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  • #41
    I'm curious about the market research -- aren't there quite a few high end rehab places already? It's been a while since I've been deeply involved in the mental health care "industry", but there certainly wasn't a shortage of high end places a few years ago.

    Personally, if I were going to set up a spa like place with a horse farm, I would do a weight reduction spa with horse back riding as one of the exercise options.
    Where Fjeral Norwegian Fjords Rule
    http://www.ironwood-farm.com

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    • #42
      "They tried to make me go to rehab and I said Whoa Whoa Whoa"

      I would not board my horse at a rehab place, but if I had to go to treatment/rehab and could take my horse with me,,,, well that would be awesome, right?
      Stoneybrook Farm Afton TN

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      • #43
        Originally posted by Long Spot View Post
        Hope you aren't planning on keeping any horse meds or tranqs at the farm...
        I don't think you have focused on this enough. Or at all, really.

        Because we did have a barn worker who waited until almost everyone was gone (BO was at a show) and got into the horse meds. So yes, an addict can and will do anything.

        I would, personally, never board somewhere like this. And, yes, I have a variety of horse meds on hand at all times, as should any well managed barn, ranging from wormers to tranqs to dex to antibiotics to banamine and bute. And I've probably left out something.
        'Computers are useless. They can only give you answers.'
        - Pablo Picasso

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        • #44
          Originally posted by tidy rabbit View Post
          "They tried to make me go to rehab and I said Whoa Whoa Whoa"

          I would not board my horse at a rehab place, but if I had to go to treatment/rehab and could take my horse with me,,,, well that would be awesome, right?

          I think horses are an all encompassing addiction, not many would have room for others?
          Unless that was a detox for horse addiction?

          No kidding, I too think they should consider handling them as two separate entities for daily operations, although an overseer may manage both.

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          • #45
            I am amazed that I am the first to say, Where's the fruitbat?
            I realize that I'm generalizing here, but as is often the case when I generalize, I don't care. ~ Dave Barry

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            • #46
              I'm sorry, but I'm also with the group that says I wouldn't board there. Not only for my horses safety, but for my OWN as well.

              A lot of people (of course not all) with substance abuse problems also have problems with violence or can become very erradic/violent if they are having withdrawls, etc.

              That said, it sounds like there are people out there that are not deterred by the idea, so if you only have 4 stalls to fill, you may be able to find 4 people who are willing. You need to make sure you are VERY clear that there is a detox facility ON THE PROPERTY because it is a saftey issue they need to be well aware of. And, I would probably not allow children on the property.
              Concordia means "Harmony" in Latin.
              Full Time Dressage Addict

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              • #47
                To answer the original question, I would hire two different people. Keep the two things separate. It will be much easier to hire and replace and manage if there is one person in charge of horses and another in charge of rehab housekeeping.

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                • #48
                  I am not skeptical of the concept in general -- high end rehab facility with equine-assisted therapy.

                  Nor would I reject boarding there, if it was well-run and the equine therapy program was well-defined and well managed.

                  I AM skeptical that THIS plan will result in a 'very high end' facility, where the cook is also barn help and also cleaning crew and is compensated with room-and-board and a stipend, and 'heavy cleaning' is done once weekly by a person from outside. Could a 'very high end' b-and-b succeed with that set-up? I have a feeling the food better be d*mned good (i.e., chef not cook) if advertised as high end.

                  Good luck and all, but it sure sounds like much more planning is needed to address the fruitbat factor.
                  ...somewhere between the talent and the potato....

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                  • #49
                    You know what it sounds like to me? A $h!tty, totally underpaid job. I don't care if it is Versailles, living in is part of the job - why is that counted as being part of the compensation? $500 a week to slave away for a bunch of addicts? It would be like an episode of Life In Hell. As for the boarders, hope they'll be warned in advance never to keep a single thing unlocked, their keys in plain view, etc.

