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Worker Comp, Accident Insurance for Riding Instructor

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  • Worker Comp, Accident Insurance for Riding Instructor

    I am a riding instructor with no employees. I am Not required to have worker comp under GA law as the sole employee/owner. However, I found this statement in my health insurance under exclusions. There is no coverage " as a result of any injury sustained during or due to participating or instructing in any of the following: operating or riding on a motorcycle; professional or Semi-professional sports; horseback riding (if the member is paid to participate or to instruct). " I looked into a worker comp policy for just me and the quote was $14,000 per year. Does anyone have coverage for injuries to themselves while working? (I have liability coverage that covers clients). I looked into Accident & Disability Insurance. Some of them will cover on the job but they often exclude sports injuries. I looked into something called Occupational Accident Insurance but it seems those policies are only designed for truckers. Has anyone ever been injured and been denied treatment by the health insurance due to the exclusion of training and teaching?

  • #2
    I've been injured while teaching and handling horses, and had no trouble with health insurance, but it was long ago. I think USEF had some supplemental insurance that might help...

    Comment


    • #3
      You should call an equine insurance company and get a quote. Trying to guess what kind of insurance and how much is inefficient and might end up with you spending more than you need or being under insured. I'm sure there are other places, but something like this:

      https://www.markelinsurance.com/ridi...-horse-trainer

      You can get a quote online but it would be useful to call and speak to an agent so you can understand what different types of insurance exist and which is most useful for you.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by S1969 View Post
        You should call an equine insurance company and get a quote. Trying to guess what kind of insurance and how much is inefficient and might end up with you spending more than you need or being under insured. I'm sure there are other places, but something like this:

        https://www.markelinsurance.com/ridi...-horse-trainer

        You can get a quote online but it would be useful to call and speak to an agent so you can understand what different types of insurance exist and which is most useful for you.
        Concur with these thoughts. Buy only what you need but get what you need from someone who understands your needs. Equine commercial brokers are a good place to start. So would be the larger organizations like USEF. This may, or may not, be a long journey. Good luck as you go forward.

        G.
        Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raa, Uma Paixo

        Comment


        • #5
          Interesting wording on the exclusion for the health insurance. I pay medical claims for a living. I have never seen an exclusion worded quite like that. The normal wording I see is that it is excluded if it is payable under a Workers Comp policy.
          Some are excluded if payable under a WC policy or would be payable if required to have WC coverage. This is to make sure it is paid under WC if they have it but also an acknowledgement that for certain situations not all states require WC for all jobs. But if the state requires it and they choose to not have it the health plan doesn't need to pick up the slack because they failed to follow the law.

          Then separately there may be what we call "Hazardous Hobby" exclusion. If you are injured doing: hang gliding, mountain climbing with ropes/guides, racing (could be horse, motorcycle, auto), zip lining, snowmobiling, jet skiing, parachuting, cliff diving, participating in professional sports,tackle football. Some policies you could pay an additional premium to cover these activities and some you couldn't.

          The only occupational accident policies we have all all for trucker that are owner/operator, couriers and independent delivery drivers. Most of those policies are through a large trucking company or a trade organization.

          Depending on where you are obtaining your health insurance you might want to look around at renewal time to see if a different policy might have an exclusion that will work better for you so you don't need a separate occupation accident/WC type policy.

          Be aware that many of the occupational accident type polices have fairly low limits and a shortish benefit period. WC generally does not have that issue. Most of the occupational accident type policies I have seen have a 2 year benefit period and a $250,000 or $500,000 lifetime maximum. That dollar limit is a drop in the bucket for many injuries. (Head and spine in particular). For the benefit period I have seen plenty of cases where after multiple surgeries and PT and injections they still need additional treatment but have gone 2 years and now there is no more coverage even if they have not hit the policy dollar limit.
          Oh, well, clearly you're not thoroughly indoctrinated to COTH yet, because finger pointing and drawing conclusions are the cornerstones of this great online community. (Tidy Rabbit)

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by atlantariding View Post
            I am a riding instructor with no employees. I am Not required to have worker comp under GA law as the sole employee/owner. However, I found this statement in my health insurance under exclusions. There is no coverage " as a result of any injury sustained during or due to participating or instructing in any of the following: operating or riding on a motorcycle; professional or Semi-professional sports; horseback riding (if the member is paid to participate or to instruct). " I looked into a worker comp policy for just me and the quote was $14,000 per year. Does anyone have coverage for injuries to themselves while working? (I have liability coverage that covers clients). I looked into Accident & Disability Insurance. Some of them will cover on the job but they often exclude sports injuries. I looked into something called Occupational Accident Insurance but it seems those policies are only designed for truckers. Has anyone ever been injured and been denied treatment by the health insurance due to the exclusion of training and teaching?
            I rarely tell the doctor how I got hurt...because the insurance company will go after the gym, the farm whatever. I pay for the insurance so it can damn well cover me regardless of how I got hurt.
            Humans dont mind duress, in fact they thrive on it. What they mind is not feeling necessary. Sebastian Junger

