• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Looking at a horse with a friend.

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Looking at a horse with a friend.

    What to focus on?
    It's a western trained arab. She does trail and possibly endurance but (like me) once she has a horse it is never sold so I don't want her stuck with a white elephant she can't ride and won't sell (She's already got one of those) She lost her 36 year old this past summer and horses like him are hard (very hard) to find. If you find one it won't be for sale.


    The horse will be fussed over so 'must' be affectionate, take baths without objection, have ears handled and in general prefer the company of humans, no spook issues.

    All my previous purchases have been impulse buys (horse picked me) and I've been very lucky in that respect. No lameness, price was reasonable, and horse(s) would cross fire if I asked.

    Prior to schedualing a PPE.
    Is it out of line to ask the owner of the dam what health issues she has ever had?
    Ask the farrier that workes on him how the horse is to work around?
    A pussycat of a horse with a chewed off tail won the triple crown, The Cubs won the world series and Trump won the Presidency.
    Don't tell me 'It can't be done.'

  • #2
    It is so NOT out of line and these should be questions you ought to ask!

    If the owner is reluctant to share the mare's vet record with you, walk away.

    If the owner is reluctant to share the name and phone number of the farrier for you to ask questions regarding any issues with her hooves/attitude or any other questions, walk away.

    Prior to scheduling a PPE, you should go visit and try this horse.

    Ask the owner to show you the horse in the stall, in the aisle while being groomed, at the lunge line, walking outside and around the property, being ridden by the owner and then your friend can hop on if wanted.

    Ask if there are trails around where you could actually try the horse there.

    Ask about loading, bathing, clipping, any related issues with vet handling, the attitude the horse while being fed.

    Ask about her attitude with other horses while being ridden, on the trailer, in a herd or what happen if the horse goes out alone.

    Is there any trainer involved? Who it is, what have been done so far and could you have a talk with said trainer about the horse?

    What should the horse eat to stay that way? (A friend of mine had sold a nice quiet TB to someone. Said person started feeding the TB high sugar feed...and the horse became the devil in person!)

    What is the usual training schedule for that horse? Beeing ridden 2-3-4 times a week? or once a week? A quiet horse used to be trained hard 5 times a week won't stay nice if only trail ridden once a week.

    What is the usual turn out schedule for that horse? 24/7/365 days? or 2 hours per day or ? Again, a quiet horse used to be out most days might not stay psychologically healthy if then kept in a stall 20hrs per day.

    These are just questions. If you don't like the answers, walk away! If the owner doesn't want to answer, walk away!

    Buy a horse that already do what you want to do with it.
    ~ Enjoying some guac and boxed wine at the Blue Saddle inn. ~

    Originally posted by LauraKY
    I'm sorry, but this has "eau de hoarder" smell all over it.
    HORSING mobile training app

    Comment


    • #3
      All very good things Alibi_18 states

      Another thing that I personally do when I purchase a horse that most people don't is get a blood draw. Check the horse out via it's blood levels and see what it is lacking or if ill. If the blood work comes back good then you have a normal blood work for the horse if it ever does get sick to compare it to.

      Another thing is go there unannounced to see the horse if you can to see how it reacts and etc.

      I have found that good horse owners do is give you a 14 or 30 day trial after the vet check and donot use their vet. Use a non-interested party.

      Maybe you can lease horse on site for a few weeks to test it if you are iffy about it.

      Good luck

      Comment


      • #4
        Confused, you want to ask the owner of the dam about the dams health records??? Is the owner of the dam of this horse also the seller? Or a 3rd party somewhere off the property?

        If the sale horse is already mature, broke and trained? Never heard of wanting to go for the dam's vet records. Especially if it's not owned by the seller, they don't have to tell you anything and probably won't. You can't bypass them and go to a vet either, they won't release records without owner consent.

        But it's fair game to ask the owner/seller about the sale horse's vet and farrier history.

        But all that fades in importance until friend actually goes and rides the horse to see if they click or not.
        When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

        The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

        Comment


        • #5
          Some good points, some not.
          Showing up unannounced to anyones barn is not respectful. If you feel you need to sneak around to see a horse, you are looking at the wrong horse -- and dealing with the wrong people.

          Asking for a trial period might get you a flat out NO, which is what I would respond with ...if this is one of your priorities,state that ahead before setting an appt.

          Many people who have horses for sale arent interested in leasing for weeks which takes a horse off the market, however, most will accomodate you coming to visit and ride as often (within reason) as it takes to assess a horse properly.

