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Money Talk- Divorced Parent Edition

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Palm Beach View Post
    IDK - I think it's relative to the age of the child and the child's desire to be part of the competition world. Not Mom's desire for the child to not "miss out" on anything in the competition world because it's inconvenient for Mom to haul the big rig around. Mom's made it clear that she will be using the trailer for her own horses as well.

    Wanderosa made good points wrt what else can be done with $200 a month. I hauled kids around in an old trailer with hand me down craigslist ponies. Any extra money went into the college fund or my retirement account. Little bits of money that I put away years ago have worked very very hard to become much bigger bits of money and allowed my kids to graduate from college debt free. Being a single parent is hard, and your kids usually hang around long after age 18, which is when mandatory child support usually ends. Although my ex and I had an OK relationship, he contributed very very little once they turned 18.
    Mandatory child support ends at 21. At least in my state.

    We really don't know what kind of money these people have. So, it's really hard to get into any kind of discussion about whether $200/month is a financial burden or not. For a lot of people, it is not. But that's not really the point...the point is whose responsibility is it? I agree that it's not really clear that this is for the kid, and that the OP would be lucky to get the ex to go half on it.

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by TheJenners View Post
      Wow bitter Betty, reel back a bit. I wasn't attacking nor was I being glib. Nor am I a recent addition. But you do you.
      sure seemed that way to me.

      Bitter Betty? Reel back? You do you? Use your grown up words instead of name calling and millennial slang.

      I think it's great that you believe yourself to be a most excellent addition; however, that really had zero to do with my post referencing that things were very cordial with my ex until the addition of the third party. This isn't unique to my situation but is fairly common. YES, there are exceptions and YES there are "good" men and YES, situations change in the blink of an eye and YES, I too have been the third party who's been everything short of a saint in a relationship. My advice was to get it in writing as things can change when they've been fine for years. A somewhat short lived n=1 great story is just that...a great story.

      End.

      ***********
      My personal take for the OP/parent? Everything in writing, water tight. It's how I got stuck with a several hundred thousand dollar university bill when my ex's new wife decided she'd rather renovate the house and do God knows what rather than pay for half of my daughter's college. And he's not about to make it his hill to die on...because he knew I would pay. And I did.

      Things change. Cars, trailers, riding lessons, meh. Make sure you get at least the big stuff in writing.

      Depending on the state, college expenses can be ordered.

      Depending on the state, child support ends at 18/high school grad.

      For those married to/dating parents? Ensure that your partner meets more than his or her share of obligations. Guaranteed it will only instill good will and be good for the kid. And stay out of the decisions as much as you can if you disagree with what both parents have already agreed to or agree to. Or don't get involved with someone who has kids. It's just not fair to the kids. Yes, it will financially affect you, but that's life.







      LarkspurCO: no horse's training is complete until it can calmly yet expressively perform GP in stadium filled w/chainsaw juggling zombies riding unicycles while flying monkeys w/bottle rockets...

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by S1969 View Post

        I think her point was that not all ex's are ass----s and not all 3rd parties are "interfering." Maybe the OP can hope that her ex meets someone like theJenners.



        To the OP; if there is no alimony/maintenance agreement it seems like asking the ex to buy you a trailer "for the daughter" is a pretty big request. I agree that your best bet would be to buy something smaller and used. I picked up a 2H Featherlite for $6K. It's pretty enough to haul in any company. I suppose if you and the ex are on extremely good terms you might ask him to go halves with you. Asking him to buy it seems like yes, you're trying to sneak something past him.
        People change. I didn't marry my ex husband thinking we'd divorce one day and I didn't divorce him thinking he'd put my daughter second to the disaster of a person he married.

        My advice was to get things covered. Sure would have prevented me a huge and unfair financial burden. Of course there are great stories out there. There are plenty that go the other way. Hope and prayers won't get bills paid.

        People change, things happen, and it's pretty annoying to read that type of shout out with minimal experience.
        LarkspurCO: no horse's training is complete until it can calmly yet expressively perform GP in stadium filled w/chainsaw juggling zombies riding unicycles while flying monkeys w/bottle rockets...

