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please sign the petition to get the anti-slaughter bill onto the house floor

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  • Jumphigh...I have put my money where my mouth is...I have rescued several from slaughter now to include one very special mustang out in my pasture right now. I rescued another mare that I worked with for a while and then sold. She found a good home. I have a barn full of rescue cats too. I'm a sucker for a sad story and an homeless animal and have spent a lot of my money helping out all kinds of animals. Yes, I have sent money to equine rescue organizations too.

    I also would shoot any one of my horses myself before sending them to slaughter and if all I had was a toothpick to dig a hold to bury them in, I'd do it too.

    Comment


    • Are we having contest for sainthood? Is there a limited time frame? Can anyone apply?

      Just for the record today you would not be allowed to bury your horse with or without the toothpick on you property. It's against the clean water act. As to have having horses shot I think I could win that contest if you let me count my whole 30 years in the business.

      We're not comparing who is least bad with our own horses, we're talking about other people who also exist in this world. Many do not even respect life in people so how do you expect them to respect the life of a horse or even a dog.

      In the real world people who are not very nice come into possession of horses and some people are poor enough to need the money from the slaughter house to survive. There is a pecking order and although the horse may be highest on your list someone in need may not have the options.

      The problem to be solved is to do it humanely and treat them with respect in their final hours. Not every horse gets to see the person they love most as the last imprint on their brain before they die.

      Even people are not nice to other people. BUT that doesn't change the fact that not recycling the meat doesn't do anyone any good and the horse is past caring at that point.
      http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

      Comment


      • "Just for the record today you would not be allowed to bury your horse with or without the toothpick on you property. It's against the clean water act."

        Bunk. Snowbird strikes again.

        Unless you qualify as an CAFO, but must first be declared an AFO (small AFO=150 horses). Soup, do you have 150 or more horses & not on pasture??
        There are guidelines for carcass composting if you do, in which case you are already aware of them
        For those of you with fewer horses, contact your local extension office for disposal recommendations. Most of us have buried horses on our property, depending on your layout it's most often not illegal.
        "There's a fine line between genius and madness. I've removed that line." -Super Genius/me

        Comment


        • Hmm. Still no answer to my question about why the bill has the qualifier "for human consumption" all over it. IE, the practices you all decry are AOK if the carcass is used for any other purpose.

          Sea Oat, I've never lived anywhere before where burying a horse would even be an option. My property is on its way to becoming an organic farm and is surrounded by waterways that supply much of northern California's supply. Would burying a chemically euthanized horse be allowed in such a circumstance?
          If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket

          Comment


          • By all means check with your township and the Board of Health as well. Methinks some people have mixes concepts into stew.

            Right now the manure issue is for 150+ horses. The law started at 600 horses and has gradually been working it's numbers down. oon they'll get to you too.

            Burying your horse on your farm anywhere is not legal, it's been done in the dark of night. There is concern that the decomposing corpse can affect the acquafir. I guess it's ok! in the desert or if you're not caught.
            http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

            Comment


            • I am curious as to what the answer to poltroon's question is as well.

              And a quick search on google shows that *most* places have laws against burying even your dog or cat in your own backyard, not to mention an animal as large as a horse.
              Success is not the result of spontaneous combustion; you must set yourself on fire

              Comment


              • There you go just because someone wants you to think they know what they're talking about doesn't make it true.
                http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

                Comment


                • Like I said, check with your local extension office for guidelines on YOUR property. Obviously if you live in a housing development, no. Not even your dog in some places. Just like you can't have your drain field near certain watersheds, etc..
                  But most of us with horses on our property have a few acres at least & often are allowed to bury a horse, just check exactly where first (& obviously not near your well or a creek). I was given the OK for one section of our farm but not another.
                  Some of you who've buried your horses, chime in with how you were permitted. To many, it's not an issue HERE, one way or the other.
                  This is anti-slaughter, not anti-disposal or anti-feed-your horse-to-your-dog, or whatever. Kill him how you like, dispose of the body as you & the law sees fit, just kill him nice & quiet like. How many ways can you people find to tediously pick apart every inkling of an iota of a miniscule of a tiny piece of any part of this subject, in support of torturing things you claim to love, is stunning.

