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I Gave 30 Days Notice

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  • #21
    Originally posted by IdahoRider View Post
    Did not intent to come across as judgy or scornful. I was a 26 year old single parent, too. I could have found a less loaded description than the one I used, for sure.
    Sheilah
    What gave me pause in the story is that they fired the BM, that was what you were counting on keeping things running well, knowing that the mother was not involved and the daughter was unreliable/not knowledgeable enough to manage.

    Once things start going downhill and affecting you as they are, they tend to not get better, but who knows, maybe they will.

    Comment


    • #22
      Wow, OP. Just wow. I can't believe you are going through something so ridiculous. The audacity of some folks amazes me.

      If it were me, I'd move both of them immediately to your former barn if they have room for the both of them, and then figure out the situation with your mare and the leasor later. I would not want the BO's mamma doing anything with my horses after what transpired in your conversation.

      Do you have a written signed contract from when you first started? What does it say?
      Can they increase fees at any time?
      Can they do so without written notice?

      Out of spite, I'd start texting her lots and lots of questions to get her answers in writing. Such as your big one: If these changes supposedly went into effect on June 1st and emails were sent out in April, why was my board "accepted" in June and July and not changed until August 1st?

      I have a real hard time with people being BULLYS and pulling cr@p like this. I have no problem taking the time (and money) to get an attorney involved to shut them up and prove a point that they can't just push everyone around.

      But of course, how much you want to pursue is up to you. Or if you'd rather not (totally fine), pay the full amount, get a receipt, and don't look back as you head out the door with your horses.

      It is not enough to know how to ride; one must know how to fall.

      Comment


      • #23
        Originally posted by HungarianHippo View Post
        Their raising their prices should not be the great offense you are taking it as. It's nothing personal-- as some have already said, you were getting dirt cheap board that almost surely did not cover their costs. And given that lesson frequency has gone down, they're not making the same revenue off your horses that they had been. Be completely positive and professional in your comms with them for the rest of the month, and don't rise to the bait if they're jerky to you.

        I'd take your saddle and anything of high value with you now, and for the next month just deal with the hassle of schlepping it back/forth. This way, if things go sour you're not giving the BO anything to hold hostage to get more payments out of you. No more using your horse in lessons-- compensation or not. Communicate this politely and professionally in writing. The time to disentangle yourself from them is right now.

        PS Would be a good idea to take off your judgypants about the younger BO and the "baby daddy drama". A tiny bit of empathy might be in order for this soon-to-be single mother and grandmother who is now looking at the need to step back into a BO role when she probably doesn't want to. I realize you are upset, but give some thought as to whether your scorn is coming across to them. <Narrator: It usually does>
        This was pretty uncalled for.

        Board varies in price based on amenities, area of the country, and area of the state. It's not fair to judge the appropriateness of a large (for the boarder) and unannounced price hike based on much you feel she should be paying.

        If they had a set board price she deserved a 30 day notice to decide if the price hike was acceptable. They are giving her no grain horse grain AND charging her for it. They also feel she shouldn't be compensated for lessons. Even if the lesson frequency went down, why would someone let you put wear and tear on their horse for nothing?
        http://weanieeventer.blogspot.com/

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        • Original Poster

          #24
          So, my gelding will be going back to my previous barn for retirement. He will be ten minutes away from my school. so I can check on him and make sure he is doing well.

          The BO at the fancy dressage barn I boarded my mare at for the first nine months I owned her has reached out and invited us back. I am not sure if my pony club kid will follow as the half lease holder, or if I will need to find someone else to do a half lease. At this point I am inclined to just make a leap of faith and move back to the fancy barn and hustle to get another lease holder if the kid doesn't want to follow.
          Sheilah

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            #25
            Originally posted by beau159 View Post

            Do you have a written signed contract from when you first started? What does it say?
            Can they increase fees at any time?
            Can they do so without written notice?
            Yes, I have a contract that stipulates thirty day notice for any changes in fees or accommodations. They can increase fees to any level they want, with appropriate notice.

            My issue is that they are saying the notice was in that April e-mail that I never saw. I was told by the BO at the time that I didn't get it because it didn't pertain to me, since my board rates were set to compensate for both horses being used in lessons. BO's Mom is now saying that they don't have to give me another thirty day notice because they already gave one in April...which I didn't get.

