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Friend w/Cancer may need to Euthanize her 6 horses

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  • #141
    Originally posted by egontoast View Post
    Only in Arkansas, apparently.
    Probably in Georgia too...at least some parts.

    Comment

    • #142
      [quote=Thomas

      It doesn't necessarily make you stop being afraid of dying but by gosh it made me so I'm never afraid of living.[/quote]

      Sorry to admit not reading all of the posts, but I suspect that EVERY decision in life based upon fear is a bad one.

      Comment

      • #143
        Originally posted by carolprudm View Post
        Umm, no it is taxpayer supported and is under increasing limitations
        http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/79...-services.html
        No British person is refused health care and no British person pays anything to the hospital/doctor for that health care. For *any* drugs people need they pay 7 GBPs for the prescription regardless of which drugs they need and the basic costs to make those drugs. Yes the can is carried by the tax system obviously but my point is that no British person has to find any money at all to be treated for anything in the UK.

        Not so in Canada where there are many extra charges for drugs and care. Canadians still pay high amounts of tax too and many people seem to think the health system in Canada does not charge extra for being treated when in fact it does. And as there are no prescription caps in Canada then god help anyone whose necessary drugs are not "approved" as many many drugs are not approved, and if there are no generic drugs of whatever type you need then once again you will directly be billed for the cost of them.

        Nothing is free in life, I realise that, by using the word "free" I meant, British people are not charged directly for their use of the NHS, no matter how frequently they end up in hospital or how many drugs they are on (excl. 7GBP prescription charge), or how often they go and visit their doctor.

        Comment

        • #144
          Originally posted by Cloverbarley View Post
          No British person is refused health care and no British person pays anything to the hospital/doctor for that health care.
          Same in Canada. If the drugs are administered in hospital, you do not pay. IF you have to get them from a pharmacy, then yes, you pay the dispensing fee ($11 at my pharmacy) and for the drugs IF you do not have private insurance that would cover the drugs. I never spent $1.00 when I was undergoing chemo. My husband has hip replacement surgery last December and never paid anything in hospital or doctor's visits. He did have to pay extra for his semi-private room since his private insurance did not cover that, but even home visits by a physiotherapist were covered!
          I broke my ankle and never paid a cent for the surgery, the cast, the follow up visits, etc.

          If the drugs are not approved, then yes, it is a different ball game and I am pretty sure that private insurance would not pay for it either.

          But in the US, you get a bill for a hospital stay EVEN if you have private insurance. We do not.

          Anyway, back to your regular programming...

          Comment

          • #145
            I agree with the other posters. The best thing you can do for your horses is to make sure they are as well trained and well rounded as possible. That way, they are more valuable to a potential buyer or adopter. You owe it to your horse.

            Comment

            • #146
              Originally posted by FalseImpression View Post
              Same in Canada. If the drugs are administered in hospital, you do not pay.
              Not so I'm afraid. If you have cancer/leukemia/similar then a lot of the drugs are not approved (but incredibly, still used in hospitals) and therefore you pay for them irrespective of you being in hospital or not.

              IF you have to get them from a pharmacy, then yes, you pay the dispensing fee ($11 at my pharmacy) and for the drugs IF you do not have private insurance that would cover the drugs.
              Yes reduced charges IF you have private health insurance. No reduced charges if you do not have private health insurance.

              I never spent $1.00 when I was undergoing chemo. My husband has hip replacement surgery last December and never paid anything in hospital or doctor's visits.
              Because you have private health insurance. You may have had to pay if you did not have private health insurance.

              I broke my ankle and never paid a cent for the surgery, the cast, the follow up visits, etc.
              Breaking bones is one of the few things where there are rarely extra added costs due to not needing special drugs.

              If the drugs are not approved, then yes, it is a different ball game and I am pretty sure that private insurance would not pay for it either.
              Yes, insurance companies in Canada rarely pay for non-approved or non-generic drugs.

              But in the US, you get a bill for a hospital stay EVEN if you have private insurance. We do not.
              Yes you get a bill for hospital visits/stays and you pass it onto your insurance company who pays it.

              Anyway, back to your regular programming...
              Lol! Yes we have gone a bit off topic haven't we

              Comment

              • #147
                Originally posted by Cloverbarley View Post
                No British person is refused health care and no British person pays anything to the hospital/doctor for that health care. For *any* drugs people need they pay 7 GBPs for the prescription regardless of which drugs they need and the basic costs to make those drugs. Yes the can is carried by the tax system obviously but my point is that no British person has to find any money at all to be treated for anything in the UK.

                Not so in Canada where there are many extra charges for drugs and care. Canadians still pay high amounts of tax too and many people seem to think the health system in Canada does not charge extra for being treated when in fact it does. And as there are no prescription caps in Canada then god help anyone whose necessary drugs are not "approved" as many many drugs are not approved, and if there are no generic drugs of whatever type you need then once again you will directly be billed for the cost of them.

