's a lot of positioning for perceived power but no one truly getting their hands dirty and making it work. There's a lot worse going on than simply throwing away new crates. Hopefully this will change soon and HSUS will be removed from any position of authority, but while there's still a chance for good media that will be very difficult. Unfortunately, right now, it's all about politics.

LA-SPCA was in charge, but was pushed out of Lamar-Dixon by the nationals. They're still a great option for donations as they are in NOLA rescuing animals still and will need to eventually rebuild their shelter in New Orleans. Laura Maloney is a very good leader there.

[BLBGP]

p.s. - I looked at the photos and those crates all look pretty darn clean. However, here's my "benefit of the doubt" on the crate issue: there's a lot of ringworm on the dogs coming out of that area and perhaps they're playing it safe and trying not to let that spread. I can't attempt to justify a single other thing happening there, though.

[Erin]

viney, I know plenty about HSUS's agenda, and their financials, and you're right, we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

Like I said, I'm playing devil's advocate. I can see there being reasonable-ish explanations for the crate thing, and even though I don't like the wastefulness of it, I'm willing to reserve judgment and not cry "fraudulent solicitation" without knowing the details.

What I find objectionable is the fact that every time the organization comes up, a certain core group of people pull out the same song and dance... again, and again, and again. This thread is not about HSUS's political agenda, and whether or not they promote veganism (who the hell cares) or campaigned against eventing has exactly ZIP to do with how they use their donations. carolprudm is just using this discussion as another opportunity to pull out her soapbox and complain about their agenda. And it's getting very tiresome.

[Anne FS]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Erin:

What I find objectionable is the fact that every time the organization comes up, a certain core group of people pull out the same song and dance... again, and again, and again. This thread is not about HSUS's political agenda, </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Erin, I agree so strongly with most of what you write, and whether or not I do agree with you I love reading your posts, yet I disagree with you on this one. I don't find this objectionable at all. In fact, I LIKE that people are on the ball in making others aware of what HSUS(for example)is up to. Some of us read all the threads and some of us don't, plus new people are probably tuning in all the time, so the information is good, and it's important. Keep it up, HSUS watchers!

As a horse, hound, cat, and fish owner, HSUS' political agenda is EXTREMELY important to me.

I remember reading reports from people who watched them when the Mississippi floods came a few years ago - the rescuers there said HSUS flew in wearing their HSUS outfits, took loads of video, got lots of media attention, and LEFT, never doing one bit of hands-on rescue but boy, did they shill for donations. I think the publicity of that nonsense among animal people is perhaps what helped spur them to actually get some work done in crises since then.

[JSwan]

Geez - take some pain meds for my neck and wake up to find I'm not as sensible as I thought I was.

I'll put this a different way so I don't lose what little credibility I have left.

"They" and I mean contractors, charitable or otherwise, human oriented or otherwise, are supposed to know what they are doing. They hold themselves out to be experts. They have plans. Training. Contracts. They get on tv and say "I'm in charge". They "KNOW" what to do.

When "they" hold themselves out to be the experts - I expect them to live up to it! Pure and simple!

The US gov't is burning food supplies from the UK for no reason. Elected officials sob hysterically instead of girding their loins and acting like they have a pair. Turf wars. Politics. Federal vs. State. Halliburton. Crates in dumpsters. Appeals for crates. Dog food being thrown out. Animals can go in shelters. Animals can't go in shelters. Animals shot. Military can't help animals. Military can help animals. Debit cards for evacuees. No debit cards for evacuees. Kids screaming as their animals are torn from their arms.

It's Abbott and Costello. Who's on first?

Any thinking person has got to be upset by those photos. And when any organization (in this case it appears at first blush to be HSUS/ASPCA) holds themselves out to be competent, to know what to do, when to do it, how to consensus build, and we see flaws - yep - you betcha - I'm going to harumph and call them on it.

Not to negate any good they might have done - but to insist that in the US - we can do better. And I think we can.

[SimplySarah]

HSUS left a foul taste in my mouth years ago (and still continue to do so through my local, embezzeling, scamming chapter), and this sort of wastefulness does nothing to abate it.

No matter HOW I look at it, I just can't find a way to justify that sort of wastefulness. And it's not just crates-- from what the OP experienced first hand, it's bags and bags of dogfood as well.
I don't get the fact that in those pics there were cages with the hardware still attached in it's bags, unused.

[Erin]

SimplySarah, you realize that THE HSUS (Humane Society of the United States) doesn't have any chapters, right? Local humane societies and SPCAs are not affiliated with HSUS or ASPCA. They just have similar names.

Anne, believe me, I am all for making sure people are informed and know who they're giving money to. No one should donate to any group without realizing what they're getting into.

But it *is* tiresome when the same group of people piles on every time the organization is mentioned in any sort of way, and as is obvious from this thread, it completely derails the topic and it winds up being yet another "you shouldn't give them money and here's why" thread. And suddenly we're not talking about the wastefullness anymore, we're back to talking about Guidestar and spay/neuter and whatever else.

Absolutely, people should raise a stink about this and see what the story is. Absolutely, it could have been handled better. So why don't we discuss *that* instead of going around in the same stupid circles we went around in a week ago?