            The board was supposed to have gone up on June 1. I had no idea and have paid June and July based on what I thought was the board rate. Nobody said anything to me about those payments being short, even though based on what they are saying, both June and July would have been $300 short each month. I didn't receive an invoice at all until yesterday, where it showed an increase in August's board.

            Yesterday I paid August's board at the "old" rate. and pointed out why I thought that was fair. I gave my notice at the same time. BO's Mom was not happy, obviously. I have no idea what BO thinks, since she never showed her face at all yesterday. I have to go out later and medicate my old guy. So we'll see what happens.
            Sheilah

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #26
              Originally posted by Bluey View Post
              What gave me pause in the story is that they fired the BM, that was what you were counting on keeping things running well, knowing that the mother was not involved and the daughter was unreliable/not knowledgeable enough to manage.
              Me, too. I had no idea that they had fired the BM until yesterday. She did a great job. The stalls were always done on time, there were no screw ups with feed or supplements.
              Sheilah

              Comment


              • #27
                Originally posted by enjoytheride View Post

                This was pretty uncalled for.

                Board varies in price based on amenities, area of the country, and area of the state. It's not fair to judge the appropriateness of a large (for the boarder) and unannounced price hike based on much you feel she should be paying.

                If they had a set board price she deserved a 30 day notice to decide if the price hike was acceptable. They are giving her no grain horse grain AND charging her for it. They also feel she shouldn't be compensated for lessons. Even if the lesson frequency went down, why would someone let you put wear and tear on their horse for nothing?
                Agreed. I boarded at a barn that charges almost exactly the same. Blanketing and Fly masks were no extra charge and horses used for lessons got $100 discount per month on board. Those with multiple horses got $50 discount on board. Invoices go out to everyone EVERY month and board increases are sent out AT LEAST 30 days in advance. This barn has been in business for 25 years and one of the nicest in the area...

                "Horses are too spency!" - Mom

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                • #28
                  Oh, Ok. Sorry.

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    You are a kind person, IdahoRider. If it were me I would move heaven and earth to get my horses out by July 31st, and decline to pay any of August's board.

                    If a BO expects me to give them 30days (or one calendar month) notice, then they must give me more than that time period for notice of any board increases so that I may give my required notice prior to the change coming into effect. No reasonable person could expect otherwise.

                    ​​​​​​I have given notice and moved my horses when a BO pregnancy and board increase occurred at the same time. I knew from the BO's previous pregnancy that the horse care would drop off, and I was extremely reluctant to pay more for less.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #30
                      Originally posted by RedHorses View Post
                      ​​​​​​I have given notice and moved my horses when a BO pregnancy and board increase occurred at the same time. I knew from the BO's previous pregnancy that the horse care would drop off, and I was extremely reluctant to pay more for less.
                      I am extremely lucky in that both barns can take each horse at a moments notice. So if things get freaky, I am out of there. I don't want to walk away from August's board, but I will (and can) if I need to.
                      Sheilah

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        Originally posted by IdahoRider View Post
                        I am extremely lucky in that both barns can take each horse at a moments notice. So if things get freaky, I am out of there. I don't want to walk away from August's board, but I will (and can) if I need to.
                        Sheilah
                        Good for you, got all your ducks, well, horses in a row now.
                        You are ready for whatever happens next.

                        Too bad that had to happen, it is never a good time for trouble, is it.

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          Originally posted by HungarianHippo View Post
                          Their raising their prices should not be the great offense you are taking it as. It's nothing personal-- as some have already said, you were getting dirt cheap board that almost surely did not cover their costs. And given that lesson frequency has gone down, they're not making the same revenue off your horses that they had been. Be completely positive and professional in your comms with them for the rest of the month, and don't rise to the bait if they're jerky to you.

                          I'd take your saddle and anything of high value with you now, and for the next month just deal with the hassle of schlepping it back/forth. This way, if things go sour you're not giving the BO anything to hold hostage to get more payments out of you. No more using your horse in lessons-- compensation or not. Communicate this politely and professionally in writing. The time to disentangle yourself from them is right now.

                          PS Would be a good idea to take off your judgypants about the younger BO and the "baby daddy drama". A tiny bit of empathy might be in order for this soon-to-be single mother and grandmother who is now looking at the need to step back into a BO role when she probably doesn't want to. I realize you are upset, but give some thought as to whether your scorn is coming across to them. <Narrator: It usually does>
                          My take on it is BO got preggers, probably doesn't feel well in early stages, Mummy stepped in to help out, took a look at the books and found out they weren't making ends meet. No need to take mortal umbrage! For some reason ammies/boarders think of these business relationships as "friends," even eternal fealty, when in truth it's no less strictly business than your relationship with the furnace service or car mechanic. They need to make more money, and you can't expect dirt-cheap board forever, particularly if the whole barn is getting the increase.

