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Lease Questions

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  • Lease Questions

    As an adult re-rider, I've had some bad luck. First OTTB just too hot to be a hunter. Found him a fantastic home as an eventer. Second OTTB (for reasons too long to list, I'm very partial to TBs...grew up in a racing family) was my dream horse. Doing great for 2 years, showing 2'9", winning year end Ch and then the black cloud rolled in. 8 months stall rest, not quite right since. Missed all season showing trying to get him right with the vets. Thinking of bringing him home and turning him out for a year. He's been in full training since he got off the track, after a 4 month let down. I adore him.

    I really would like to spend next next spring/summer just enjoying a nice, sound horse and ads on FB got me thinking.

    Give it it to me in a nutshell:

    -average cost to lease for 3 foot packer. Doesn't need to jump like Brunello...doesn't need to get a piece of the hack all the time. Just local shows with the occasional "A" show. Would love to get better at the Adult Eq.

    -what does contract typically state? I pay for ?? They pay for??

    -horse would be in full training if desired...and I definitely think I'm a great, responsible home.

    I'm just looking to educate myself before I decide to reinvest in another OTTB.

  • #2
    Originally posted by mjwright View Post
    Give it it to me in a nutshell:

    -average cost to lease for 3 foot packer. Doesn't need to jump like Brunello...doesn't need to get a piece of the hack all the time. Just local shows with the occasional "A" show. Would love to get better at the Adult Eq.

    -what does contract typically state? I pay for ?? They pay for??

    -horse would be in full training if desired...and I definitely think I'm a great, responsible home.

    I'm just looking to educate myself before I decide to reinvest in another OTTB.
    The contract can state anything you want it to state. Typically the lessee takes out mortality and major medical insurance, and is responsible for all costs; board, vet, farrier, etc., during the lease. You may wish to google the terms "horse lease agreement" and investigate a number of the search links that come up.

    If it is a full lease, as a lessor I am not expected to pay for anything during the lease period. The rights to use the horse along with the cost to care for the horse are transferred to the lessee during a lease.

    Comment


    • #3
      Leases can vary pretty much from horse to horse. Price is typically one half or one third (I’ve seen both) of purchase price/horses value. For a decent 3’ packer you could expect to pay anywhere from $5-10k a year to $50k a year depending on the animal and how proven/easy/nice it is, and also depending on where you’re located.

      As OneTwoMany states, you should expect to pay for everything when you take on a lease. There are exceptions, of course, but every lease horse I’ve had and any time I’ve leased out my own, lessee becomes fully responsible for all costs for maintenance, health, and upkeep. We typically did have an exception in our leases with our own horses at my barn that if they needed major medical surgery (greater than a certain amount) horse would come home to us and we’d terminate the lease.

      Again, they can all be different. If you’ve seen one lease, you’ve only seen one lease. good luck!

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by mjwright View Post
        As an adult re-rider, I've had some bad luck. First OTTB just too hot to be a hunter. Found him a fantastic home as an eventer. Second OTTB (for reasons too long to list, I'm very partial to TBs...grew up in a racing family) was my dream horse. Doing great for 2 years, showing 2'9", winning year end Ch and then the black cloud rolled in. 8 months stall rest, not quite right since. Missed all season showing trying to get him right with the vets. Thinking of bringing him home and turning him out for a year. He's been in full training since he got off the track, after a 4 month let down. I adore him.

        I really would like to spend next next spring/summer just enjoying a nice, sound horse and ads on FB got me thinking.

        Give it it to me in a nutshell:

        -average cost to lease for 3 foot packer. Doesn't need to jump like Brunello...doesn't need to get a piece of the hack all the time. Just local shows with the occasional "A" show. Would love to get better at the Adult Eq.

        -what does contract typically state? I pay for ?? They pay for??

        -horse would be in full training if desired...and I definitely think I'm a great, responsible home.

        I'm just looking to educate myself before I decide to reinvest in another OTTB.
        Lease prices on 3' horses that are appropriate for the occasional A show are higher than you might think, unless you find a local situation through a connection or are only in need of something suitable for the Eq. and not the hunters. I was routinely seeing $15-25k/year on the ones that are marketed, even on ones that they wanted to limit to the 2'6" pre-adults. Doesn't mean there aren't ones with lower prices out there, it just means it takes a little digging or a little flexibility on your criteria. Finding an older been there done that type could be a good option.

        If it is a full lease, you are going to pay for everything, as if you owned the horse. You may be required to pay the insurance premiums also if the horse is insured. It will vary from situation to situation. I have seen it where the owner retains responsibility for life-threatening veterinary issues, but the lessee is almost always responsible for routine vet care and maintenance.

