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why no auto release in hunter ring? is it penalized?

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  • why no auto release in hunter ring? is it penalized?

    As the title says.

  • #2
    Nope, not penalized. Use whatever release is best for your horse.
    "Are you yawning? You don't ride well enough to yawn. I can yawn, because I ride better than you. Meredith Michael Beerbaum can yawn. But you? Not so much..."
    -George Morris

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    • #3
      no

      It actually wouldn't be penalized, but should be rewarded. It's just a fad of today's professional hunter riders. They do it, the juniors follow. A lot of people prefer the crest release for the hunters, and everyone has a different opinion. I think the automatic release is much more beautiful than a crest release, because it looks less posy.

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      • #4
        I love the look of the auto release...hate the butt in the air, over-exaggerated hands above the crest thing that is the rage in the hunters these days
        "You can't really debate with someone who has a prescient invisible friend"
        carolprudm

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        • #5
          Originally posted by mroades View Post
          I love the look of the auto release...hate the butt in the air, over-exaggerated hands above the crest thing that is the rage in the hunters these days
          It goes so well with the "hunter-hula"!
          Steppin Not Dragon "Bella"
          Top Shelf "Charlie"
          Check out the Military + Horses fb page!

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          • #6
            The auto-release isn't a fad! It's the way I have always known is correct(been riding 36 years). I have never understood this whole "crest release" fad. Yes, for beginners just learning balance... but then go to auto release to show independent seat and hand, not having to balance yourself by placing your hands on the neck. Auto release was around LONG before crest releases!
            Last edited by headsupheelsdown; Mar. 24, 2010, 09:47 PM.

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            • #7
              It's because you're supposed to ride the hunters with your hands in your lap so when you get to the jump you can make a big dramatic move and throw your hands up the horses neck and have all that floppy excess rein show off your horse's jump. Right?
              Stoneybrook Farm Afton TN

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              • #8
                Neither release is more or less "correct"- they are different and have different uses. Since hunter is judging the horse, use whatever you need to for the individual horse and individual situation. I would like to see more of it in the Eq ring- a nice auto release looks great but a lot of times that level of finesse is not needed as much with today's courses and horses.

                Personally I use the crest release more than the auto but some horses I ride are better suited with the auto (usually the ones that like to drift or do other silly things).

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by hntrjmprpro45 View Post
                  I would like to see more of it in the Eq ring- a nice auto release looks great but a lot of times that level of finesse is not needed as much with today's courses and horses.
                  This is what I was going to say. With regular hunter courses it isn't needed as much as the jumpers and eq courses. Not that it's a bad thing to do, but I guess it just isn't needed as much. We all know GM wants every higher level rider regardless of the ring they're in, to do it He loves that auto-release.

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                  • #10
                    i think that the release is what suits your riding and your horse. And who really cares? Just show your horse the best way. Trust me, judges do not care. And look at the photos from the Olympics...where are their hands? Up top, or down low? Do you think the horses care? Just give them what they need to jump their best.
                    www.midatlanticeq.com
                    Mid-Atlantic Equitation Festival,Scholarships and College Fair
                    November 11-13, 2016

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                    • #11
                      If you need the amount of control and influence that an automatic release provides to jump a very simple 3'6 course, that is a big problem and not something you want to advertise.
                      -Grace

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by TheOrangeOne View Post
                        If you need the amount of control and influence that an automatic release provides to jump a very simple 3'6 course, that is a big problem and not something you want to advertise.

                        bing bing bing, we have a winner. The auto demonstrates YOUR skill as a rider, not necessarily how skilled your hunter is and how exceptional his form is (and you know, until hunters start awarding bonus points for mad rider skilz, the auto should not be rewarded in a hunter class). However while I enjoy a nice mid jump nap and some ears for a snack as much as the next rider, you can still choose to NOT drape all the way up there and still not be doing an auto.

                        Sometimes I see conversations about the auto devolve into typical knee jerk reactions - you see a lot of bad crest releases and instead of thinking about the value of a GOOD one, the only correct answer is to do an auto? Baby, bathwater, much?
                        Your crazy is showing. You might want to tuck that back in.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by chunky munky View Post
                          i think that the release is what suits your riding and your horse. And who really cares? Just show your horse the best way. Trust me, judges do not care. And look at the photos from the Olympics...where are their hands? Up top, or down low? Do you think the horses care? Just give them what they need to jump their best.
                          True, but that is jumpers in the Olympics, not hunters.

                          I do not feel at all that an auto release/following hand indicates a problem horse. It is correct, traditional equitation that will show off your hunter. I see those perchy crest releases and I think beginner rider trying to keep their balance because they do not have an independent seat and hand. I know that is not the case in the vast majority of riders, that crest releases are just a popular style, but I am old and a traditionalist! JMHO

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I didn't read everyone's responses soooo I could be throwing myself under the bus BIG time!!!

                            My understanding was always this. A hunter course is based on the horse. You want to make your horse look like any joe blow can get on him and go for a nice little hunt. Now with that in mind when you are "looping" your reins and resting on the neck for a crest release you are saying "hey look at my horse he will jump anything as nice as can be with NO assistance from me." AND you are not impeding your horses natural form over the jumps by using your reins.

                            Same goes for our half seat. It's essentially to say look I can perch up here and my horse is just going to go along AND you are not using your seat, body, what ever to really get in his way, it's his natural movement you are just showcasing it.