                  Poltroon....your question on other food sources but not human consumption has already been answered, if not directly, read the links and the bill itself. It's redundant material, take time to look at it.
                  The human food trade commands the prices ($20. per lb) which commands the market. History shows THAT in itself closes the plants when removed.
                  The bill also prohibits trade & transport of *horseflesh* (meaning all parts of a dead horse) & *slaughter* (meaning commercial killing of one or more horses for human consumption). Overall stopping trade of horseflesh & live horses intended for human consumption AND other purposes.
                  THIS DOES NOT STOP ANYONE FROM DONATING A HORSE FOR ZOO OR PET FOOD. You just can't get paid for it. You may have who you are donating to put the horse down in exchange for the carcass.
                  Among other things, there's nothing wrong or argued with use of a carcass, but there is outrage at the method of kill required for any market induced assembly line slaughter. If an unwanted horse could be proccessed in large numbers HUMANELY I *might* re-think my position, but it is impossible. Literally impossible to proccess horses ASSEMBLY LINE as such, in the #s the human food market demands, in any way short of horrific.
                  And when you throw $$ into a dead horse, all kinds of shady dealings and irresponsible acts arrise. So WHY IN HELL would I fight for better means of dropping the horse at all?
                  Leave it to rendering plants to accept the dead weight for other uses.

                  IF YOU WERE TO PUT A HORSE DOWN, IN YOUR BARN, THE WAY THESE HORSES ARE PROCCESSED *REGULARLY*, YOU WOULD BE WIDE OPEN FOR ABUSE PENALTIES. Your friends would see you as a monster. If you can pose an argument either for or against this slaughter bill, than at least LOOK at the films, lest you hold no imaginable idea of what you're speaking about. Hard to grasp w/out seeing.
                  "There's a fine line between genius and madness. I've removed that line." -Super Genius/me

                  Comment


                  • It most certainly IS legal to bury your horse on your property in some areas, you really should check with your county first though. A well known horse rescuer in my area lost her favorite horse and the sheriff and several firemen helped her bury him, so I highly doubt it was illegal... plus, they did help bury him in the daylight...
                    My Equines:::
                    Flower: http://www.eqbydesign.com/flower.htm
                    Quin: http://www.eqbydesign.com/quin.htm
                    Half Magic: http://www.teamwindchase.com/Half_Magic.htm

                    Comment


                    • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SeaOat:
                      Kill him how you like, dispose of the body as you & the law sees fit, just kill him nice & quiet like. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      As long as a person doesn't eat him.

                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
                      How many ways can you people find to tediously pick apart every inkling of an iota of a miniscule of a tiny piece of any part of this subject, in support of torturing things you claim to love, is stunning.
                      <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      Well, Sea Oat, the thing is that the law is all about tediously picking apart every inkling of an idea. That is what lawyers and judges do.

                      I'm not pro-slaughter, I'm anti-bureacracy. I dislike rules that are anything less than clear. I dislike rules that outlaw one thing when they really mean to outlaw something else.

                      Just because you label the bill as pro-horse does not mean it will be so in practice.

                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>

                      _Poltroon_....your question on other food sources but not human consumption has already been answered, if not directly, read the links and the bill itself. It's redundant material, take time to look at it.
                      The human food trade commands the prices ($20. per lb) which commands the market. History shows THAT in itself closes the plants when removed.
                      <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      Actually, I have read the bill quite closely.


                      The price of horsemeat is a useful fact and in fact shows that my approach - which would require better attention to each horse and thus raise the cost - is likely to end horse slaughter in a clean market fashion. My approach would also allow, say, someone to raise organic grass-fed horse meat, kill each one lovingly, and sell it at gourmet prices - just as many family farms are now doing with beef, lamb, and pork. I'm not saying I would do that or be a customer - but my neighbor's cute calves are 200 yards from me in the finest grass field I've seen anywhere. They live a good life. And I'll probably end up buying steaks from one of them.

                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
                      The bill also prohibits trade & transport of *horseflesh* (meaning all parts of a dead horse) & *slaughter* (meaning commercial killing of one or more horses for human consumption). Overall stopping trade of horseflesh & live horses intended for human consumption AND other purposes.
                      <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      This is my prime complaint on sloppy legislation. As I read it, it's (horseflesh and live horses) intended for human consumption. If you think it's otherwise you should get one of your sponsors to change the wording to clarify. Before it passes, not after a judge decides.