                Nothing is free in life, I realise that, by using the word "free" I meant, British people are not charged directly for their use of the NHS, no matter how frequently they end up in hospital or how many drugs they are on (excl. 7GBP prescription charge), or how often they go and visit their doctor.
                I'll see a couple of things to you and which you've clearly totally failed to take into account:

                Dentists - You do know it's impossible to get an NHS one in the UK don't you?

                and

                NICE (Note I mean the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence)

                Note that not a single penny of my treatment was funded by the NHS. It wasn't approved by NICE! There's a heck of a lot not approved by them.

                Be clear that the National Health Service ensures that there's basic primary health care service free at point of entry for all.

                Note though this thread isn't about what it costs for health care.

                It's about how individuals deal with the responsibility of owning a horse and whether you have the right to kill it even if it's young and healthy because it no longer suits you to own it and you don't want to bother looking for an alternative home.

                Comment

                • #148
                  Originally posted by Thomas_1 View Post
                  I'll see a couple of things to you and which you've clearly totally failed to take into account:

                  Dentists - You do know it's impossible to get an NHS one in the UK don't you?
                  Perhaps for new patients. I have an NHS dentist and have been with him for 20 years - let's hope he doesn't peg it eh!

                  NICE (Note I mean the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence)

                  Note that not a single penny of my treatment was funded by the NHS. It wasn't approved by NICE! There's a heck of a lot not approved by them.
                  So you have private health care. Me too, however I've only used BUPA once in my life. Everything else I've used the NHS.

                  Be clear that the National Health Service ensures that there's basic primary health care service free at point of entry for all.
                  I'd suggest that the NHS provides FAR more than just basic primary health care. Canada provides basic primary health care. There is a huge difference. In the UK, if you want something doing quicker or you have been told for whatever reason that the NHS will not go further with your treatment (generally because positive prognosis is bleak), then you have the option to go private and speed up the process. As you said, you were unlikely to survive any treatment hence the NHS pulled the plug on anymore, but my guess is you had had treatment up till that point where they felt "it was using money on a lost cause when they could better use it elsewhere". The postcode lottery strikes again. The point I was making was that you received treatment initially, with no added costs to you because you happened to have certain drugs etc. In Canada it directly relates to which drugs are needed and if they are not approved then sorry but it sucks and you'll have to pay to get them ... regardless of a postive/negative prognosis.

                  Note though this thread isn't about what it costs for health care.
                  It's about how individuals deal with the responsibility of owning a horse and whether you have the right to kill it even if it's young and healthy because it no longer suits you to own it and you don't want to bother looking for an alternative home.
                  Yes. Hence we commented on going OT. Sometimes discussion veer off you know. This was one of them.

                  Comment

                  • #149
                    And not entirely OT, as expenses (not even all DIRECTLY medical related, ie doctors/drugs/treatments/insurance) can pile up. When you're too sick to work, there are other bills that still have to be paid, and neither AFLAC nor the government can afford to cover rent/mortgage, car expenses, groceries, electricity, water, trash...if you need cancer treatment at a hospital that's five hundred miles away there's travel plus room/board if you have family/friend/advocate with you.

                    All of which creates additional pressure on a horse owner. Those huge expenses piling up with no income coming in include the board, vet, farrier, etc. I'm still not saying "kill them all" is automatically right, just that it's not even the diagnosis alone that can make you irrational.
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                    • #150
                      That is when additional cancer insurance and short/long term disability insurance comes in.
                      No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle. ~Winston Churchill

                      Comment

                      • #151
                        Take one day at a time.Think of all resources,lives are at stake[horses].pros and cons.

                        Comment

                        • #152
                          Originally posted by Cloverbarley View Post

                          So you have private health care. Me too, however I've only used BUPA once in my life. Everything else I've used the NHS.

                          I'd suggest that the NHS provides FAR more than just basic primary health care. Canada provides basic primary health care. There is a huge difference. In the UK, if you want something doing quicker or you have been told for whatever reason that the NHS will not go further with your treatment (generally because positive prognosis is bleak), then you have the option to go private and speed up the process. As you said, you were unlikely to survive any treatment hence the NHS pulled the plug on anymore, but my guess is you had had treatment up till that point where they felt "it was using money on a lost cause when they could better use it elsewhere". The postcode lottery strikes again. The point I was making was that you received treatment initially, with no added costs to you because you happened to have certain drugs etc. In Canada it directly relates to which drugs are needed and if they are not approved then sorry but it sucks and you'll have to pay to get them ... regardless of a postive/negative prognosis.
                          Not that it's anything to do with this thread but no I don't have private health care and you're totally wrong about the reasons why my treatment wasn't ever funded (not even from the onset.)

                          But back to horses ............