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                    • #50
                      I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that just because one is an addict or in recovery/treatment doesn't automatically make that person a thieving criminal and a danger to society in general.

                      I'd guess that these people would already have detoxed at some hospital and would already be on their road to recovery.

                      Still, the job sounds terrible and difficult and not one I would want.
                      Stoneybrook Farm Afton TN

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                      • #51
                        That's very true, tidy rabbit, but so is the inverse - that just because one is a "high end" addict doesn't mean that one's not also a thieving criminal or a danger to society. Addiction does a number on all people, even rich "high class" people.
                        Proud Member Of The Lady Mafia

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                        • #52
                          I've seen rehab go both ways for people - several folks I know are very successful in AA and lead profitable lives on the up and up. Others never bounced back, lied, stole, whored themselves out, you name it. Both sets of people were at one point in their lives wonderful human beings. As a rehab facility, I'd imagine you'll have quite a bit of difficulty figuring out which is which, because truly, no one can lie like an addict. Even those who "want to be there."

                          Honestly? That job? I think it's a horrible thing to ask of anyone. You'll probably need someone who is very familiar with addicts and is actually qualified to work with them, not someone who can just cook, drive a car, and do barn work. Otherwise, it could easily become a dangerous situation.

                          Secondly, it's just. too. much.

                          So even though the person we are looking for will be living on site, their time off will realistically be REAL time off.
                          If they're living on site, particularly in the same house, they will NEVER have "real time off." That isn't realistic in the slightest. I'd imagine the burnout level would be worse even than just a barnworker. A stipend, meals, and housing would be a joke.
                          ---
                          They're small hearts.

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                          • #53
                            Originally posted by Trixie View Post
                            If they're living on site, particularly in the same house, they will NEVER have "real time off." That isn't realistic in the slightest. I'd imagine the burnout level would be worse even than just a barnworker. A stipend, meals, and housing would be a joke.
                            And I meant to say this in my original post- I'm not sure it counts as "meals provided" if one has to cook most of those meals themselves, and 24k a year isn't terribly generous in this part of the country, even if housing is covered.
                            bar.ka think u al.l. susp.ect
                            free bar.ka and tidy rabbit

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                            • #54
                              I haven't read all the replies, but I'll chime in anyway!

                              I think the "small working farm" setting as a residential rehab facility is a great idea. The gardening, outdoors, and animal exposure could really benefit people, especially if the patients are encouraged (or required) to get involved in some of the day to day farm experiences like gardening and animal care.

                              On the other hand, I can't wrap my mind around incorporating outside horse boarding into the mix. I don't think this is a good idea.

                              There is a great amount of liability involved here. Imagine if a patient is accidentally injured by a boarder's horse....or a boarder's horse is accidentally injured by a patient....or a boarder's child wanders into the company of patients. If you are ever sued for any reason, a court is going to wonder why you were mixing these two endeavors (each with its own high liability risks).

                              Just my opinion!

                              I would consider keeping some donated horses in the barn for you to use with the patients in their recovery. I would never introduce boarders (ie: the public) or privately owned horses into the equation.

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                Originally posted by Anselcat View Post
                                I am not skeptical of the concept in general -- high end rehab facility with equine-assisted therapy.

                                Nor would I reject boarding there, if it was well-run and the equine therapy program was well-defined and well managed.

                                I AM skeptical that THIS plan will result in a 'very high end' facility, where the cook is also barn help and also cleaning crew and is compensated with room-and-board and a stipend, and 'heavy cleaning' is done once weekly by a person from outside. Could a 'very high end' b-and-b succeed with that set-up? I have a feeling the food better be d*mned good (i.e., chef not cook) if advertised as high end.

                                Good luck and all, but it sure sounds like much more planning is needed to address the fruitbat factor.