                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
                      THIS DOES NOT STOP ANYONE FROM DONATING A HORSE FOR ZOO OR PET FOOD. You just can't get paid for it.
                      <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
                      Or take a tax deduction for it, because according to your reading, it cannot be sold and then the carcass legally has no value. But, thank goodness that zoos can still feed horsemeat. I guess. Why aren't you against that?

                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
                      You may have who you are donating to put the horse down in exchange for the carcass.
                      Among other things, there's nothing wrong or argued with use of a carcass, but there is outrage at the method of kill required for any market induced assembly line slaughter.
                      <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      Here I agree. Since these plants cannot exactly be hidden, why not specifically prohibit the practices that cause cruelty? Why tell veterinarians to use a firearm instead of a captive bolt if they need to euthanize a horse? Why tell one guy he can't humanely kill his horse and sell it to his neighbor for food?

                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
                      If an unwanted horse could be proccessed in large numbers HUMANELY I *might* re-think my position, but it is impossible.
                      <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      The bill as written makes it impossible for anyone to invent such a way.

                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
                      Literally impossible to proccess horses ASSEMBLY LINE as such, in the #s the human food market demands, in any way short of horrific.
                      And when you throw $$ into a dead horse, all kinds of shady dealings and irresponsible acts arrise.
                      <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


                      And the same is true for beef, lamb, pork, poultry... which is why I buy from people who care for their animals and treat them well when alive.

                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
                      So WHY IN HELL would I fight for better means of dropping the horse at all?
                      Leave it to rendering plants to accept the dead weight for other uses.


                      IF YOU WERE TO PUT A HORSE DOWN, IN YOUR BARN, THE WAY THESE HORSES ARE PROCCESSED *REGULARLY*, YOU WOULD BE WIDE OPEN FOR ABUSE PENALTIES. Your friends would see you as a monster. If you can pose an argument either for or against this slaughter bill, than at least LOOK at the films, lest you hold no imaginable idea of what you're speaking about. Hard to grasp w/out seeing. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      No disagreement. Treating a horse (or a cow, or a sheep, or a chicken, or a pig) that way should be against the law. Why doesn't someone write a bill that would do that? Or why doesn't the local Animal Control cite them for felony abuse?

                      I fight this bill not because I want to see horses badly treated, or eaten, or sent to slaughter.

                      I fight this bill PRECISELY because I don't believe it will stop bad treatment or slaughter of horses. I believe it will prevent other, better legislation that could make slaughter more humane from being proposed or passed. I believe the enforcement of the law will be spotty. I think what will happen is the bill will pass (if it does), the celebrities will have a round of "Huzzah!" then pat themselves on the back and go home, content that at last the horsies will have long happy lives in green fields and no one will ever hurt them again. Fat horses will end up being trucked to Mexico. And horses will be a little less "agriculture" according to the wackos who define it.
                      If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket

                      Comment


                      • Poltroon I love you!
                        http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

                        Comment


                        • Snowbird, you are so full of shit. I wrote much of what Poltroon said about my current purchases of meat NOT factory raised and you ridiculed me. You were positively snotty. *Someone* needs to change her Depends right along with her meds. God I hope my mind doesn't go before my fingers on a keyboard when I get old.
                          Plotroon, I give up. Much of your reponse is moot. I never said I was against feeding meat to zoos for example. You ask questions, I answer them, then you ask ask ask them again.
                          This is silly. I have a movie to watch and a cold one w/ my name on it. Talk amongst yourselves......
                          "There's a fine line between genius and madness. I've removed that line." -Super Genius/me

                          Comment


                          • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by poltroon:

                            No disagreement. Treating a horse (or a cow, or a sheep, or a chicken, or a pig) that way should be against the law. Why doesn't someone write a bill that would do that? Or why doesn't the local Animal Control cite them for felony abuse?

                            <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                            Oh but they DO! Animal Control and Humane Organizations are there to protect all animals... my friend who is a humane officer was right in the middle of the shut down of a pig slaughter plant - closed due to horrible humane violations. The reason we are discussing the slaughter of horses here, and therefore the difference in horses and other animals which are slaughtered to most of us here is: 1. This is a board for equestrians therefore most of us are specifically interested in horses and 2. Horses are not thought of in this country (the US) as a food animal they are thought of as pets, which makes this all particularly hard to swallow (forgive the pun).
                            My Equines:::
                            Flower: http://www.eqbydesign.com/flower.htm
                            Quin: http://www.eqbydesign.com/quin.htm
                            Half Magic: http://www.teamwindchase.com/Half_Magic.htm

                            Comment


                            • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Snowbird, you are so full of shit. I wrote much of what Poltroon said about my current purchases of meat NOT factory raised and you ridiculed me. You were positively snotty. *Someone* needs to change her Depends right along with her meds. God I hope my mind doesn't go before my fingers on a keyboard when I get old. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                              That isn't very kind SeaOat, I'm still quite controlled and don't need Depends "YET". I'm not on any meds this is just the pure free spirited me who has always been and always will be anti-bureacracy.

