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When is it not your business?

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  • When is it not your business?

    I'm going to keep this pretty vague, just in case.

    I have been riding other people's horses for a while, a free lease kind of deal. I met this person who has a few horses, a place with some professional jumps, and very little knowledge. The owner wanted me to work with one horse in particular. The horse rides okay but I mentioned that it seemed stiff and just "not quite right." We did the "staring at the horse and muttering well-maybes" thing for a little while, and decided just to watch it and see how it goes.

    Fast forward a couple weeks and the owner had bought a bunch of fancy stuff (trying to be nondescript) that was very expensive and let's just say not necessary, all the while complaining about money. I go to ride the horse, and discover that its loin is extremely sore, so much that it's tossing its head and shifting away during grooming. Its spine looked misaligned in the SI area and I mentioned this to owner and suggested a vet. Owner says vets just try to rip you off and that the spine is supposed to look this way in this breed. And anyhow owner doesn't have the money.

    I declined riding and gently suggested, again, that someone take a look at horse, and that I wasn't comfortable riding until someone did.

    Owner later emails me that horse looks fine in pasture (of course) and asking me to ride. Saying again that this problem is normal in this breed. I respond that, again, I am not comfortable riding until someone clears horse, because I have seen spine issues before, and it's not worth the risk. Owner then tells me they have spent all their money buying more expensive and unnecessary things.

    Okay, so what should I do? It is hard to find English places to ride out here, and no I can't afford to lease or own. I think my reaction was more than reasonable. Should I gently recommend to owner that they sell some of their recently acquired expensive accessories to provide vet care? Do I walk away?

  • #2
    Walk away.

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    • #3
      It's the owners choice what to spend money on, just as it is your choice as to whether or not you continue to ride a horse thats NQR.

      Doing the right thing..isn't always the same as doing the easy thing:/
      Originally posted by ExJumper
      Sometimes I'm thrown off, sometimes I'm bucked off, sometimes I simply fall off, and sometimes I go down with the ship. All of these are valid ways to part company with your horse.

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      • #4
        Inform the owner you cannot, in good faith, exercise an animal in such pain. And walk away.

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        • #5
          I would walk away. When you can't get to an ok place in the middle, that's a deal breaker.

          The owner spent that money on that stuff for that horse. Not for you. That's their problem, frankly.

          Going forward, in similar situations with other owners/horses, plan 'check ups' at- let's say -60 day intervals. so you know every 60 days we'll talk about how it's going.

          Since you've gone to emails with them just VERY politely reply that you are not comfortable riding a horse that demonstrates pain and soreness in his loins. You don't feel that it's fair to the horse. If he gets vetted and cleared for rehab work on that loin issue, that you may be free to assist with that, schedule permitting. In the meanwhile I thank you for the opportunity to ride him in the past, and wish her and the horse well going forward.

          be polite, but he's her horse, it's her choice, and it's her money.

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            #6
            Originally posted by rainechyldes View Post
            It's the owners choice what to spend money on, just as it is your choice as to whether or not you continue to ride a horse thats NQR.

            Doing the right thing..isn't always the same as doing the easy thing:/
            I guess that's my problem. It's tough, I want to ride, love horses, and think this horse and I would get along well. And of course I don't want it hurting. But I guess not riding is better than getting entangled in drama and sticking my nose where it doesn't belong.

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            • #7
              Well...if you're willing to walk it wouldn't hurt to give them a dose of reality as you do it.

              Why not just be honest about how you feel, tell person (s)he is being pretty darn unrealistic and irresponsible with the care of their horse and it's stupid (not to mention painful and a little cruel for the horse) to expect you to keep riding the horse when there is an obvious problem. Either the person will realize they need to get this horse some attention or they will tell you to walk. It doesn't sound like you need to be riding this horse anyway if it's in that much pain.

              Sure, you run the risk of the person bad-mouthing you and potentially screwing up other potential riding opportunities for you but do you really want to ride for someone that thinks it's okay to be riding a horse in that condition and not getting it any vet care?

              I say walk, and tell them exactly why you're doing it.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by alg0181 View Post
                I guess that's my problem. It's tough, I want to ride, love horses, and think this horse and I would get along well. And of course I don't want it hurting. But I guess not riding is better than getting entangled in drama and sticking my nose where it doesn't belong.
                And telling her how to pay for something she already thinks is BS, is a One Way Ticket to getting entirely in her yard and trespassing

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                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  Originally posted by saddlebum122 View Post
                  Well...if you're willing to walk it wouldn't hurt to give them a dose of reality as you do it.

                  Why not just be honest about how you feel, tell person (s)he is being pretty darn unrealistic and irresponsible with the care of their horse and it's stupid (not to mention painful and a little cruel for the horse) to expect you to keep riding the horse when there is an obvious problem. Either the person will realize they need to get this horse some attention or they will tell you to walk. It doesn't sound like you need to be riding this horse anyway if it's in that much pain.

                  Sure, you run the risk of the person bad-mouthing you and potentially screwing up other potential riding opportunities for you but do you really want to ride for someone that thinks it's okay to be riding a horse in that condition and not getting it any vet care?

                  I say walk, and tell them exactly why you're doing it.
                  I agree with the sentiment, and trust me, I wanted to tell owner exactly this; the problem is that owner is just honestly inexperienced. Owner buys everything they see in catalogs because they think they need it but really can't see the problem I was describing (and, for example, how it differs from just poor conformation). So I don't want to be cruel when owner just doesn't know better.