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #64
          Originally posted by clanter View Post

          you can have a even a used trailer shipped in from elsewhere.... but what we talking about $15k new $10k used? .... if you have 8 polo ponies five grand is not much of a jump
          I live in a kind of weirdly isolated area. Going to see a far-off used trailer or having one shipped pretty much negates the savings. I cannot bear the thought of buying a trailer without kicking the tires myself. The new trailer is $9k, the same trailer used is going for like $7k in good condition. Seeing as though the main reason for getting the trailer is to make things easier I am prone to just want the new one because of maintenance and unknown stuff that comes along with used trailers. Polo ponies sound a lot fancier than they really are. Most cost around 10 if they are finished, but many of us make our own from OTTB, which we get for cheap since we want the short ones.

          I don't really understand why people think I am trying to collect different sized trailers for my own luxurious use. I basically have no use for a 2h other than major vet emergencies. Anyone who says just use the 8h is welcome to drive my rig through a small town intersection on a sunday afternoon anytime.

          If ex decides to bail on the trailer payment I will be OK so I am not too worried about that, it would just be insanely annoying of him. Anyway... we are getting the trailer so wish me luck!

          Comment


          • #65
            I think your n=1 obviously applies to you too, speaking honestly. While most second marriages aren't to "disasters" who put kids second, yours was and you clearly need to work through that. Being a snark at me tho? More than once? Uncalled for. Sorry I pushed your buttons, but my posting history is far from glib. And "you do you" etymology is from Mary Shelly's Frankstein....

            But you do you!
            COTH's official mini-donk enabler

            "I am all for reaching out, but in some situations it needs to be done with a rolled up news paper." Alagirl

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by right horse at the right time View Post

              My personal take for the OP/parent? Everything in writing, water tight. It's how I got stuck with a several hundred thousand dollar university bill when my ex's new wife decided she'd rather renovate the house and do God knows what rather than pay for half of my daughter's college. And he's not about to make it his hill to die on...because he knew I would pay. And I did.

              Things change. Cars, trailers, riding lessons, meh. Make sure you get at least the big stuff in writing.

              Depending on the state, college expenses can be ordered.

              Depending on the state, child support ends at 18/high school grad.
              Well, if these things aren't in your divorce agreement, your lawyer didn't do a very good job. Who is responsible for college costs - that should be in the agreement, for sure - since it's practically the single largest expense in raising a child.

              Some form of "agree to share financial responsibility for dependent child's needs" is likely to be written into most divorce agreements in some way or another. The point is that it would be unlikely to extend to extra curricular activities - no one "needs" riding lessons or a horse trailer...it would apply to things like travel for college visits, buying a used car for the child so they can get to work/school, etc.

              Once the divorce is in place, no normal person is going to put something else in writing. If I were her ex there is no way in hell that I would agree - now - to specifically fund riding or any other sport. Not to mention, what kind of legally binding agreement would cover this?

              OP I don't think you're looking to stack up trailers for your personal luxurious use. But from what it sounds about your divorce, it doesn't really fall into the category of something your ex should have to buy. If he wants to, that's different. If he wants to buy the trailer and keep it in his name - that's not unreasonable either.

              Comment


              • #67
                I would not want to date or marry a parent who was not helping their kid get a good start in life.
                "When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in a confederacy against him."

                Comment


                • #68
                  I get that it's easier to drive a two-horse, though I'd argue that excludes bumper pulls. I honestly don't see any other advantage to them. Everyone I know that has the means has a 6-horse. Show grounds, vets, farriers, and the like are set up to accommodate big trailers. A surprising number of folks here actually have the tractor trailer sized rigs that commercial transport companies use. Big trailers have superior stability, making for a more comfy ride for the horses. Plus, you're missing out on a money-making opportunity hauling other kids' ponies to the shows along with yours! One of the other moms at our barn joked that I needed to start dating one of the Argentinian polo guys so I could save money on trailering fees. lol. When I drove for a commercial carriage company I picked up the practice of using the big Stanley tool boxes that roll for tack. They don't look as nice as the wooden trunks. But they're weather tight to the degree that I can leave them sitting outside for a few hours without worry and they take up way less space on the trailer. And, you should've seen the envious looks I got leaving the show this weekend from the people struggling to lift their wooden trunks back into their trailers as I rolled by with the Stanley.

