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Ever Look At Sale Ads And Wonder...

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  • IdahoRider
    started a topic Ever Look At Sale Ads And Wonder...

    Ever Look At Sale Ads And Wonder...

    ...what planet the seller lives on? I had a text message from someone I know asking me why my gelding was for sale and wasn't he older than the ad stated?

    Turned out to be an ad on an internet sales site, but not my horse. Right barn name (unusual, so I can see why she mistook him at first glance), right color. But wrong breed and age. Anyway, I read the ad and walked away wondering why this person thinks their horse is worth that price. It seemed kind of steep ($15,000 for a horse that has done nothing much, other than been trained steadily for a couple of years and trail ridden).

    Then I saw another ad for a hard to sell breed in this state, with the horse prices at $10,000. Are this young people who think their special horse is worth a ton of money? People who don't want to sell, so place an outrageous price on the horse to avoid actually selling?

    What are people thinking when they put a price on their horse? When I sell a horse I put a realistic price on them so I can, you know...sell them.

    When I was looking for a horse, before I purchased my mare last year, there was an ad for a grade gelding that was advertised as having potential for western pleasure, trail riding, grad prix jumping and "upper level dressage". And the price tag was only $17,000. I wanted to respond just to ask what they were drinking. Then I thought that perhaps it might be a teenager who really thinks that the horse could go on to do well in any of those careers.

    I know that this is a free country and someone can ask whatever they want for their horses. But as a serious buyer, I am turned off when someone kind of throws all these different disciplines out there with nothing to back it up. And then puts a hefty price tag on it.
    Sheilah

  • xeroxchick
    replied
    Last time I was horse hunting I went to see a $2500 paint, quiet, steady, nice horse. Went to see a 25000$$ paint. Anxious, rushed, was half Irish Sport Horse but the other paint was a far better horse. Fo figure.

    Leave a comment:


  • Belowthesalt
    replied
    About the "too low must be something wrong with it." Yeah. Years ago I had a nice 16.3 h.h. Appy that had evented through Prelim, done jumpers to 4'6", schooled over 5'. His dressage wasn't great (not forward enough), but he was obedient and on the bit (and had a bone-jarring trot because he was very hard to collect wit his long back). BUT - he was a wonderful jumper and easy to ride over fences. One hunter trainer once lamented that he was an Appy, because he would have "made a great equitation horse. You can place him easily and he doesn't break his back over anything under 4', so it's easily to look good on him." LOL So at the time, I thought I would get out of eventing/jumping and into dressage so I put him up for sale. This was the early '80s. I price him at $6,500. I had a kid with parents come to try him. The kid got better dressage out of him than I did, rode him around out mini-x-country course, did some stadium fences - just clicked with him. Parents offer me $3,500 with the statement, "Well, you priced him under $10K, so he can't be THAT great, and besides that, he's an Appaloosa." The kid, a boy, wanted to event. I just said, either pay the asking or I'll keep him. And I did, for another 9 years, then gave him, at age 21, to a friend who trail rode him until he died at 28.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bogie
    replied
    Originally posted by Belowthesalt View Post

    You made me think of the first time I took first eventer hunting. Drag hunt, so the runs were fast. When we started, he went vertical and bolted. I was able to get him back under control before he passed too many people. Once he realized he was going to be allowed to gallop, he settled down and behaved very well. After the first check, he seemed to have figured it out, and we had a great day, even giving a couple of regular hunt members leads over a few fences. We hunted with that hunt a couple more times. But I realize I was very fortunate tha t he learned to cope so quickly. That first rear was both scary and embarassing, but he certainly redeemed himself! He was an Appy, foundation bloodlines.
    The first time I hunted my mare she reared too. Then she bucked and squealed the whole time. It took her about four hunts to finally settle in and figure out she liked it. It took me completely by surprise.

    Leave a comment:


  • findeight
    replied
    Perhaps the kids want one that looks like a carousel horse- high head, gaping mouth, leaping with all four feet curled up, fire in its eyes. No thanks.