                                I completely agree

                                Originally posted by NeedsAdvil View Post
                                Anyway, lots of things to consider. Caring for 4 horses is not a full time job, and I think we were hoping that we could compensate w/ other responsibilities. Living in what basically equates to a mansion with free meals and free board plus roughly $500 a week in pay didn't seem like such a hardship. The right person probably exists for this, so hopefully we will be able to find someone.

                                Living in a mansion that has been turned into a rehad facility is not what I would call "living in a mansion".
                                Auventera Two:Some women would eat their own offspring if they had some dipping sauce.
                                Serious Leigh: it sounds like her drama llama should be an old schoolmaster by now.

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                                • #56
                                  OK, I actually read all three pages because I was sure someone would have come up with this question:

                                  A BOARDING facility? Open to the public? How the heck are you going to maintain patient confidentiality when you run a secondary public business on the same property?
                                  If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude.
                                  ~ Maya Angelou

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                                  • #57
                                    I would actually ask for MORE money if I was required to live in the same house as a bunch of addicts. Even on a different floor. Always having to make sure my rooms are locked up tight, so my money/valuables aren't stolen or gone through. . . . and if I am 'off' having to basically lock myself in my room(s) unless I wanted to leave the property. Or sleep wondering if someone gets their mental knickers in a knot and comes pounding on my door at 3am because they didn't like the way I looked at them earlier in the day. The burnout rate is going to be incredible. Maybe a few recovering addicts are nice and ok to be around, most are not. I went through this with someone who was (WAS) my best friend. I couldn't deal with the jeckle and hyde thing. I got so sick of never knowing which one I'd get when I picked up the phone or saw her. And I didn't even live with her. I couldn't imagine living in a house with them. I loved her dearly and still miss her a lot, but I couldn't stand having someone turn on me so nastily out of the blue. . .then not seeing anything wrong with her behavior.

                                    If the 'patients' have access to the horses -at all- I would not board outside horses. I would never mix recovering addicts with the public. that sounds like a recipe for disaster. As does asking anyone who is not trained to deal with such people to drive them -anywhere-. Addicts can be very very manipulative and if they are having a bad day, downright dangerous and violent on top of horribly verbally abusive. To me the 'room and board' is worthless in this situation. Particularly if you have to shop for and cook the food yourself doesn't matter if it's bought with someone else's money. And yeah, you can do the basics with 2 to 4 horses in two hours. . .. but what about grooming? exercise? training? Cleaning tack? Sure I can clean four stalls and feed four horses in two hours and scrub buckets and ready the evening feed. . .but that doesn't allow any time for anything else.

                                    I'd hire separately for barn and house, hire someone -qualified- to be around addicts and seriously consider building a duplex or couple of small houses on the property that are NOT connected to the main house for the 'help' to live in if you want to offer housing as part of the package.

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                                    • #58
                                      Boarding business & rehab? Nope - too many potential problems. Now, if you want to add horses at some point owned by the rehab as part of the rehab - yes I can see that.

                                      Personally, I would forget the horses at this point. Concentrate on your rehab first. Get it up and running. You can always add horses if you so choose.

                                      Comment


                                      • #59
                                        ok I understand what you are asking.. and even kow the person who would be great.. if she was looking

                                        RN, PhD psychiatric nurse, horse nut who does her own stalls and a whiz of a gardner and cook. Who never has time to take her own hunter to a show because she is (already) working for a high end specialy facility for mega rich people. She makes alot of $$ for that skill set. I am sure there are more people like her randomly around .

                                        I wouldnt take public boarders I would get someone in that has a private horse- psychotherapy biz.. they will stay in their own world and not "out" your patients and having some therapy horse there might be good for your patients also
                                        I can explain it TO you,but I can't understand it FOR you

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                                        • #60
                                          wonder if the horses have something to do with a tax break for the company?
                                          Draumr Hesta Farm
                                          "Wenn Du denkst es geht nicht mehr, kommt von irgendwo ein kleines Licht daher"
                                          Member of the COTH Ignorant Disrepectful F-bombs!*- 2Dogs Farm

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