        Comment


        • #5
          I just leased one out that fits this description. Older 3' packer with a few quirks but will always, always jump and do it safely. Stylish enough to for a tricolor in the hunters at small, local rated shows, assuming I let him do his job, but definitely not a knees-to-nose world beater. Might get a pastel ribbon in the hack if the judge doesn't see his cart horse trot and/or there are fewer than 8 horses in the class

          My contract stipulates lessee is responsible for paying for major medical/mortality insurance with me listed as sole beneficiary, and that lessee is responsible for all vet bills until the end of the lease term (but obviously medical payouts go to them as necessary). I also did a 6 month with an option to renew for another 6 months at the request of the lessee; they wanted some protection against an injury so they wouldn't be out a year lease fee and stuck paying the bills for a full year. As owner I also wanted the protection against a change in circumstances that would make me want to bring the horse home. Seemed like a good compromise.

          Lessee also pays all board, training, and farrier cost, plus I added a clause that he has to stay on daily Previcox at her expense. So I pay for nothing as long as he's leased out. If he's injured, I can either let him rehab at their place until the lease ends or bring him home, but either way they pay all costs until the lease ends.

          Price wise, I took less than he's "worth" because I very much trusted the trainer working with the lessee, and wanted my horse to be in a program I approved of. My horse kept his same farrier, same vet, and gets a better turnout situation than he had at home, plus isn't being asked to show much or even jump to height at home really most of the winter. This was honestly the only trainer I offered him to; he wasn't even officially for lease at the time. Just a right time, right place kind of thing.

          If I'd leased him to anyone else, I would probably have asked low 5 figures.

          Comment


          • #6
            Around here (PNW) a 3' packer who will get the job done but not win is going to run you 10-20K per year to lease depending on quality and connections.

            Comment


            • #7
              Just a thought here....in your situation, you might want to look into a month to month lease. These reduce your exposure to non routine vet and other high price tag surprises, the down side is either side may terminate for any reason with 30 days notice and they can often be Sale horses that might sell.. But that’s not necessarily a bad thing as the trade off is you get access to far better horses then you could afford to lease for a longer term and if you are serious about improving your riding ? It’s a win win. Trainers often have this type lease available and take care of the management if the horse...which can be a blessing if you have a busy life full of non horse related surprises that can impact both barn time and budget.

              There are part leases too, half lease, share board numerous other arrangements, usually these are month to month as well, terms vary, usually 50% of all routine costs or a flat fee which amounts to about the same, you get 3 set days a week, Shows are worked out between the parties. Owner manages the horse and non routine vet costs. Generally, if it is a show worthy horse, the trainer will be involved.

              Ask your trainer.

              Do get a sense you might tend to fall in love with your horses pretty quick. That might make leasing more difficult but also might allow you to be more objective in evaluating and selecting appropriate horses for yourself when you are ready to buy as well as enlarge your comfort zone as far as breed is concerned,

              Wonderful as ownership is, sometimes the most wonderful day is the one when you hand the leadrope back to the owner. Really. Those who have had a lot of horses have learned to appreciate that feeling of relief with a few of them along the way.
              Last edited by findeight; Dec. 6, 2017, 09:44 AM.
              When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

              The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

              Comment


              • #8
                I’m in Pennsylvania. Around here 20-30K a year and unless you are willing to accept significant soundness or other issues very hard to find a month to month option. I’ve found a couple of wonderful horses to lease cheaper than stated above but I was very fortunate (essentially the lessee for @541hunter) and willing to accept some trade offs beyond no hack prize. Good luck in your search. Good example of how our industry is really pricing out the middle, IMO.

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  Thanks everyone! I really appreciate the education. It's interesting for sure and there are lots of great points here I need to re-read.

                  its definitely a side to having a horse that I really need to consider.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Others have had a lot of good advice. I'd encourage you--if you are a good rider and have a few connections--to try to dig around for one of those leases that is "to the right person only." There are a decent number of owners out there who are willing to charge less for a lease in exchange for the comfort of knowing that it is with a particular special person, at a particular facility, etc. Leases can be wonderful, so I think you are wise to consider this option. I know that lease fees seem expensive, but a great year on a fun horse can be a great value compared to pouring money into board bills and vet bills or training bills on an unsound or unsuitable horse.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Something else to think about with a full lease for a show animal: if you execute a 12 month lease and 9 months into the lease, the horse tears a suspensory and needs 12 months of stall rest and rehab - who pays for that? Typically, it falls on the lessee, not the owner. That can be a surprise to first time lessee's. Of course, anything can be negotiated, but helps to know the starting point.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I leased my 3’ packer in the PNW for 20k a year. Sound and will jump around no matter what, decent mover and consistently in th 80s in the Hunters. He had a previous tendon injury before I got him, so that was excluded in the lease, meaning if he reinjures it the lessee is not responsible for ongoing vet bills. They also covered insurance for the year, as well as hauling fees during the trial.

                        Comment

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