    Leave a comment:


  • horseshorseshorseshorses
    replied
    I love looking at ads (I just bought a horse so no need for more to actually buy another) and there is one in my area that has been reposted to multiple FB groups different ways that boil down to:

    Grandma(or mom) wants a pony for her grandsons (or sons). Must be:
    • Under 14.2 hh
    • Bomb proof (one of the boys is developmentally disabled and I think this is a reasonable requirement)
    • Must be grey with no pink skin around the eyes or muzzle
    • Must be young (every ad she lists a different requirement)
    • Must look like a carousel horse (whatever that means)
    • Must be under 10K
    The budget it right but man she is going to have a hard time with her requirements.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gainer
    replied
    I once offered to take a horse that had cervical arthritis and was unrideable and give it a good retirement home. Owner countered that she wanted $10K for him. After I laughed my head off, I told her to call me when she changed her mind. Took her about 2 months, but she did finally give him up.

    I felt bad for her that her dream horse wasn't what she thought he would be, but jeez!

    Leave a comment:


  • Tyrus' Mom
    replied
    When I was looking for a horse, my friend who manages a barn/ranch and her daughter who is a trainer told me that when people are advertising their horses very often they would say it was 16H and they were 15H. They were looking for me, and I was looking on the internet too. However, I was looking at ads from all over the country and because my minimum was 16H I only checked out 17H horses on-line out of my area because I certainly didn't want to fly across country to be faced with a smaller horse! I figured the horses would then be at least 16H.

    So often I was looking at videos of people riding the horses and they were smaller women and it was hard to tell exactly how big the horse truly was. Also, my budget was extremely low five figures and it really means if you want a decent horse in that price range, he/she will be young and have very little training or an older well bred horse probably with issues, training or health issues. So that's what I had to do, and looked at horses in that direction. I ended up going younger with very little training. Very happy, though. Perfectly content.

    The whole buying process is tough from a buyer's perspective. I know I looked at pictures/videos of horses that were beyond my price range and lamented the fact my budget wasn't bigger.... and looked at ads for horses whose price wasn't mentioned and after one inquiry stopped thinking of asking those owners about their price... knew they were beyond my budget. It is what it is... I didn't begrudge the higher prices on horses, but it was a little depressing for a time until I found my boy.

    As a buyer, there are a lot of warning signs. There are those videos of people riding a horse around and they will walk and trot, but not canter. Videos of horses running loose are a dime a dozen and it helps to see movement, but still... there is so much more you need to know. Videos of a rider on a horse that looks scared... the rider, not the horse... those were my buyer beware videos I chuckled at... shoot....it's a mine field out there!

    Oh, oh, my favorite funny videos are those sellers that think if the rider can stand on the saddle on this horse it's a good horse, or the rider can mount the horse from on top of a horse trailer (jumping down on it). Those videos only made me laugh.... cripes.... the day I decide it's a good day to stand on my saddle or mount from jumping off of something, please find me good meds to get me over those very bad ideas! OK- I get it, it's a gentle horse that puts up with stupid stuff or it's been tranq'd up to the gills so they can do stupid stuff to it. Either way, I'll pass.

    Leave a comment:


  • NancyM
    replied
    I love the ads that describe a "talented jumper", and show pictures of the horse hanging it's knees and jumping over it's shoulder or completely inverted. You know, if I was trying to sell a horse for something that I knew nothing about, I probably wouldn't include a picture.

    Leave a comment:


  • clanter
    replied
    Originally posted by punchy View Post

    Well, that's my point. The "backyard doofus," as you call them, has no idea how to value their horses for the market because they don't know what actual purchase prices are. All they see are adds for an 'x' kind of horse for 20k, and price their horse accordingly.
    .
    might be because we backyard doofus had no intention of selling the prized mount... more than once we had unsolicited people try to buy a couple of our kid's horses.... the topper was the guy who was dumbfound when I told him the horse was not mine to sell, she was my kids' horse... he told me all I was going to do with was ruin her... yes we did, horse continued winning beating all the others in multiple disciplines until retired in her twenties

    As for us buying horses, we never relied upon some ad as mostly we knew the horse we bought or went to where the horse was to spend some time with it... daughters were always finding a horse in Billings, Montana area.. that was along road trip but doable

    Leave a comment:


  • Belowthesalt
    replied
    Originally posted by Bogie View Post
    Yup. This drives me nuts.You have NO IDEA how a horse is going to pan out in the hunt field until you're about six hunts into the experience. You cannot replicate the hunt experience without, well, hunting!
    You made me think of the first time I took first eventer hunting. Drag hunt, so the runs were fast. When we started, he went vertical and bolted. I was able to get him back under control before he passed too many people. Once he realized he was going to be allowed to gallop, he settled down and behaved very well. After the first check, he seemed to have figured it out, and we had a great day, even giving a couple of regular hunt members leads over a few fences. We hunted with that hunt a couple more times. But I realize I was very fortunate tha t he learned to cope so quickly. That first rear was both scary and embarassing, but he certainly redeemed himself! He was an Appy, foundation bloodlines.