          Just go ride, as if you were at home, -- a nice trail ride... start there. If the horse is comfortable and reasonably compatable, then: ask for a 2nd appt to see consistancy. If this horse wow's you, then ask for a 2nd appt anyway.
          IN GOD WE TRUST
          OTTB's ready to show/event/jumpers. Track ponies for perfect trail partners.
          http://www.horseville.com/php/search...=1&ssid=057680

          Comment


          • #6
            I've gone to buy horses myself and with friends maybe a whopping five times in my lifetime and we have never kept with the list we made up, for one reason or another. Sometimes you get there and you just know you need to leave. Or stay.

            I would prefer to get an opportunity to catch the horse in the pasture, bring it in, groom, pick feet, bridle and saddle, then have the owner show it off and WTC both ways before I got on, but you don't always get that, sometimes sellers are selling a nice horse and have it all tuned up when you get there and other times they haven't got any tack for the horse they are trying to sell! Or any place to ride except the barn aisle or the pasture or the driveway so you don't get the horse's real reaction to where you want to go and do.

            When we looked at the pony he was owned by a farrier so it was almost a joke to ask if he was good for the farrier - I asked how he was for other people and I'd picked his feet and had a little attitude. They were pretty honest about him being sort of a giant, untutored pet, I asked specific questions about what cues they used to canter etc and they couldn't tell me, I asked about his training and they told me he'd been started by a pro but couldn't remember the name, asked (actually they volunteered) about his breeding but of course they had lost the paperwork too and couldn't remember the names .

            He didn't have a current Coggins and we didn't go pick him up until they produced one, his vax record was nonexistant, sort of like any horse you get from the auction houses and I didn't even bother to ask who their vet was by that time. DH loaded him fine on the stock trailer, he rode fine, he was a real jerk for the first few months here till we got his ground manners better but he's still a mouthy brat, but they weren't dishonest about that either.

            I personally would have skipped buying him, just too much little horse 'tude, not a sweetheart at all although he is getting better, sort of. DH fell in love with the idea and thought he could work with him, he's not un horsey at all, but he just didn't have the time and I couldn't talk him out of it, so my advice is to be straighforward with your friend without being excessively negative or positive. Discuss any dealbreakers that she might have and be clear about them.

            Pony was so cheap we did a vetting after the fact, more of a here he is, he needs shots, deal than a real PPE, but he wasn't planned to be a show horse or a competition horse, just company for the old guy and light trail riding. He was in good flesh, feet were good, bright, alert, opiniated in a pony way and quite the easy keeper, we asked about his diet as well and they were quite honest through the whole deal.

            We did go home and sleep on it - I was hoping DH would see the light but . . . and then the next issue was the owner failing to produce the coggins, but maybe he wanted to make sure we really wanted his little problem child that he couldn't afford to keep any more.

            Good luck - take your time, there'll be someone out there for your friend sooner or later.
            Courageous Weenie Eventer Wannabe
            Incredible Invisible

            Comment


            • #7
              As a breeder, buyer and seller of my own horses and other people's horses I would say your friend or anyone really has to put in perspective all the time involved in this process on both ends-buyer and seller.

              I have sold a lot of horses and never once has anyone asked for the dam's health records-this includes my own babies and I own the dam and sire of all my babies. A dam's health in no way guarantees anything of her offspring. I tell everything I know of the horse-good and bad, the food the eat, quirks, level of training/handling they have and so forth. If the horse sells, I tell the buyer it will all be put in writing, contract form, so there's no "he said, she said".

              There are horse sellers who are going to simply lie through their teeth to sell a horse, just like a car, a dog you name it. It is your or your friend's responsibilty to go in with OPEN eyes and OBSERVE everything.

              If you go, with an appointment, to a barn to look at a horse RUN YOUR HANDS OVER THE HORSE, look at horse's eyes, look at their teeth, Touch their ears, scratch their belly and see what the horse does, feel down their legs, ask the horse to back up..... See if they are mouthy, stand quietly, how they are tacked up. Start with the basics.

              I always watch a horse move free and show those I have or do sell go free-in the ring. Not only am I looking a movement, lameness etc, I am waiting to see if 1. the horse knows anything and 2. listens to the owner/handler.

              I can go on and on and the OP is welcome to PM me. While "you" are a buyer you still should be reasonable in time expectations and realistic of what your budget can buy, your abilities, riding and handling a horse, the horse's abilities and if this is the right horse for you-or your friend.

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #8
                Horse was 13 (older than I was expecting) so Dam's vet records are a non issue, at that age anything that was going to have cropped up would have by now.