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Bogey2 View Post

              I rarely tell the doctor how I got hurt...because the insurance company will go after the gym, the farm whatever. I pay for the insurance so it can damn well cover me regardless of how I got hurt.
              I was holding the horseshoe in my hand looking closely at it when the car's airbag went off...that is why there a horseshoe imprint on my forehead

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by clanter View Post

                I was holding the horseshoe in my hand looking closely at it when the car's airbag went off...that is why there a horseshoe imprint on my forehead
                exactly! LOL and I have yet to have a horseshoe imprint on me...they usually buck me off or run me over...LOL
                Humans dont mind duress, in fact they thrive on it. What they mind is not feeling necessary. Sebastian Junger

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Bogey2 View Post

                  I rarely tell the doctor how I got hurt...because the insurance company will go after the gym, the farm whatever. I pay for the insurance so it can damn well cover me regardless of how I got hurt.
                  Yeah....but when an ambulance is called to take you from the arena to the ER....going to be hard to get out of that one. Better to just have good insurance.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by S1969 View Post

                    Yeah....but when an ambulance is called to take you from the arena to the ER....going to be hard to get out of that one. Better to just have good insurance.
                    There are a lot more things that happen to us that don't require an ambulance. I have never left the farm in an ambulance but I have broken bones over the 25 years I have had a farm.
                    My friend pulled some muscles at a crossfit class he was going too...he was getting letters from his health ins. wanting to know the name of the gym etc. He finally stopped saying where he was "injured" because it was his choice to take the class and he didn't want to cause problems for the little guy he worked out at.
                    Humans dont mind duress, in fact they thrive on it. What they mind is not feeling necessary. Sebastian Junger

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      *drags out soapbox*

                      Remind me again why we pay a lot of money for health insurance that regularly denies claims, treatments and apparently feels it is doing us a favor by taking more of our money and giving us less service than I could receive in any other relatively wealthy country? It is ridiculous that a riding instructor in the UK who gets injured doesn't have to worry about any of this. A visitor to the UK on a riding holiday who suffers an injury doesn't worry about getting an outrageous bill, if they get a bill at all.

                      *returns soapbox*

                      I have used Markel in the past and they were lovely. Fingers crossed they can help you get an affordable policy that won't leave you in a lurch if you ever have need of it.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by MorganSercu View Post
                        *drags out soapbox*

                        Remind me again why we pay a lot of money for health insurance that regularly denies claims, treatments and apparently feels it is doing us a favor by taking more of our money and giving us less service than I could receive in any other relatively wealthy country? It is ridiculous that a riding instructor in the UK who gets injured doesn't have to worry about any of this. A visitor to the UK on a riding holiday who suffers an injury doesn't worry about getting an outrageous bill, if they get a bill at all.

                        *returns soapbox*

                        I have used Markel in the past and they were lovely. Fingers crossed they can help you get an affordable policy that won't leave you in a lurch if you ever have need of it.
                        Well, yeah...but in other professions, worker's comp covers the tab if someone gets hurt at work. So, if you're employed in a job that is known/likely to put a person more at risk for injuries, I can understand why the insurance company wants additional insurance. It's different if you are just riding your own horse and get hurt. When you're being paid to ride other people's horses, a commercial insurance should be involved.

                        When we hire consultants at my office - anyone making more than $25K has to have a commercial liability policy, even if they are just sitting in their home writing a report.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by MorganSercu View Post
                          *drags out soapbox*

                          Remind me again why we pay a lot of money for health insurance that regularly denies claims, treatments and apparently feels it is doing us a favor by taking more of our money and giving us less service than I could receive in any other relatively wealthy country? It is ridiculous that a riding instructor in the UK who gets injured doesn't have to worry about any of this. A visitor to the UK on a riding holiday who suffers an injury doesn't worry about getting an outrageous bill, if they get a bill at all.

                          *returns soapbox*

                          .
                          drag that box back out as the answer you posted is sort of correct


                          Emergency treatment is free

                          If you have an accident or need emergency medical treatment, you will receive that treatment free of charge, regardless of your nationality or place of residence as long as that emergency treatment is delivered at:
                          • a primary care facility or General Practitioner's office, known as a GP's Surgery
                          • a hospital emergency room, called Accident and Emergency (A&E) or Casualty in UK hospitals
                          • A walk-in center providing services similar to an emergency room.