                          Comment

                          • #153
                            whats the nhs got to do with horses

                            excuse me this is a bout 6 horses lives and 1 mate
                            and op has gone no doubt becuase of what isaid as might have hit the nail on the head and truth hurts


                            remeber hope and dreams and giving someone a reason to live an giving those horses a reason to live they are not just horses
                            and i have nicked this from another forum becuase it relevent

                            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MR6Qk7AdVgE

                            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWzID-JQxQ4

                            now tell us all they worth keeping and that your mate thats ill
                            can have hope

                            Comment

                            • #154
                              Originally posted by goeslikestink View Post
                              whats the nhs got to do with horses
                              *Sigh* because in the UK you don't have to consider costs for healthcare. The lady in the OP does have to consider her health costs, which could run to 10's of thousands of dollars, as well as her board costs for 6 horses, which is probably why she is in a total and utter panic right now.

                              excuse me this is a bout 6 horses lives and 1 mate
                              and op has gone no doubt becuase of what isaid as might have hit the nail on the head and truth hurts
                              I don't know what you said, if I'm honest I rarely understand your posts, sorry. We all know it is about 6 horses and the OPs friend. She asked for advice. Everyone gave it. Hopefully the OP can help guide her friend to taking a step back and thinking about this logically and rationally, and then no horses will have to die. Ranting does no good. Sitting down and gently and kindly trying to help people come to the right decision is a far better way.

                              Comment

                              • #155
                                Originally posted by Cloverbarley View Post
                                *Sigh* because in the UK you don't have to consider costs for healthcare. The lady in the OP does have to consider her health costs, which could run to 10's of thousands of dollars, as well as her board costs for 6 horses, which is probably why she is in a total and utter panic right now.


                                I don't know what you said, if I'm honest I rarely understand your posts, sorry. We all know it is about 6 horses and the OPs friend. She asked for advice. Everyone gave it. Hopefully the OP can help guide her friend to taking a step back and thinking about this logically and rationally, and then no horses will have to die. Ranting does no good. Sitting down and gently and kindly trying to help people come to the right decision is a far better way.
                                and her friend surgessted pts - as when yu have a mate in that sort of position you look at all options not just one why do you think her mate came on here
                                because no doubt over a cuppa she surgested it now has 6 horses that have might have to be pts
                                had you read all post you would know that
                                thats not th best answer for the lady in question but to find decent homes and give her hope to live and worth lving for give her a reasons to get her life back but dont shorten it its short enough for anyone as it is

                                and if the lady cant afford it - there other means all she should have done was say

                                help my mates sick and i need to rehome 6 neddies can anyone help me

                                your fairly new to coth but cothers have a way of helping each other in a crisis

                                and by the way i am from uk to


                                so if she want to help her mate then blooming ask not hard is it

                                Comment

                                • #156
                                  Originally posted by Thomas_1 View Post
                                  It's about how individuals deal with the responsibility of owning a horse and whether you have the right to kill it even if it's young and healthy because it no longer suits you to own it and you don't want to bother looking for an alternative home.
                                  Actually, this thread is about what to do when someone you are close to is facing a VERY scary diagnosis that leaves their future uncertain and what they do with their horses.

                                  Originally posted by danceronice View Post
                                  And not entirely OT, as expenses (not even all DIRECTLY medical related, ie doctors/drugs/treatments/insurance) can pile up. When you're too sick to work, there are other bills that still have to be paid, and neither AFLAC nor the government can afford to cover rent/mortgage, car expenses, groceries, electricity, water, trash...if you need cancer treatment at a hospital that's five hundred miles away there's travel plus room/board if you have family/friend/advocate with you.
                                  Just as a point of reference, I know many personal stories of how AFLAC helped them keep their house during cancer treatment and know people who have gotten upwards of $50K from Aflac when undergoing cancer treatment and also in horrific car accidents and other sicknesses and injuries. (Aflac pays for travel and hotel rooms). I know one person that used Aflac to pay for alternate cancer treatment a few states away.

                                  But that is part of financial planning I am not someone to judge someone for lack of financial planning! Not me, with no retirement plan! (yeah, yeah, working on one).

                                  Back to the topic at hand - without knowing the woman's diagnosis or how the doctor delivered the news (yeah, not all doctors are people persons, ask my sister-in-law, the nurse), I do not think anyone can judge this woman's reaction. Right now, I am not sure what I would do if I were given a death sentence. Would I put my mare down? She really would not likely do well somewhere else. Yes, my trainer is willing and able to take her, but why would I burden her with another horse? I really do not know what I would do.

                                  Comment

                                  • #157
                                    Originally posted by danceronice View Post
                                    When I lived near Windsor, a fairly significant chunk of my doctor's practice was Canadians coming over the border. I don't know if it was price or more approved drugs or what.
                                    From what I understand from my Canadian relatives, it is because they can get health care with out waiting for it that way.

                                    Some testing the wait is an eternity up there.

                                    Comment

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