• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

Credible threats of suicide will be reported to the police along with identifying user information at our disposal, in addition to referring the user to suicide helpline resources such as 1-800-SUICIDE or 1-800-273-TALK.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 2/8/18)
See more
See less

pony thread spin off...would you buy a made pony

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • pony thread spin off...would you buy a made pony

    ...for $3,500 or more?
    I love ponies and am a pony sized rider. I would love to change my business to dressage ponies ( I buy, train and sell horses amateur friendly type dressage horses) It seems like a lot of baby boomers are tired of big ginormous horses and would enjoy a sportier little model!
    What do you think?

  • #2
    I think there is a need. The greatest problem I've seen is lack of training (skilled training) on ponies for dressage. Now having said that would I buy one? No, absolutely not. So far most of what I've seen has been overpriced or not properly trained. Now I say that knowing good and well that my scope/experience is limited so I would change my mind if I could no longer train them myself and found someone I felt did a consistently good job. I have a few here that were very poorly started and not necessarily at the fault of the owner but I lay blame with the trainers they chose (in good faith and with good reputations). They have signficant baggage and issues which I have dealt with and all except one are doing quite well now both with overall handling and performance. Each took considerable time and patience to get them to where they are now. I have one though that will never be salvaged (brain is far too fried and he is now dangerous) and instead he is my weanling babysitter. I get calls rather regularly for those wanting or needing me to take one because of similar issues that resulted with their training. So, my view is rather slanted due to what I've been exposed to..............I did not see the same issues when I rode hunter/jumper on the East coast and came into regularly contact with green/young ponies that were for sale.

    So while I am not your market in the sense that I much prefer to take on a blank slate and start them and train them myself, I do see a need. I also think if you select prospects truly for amateurs you would maximize your potential for success too. Just like horses, there are ponies who are more suited for a professional and aren't going to be suited to the average amateur until they're at least, oh 15 or so.

    Ok flame suit is on, zipped and ready for action
    Ranch of Last Resort

    Comment


    • #3
      While big, ignormous horses with lofty gaits are generally not that easy for many amateurs to ride, they lack time in the saddle and skills to aquire that kind of seat necessary, those big horses tend to be slower moving and kinder to beginners than many ponies.
      There is a reason pony is a four letter word. Just kidding.

      The question would be, are there enough ponies/very small horses with the right characteristics of "big horse temperament" and good enough gaits, not choppy and/or hurried, at the right price to eventually make a profit reselling, to get enough for what you want?

      I think you will find a market, but will have to be a very good salesman to get people convinced the ponies you have for sale is what they need, against tradition and today's market wanting what they want, those bigger horses.

      One example of training for the market, my friend trains roping horses and sells most to weekend arena ropers.
      For that kind of roping, the smaller horses are better and handier, but those kinds of ropers like to ride big horses, so that is what my friend gets to train and resell.

      If you think your idea will float, why not try that with just one or two first?

      Then, so many pony breeders are already doing what you want to do, raising and training for all kinds of markets, including the adult amateur one.
      You can see that in the COTH magazine pony issue every year.

      Comment


      • #4
        I ride with a bunch of older riders, and I agree that a lot of them these days want smaller steeds. Of the age 40+ riders in my group, the majority have horses smaller than my 15.1 hand mare.

        However, I'm not seeing people who are still serious about showing dropping down to smaller horses. Rather, I'm seeing people scaling back their showing and instead hacking out more with friends on weekends. Usually this happens around the time that their been there done that show horse needs to retire and/or the kid grows up and goes to college. At that juncture they decide its would be nice to have a horse you can mount from the ground and which fits into their friends' slant load trailers.

        The trouble is, a lot of these people don't have a realistic grasp of their own abilities or the price of a horse which does what they really need. They want a dead broke 4 year old which won't flinch at a quail exploding under is feet and which won't bat an eye if someone decides to enter it in the 2' class at a local show. And they want to pay $1100 for it, because nobody pays more than that for a trail horse which only jumps 2'.

        Comment


        • #5
          The trouble is, a lot of these people don't have a realistic grasp of their own abilities or the price of a horse which does what they really need. They want a dead broke 4 year old which won't flinch at a quail exploding under is feet and which won't bat an eye if someone decides to enter it in the 2' class at a local show. And they want to pay $1100 for it, because nobody pays more than that for a trail horse which only jumps 2'.

          You left out the part that they have to have 3 better than average gaits and the ability to go to at least third just in case they wantta
          Ranch of Last Resort

          Comment


          • #6
            I suppose it depends on the are where the pony trainer is.

            In the more 'rural' areas it would probably not work too well, but closer to the equestrian hubs, I don't see why not.

            (and 3500 is not that much for a trained horse, regardless of size)

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              Thanks for the input. And yes, so many are looking for the bomb-proof, fancy, perfectly sound,easy keeper for $1200! I think it could be more possible for me to provide a pony-sized mount that fits that criteria, than a horse in closer to that price point.
              'Going pony' would certainly lower my bottom line...less hay,smaller vehicle to move them around, and less poop to shovel!

              Comment


              • #8
                I don't know that the market niche is ponies; I think the niche for smaller, made, ammy friendly horses tops out more like 15'1", particularly since the candidate riders don't all weigh 110 lbs.

                I do agree that when riders decide they don't want a 18 hand teutonic snort beast, it's partially because they are putting less priority on showing.