                          That service only extends to the immediate emergency. Once you are admitted to a hospital - even for emergency surgery or further emergency treatment - you have to pay for your treatment and medicines. If you are asked to return for a clinic visit to follow up your emergency treatment, you will also have to pay for that. If the doctor prescribes medication, you'll have to pay the full retail price rather than the subsidized price paid by UK residents. And, if you run up charges of £1,000 and you or your insurance company fail to pay within the specified time, you could be denied a visa in the future.

                          there is more

                          https://www.tripsavvy.com/visitors-u...rvices-1662372

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Still sounds like a relative bargain as I do have employer-provided health insurance (for which I still pay a packet towards my premium and then the co-pays, etc.) and it would follow me if I were injured overseas. 1000 pounds is $1222 dollars, more or less. That is what payment plans are all about. Even if my insurer were to balk because that is the first thing they do. Deny claims.

                            Goodness knows I paid a lot more not so very long ago (not a riding accident). The joys of arguing with insurance companies while recovering can't be overstated. It took me two years to finish paying off the bills. With very good insurance, mind you.

                            But I digress. I have used Markel in the past and they were very good then. May they still be now!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by S1969 View Post

                              Well, yeah...but in other professions, worker's comp covers the tab if someone gets hurt at work. So, if you're employed in a job that is known/likely to put a person more at risk for injuries, I can understand why the insurance company wants additional insurance. It's different if you are just riding your own horse and get hurt. When you're being paid to ride other people's horses, a commercial insurance should be involved.

                              When we hire consultants at my office - anyone making more than $25K has to have a commercial liability policy, even if they are just sitting in their home writing a report.
                              Still drives me crazy that as one of the richest countries in the world, there are people who are uninsured or underinsured. Meanwhile, yes, an additional policy is needed. Something else to factor into your fees, OP.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by S1969 View Post

                                Well, yeah...but in other professions, worker's comp covers the tab if someone gets hurt at work. So, if you're employed in a job that is known/likely to put a person more at risk for injuries, I can understand why the insurance company wants additional insurance. It's different if you are just riding your own horse and get hurt. When you're being paid to ride other people's horses, a commercial insurance should be involved.

                                When we hire consultants at my office - anyone making more than $25K has to have a commercial liability policy, even if they are just sitting in their home writing a report.
                                And that $25,000 is where the rubber meets the road. I would imagine that many riding instructors/trainers after expenses make that much...and certainly wouldn't if they had to pay $14,000 in WC insurance.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  AFLAC?
                                  Every mighty oak was once a nut that stood its ground.

                                  Proud Closet Canterer! Member Riders with Fibromyalgia clique.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by MorganSercu View Post
                                    *drags out soapbox*

                                    Remind me again why we pay a lot of money for health insurance that regularly denies claims, treatments and apparently feels it is doing us a favor by taking more of our money and giving us less service than I could receive in any other relatively wealthy country? It is ridiculous that a riding instructor in the UK who gets injured doesn't have to worry about any of this. A visitor to the UK on a riding holiday who suffers an injury doesn't worry about getting an outrageous bill, if they get a bill at all.

                                    *returns soapbox*

                                    Your viewpoint is incorrect. You pay a premium for coverage resulting from injury from certain causes. If another is responsible for you injury then you, as a person, could recover. If the insurance company pays for that injury they hae the right to "step into your shoes" and seek recovery (technical term is "subrogation"). In the policy you agree to this term. If you don't fulfill it you are in breach of your contract. If you breach the contract the company may deny coverage. That's how it works.

                                    I have used Markel in the past and they were lovely. Fingers crossed they can help you get an affordable policy that won't leave you in a lurch if you ever have need of it.
                                    Getting hurt is not fun. You have insurance to cushion that "blow." Don't "blow" it by not following your contract.

                                    G.
                                    Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raa, Uma Paixo

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by jawa View Post

                                      And that $25,000 is where the rubber meets the road. I would imagine that many riding instructors/trainers after expenses make that much...and certainly wouldn't if they had to pay $14,000 in WC insurance.
                                      Well, that's just our location. Many other campuses impose that requirement on any consultant making over $10,000 and some for anyone making over $600. They are boilerplate contracts.

                                      At minimum, they require Commercial General Liability, which if I recall, only costs about $400/year for a consultant to obtain $1M in coverage. Not really a lot of money, especially for an occupation that is far more likely to result in injury than an educational consultant.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by Guilherme View Post

                                        Getting hurt is not fun. You have insurance to cushion that "blow." Don't "blow" it by not following your contract.

                                        G.
                                        That is good advice for OP. I don't have a contract to blow. I am not paid to provide services to clients. I still want coverage for every citizen, regardless of age, gender, occupation, etc. Bad things can happen and no one should go bankrupt due to their age, illness, salary or injury. It is barbaric.

                                        Markel was comprehensive and affordable in the 1990's. May it be so today.

                                        Comment

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