                          The choices are binary: To stay and pay or to go where the pastures are greener. But do your research first; it may well be more expensive in the long run to move, especially if you like the care here. Between leasing one horse to a kid, and the lesson-horse swap, sounds like the deal wasn't doing much for the BO frankly. Barter don't pay the hay man!

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            Originally posted by IdahoRider View Post
                            Yesterday was not a happy day for me. I terminated my boarding contract and gave thirty days notice. I opened the invoice for August and almost had a heart attack. My board had increased by 1/3, and I was being billed well over $1,000.
                            I took a closer look and saw that I was being charged $60 a month for both horses to get their fly mask put on before going into turn out. I was being charged $20 a month for grain for my gelding who can't have grain. My mare's board had increased by $100. It was shocking to get this bill without any advance warning.

                            So I shoot a text to the BO, and she responds right away saying that she gives my gelding a handful of grain at dinner because he bangs on the wall when the other horses get their grain, so that is where that charge came from. And on and on. Then she said that I should be looking at an extra $80, and what is the big deal about that amount. Still texting, I told her that my mare's board had increased by $100, so what was up with that. I texted that I was on my way out. She responded and said we could talk when I got out there.

                            By the time I made the 15 minute drive, the BO was laying down and napping. BO's Mom said that she would be the one talking to me anyway, so no harm done with the missing BO. I should explain that BO is 26 years old. She bought the property when she was 22, 23 years old. She has been running it. Her Mom lives on the property, but has never had anything to do with the horses. She knows names and is happy to visit, but she doesn't ride or teach lessons. BO is pregnant and there is a lot of stress involved and BO is doing this pregnancy on her own. They had a great barn manager and I wasn't too worried about the baby changing things, since the BM was the one getting the day to day stuff done.

                            Anyway, I sit down with BO's Mom and she hands me some printed pages and told me that everything that was changed about my contract was covered in the print out. Then she said that she knew I didn't read my e-mails from the BO, but if I had read them I would have known that they told people in mid-April that the rates for everything were going up, starting June 1. I explained that her daughter had told me in April that none of that applied to me because she used both my horses in the lesson program and my board was staying the same because of that use.

                            BO's Mom said that was ridiculous, that nobody should get a discount for their horses being used in lessons because that is really just free exercise for the horses. And anyway, Noodle (my senior gelding) is only being used for one student now, so he only has two lessons a week). Then she went on to tell me that I have been shortchanging them for years, but they never said anything because they liked me.

                            I pointed out that I had paid what I thought was the right amount for June and July. I asked why, if the amount had increased on June 1, nobody had said anything. She didn't have an answer for me. She just went into this kind of rant about how she is taking over the business end of the barn and that the property and program represent her retirement and she is working too hard to see it go to pot. They had fired the BM and BO's Mom was out there every day doing the hard work. I told her I haven't seen an invoice in over a year and she said that is because they knew I never read them, so they often didn't bother sending one.

                            I was speechless. She kept trying to get me to read the print out and I kept telling her that the print out was not the problem that I was struggling with. I pointed out that I felt like the BO was going back on her word that increases wouldn't impact me and that my horses were being used and I was not being compensated for that use. And that was not something I was willing to agree to. So I gave my 30 day notice. I have NEVER given notice without knowing where I was moving first.

                            I have no idea where I am going to move them. I still have the teen aged girl doing a half lease. I texted her Mom and was told they would like to continue the lease if I could find a barn that had a lesson program for daughter.

                            I am still in shock. I feel like a house landed on me. Thank you for lending your ear to my long tale.
                            Sheilah
                            All I can say is WOW.....Good luck.
                            www.crosscreeksporthorses.com
                            Breeders of Painted Thoroughbreds and Uniquely Painted Irish Sport Horses in Northeast Oklahoma

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              OP, I understand your feelings. I went through something similar many, many years ago-- opened up my invoice and SURPRISE! There was a very big number there that I was not expecting.

                              It doesn't matter what the original cost was and whether or not you are/were getting a "deal." When you are told your board is going to be one price, then that price suddenly skyrockets without appropriate warning, it doesn't bring about warm and fuzzy feelings towards the BO.