    Leave a comment:


  • BigMama1
    replied
    Originally posted by PNWjumper View Post
    I guess I'm struggling to understand why you care that someone has their horses (potentially) over-priced? And I'm not sure who made you the judge of horse pricing? Maybe that horse is a packer extraordinaire and worth every penny? Or maybe it's a backyard nag that's not worth $1k, but it's not *your* horse to sell, so it shouldn't matter either way. IME, when someone has a horse grossly overpriced, it doesn't sell. That's self-correcting karma (or something). No need for random strangers to add their voice to it

    Yes, I am a little sensitive about this subject, but I get trainers (and random strangers) telling me this often enough that it sets me on edge to hear it here. I sell most of my horses in the higher 5-figure range, and I frequently get comments and messages about how "my pricing is ridiculous." And yet, I've sold every horse I've had at the asking price and in the time frame I've expected (and, FTR, I've also had trainers tell me that my horses are underpriced - everyone's a critic!).

    And don't even get me started on the people who read my ads that state "horse is priced in the high 5-figure range," text me to ask the price, and then when I respond with $85k" text me back something nasty about how they only have $25k and *that's* high 5-figures to them, and "who do you think you are to have your horse priced at $85k?!"

    At the end of the day, it doesn't hurt YOU to have someone asking 17k for THEIR horse. Yes, it might be overpriced for the market, in which case the horse won't sell. Period.
    The issue is with people who price their horses unreasonably, not with people who fairly price their horse high because their breeding / training / show results / market value warrant it. I get why he OP is frustrated, because it is very time consuming and irritating to wade through such ads. Life and death? no. But annoying nonetheless.


    Leave a comment:


  • findeight
    replied
    Some people keep nice, well trained horses in their nice backyards and others really deserve the backyard doofus tag. Don't take it personally. I came out of a nice backyard and it never bothered me but there is a valid point in referring to something as backyard trained.

    All you need to do is watch the sale videos with the horse weaving around a tractor dodging a goat. Now, some of those are pretty well broke or somebody would have died but wouldn't look for any specialized skills pointing to success in competition in the near future. And those better be cheap.

    Thing that's always gotten me is the misleading terminology and translating "ad speak" into English before driving hours to look at a horse. For example

    Jet Black=brown
    Mahogany Bay=brown
    Bright chestnut= brown.
    8 year old= either 2 or 10
    16h= 15.1. Tops.
    Great on trails= once or twice we tried it
    Propect= untrained
    Great jump= just not with a rider

    And on and on. Some I don't blame, they don't know what they don't know. You get to where you can sort of tell before wasting too much time oersuing a particular horse. But you still get fooled, even today intne digital age.

    One point about ads for less numerous breeds. You don't know if that seller is delusional or an actual successful breeder of a rarer breed offering quality stock at a fair price. We have a longtime poster on here who is just that with a very good reputation. You could miss out if you are too quick to dismiss if the unusual breed and price are your only clues to the seller. There's usually other clues in the ad, pictures and video but don't just go by price.


    Leave a comment:


  • Scribbler
    replied
    Originally posted by punchy View Post

    Well, that's my point. The "backyard doofus," as you call them, has no idea how to value their horses for the market because they don't know what actual purchase prices are. All they see are adds for an 'x' kind of horse for 20k, and price their horse accordingly.

    Nice snobbery you got going on, but plenty of trainers are asking and expecting too much for their horses, not just an equestrian selling their own horse that they keep at a barn at their house. And then there are the 6 figure asks by large sale barns for horses who walk out of the stall lame.
    I completely agree that many trainers are asking way more than I think a horse is worth, and that they sell to less experienced clients who are in part paying for a horse acceptable to their trainer. I also suspect that some of these horses are sold at a discount that makes them closer to their market value but buyer and seller can both go on saying its a $50,000 horse or whatever.