                            It's the equivalent of western pleasure the looser the rein shows how dead broke your little pony is!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              DMK and Orange have it right, plus hunters get ridden by all sorts of incompetent people.

                              In this scenario, GM and others felt it best to teach us incompetents the crest release. It was a damage control thing.

                              Then it became a common look, in part because it helped get noobs into the show ring that much faster. And there they were-- in the ring, in photos, in lessons and clinics-- establishing an aesthetic standard in a very rigid sport.

                              Back to damage control and the ideal hunter-- that horse should jump beautifully for anyone. But your average horse with you average rider is more likely to jump better if he trusts that you'll let go of his face every time.

                              At some point (and I secretly like this) it became cool to float the reins a few strides out when you saw your distance.

                              I think this trend developed after the WB invasion and the canter got so long and slow. Riders had the time to see a distance and adjust with their body, allowing the horse to use his front end just as well as he possibly could.

                              Some day, I'll have one so broke that I do the whole course this way-- all off my eye and shoulder a few degrees forward or more upright.
                              The armchair saddler
                              Politically Pro-Cat

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by headsupheelsdown View Post
                                True, but that is jumpers in the Olympics, not hunters.

                                I do not feel at all that an auto release/following hand indicates a problem horse. It is correct, traditional equitation that will show off your hunter. I see those perchy crest releases and I think beginner rider trying to keep their balance because they do not have an independent seat and hand. I know that is not the case in the vast majority of riders, that crest releases are just a popular style, but I am old and a traditionalist! JMHO
                                Sorry, I think that the so called auto release requires the rider to bend over lower, which is not necesary at the 3'6" height. At 3'6" it looks silly. I can go with it at 4'6". Use it where it is necesssary. It is not in the Medal and Maclay.
                                www.midatlanticeq.com
                                Mid-Atlantic Equitation Festival,Scholarships and College Fair
                                November 11-13, 2016

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  It's so nice to see how many successful, top-level hunter riders we have on this board! I am QUITE impressed.

                                  Would one of you skilled, experienced, upper level pro riders mind telling me why SO many hunters go in a standing martingale? While you're at it, can you give me an example of a hack winner?

                                  TIA :c)
                                  Here today, gone tomorrow...

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by chunky munky View Post
                                    Sorry, I think that the so called auto release requires the rider to bend over lower, which is not necesary at the 3'6" height. At 3'6" it looks silly. I can go with it at 4'6". Use it where it is necesssary. It is not in the Medal and Maclay.
                                    How much lower can you bend over than sticking your butt up in the air and lying on the horse's neck?
                                    Donald Trump - proven liar, cheat, traitor and sexual predator! Hillary Clinton won in 2016, but we have all lost.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      hmmm, have any of you seen Lillie Keenan show a horse? She actually does it very close to perfectly.
                                      "You can't really debate with someone who has a prescient invisible friend"
                                      carolprudm

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        You know why the following hand is so rarely seen? Because it takes extensive and diligent development of the horse and his jump in order to do it consistently and well. The ability to perform an automatic release well is totally dependent on the quality of contact, the horse's jumping form, and the horse maintaining the perfect balance between forward and vertical thrust over the fence, which is dictated by the height and type of fence and the objectively ideal takeoff distance. The correctly jumping horse supports his rider (softly closing the rider's angles as the energy is sent upward and forward in the perfect ratio) at all points in the jumping trajectory because his jumping effort is balanced from the physics/biomechanics perspective, and it is this support that allows the rider the freedom of the arm required to properly follow the forward/downward gesture of the horse's head and neck over the fence. It indicates maximum efficiency of the jumping effort. If this support from the horse's jump is lacking (especially in the case of imbalance of the forward vs. upward thrust ratio, with the forward thrust being greater), the rider has no choice but to seek the support he requires from the crest release. So the reason we see it so rarely in the hunters is not only because it has fallen out of "style" (and good riding should NEVER be subject to trends, IMHO) but because hunters are generally ridden to a significantly longer distance than the type/height of fence dictates, in order to give the horse more time to get his front end up and out of the way and achieve the high knees and "boxy" hunter front leg technique. Because they stand significantly farther out from the base, they are required to thrust harder than really is necessary to get from one side to the other, which results in that excessive forward thrust and corresponding crest release/open angles of the rider.

                                        What I find aggravatingly ironic is that in terms of movement, hunter folks place great value on economy, seeking that long, low-to-the-ground stride with little knee or hock action. You would think the same principle would apply to jumping, but over fences the exact opposite is desired: EXTRAVAGANCE, even at the expense of efficiency. It is totally illogical, and a source of ire and vexation for my admittedly Spock-like brain. It is also a disservice to the horse, as he is consistently required to jump harder than he needs to, resulting in greater forces on his hocks and landing gear than is necessary. Add to that the silly notion of "riding the neck down" (people, the neck isn't SUPPOSED to go down on landing, the head and neck are supposed to come UP!), which impedes the horse's ability to decelerate in the air and obtain a great measure of relief from the concussive landing forces. And add to that the rider insisting on "staying off the horse's back" by remaining forward through the landing (thereby also failing to decelerate and actually increasing the horse's already excessive burden upon landing.) VOILA! You have a recipe for abuse...albeit, ignorant abuse. It's just not fair to the horse.

                                        Seriously. Go watch videos of top modern hunters and compare to puissance horses. The hunters land harder. No wonder there's so much headshaking on the backside of fences...

                                        Sigh.....off my soapbox. Flamesuit on.

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