                Seller was honest about the horse being dog aggressive and not doing well in large groups of horses (such as in a large endurance ride) The larger group thing I think can be built up to in low key settings, the dog thing well dogs aren't allowed on the stable grounds and I'd rather have a dog aggressive horse than one that spooks at them. Example Pitbull vs dog aggressive horse - dog will lose. OTOH Pit vs fearful horse horse goes through fence or gets bit to pieces.

                The seller has had the horse since he was 4 months old, Shared name of farrier and vets without a blink.

                Horse is a sweetheart, affectionate, tall for his breed 15.2-16hh or so (no stick so guess-timating). I took a couple of incredibly bad pics but they wouldn't upload to the computer from the chip so may have to find a cable to download. (forget the cable here is a link: http://forums.arabianbreeders.net/to...tered-gelding/)
                Horse will have to go from pasture life to in out stall living in a pipe corral I'm not sure how well he would cope with that.

                No, he didn't come home with us this time. No, he wasn't ridden it was just a from the ground evaluation(Friends does (Whisper) 'Parelli'), He had good ground manners and was clueless as to the lead rope shaking but he didn't get annoyed at the rope just seemed confused by it. Figured out by the end of the evaluation that it means 'back up'. Seller does Clinton Anderson so I felt out of the loop there -( I train by 5"x7" white flash cards but different strokes.)
                The tree next door was getting it's limbs cut off and he spooked at that but he was careful not to run over friend.

                I think the seller may offer friend a 30 day trial since this is a word of mouth sale and a good home is more important than the price -which is low.

                My personal gut feeling - no one keeps a dreadful horse for 13 years. If I were not already over my horse limit I would have bought him myself.
                Last edited by 5; Dec. 11, 2011, 11:21 AM.
                A pussycat of a horse with a chewed off tail won the triple crown, The Cubs won the world series and Trump won the Presidency.
                Don't tell me 'It can't be done.'

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by 5 View Post
                  All my previous purchases have been impulse buys (horse picked me) and I've been very lucky in that respect. No lameness, price was reasonable, and horse(s) would cross fire if I asked.
                  Can you explain (cross fire) - it has me puzzled as to why you would want that....
                  "When life gives you scurvy, make lemonade."

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Because you never know when it will come in handy.

                    5, sounds like he's a good 'un. When's the PPE?
                    In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
                    A life lived by example, done too soon.
                    www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yes, I was a bit puzzled by the crossfiring comment as well.

                      Comment

                      • Original Poster

                        #12
                        Originally posted by BEARCAT View Post
                        Can you explain (cross fire) - it has me puzzled as to why you would want that....
                        Cross fire= Cross a river of fire/ Walk through fire/Set aside natural instincts and trust the riders judgement.

                        I wasn't referring to the disunited canter type of crossfire. Sorry.
                        A pussycat of a horse with a chewed off tail won the triple crown, The Cubs won the world series and Trump won the Presidency.
                        Don't tell me 'It can't be done.'

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by 5 View Post
                          Cross fire= Cross a river of fire/ Walk through fire/Set aside natural instincts and trust the riders judgement.

                          I wasn't referring to the disunited canter type of crossfire. Sorry.
                          I read it like I think Bearcat did...I thought you wanted your horses to crossfire at a canter and was also pretty confused. This is why I shouldn't read COTH before I have coffee.
                          exploring the relationship between horse and human

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            Originally posted by ESG View Post
                            5, sounds like he's a good 'un. When's the PPE?
                            I don't know.


                            My friend is recovering from knee surgery the second one on the same knee and may have been put off by the 'not doing well in large groups=horse was taken(while on previous trial) to an endurance ride and was spooked by a fast moving band of paso finos and had a meltdown/did a 180 (perhaps with bolt) dumped the rider and horse came back.

                            Would have been something to work on if it were me but friend might be justifiably cautious because of knee. Horse would be perfect for me but I'm not her and no one welcomes a third knee surgery.

                            Pasture pets spook. A good owner doesn't throw a horse into a situation like that without working up to it slowly.
                            Last edited by 5; Dec. 11, 2011, 11:04 AM.
                            A pussycat of a horse with a chewed off tail won the triple crown, The Cubs won the world series and Trump won the Presidency.
                            Don't tell me 'It can't be done.'

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #15
                              Originally posted by CosMonster View Post
                              I read it like I think Bearcat did...I thought you wanted your horses to crossfire at a canter and was also pretty confused. This is why I shouldn't read COTH before I have coffee.
                              Stupid english language. Too many homonyms.
                              A pussycat of a horse with a chewed off tail won the triple crown, The Cubs won the world series and Trump won the Presidency.
                              Don't tell me 'It can't be done.'

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X