                              Raising rates as necessary is certainly justified, but there are professional ways to go about it. Maybe this was just a misunderstanding or an oversight, given the situation with the discount. But you still have every right to be miffed. I know I was when it happened to me; I also terminated my contract.
                              Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                HungarianHippo honestly your post sounds far, far more judgypants than the OP.

                                OP, all this "we didn't send you" this or that communication "because we know you don't read them anyway" is the most contorted bs I've heard in a while. Umm, no, they don't get to forgo basic business communication because they just assume a customer won't read it. Even if a customer had a demonstrated history of that behavior, the business is still obligated to make the communication on matters like changes in contracts, prices, etc. I can't even fathom that something so ridiculous was even stated as a reason for not sending emails/ bills. No wonder your invoice was a shock.

                                And the BO knew you were on your way -- why in napping/do not disturb mode only 15 minutes later? That avoidance was telling.

                                And that's not even going near the change from a compensated use of your horses to suddenly characterizing their use in lessons as "free exercise." Or the giving of grain, no matter how little, to a "no grain" horse. That alone is unacceptable -- some horses, even a small amount could be disastrous for their health. And then to charge you for it, without ever having checked with you about it?

                                The crazy is strong here. Glad you can get out.
                                Last edited by Rallycairn; Jul. 27, 2019, 01:00 AM.
                                If thou hast a sorrow, tell it not to the arrow, tell it to thy saddlebow, and ride on, singing. -- King Alfred the Great

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by IdahoRider View Post
                                  I am in the Boise area.
                                  Sheilah
                                  Sheilah, send me a PM. I board at a barn west of Boise that is even cheaper, BO's are wonderful, lesson program on site, and you won't have to worry about crazy price increases!
                                  Originally posted by katarine
                                  I don't want your prayers, tiny cow.
                                  Originally posted by Pat9
                                  When it's time for a horse to go to a new person, that person will appear. It's pony magic.

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    I think the main problem here is, the odd way the rate increase was showing us, the barn lost it's good manager and now management is suffering and little hope it will straighten up, not fall further in disrepair, with all else going on.

                                    This rate increase was the tip of that iceberg, as the OP just found out.
                                    One more detail the horse being unruly at feeding and getting grain it should not have and being charged for it, without consulting the OP first about that situation?

                                    Not really where anyone would want to keep their horses, not knowing what will happen next.
                                    That is why many feel it seems time to move on, find a different place.

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      Gee I don't consider $425/mo/horse dirt cheap .
                                      COTH's official mini-donk enabler

                                      "I am all for reaching out, but in some situations it needs to be done with a rolled up news paper." Alagirl

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        Originally posted by TheJenners View Post
                                        Gee I don't consider $425/mo/horse dirt cheap .
                                        Depending on the area, it's towards the low end. In a rural area it would be about average. In a sub-urban area it would be low end. In an urban area it would a pasture board rate!!!

                                        As I read the OP's recounting the contract requirements, they are entitled to a 30 day notice on a board increase or other substantial change in boarding terms and conditions. If that is correct then they pay the old rate for the last month and they are gone. If additional charges are being imposed we go BACK to the contract and see if they are permitted. If so then they are "jake" even if they have never been imposed before.

                                        Business is business. If a business owner cannot provide contracted services for any reason (including pregnancy) then they have to give back any money they took for providing such services. Pregnancy is not a defense to breach of contract. Nor would any other physical limitation be such, for either a short or long period.

                                        The OP should pay the last month and then immediately move. Yes, that will "sting" financially. But at the end of the day will hurt less than any other path presently open to them.

                                        G.

                                        Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raa, Uma Paixo

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          I would take my horses out of that barn the first second that stalls are available, even if one has to go to a temporary location until a stall opens up.

                                          It's one thing to raise board, and not tell you, but it's entirely different to say that they fed a horse grain that's not supposed to have it.

                                          The statement about your horses being exercised by being in their lesson program is terrible. People that clueless shouldn't have access to your horses for one second longer than you have to. I'm wondering how many lessons your horse is actually being used in now? Once you give notice, anything can happen, including your horse being ridden into the ground.

                                          I would worry about the woman you talked to getting upset about your move, and dumping a bunch of grain for your horse that's not supposed to have any.
                                          Last edited by JanM; Jul. 27, 2019, 04:33 PM.
                                          You can't fix stupid-Ron White

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