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                  • #10
                    I would walk away. This doesn't sound like somebody you will be able to reason with. It isn't right for the horse to not get the care, and if there is an issue you don't want to get hurt when the horse says enough. I don't know a single breed that that kind of reaction would be normal for. The owners have their priorities in the wrong place, and I doubt there is anything you can do to sway the opinion.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Originally posted by mjrtango93 View Post
                      I would walk away. This doesn't sound like somebody you will be able to reason with. It isn't right for the horse to not get the care, and if there is an issue you don't want to get hurt when the horse says enough. I don't know a single breed that that kind of reaction would be normal for. The owners have their priorities in the wrong place, and I doubt there is anything you can do to sway the opinion.
                      I am very familiar with this breed. It is most definitely not normal and I have in fact seen this problem before, with a chiro being necessary to keep the horse sound.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by alg0181 View Post
                        I am very familiar with this breed. It is most definitely not normal and I have in fact seen this problem before, with a chiro being necessary to keep the horse sound.
                        Sounds like you have your own answer then. I would politely e-mail or call, inform the owner that you will not ride the horse unless it is seen and cleared by a vet, thank them for the opportunity and walk away.

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                        • #13
                          I would walk before you get too attached. The wealthy (which it sounds like she is despite the money complaints, or she just acts like a wealthy person by spending a lot, which is a similar mentality in this case IMO), know-nothing horse owners who are convinced they know more than you are complete Hell to deal with. There is no reasoning and no accepting of logical explanations. They know best, it's THEIR horse, and you obviously haven't a clue (in their minds, of course). It doesn't matter how much you try.

                          I got too involved with a slightly similar situation (horse in medical need and it was NOT being attended to) and am too deeply attached to the animals to leave at this point. The verbal abuse, condescending (yet, at the same time, completely idiotic) talk, and threats are miserable...but I'm too attached to the horses and am worried about what will happen if I don't care for them on my own. On my dollar at this point too. I might be overreacting because of the position I am in, but I think you should stop before you end up in my position.
                          Last edited by mg; Dec. 14, 2010, 05:34 PM. Reason: typo
                          "Last time I picked your feet, you broke my toe!"

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            Originally posted by mg View Post
                            I would walk before you get too attached. The wealthy (which it sounds like she is despite the money complaints, or she just acts like a wealthy person by spending a lot, which is a similar mentality in this case IMO), know-nothing horse owners who are convinced they know more than you are complete Hell to deal with. There is no reasoning and no accepting of logical explanations. They know best, it's THEIR horse, and you obviously haven't a clue (in their minds, of course). It doesn't matter how much you try.

                            I got too involved with a slightly similar situation (horse in medical need and it was NOT being attended to) and am too deeply attached to the animals to leave at this point. The verbal abuse, condescending (yet, at the same time, completely idiotic) talk, and threats are miserable...but I'm too attached to the horses and am worried about what will happen if I don't care for them on my own. On my dollar at this point too. I might be overreacting because of the position you are in, but I think you should stop before you end up in my position.
                            I think you're right, I would easily become attached to this horse and frankly it's easy to become attached to ANY horse when you feel their owner is not providing good care. Owner is not super-wealthy but the money they have spent just in the last couple of months on accoutrement would pay for vet and farrier care for the horses for probably a year. Which is hard to watch.

                            Of course, I'm not great at managing money either. But my animals get care even when I've had to sell my stuff or eat ramen noodles.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Failure to provide needed medical care is neglect. Keep standing up for the horse. Tell her you love her farm and horses and hope you can ride/help for a long time to come, but only if the animals get medical care when it is needed. Try to find and suggest a vet that she might be willing to try and put some faith in. It's all part of responsible horse ownership. I know all this is easier said than done...but she might be willing to learn from you and the animals would benefit.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Walk away. I agree, doing the right thing is many times not the easy thing. But, it's still the right thing.

                                Cause you know if you do ride him and it goes really bad who's fault that will be.
                                www.Somermistfarm.com
                                Quality Hunter Ponies

                                Comment

                                • Original Poster

                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by Somermist View Post
                                  Walk away. I agree, doing the right thing is many times not the easy thing. But, it's still the right thing.

                                  Cause you know if you do ride him and it goes really bad who's fault that will be.
                                  I told the owner straight out that this was one of my concerns, that in no way will I let myself be held liable for a horse going permanently lame.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by Somermist View Post
                                    Walk away. I agree, doing the right thing is many times not the easy thing. But, it's still the right thing.

                                    Cause you know if you do ride him and it goes really bad who's fault that will be.

                                    Ditto!

                                    Comment

                                    • Original Poster

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by HPFarmette View Post
                                      Failure to provide needed medical care is neglect. Keep standing up for the horse. Tell her you love her farm and horses and hope you can ride/help for a long time to come, but only if the animals get medical care when it is needed. Try to find and suggest a vet that she might be willing to try and put some faith in. It's all part of responsible horse ownership. I know all this is easier said than done...but she might be willing to learn from you and the animals would benefit.
                                      Yes, but...it's not my job. As a grown person, owner can take or leave advice. I gave advice, and strongly suggested that horse see a vet. I can't force owner to do anything, and they certainly don't want to learn, because they got defensive when I said I would rather not ride.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Perhaps there are some printed references you can give to them regarding whatever the problem is....it wouldn't be your word then but the word of a vet, research facility, breed info site, whatever...?

                                        I would emphasize that riding will likely make the problem worse which is not good for the horse or their eventual vet bill.

                                        And that riding a horse in pain puts YOU at risk of a nasty reaction on the part of the horse when he gets fed up with hurting.....and their insurance company might not be all that happy about that.
                                        Colored Cowhorse Ranch
                                        www.coloredcowhorseranch.com
                                        Northern NV

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