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No reaction to Mary Babick's article in COTH?

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  • No reaction to Mary Babick's article in COTH?

    Seems that every time I mentioned that hunter hair was unsafe I was dismissed as an idiot who didn't understand tradition. Now one of the influential "powers that be" comes out in favor of helmet safety and no one reacts?

    As I see it, if Ms. Babick talked to a handful of the most influential trainers and suggested that safety was important and that their students should get with the program, that would go halfway. If she got together with the influential judges and convinced them to publicly state that they agreed that safety trumps fashion, and that they would not penalize riders with tidy unconventional hair, that would complete the answer.

    Such a simple solution.
    madeline
    * What you release is what you teach * Don't be distracted by unwanted behavior* Whoever waits the longest is the teacher. Van Hargis

  • #2
    Two points

    1) Link to an article if you want to discuss

    2) Anyone who buys a helmet that doesn't fit properly because of hair or any other reason (which is I presume the discussion?) is a fool endangering her own life.

    Does anyone really argue that point?
    Let me apologize in advance.

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      Sorry. I assumed that since the article was in this week's COTH, people may have read it.
      try this link :

      http://read.uberflip.com/i/801795-march-27-2017/73

      And for your question about helmet fit? You would be surprised at how many on this forum are avid advocates of hunter hair under the helmet...
      madeline
      * What you release is what you teach * Don't be distracted by unwanted behavior* Whoever waits the longest is the teacher. Van Hargis

      Comment


      • #4
        I just got a new helmet and I got it to actually fit my head not my head and hair. I've been brain storming how I'm going to show in it. I still put my hair in a hairnet but then leave it hanging in the back. I'm thinking I'll probably put it in a tight bun in the back or do some sort of braid bun thing. I honestly can't believe that a judge would mark me down for that if they even were to notice
        Hudson Valley's Premier Tack Shop www.argentoeq.com/

        Life is happening for us not to us

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by ladyj79 View Post

          2) Anyone who buys a helmet that doesn't fit properly because of hair or any other reason (which is I presume the discussion?) is a fool endangering her own life.

          Does anyone really argue that point?
          Apparently thousands and thousands of hunter riders every year. Hunter hair diminishes the effectiveness of the helmet, and yet hunter hair persists.

          I've been guilty of it myself so I don't judge too harshly, but it is definitely an issue worthy of discussion and trying to raise awareness.

          Comment


          • #6
            btswass --I ride with my hair in a bun at the base of my neck with a no-knot hairnet over it. My hair is dark, as is my hairnet and I don't think anyone can really tell the difference from a distance. But I don't show and my hair is only slightly longer than shoulder length so I'm not coping with massive amounts of it.

            Still, good for Mary Babick to once again start a conversation that not many people are willing to have within the h/j world although as a practical matter it is more difficult to influence a trend versus to pass a rule (and it would be impossible to enforce a rule regarding how hair should be coiffed).
            Crawling Between Heaven and Earth is now available!

            Comment


            • #7
              It's not really the jumpers. Most jumper women I know have a plain old pony tail down the back if they don't have short hair.

              and they get slagged on the internet for "unkept hair".
              Let me apologize in advance.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by ladyj79 View Post
                It's not really the jumpers. Most jumper women I know have a plain old pony tail down the back if they don't have short hair.

                and they get slagged on the internet for "unkept hair".
                True--many women riding in the jumpers at all levels have ponytails or just more functional hairdos in general.

                Incidentally, I dream of the day that the only bad thing people can say about my riding is that I have unkempt hair!

                Crawling Between Heaven and Earth is now available!

                Comment


                • #9
                  I haven't really thought about this much, but it makes since. I do lots of hunters and eq and live in fox hunting country, so none of my helmets fit without my hair up. crap.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I don't have thick hair but my helmet fits exactly the same between a low pony tail flipped up in a hairnet to lay flat on the top of my head and my new pixie cut. If you have super thick long hair I get that there is a difference but it's not applicable to every person.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I ride with 'hunter hair' every time I ride, schooling or shows. My helmet is fitted to my head and hair, though I do have to say that the fit difference of hair vs nonhair is very minimal for me.
                      I think that a bun with a bow/net over it (like in dressage) just below the helmet is very classy and a good substitute for hunter hair, if you are worried. Fair warning though, if I see a ponytail in the hunter ring, I may come up behind the rider and snip it off

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I am not able to get the link to work, but will say.. so much about showing has become divorced from orginal uses and traditions-- of course if you go far enough back in the day people jumped without hats and helmets. A helmet is for safety. Any thing that is done that modifies that is just silly. Horse show fashions are just that-- the fads and fashions of the show ring-- not really about what is practical, safe or even tradition. But so long as show judges reward fad and fashion- those in pursuit of horse show success will follow those trends.
                        A canter is a cure for every evil. ~Benjamin Disraeli