                  Anyway, I'm glad you and your ex got it worked out. Enjoy the new trailer!

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    #69
                    Originally posted by S1969 View Post


                    OP I don't think you're looking to stack up trailers for your personal luxurious use. But from what it sounds about your divorce, it doesn't really fall into the category of something your ex should have to buy. If he wants to, that's different. If he wants to buy the trailer and keep it in his name - that's not unreasonable either.
                    Of course, and that is how I framed it to him. I said before I even asked that I totally understand if he says no, but then went on to describe why we would be a lot better off with the trailer. He is keeping it in his name, which I also totally understand. Trailer issue solved!

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #70
                      Originally posted by Wanderosa View Post
                      I get that it's easier to drive a two-horse, though I'd argue that excludes bumper pulls. I honestly don't see any other advantage to them. Everyone I know that has the means has a 6-horse. Show grounds, vets, farriers, and the like are set up to accommodate big trailers. A surprising number of folks here actually have the tractor trailer sized rigs that commercial transport companies use. Big trailers have superior stability, making for a more comfy ride for the horses. Plus, you're missing out on a money-making opportunity hauling other kids' ponies to the shows along with yours! One of the other moms at our barn joked that I needed to start dating one of the Argentinian polo guys so I could save money on trailering fees. lol. When I drove for a commercial carriage company I picked up the practice of using the big Stanley tool boxes that roll for tack. They don't look as nice as the wooden trunks. But they're weather tight to the degree that I can leave them sitting outside for a few hours without worry and they take up way less space on the trailer. And, you should've seen the envious looks I got leaving the show this weekend from the people struggling to lift their wooden trunks back into their trailers as I rolled by with the Stanley.

                      Anyway, I'm glad you and your ex got it worked out. Enjoy the new trailer!
                      Oh dear now you have gotten me to admit the one part of this whole situation that is the most embarrassing... I am honestly not too comfortable hauling with a bumper pull. It feels weird, mostly because I have not done it as much as a gn. I am sure I will be fine after a few trips. We won't be going far. The situation works out better if the 2 horse is a bp, since my regular car is a large SUV. In my mind it makes sense to have the spare trailer be something that's easy to hook up to the SUV and go, instead of unhooking the huge one from the flatbed and sticking the 2h on, etc. This is also why I was leaning towards a new trailer that's relatively light but sturdy and has new brakes and electric. Since the two trailers will be in use at the same time pretty frequently, getting a gooseneck would kind of defeat the purpose. Weekends where we both have a riding activity will have to be pretty strategic as it is. I haul the kid and pony to do kid stuff in the morning, and then we all head over to my game where a groom has already hauled my own string to the field. Kid and pony can wander around on the sidelines with the other feral polo children. Before anyone asks, no I do not have a full time groom. You HAVE to use one for games because the length of time between periods is not enough for anyone to check tack, switch bridles, or responsibly deal with the horses on their own. I can't trade the SUV in for another truck- I need that covered cargo space for other activities. My SUV is the storage zone for all sports equipment, dog items, and other kid stuff. It is 2 years old and smells like a dirty sock no matter what I do.

                      I swear I have thought this out from every angle. I feel like I could write a novel about two horse trailers at this point. I did really enjoy looking at the fancy ones the salesman had on the lot. Wow, what a cool peek into what fancy horses get to do! I probably know the Argentine polo guys you and your friends joke about dating and I have to say that no amount of hauling is worth dating any polo player whatsoever, myself included! Haha

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by S1969 View Post

                        Well, if these things aren't in your divorce agreement, your lawyer didn't do a very good job. Who is responsible for college costs - that should be in the agreement, for sure - since it's practically the single largest expense in raising a child.

                        Some form of "agree to share financial responsibility for dependent child's needs" is likely to be written into most divorce agreements in some way or another. The point is that it would be unlikely to extend to extra curricular activities - no one "needs" riding lessons or a horse trailer...it would apply to things like travel for college visits, buying a used car for the child so they can get to work/school, etc.

                        Once the divorce is in place, no normal person is going to put something else in writing. If I were her ex there is no way in hell that I would agree - now - to specifically fund riding or any other sport. Not to mention, what kind of legally binding agreement would cover this?