                              You got it backwards the brain is just fine and for your sake at my age I hope you do as well in that area.

                              I'm sorry if I didn't comprehend that you agreed with Poltroon and if you do, do not despair I love you too. I really didn't mean to make you feel rejected.
                              http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

                              Comment


                              • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Snowbird:
                                I really didn't mean to make you feel rejected. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                Something tells me that SeaOat doesn't need your approval one way or the other.

                                And might I suggest reading people's posts in full and actually taking the time to absorb what is written before you spout off your opinion (you're not the only one who could use this advice). It would be great if you could spare us all your hot air.

                                I've been following this topic for awhile now, and it's getting pretty boring reading the SAME questions being asked and answered, only to be asked again.

                                In person, I might say that these people like the sound of their own voice, but on a forum, it's just plain repetitive.

                                If you have a new view, awesome! By all means, share it! But don't ask, "Well why don't you...." when it's already been answered.

                                Poltroon: "The price of horsemeat is a useful fact and in fact shows that my approach..."

                                Then get out there and do something, rather than just talking about it.
                                -The Girl With Endoscope Eyes

                                Comment


                                • And exactly what that is new and educational does your post inspire? Please explain it is a new question.

                                  Amazing "shit" and "hot air" would that be considered in your semantic a "fart"? I'm afraid I'm not familiar with your vocabulary.
                                  http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

                                  Comment


                                  • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Snowbird:
                                    And exactly what that is new and educational does your post inspire? Please explain it is a new question.

                                    Amazing "shit" and "hot air" would that be considered in your semantic a "fart"? I'm afraid I'm not familiar with your vocabulary. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                    That has to be the worst comeback ever.

                                    And actually, the intention of my post was to just flat out say: Don't be so quick to post your opinion if you aren't even paying attention to what people are saying.

                                    That having been said, I'm done with this topic. It's beginning to sound like a broken record.
                                    -The Girl With Endoscope Eyes

                                    Comment


                                    • Snowbird, Stilicho, Tory Relic and Poltroon instead of spending countless hours on the internet posting your rantings and all your very time consuming stat links why not get together and write a bill that you believe to be correct. Any major University with a Political Science department can help you. You say we won't answer your questions, well right back at ya. Wouldn't your time be better spent being productive on that front than hours on an internet board .
                                      NO HORSES TO SLAUGHTER CLIQUE
                                      http://www.cafepress.com/maneshirts

                                      Comment


                                      • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by FlowerPower:
                                        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by poltroon:

                                        No disagreement. Treating a horse (or a cow, or a sheep, or a chicken, or a pig) that way should be against the law. Why doesn't someone write a bill that would do that? Or why doesn't the local Animal Control cite them for felony abuse?

                                        <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                        Oh but they DO! Animal Control and Humane Organizations are there to protect all animals... my friend who is a humane officer was right in the middle of the shut down of a pig slaughter plant - closed due to horrible humane violations. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                        So, I'm even more confused. Why aren't existing plants shut down/cited/cleaned up with these existing laws/mechanisms then?
                                        If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket

                                        Comment


                                        • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SweatySaddlepad:
                                          Snowbird, Stilicho, Tory Relic and Poltroon instead of spending countless hours on the internet posting your rantings and all your very time consuming stat links why not get together and write a bill that you believe to be correct. Any major University with a Political Science department can help you. You say we won't answer your questions, well right back at ya. Wouldn't _your_ time be better spent being productive on that front than hours on an internet board . <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                          SweatySaddlepad, I've been spending my time ensuring that electronic voting systems are secure and auditable, which is (a) a higher priority for me and (b) closer to my area of expertise.

                                          If you want more support for your bill, make it about improving conditions instead of about eating horsemeat, and I think you'll get it.
                                          If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket

                                          Comment

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