[SimplySarah]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">SimplySarah, you realize that THE HSUS (Humane Society of the United States) doesn't have any chapters, right? Local humane societies and SPCAs are not affiliated with HSUS or ASPCA. They just have similar names.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The entire situation was quite long and drawn out, with lots of corruption, so I'm not going to get into all of the details. I will say that the HSUS WAS involved directly. It was, and continues to be, a very ugly situation.

[mairzeadoats]

"LA-SPCA was in charge, but was pushed out of Lamar-Dixon by the nationals. They're still a great option for donations as they are in NOLA rescuing animals still and will need to eventually rebuild their shelter in New Orleans. Laura Maloney is a very good leader there."

Thank you for this info. That is where I sent my money and I'd like to think, having been unemployed for nearly 4 years, living off what was supposed to be my retirement fund while trying to start over, that the little I could contribute was NOT thrown away.

J Swan, I'm with you. There are still dogs starving in the streets in NO. Ringworm is the least of their problems. They're afraid the dog food might get wet? Go put it into feeding stations so the loose dogs have half a chance.

They're afraid the crates have ringworm? I brought my puppy home last winter with 4 different gut worms, giardia, ringworm and food allergies. All fixed within a few weeks. That's part of what rescuing is about...

[vineyridge]

One of the things that HSUS does is train shelter managers all over the country. I noticed that Memphis had hired an HSUS employee to be the director of their local government funded shelter.

HSUS may do their shelter management training well; if so, I give them credit for their achievements. I also worry when animal rights advocates are placed in legitimate government positions where they can advocate their beliefs with presumed credibility.

As to wastefulness, Memphis, of all places, can't afford waste in their animal programs. One can only hope that aspect of HSUS hasn't been trained into their employees.

[OldLadyOnATB]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BLBGP:
p.s. - I looked at the photos and those crates all look pretty darn clean. However, here's my "benefit of the doubt" on the crate issue: there's a lot of ringworm on the dogs coming out of that area and perhaps they're playing it safe and trying not to let that spread. I can't attempt to justify a single other thing happening there, though.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I brought home 5 crates tonight that were slated for the dumpster. They were large veri kennels. The were big enough for a lab or golden. The were on the back of another truck full of crates being tossed into the dumpster. They were new with the tags still on. The had never even been put together.

Anyone need a crate?

Elizabeth

[luvmytbs]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by OldLadyOnATB:

Anyone need a crate?

Elizabeth </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Yeah!
The animals that need to be rescued after Rita.

This is insane!

[carolprudm]

Everything, with the exception of its opposition to the Three Day Event at the Athens Olympics, I have stated as fact concerning the HSUS can be proved, in most cases from a close examination of its own website.

For example if you look at its home page
http://hsus.org/home.html
you will see appeals for money and discussions of its various legislative and social oncerns. There is little direct involvement with animals. What they do the most of, they do best.

You can also see their 2003 IRS form 990. The 2004 information is available in a slightly more readable format on

http://give.org/reports/report.aspx?ID=226&ReportType=1 It shows that much of the money collected goes to administrative and membership expenses and that they have net assets of over $100 MILLION.

If you go back to Hsus.org you will find a link to donate to disaster relief. If you notice "Yes! I want to help animals affected by Hurricane Katrina, Hurricane Rita, and OTHER disasters". IOW money you donate will not necessarily go to hurricane relief but may be held in reserve.

If you look here

http://www.surveymonkey.com/Users/74623895/Surveys/4014...O_NOT_COPY_THIS_LINK
you will see how what HSUS requires of its volunteers and what support it gives them.

In general money donated to local groups is spent more effectivly than money given to national groups. They have less overhead, no $300,000+ CEO.
Think of it this way, if you stub your toe you don't put ice on your knee.

[NMS]

Well, it's been 24 hours and they still haven't provided an explanation to me via e-mail. Just a one liner would do.

Nancy

[June]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by J Swan:
Geez - take some pain meds for my neck and wake up to find I'm not as sensible as I thought I was.

I'll put this a different way so I don't lose what little credibility I have left.

"They" and I mean contractors, charitable or otherwise, human oriented or otherwise, are supposed to know what they are doing. They hold themselves out to be experts. They have plans. Training. Contracts. They get on tv and say "I'm in charge". They "KNOW" what to do.

When "they" hold themselves out to be the experts - I expect them to live up to it! Pure and simple!

The US gov't is burning food supplies from the UK for no reason."

Hi JS,

I enjoy your posts and remember how helpful to me you were regarding whips on the Hunting Forum. I only wanted to comment on your quote regarding burning food supplies from the UK "for no reason". There is a reason. BSE. Please don't ask me to defend the reason; it is regulatory and has to do with perceived risk and has been in place for many years. If tins of minced meat were part of food rations generously donated by UK, they must be destroyed. That whole concern is not appropriate for these boards and I'll answer a private query. I just wished to say, for that particular citation, there is a justifiable (in my experience)reason. Carry on.

Prayer Continues,
June

[Anne FS]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by OldLadyOnATB:

Anyone need a crate?

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah, I need crates. It'd probably be cost effective to ship a bunch of them up here. I can always use some and give others to people who can't afford them and then they'd be ready for their own evacuations. We're within 10 miles of TMI here and yes, people are supposed to have a plan.

You can see in the photos that the plastic bag of the screws is still there for these brand new crates.

[Seahorsefarmtobe]

Just how dead can a dead horse be beaten?