    Sorry if I came across as snobbish, but my point was that trainers and sales barns over price strategically to see what the market will be. There is a vested interest in *every trainer* in a discipline pricing high because then the "value" of a horse in that discipline rises.

    Leave a comment:


  • punchy
    replied
    Originally posted by Scribbler View Post
    Yes, I think a lot of people adverise a horse at a certain price to set a public value for their breeding or training program, and sell for a lot less. So both buyer and seller can say the horse is "really" worth $20,000 when the real price was $5000.

    Price inflation by knowledgeable trainers is also one thing, usually strategic. Price inflation from some backyard doofus is another thing. The "why" is going to be different in each of these cases.
    Well, that's my point. The "backyard doofus," as you call them, has no idea how to value their horses for the market because they don't know what actual purchase prices are. All they see are adds for an 'x' kind of horse for 20k, and price their horse accordingly.

    Nice snobbery you got going on, but plenty of trainers are asking and expecting too much for their horses, not just an equestrian selling their own horse that they keep at a barn at their house. And then there are the 6 figure asks by large sale barns for horses who walk out of the stall lame.

    Leave a comment:


  • thebiggrey
    replied
    I had someone tell me they were going to LEASE their pony out for 30k.

    The pony was was super sweet, but was terrible with kids and would take off on them. No real show experience, too quick to be a hunter, and couldn't jump the pony jumpers. Not safe on trails, lived on a calming supplement, and needed maintenance to get her lead changes. Not saying this pony wasn't amazing for this family, but to basically want some small adult to lease this pony and ride it for fun for a year and pay them an exorbitant amount of money so they could get another horse just didn't sit right with me.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bogie
    replied
    Yup. This drives me nuts.You have NO IDEA how a horse is going to pan out in the hunt field until you're about six hunts into the experience. You cannot replicate the hunt experience without, well, hunting!
    Originally posted by Dutchmare433 View Post

    Re: fox hunters...I think people who have never been hunting don't think about what the horses need to be able to cope with. They think it's like a hunter pace with some dogs. But once you've hunted, you know those good-minded horses are worth their weight in gold, even though they aren't commanding the prices of competive jumpers or Dressage horses. It's similar with trail horses.

    Leave a comment:


  • Scribbler
    replied
    Yes, I think a lot of people adverise a horse at a certain price to set a public value for their breeding or training program, and sell for a lot less. So both buyer and seller can say the horse is "really" worth $20,000 when the real price was $5000.

    Price inflation by knowledgeable trainers is also one thing, usually strategic. Price inflation from some backyard doofus is another thing. The "why" is going to be different in each of these cases.

    Leave a comment:


  • punchy
    replied
    I've seen barns advertise a horse for sale for an inflated price, then advertise that it's been sold, but the whole time they had a buyer (usually their own client who paid less); so it was just a fake sale ad used as advertising and puffery for higher volume/dollar sales for the barn. If I see a random sale ad for 20k and then a "Sold!" on it, I have no idea if that horse sold for 20k, 18k, or 4k. So if that's what your guideline is for pricing, no wonder it's out of whack.

    Leave a comment:


  • 16 Hands
    replied
    If you're talking about actually doing competitive trail as opposed to keeping you safe in the mountains, then $10K is probably ballpark.

    I wish you could have seen my old guy. He was sold to me as a 9 year old quarter horse cross who was mostly used as a pack horse. The owners were looking to transition to all mules so he was for sale. I fell in love with him the instant I saw him. Around 15.1 hands, chestnut, blaze, stocky strong body, good legs and feet and the kindest eye in the world. He could get up and go when asked but was careful and serious when negotiating the mountains. In his lifetime he carried me hundreds if not thousands of miles over 20 years with me and although we didn't always see eye to eye, he and I were tight and knew each other so well. He was fun to ride, had a cute personality and was a jokester. Turns out he was not quarter horse at all but a Morgan, which was told to me by a Morgan breeder who said he had all the hallmarks of the breed. Dang I miss him.

    Leave a comment:

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