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Haven't had time to read the article yet, but I think that's great. I'm sure there are some people who can get it to work without sacrificing the fit and security of their helmet, but I find that not only does it change the fit, it makes the helmet more likely to slip around on my head as the layers of hair are slippery. For the hunters, I currently secure my hair closely at the nape of my neck under the back of the harness and cover with a snug hairnet.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Its totally appropriate for kids to wear their hair in braids why not for adults? My hair is fairly long and quite thick and while I'm going to attempt to do the bun thing for shows it would be much easier to just braid it. Though I suppose it looks a little girlish but who cares. Its neat and secure and thats the whole point of hunter hair
                            Hudson Valley's Premier Tack Shop www.argentoeq.com/

                            Life is happening for us not to us

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hunter hair is just another way for women (including the preference for stick thin) to be closer to the male ideal of the hunter/equitation world. That's my opinion and I would guess that if Liza Boyd or Tori Colvin wore a pony tail, despite the cries of horror from the rail birds, they would just manage to put in winning rounds.
                              kenyagirl

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Pulling your hair over your ears and tucking it under your helmet is in response to the male gaze? I don't think so. I don't even think it's in response to fear of being dropped in the placings by a judge. A handful of r and R judges post here; I'm sure they'd attest that this would never happen on their watches to a rider with the superior trip, hair neatly confined in a manner other than the standard.

                                What is it about? A bunch of women who care too much about what other riders and trainers (most often, other women) think of them. Riders and trainers who fear appearing uncouth if they don't do what's expected-- like it will mark them as a pretender or A-show outsider. I also think--less judgmentally--that some keep doing hunter hair because they like how it looks, and, for some with shorter or thinner hair who keep the hair tie below the rim of their hat, the fit difference truly is negligible.
                                Last edited by lmlacross; Mar. 26, 2017, 02:23 PM.
                                "With mirth and laughter, let old wrinkles come" (Shakespeare).

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by lmlacross View Post

                                  What's is it about? A bunch of women who care too much about what other riders and trainers (most often, other women) think of them. Rider and trainers who fear appearing uncouth if they don't do what's expected-- like it will mark them as a pretender or A-show outsider.
                                  I definitely agree with this. There is such a stigma to fit in. So much so that everyone looks the same. Just about everyone wears parlantis and because they are the boot to wear. At least there is a little more differentiation happening with helmets. It shouldn't be about what is popular it should be about what works for you. What fits you best. What you feel comfortable and confident in.
                                  Hudson Valley's Premier Tack Shop www.argentoeq.com/

                                  Life is happening for us not to us

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Kenyarider didn't say male gaze, she said male ideal. The look of the foxhunter riding astride is a man--no ponytail hanging down because that hasn't been a man's fashion in nearly two hundred years. Clothing based on men's clothing, and "ideal" body types with minimal curves, flattered by men's inspired coats and breeches based on a man's garment (even breeches manufacturers who generously consider someone might be riding who needs a larger size seem to have trouble with the notion that the waist can still be much narrower with the hips or high thigh the widest point-that's how most female bodies are, but not male bodies.) Female hair has to be crammed under a net and all excess hidden from view with no hints it might actually be long. The mushroom developed out of that being VERY difficult for many women to achieve by shoving it under the cap, but down the back of the neck wasn't acceptable.

                                    Once it's decided that's The Look? You fit in. Women reinforce that far more than men in this sport, but the general ideal was created based on abandoning traditional women's riding attire as restrictive and looking as much like the male example as possible.
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                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Kenyarider, is that what you meant? If it is, then I'm sorry, I didn't get that at all. I took you as suggesting that female riders were trying to appear aesthetically pleasing to men, and that hairdo and body type were two separate symptoms of the same-- not that both were actually a symptom of female conformity to a preferred boyish look. I'm not sure that I really buy hunter hair as an outcropping of the preference for a boyish body type (which definitely is not exclusive to hunters or riding in general), but I may be alone in that. I think it's a simple function of our over-emphasis on "tidy hair," the fact that hunter riders often behave like lemmings, AND our great attachment to "what we've always done" and reluctance to change until forced.

                                      Last edited by lmlacross; Mar. 26, 2017, 03:34 PM.
                                      "With mirth and laughter, let old wrinkles come" (Shakespeare).

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        I am sure this will not be an popular sentiment-- but the thought occurs to me how much showing is a perversion of once upon a time utilitarian clothing and horses. A modern show hunter would probably collapse in the hunt field, and its riders off over its head at the first bank or uneven ground. Stock ties with pins were a first aid go-to in the field. The whole notion of show hunters-- big fat slow lazy horses slumbering over flat ground with dead even striding, with riders perched way forward on the neck with loopy slack reins..... this is a far cry from a field hunter. Show hunters have nothing, really, left to do with hunting.
                                        A canter is a cure for every evil. ~Benjamin Disraeli

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