                        OP I don't think you're looking to stack up trailers for your personal luxurious use. But from what it sounds about your divorce, it doesn't really fall into the category of something your ex should have to buy. If he wants to, that's different. If he wants to buy the trailer and keep it in his name - that's not unreasonable either.
                        This varies widely by state. That's my point. Get everything in writing water right.

                        You don't have the information necessary to make the statement that my lawyer didn't do a good job, and it's entirely irrelevant to this post.
                        Many "normal" people will make post decree agreements; situations change, and it is actually not incredibly unusual to go back to court.

                        The point is, going back to my comment, that it's all great when everyone is getting along swimmingly. When that changes, it's important to have a watertight agreement upon which to rely. That's my entire point.
                        LarkspurCO: no horse's training is complete until it can calmly yet expressively perform GP in stadium filled w/chainsaw juggling zombies riding unicycles while flying monkeys w/bottle rockets...

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by TheJenners View Post
                          I think your n=1 obviously applies to you too, speaking honestly. While most second marriages aren't to "disasters" who put kids second, yours was and you clearly need to work through that. Being a snark at me tho? More than once? Uncalled for. Sorry I pushed your buttons, but my posting history is far from glib. And "you do you" etymology is from Mary Shelly's Frankstein....

                          But you do you!
                          No, but thanks for playing. Everyone's situation is individual and your nasty last little dig about me having to work through things really isn't your call to make, now is it? I would say you go far beyond the snark of which you're accusing me.
                          But, go ahead, keep twisting and trying to find that dig that will get through, because it clearly bothers you deeply that you aren't in control of this thread, of my responses to you, or of anything in this situation. You're in a fairly new relationship trying to tell your boyfriend what to do (under the guise of offering and joking) with his kids regarding cars and horses and being told no, then coming on here handing out ridiculous inexperienced/inexpert thoughts and ideas to those of who have been through it for YEARS. You are probably having your own issues with this. My advice to you would be to butt out, but I don't think you'll truly hear that from anyone, especially because you clearly are not interested in any kind of diffusing of the situation, but rather escalating to win control. Stick to your lane; you're out of line here and what you offer is inexperienced and uninformed opinion, not expertise.

                          I also have a lengthy posting history, including details of much of what has been discussed in this thread.

                          I think for the sake of both of us, let's just agree to stay far away from each other, and in that way, I can do me, and you can do you, to put it in language it seems that you understand.
                          LarkspurCO: no horse's training is complete until it can calmly yet expressively perform GP in stadium filled w/chainsaw juggling zombies riding unicycles while flying monkeys w/bottle rockets...

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by right horse at the right time View Post

                            This varies widely by state. That's my point. Get everything in writing water right.

                            You don't have the information necessary to make the statement that my lawyer didn't do a good job, and it's entirely irrelevant to this post.
                            Many "normal" people will make post decree agreements; situations change, and it is actually not incredibly unusual to go back to court.

                            The point is, going back to my comment, that it's all great when everyone is getting along swimmingly. When that changes, it's important to have a watertight agreement upon which to rely. That's my entire point.
                            OK, then I guess I don't know what your point really is - what varies by state? The OP's divorce is already final. Do you think they should go back to court about a horse trailer? Because I doubt it falls into any category outlined in their divorce that either one of them are "required" to pay.

                            My divorce agreement outlines the final disposition of a number of items (property, mortgage, retirement, college costs) and that's it. It would take a lot for a judge to mandate that my ex pay for more than he already is outlined in the agreement. I could take him to court to enforce the agreement - e.g. if he didn't pay for the college costs as specified, of course. But I can't really think of a scenario where I would have grounds to ask for more than already agreed to - unless it was something really unusual. Maybe I am missing your point.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              A bit off topic but reminds me of when I was taking Family Law in law school . . . in Ontario there is an "extraordinary expenses" claim parents can make for child support--kid's expensive activities/sports usually fall under this, and my professor told us that it is the most contested area of child support--figuring out what is fair for parents to pay when a kid is involved in an expensive sport.