                I think that trainers who are good at finding and bringing along small to medium sized horses that are kind and willing and can do a little of everything are still selling their horses.

                It's not just owners that are unrealistic, either. I know a number of middle-aged lady riders who got suckered into buying horses that are completely unsuitable for their abilities by trainers who end up riding the too green / too hot / not easy to hack animal for them, after they get bucked off too many times.
                I tolerate all kinds of animal idiosyncrasies.
                I've found that I don't tolerate people idiosyncrasies as well. - Casey09

                Comment


                • #9
                  a truly made pony for $3500? in my area that would be a huge bargain (FL)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Depends on your definition of "made."

                    But no, I would never, ever spend $3500 on ANY horse.

                    My most expensive horse was $500.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I would say a "made" pony should be 5 figures...seriously...if it can be ridden by beginners and children. If it's doing a solid second level and has the gaits to be reasonably competitive, you are looking at quite a nice price...and I'd not give it away just because it's small nor an "in vogue" breed.

                      Can you make a living marketing ponies? I'm not honestly sure but it would be neat to see someone focusing on turning out well trained American bred ponies to compete with the GRP imports. They aren't giving those away...and neither should the American breeders of quality smaller sport horses/ponies.

                      I sold a green barely started filly this fall for not quite double that amount. She was with a trainer and was being marketed in a nice area (mainline PA) where that price was not that high. In some areas, there just isn't the buyer base to support a sport pony market.

                      Personally I think way more ammie riders would be far happier on a quiet smaller horse than the high octane sporthorses they often end up with. I know too many ammie riders...those with jobs and limited time/resources...save up their money, buy their dreamhorse...usually a WB, and then the struggle begins to enjoy it as the horse is a Ferrari and their skills are more suited to a less souped up model.

                      Ponies and small horses can be quicker than a large horse...that is true...but in general I find them easier to put together and balance. They sure are closer to the ground in case of a wreck and that does matter as you get older.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I think that you're RIGHT that baby boomers are comfortable on pony-sized mounts, given that most of us who ride are women, whose average height is 5'4". BUT -- research the market in your area to see what kind of people there are to sell smallish steeds to, and you'll have your answer.

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          #13
                          I guess my use of the word 'made' is a little vague...I'm thinking a pony that is w/t/c schooling 1st, ready to show training, will hack out started over poles and x's...that sort of thing. I know there's a huge market for hunter ponies...that's not my thing. I have found some 1/2 welsh that would make super dressage mounts....just worried that i'd have no one to sell them to!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            The USDF tried to promote pony dressage but I'm not sure if it worked. Lendon Grey also promotes ponies for kids. Scott Hassler has a nice Pony Stallion in his barn. I think he's from Summit Sporthorses, a dressage pony breeder in NJ.
                            Unfortunately, people want horses, even for their kids, so that they can grow into them. However, if you can show that your ponies win at big shows, you may be able to command whatever price you want. Winners are always wanted regardless of size or breed. Easy horses are also always wanted just at a lower price.
                            Your best market may be Pony Club, but your ponies must also jump. $3500 for a TL/1st level pony, with decent gaits, that jumps, goes trail riding, and is quiet, is reasonable, and even cheap for some areas of the country.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              You are talking about a solid base. I don't see where that would be a bad thing, even for the hunter prospect.

                              From what I gathered over the years finding ponies with a good foundation is hard.

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #16
                                That's what I was thinking...hard to find one with good solid basics. I am on the small side, can ride larges and have a w/s who is tiny as well. I think we could be a good team to start them and promote them. Guess there's only one way to find out...take the plunge and buy some ponies!

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  I'm no expert, but I think there's definitely a rising demand for horses/ponies in the 14-15 hand range for eventers and dressage folk. I think there could also be quite a profession to buying "reject" hunter prospects that aren't quite the right height to be sold, (14.3-15.1). Not only is my 15.1 baby amazing, but I know of several other horses out of top notch hunter barns that just didn't have the right height to be sold top dollar for their breeding/movement. After seeing my horse, a few girls at my barn even asked me "where can I get one" because they just couldn't afford the "normal sized" horses who were essentially the same class of animal, just taller and with bigger price tags.

                                  But many people do still prefer to buy ponies because of their resale flexibility. There's also a high demand for ponies right now with the world pony finals or something coming up in a year or so. I don't know exactly what kind of classes are offered, but I'd think for a kid that a good pony is a good pony regardless of discipline. Not to make any rash generalizations, but in this particular situation I think the assumption is that if you're a parent buying a pony for your kid to compete at a huge show like that, that you probably have deep pockets and $3500 would be a deal for anything with above average quality.

                                  I don't know anyone older than college-aged to say anything about older adults buying honies/ponies for eventing/dressage, but like I said, younger folk are definitely more interested. Financially more realistic, easier keepers, and not as far of a fall.

                                  One last thing, I kind of disagree with marketing to ponyclubbers. I'm a kid, (well, kind of) and I know that having what's in "style" is very important. Ponies and small horses are not in style right now. I used to be at a ponyclub barn and was constantly teased about my hony when I first bought him. It was like his height represented my low-income and inability to afford a "real" sized horse, even though he's a superb mover. When I moved to a pony hunter barn though, all of the kids LOVED my hony. They were also a few years younger. Maybe it's a generational thing.

                                  Comment

                                  Working...
                                  X