                              Though in Canada, the sport that causes the most grief isn't riding . . . it's hockey, of course

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                OP once you get used to a BP, it is not even something you think about anymore while hauling I transitioned from a 6h GN to a 2h BP when I downsized, and I don't ever want to go back
                                COTH's official mini-donk enabler

                                "I am all for reaching out, but in some situations it needs to be done with a rolled up news paper." Alagirl

                                Comment


                                • #76
                                  Originally posted by ecpolo View Post

                                  Oh dear now you have gotten me to admit the one part of this whole situation that is the most embarrassing... I am honestly not too comfortable hauling with a bumper pull. It feels weird, mostly because I have not done it as much as a gn. I am sure I will be fine after a few trips. We won't be going far. The situation works out better if the 2 horse is a bp, since my regular car is a large SUV. In my mind it makes sense to have the spare trailer be something that's easy to hook up to the SUV and go, instead of unhooking the huge one from the flatbed and sticking the 2h on, etc. This is also why I was leaning towards a new trailer that's relatively light but sturdy and has new brakes and electric. Since the two trailers will be in use at the same time pretty frequently, getting a gooseneck would kind of defeat the purpose. Weekends where we both have a riding activity will have to be pretty strategic as it is. I haul the kid and pony to do kid stuff in the morning, and then we all head over to my game where a groom has already hauled my own string to the field. Kid and pony can wander around on the sidelines with the other feral polo children. Before anyone asks, no I do not have a full time groom. You HAVE to use one for games because the length of time between periods is not enough for anyone to check tack, switch bridles, or responsibly deal with the horses on their own. I can't trade the SUV in for another truck- I need that covered cargo space for other activities. My SUV is the storage zone for all sports equipment, dog items, and other kid stuff. It is 2 years old and smells like a dirty sock no matter what I do.

                                  I swear I have thought this out from every angle. I feel like I could write a novel about two horse trailers at this point. I did really enjoy looking at the fancy ones the salesman had on the lot. Wow, what a cool peek into what fancy horses get to do! I probably know the Argentine polo guys you and your friends joke about dating and I have to say that no amount of hauling is worth dating any polo player whatsoever, myself included! Haha
                                  Ahh. You'd be using both trailers at the same time. Now it makes more sense. What kind of SUV do you have? I had a Suburban for a while because it had a full size truck chaisse. It hauled pretty well.

                                  Lol on the dating polo guys. The ones around here mostly seem to "reverse snowbird" for the summer season. There's one in particular that drives an F550 that I watched getting out of the truck at the auto repair shop and couldn't help but laugh because he looks like the prototype model for Polo Ralph Lauren. I swear that someone was following that man holding a fan so his hair would blow just so. The other guy with him wasn't half bad looking. But I doubt anyone noticed him standing there in the shadow of the South American Adonis!

                                  Comment

                                  • Original Poster

                                    #77
                                    Originally posted by S1969 View Post

                                    OK, then I guess I don't know what your point really is - what varies by state? The OP's divorce is already final. Do you think they should go back to court about a horse trailer? Because I doubt it falls into any category outlined in their divorce that either one of them are "required" to pay.

                                    My divorce agreement outlines the final disposition of a number of items (property, mortgage, retirement, college costs) and that's it. It would take a lot for a judge to mandate that my ex pay for more than he already is outlined in the agreement. I could take him to court to enforce the agreement - e.g. if he didn't pay for the college costs as specified, of course. But I can't really think of a scenario where I would have grounds to ask for more than already agreed to - unless it was something really unusual. Maybe I am missing your point.
                                    You explained this better than me. Of course I am now at risk of him taking back the trailer since anyone can do that with their own property. In that case I will just go buy one myself as soon as I can. Having known him for decades, I do not think that is very likely. He is more of a "make you beg for stuff so I can feel powerful" type of guy. Whatever, he can feel like the cool trailer buying macho dude for a few weeks if it makes my life easier in the long run.

                                    More importantly, it would take a hell of a lot more than a $9k trailer to get me back to lawyer fighting stage with him. The legal fees would end up costing as much as the dumb trailer to begin with! We have been divorced rather amicably for years and I sure as hell am not going to screw that up by demanding a trailer or demanding he sign documents guaranteeing a trailer.

                                    Just to bother the folks who are annoyed that I might actually use the trailer myself once in a while, I will add that I plan to pick up the trailer from the dealer and head directly to grab my own new horse I am purchasing for my own personal use. The horror!

                                    Comment

                                    • Original Poster

                                      #78
                                      Originally posted by Wanderosa View Post

                                      Ahh. You'd be using both trailers at the same time. Now it makes more sense. What kind of SUV do you have? I had a Suburban for a while because it had a full size truck chaisse. It hauled pretty well.

                                      Lol on the dating polo guys. The ones around here mostly seem to "reverse snowbird" for the summer season. There's one in particular that drives an F550 that I watched getting out of the truck at the auto repair shop and couldn't help but laugh because he looks like the prototype model for Polo Ralph Lauren. I swear that someone was following that man holding a fan so his hair would blow just so. The other guy with him wasn't half bad looking. But I doubt anyone noticed him standing there in the shadow of the South American Adonis!
                                      I have a similar SUV, it shouldnt be an issue. My trailer guy actually laughed at me when I was like ooooh do ya think I can do it? Haha. Like most other horse industry people, the trailer guys think polo people are nuts.

                                      Middleburg has a pretty decent polo crew, and I can confirm that there are a couple of major babes who pro there in the summers! You should go check it out sometime. I have never played there but the social aspect looks pretty fun and the Sunday polo is 10-12 goal so it would be pretty exciting to watch.

                                      Comment


                                      • #79
                                        Originally posted by ecpolo View Post

                                        I have a similar SUV, it shouldnt be an issue. My trailer guy actually laughed at me when I was like ooooh do ya think I can do it? Haha. Like most other horse industry people, the trailer guys think polo people are nuts.

                                        Middleburg has a pretty decent polo crew, and I can confirm that there are a couple of major babes who pro there in the summers! You should go check it out sometime. I have never played there but the social aspect looks pretty fun and the Sunday polo is 10-12 goal so it would be pretty exciting to watch.
                                        We meant to go watch all summer. Seemed like I was either working or we were showing ourselves every Sunday, unfortunately. And a lot of weather cancellations this year. The Safeway in Middleburg is a madhouse at 1pm on polo Sundays! Crowds of dressed up people hauling massive quantities of wine and cheese platters out. I've thought about trying polo because I'm much less nervous riding if I have something else to distract me from the fact I'm riding :0

                                        Comment


                                        • #80
                                          Originally posted by S1969 View Post

                                          OK, then I guess I don't know what your point really is - what varies by state? The OP's divorce is already final. Do you think they should go back to court about a horse trailer? Because I doubt it falls into any category outlined in their divorce that either one of them are "required" to pay.

                                          My divorce agreement outlines the final disposition of a number of items (property, mortgage, retirement, college costs) and that's it. It would take a lot for a judge to mandate that my ex pay for more than he already is outlined in the agreement. I could take him to court to enforce the agreement - e.g. if he didn't pay for the college costs as specified, of course. But I can't really think of a scenario where I would have grounds to ask for more than already agreed to - unless it was something really unusual. Maybe I am missing your point.
                                          Exactly. In some states, CS ends at 18. In others, it extends to 21. Massachusetts and a few other states require the non-custodial parent to contribute to college costs. I personally think that's a gross overstep on the part of the state as isn't required of married couples. I plan to help my children with their college tuition but I don't wish to be obligated for it. My daughters were 4 and 6 when my ex and I split. There's too much that can happen between then and them going college. I could get sick or injured and not be able to work. Or, god forbid, one of the girls gets sick and requires the financial resources I would have devoted to tuition. It's not ideal but they can always take out student loans.

                                          In my state, either party can request a review of CS every 3 years. In all 50 states, CS is a simple calculation based off plugging each parents' income into an online calculator. Extraordinary additional expenses are not part of that formula. Instead, they are determined by the court as needed. My children weren't riding at the time of the divorce. I could certainly go back to court and ask for riding expenses to be split. It would be risky, though. My ex got fired from the job he had at the time of our divorce. He's secretive about his current earnings, but I believe it to be only half of what it used to be. There's a good chance that the judge would adjust the base CS downward if I hauled him into court to get horse money.

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