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jumping position?

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  • jumping position?

    I was flipping through the pages of a recent COTH edition and couldnt help but notice several ads portraying horse's over fences. Wonderful looking and talented horses (and ponies too) who's photos had been extremely distracting by the position of the rider. they were throwing himself/herself (i dont recall the gender) on the horses neck, staring straight at the ground, standing on their toes, rounded/hunched back and completely out and over the pommel of the saddle. Im sure they were very talented riders who were pro's at getting a horse around a course in the winning fashion....but that position is just god-awful and so utterly distracting.

    who on earth made it an "Ok" position to ride like that???? I couldnt help but cringe many times as i flipped the pages. It was such a distraction that i honestly wouldnt even look at the horse; id just stare at the odd and awful posture that the riders were exemplifying....and still ponder the fact that they had talent just because they could stay on the horse after exuding such a position over fences. I understand riding position isnt as important in hunters but for pete's sake, if i were judging or watching i could only imagine how ugly it would look to see a rider being that dramatic over fences, it would deteriorate the overall appearance of the horse as they went around the course.

    Im not pointing out names as frankly i dont even remember specific genders or the horse's being ridden. Im sorry for the rant; but its just something that i had to put out there for discussion as it was quite distrubing to me. any thoughts?

  • #2
    annnnnd..here we go again. *jumps off train*

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      did i miss something?

      Comment


      • #4
        My first thought is this topic has been discussed ad nauseam, beit directly or indirectly in various topics, Caylie.

        My second thought is showing at that level, the pro riders and talented juniors/amateurs may use whatever position that is effective to achieve the best jump and performance out of the horse.

        My third thought, Caylie, is that you haven't watched enough videos of the upper level hunters winning and being marketed. The photo only captures an instant--the video shows the fluidity in movement and harmony between horse and rider in action.

        That is not to say there are not distracting riders, but there are fewer than you would think.

        I suggest searching through old threads such as these to see what people have said on the matter.

        http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...#39;s+position

        http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...#39;s+position


        http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...#39;s+position
        Last edited by Pony+ an inch; Dec. 12, 2009, 01:13 PM. Reason: edited for redundancy...

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          hmmmm...i am actually watching videos right now

          Secondly, you spelt my name wrong, its Caylei.

          And lastly, i dont really agree on the point that throwing yourself on the horse's neck, standing in your stirrups, pinching with your knees, and looking straight at the ground is equitation that will get "the best jump out of the horse."

          I didnt know other threads on this topic existed, i just saw it and decided to get other people's thoughts/opinions but thanks for posting them; ill go check them out.

          Comment


          • #6
            Some of the pros started doing this to make their horses look like they were jumping extra hard and throwing them out of the tack... Because those pros were on genuinely nice horses they were sucessful in the ring and pretty soon other people started copying the pros... tada! new trend.

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              Originally posted by fourmares View Post
              Some of the pros started doing this to make their horses look like they were jumping extra hard and throwing them out of the tack... Because those pros were on genuinely nice horses they were sucessful in the ring and pretty soon other people started copying the pros... tada! new trend.
              ah ha. thats crazy and silly all at the same time when you really think about it. i grew up riding the hunter ring and i was constantly always drilled by trainers for equitation as its the base for the best performance in any ring. kind of sad to see such poor examples to the young equestrians of today

              Comment


              • #8
                [edit]

                It's called "Drama Riding" and it's frown upon by George Morris. I even asked him why some pros rode like this and he told me "Because they are lazy."
                Last edited by Moderator 1; Dec. 13, 2009, 12:34 PM. Reason: reference to deleted comments
                "Common sense is so rare nowadays, it should be classified as a super power."-Craig Bear Laubscher

                Comment


                • #9
                  It is so interesting to read through those other threads and see how many people are such strong advocates of the automatic release.

                  I just recently had the opportunity to ride in a clinic given by McLain Ward, who, as you know, has fantastic equitation and the ability to make the biggest Grand Prix courses in the world look like equitation rounds. One of the things that McLain said to us was that he was a supporter of the crest release. I don't think he meant the exaggerated one that we sometimes see, but I thought it was very interesting to hear that from someone who has gone all the way. It also was nice for those of us who have horses who really don't like an automatic release - my mare is one of those horses who really likes to be dropped right in front of the jump - to feel that a crest release was okay.

                  Anyway, carry on, I only wanted to share that particular tidbit.
                  (If anyone wants to see other things that McLain said, I have the first day of the clinic up on my YouTube account. The second day will be up in a few weeks, once I get back home for winter break).
                  http://www.youtube.com/user/supershorty628
                  Proudly blogging for The Chronicle of the Horse!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    [edit]


                    BACK TO THE ACTUAL TOPIC...

                    Caylei I agree with you wholeheartedly. I think professionals should practice proper equitation. Are there moments here and there where equitation gets sacrificed to "get the job done"? Of course. Do I sit at the ring and feel disgusted at the numbers of pros that go in the ring with roached backs, ducking off the side in the air and throwing their hips to get lead changs? Yes.

                    Am I perfect? NO! But I do practice, and I do care about my equitation, and I do strive to make it better and better no matter what I am riding.

                    I also agree with Fourmares... And I this is the exact reason why professionals need to be held accountable for their "style" of riding.
                    Last edited by Moderator 1; Dec. 13, 2009, 12:36 PM. Reason: reference to deleted commentary
                    www.millcreekfarm.net
                    **RIP Kickstart aka Char 12/2/2009**

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Where's Chanda? I certainly hope that she has something that she can cut-and-paste into this thread -- considering how often she is called upon to answer this question.
                      Last edited by ExJumper; Dec. 12, 2009, 11:51 PM.
                      Originally posted by tidy rabbit
                      Oh, well, clearly you're not thoroughly indoctrinated to COTH yet, because finger pointing and drawing conclusions are the cornerstones of this great online community.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Oh no I think we are being invaded with former horse show spy posters!!!

                        [edit]

                        I too think the equitation is not to be desired.
                        The Riders are talented, but not all to be copied.
                        Last edited by Moderator 1; Dec. 13, 2009, 12:37 PM. Reason: reference to deleted comments

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by supershorty628 View Post
                          One of the things that McLain said to us was that he was a supporter of the crest release. I don't think he meant the exaggerated one that we sometimes see ...
                          I'm sure he meant a properly executed crest release, as well as that there is more than one type of release and to use the appropriate one based on the situation. Not that one is better than another, just different and used for different reasons. GM loves the crest release as well, but hates that it became the ONLY release. Much like this widely accepted idea that flailing around like a fish out of water on your horses back over a fence somehow shows them off! I beg to differ, as I can barely watch the horse btw all the flopping the rider is doing, so distracting. Good riding is invisible!
                          www.brydellefarm.com ....developing riders, NOT passengers!
                          Member of LNHorsemanshipT & Proud of It Clique
                          "What gets me up every morning is realizing how much more there is still to learn." -GHM

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Edit: I removed this because I'm tired of people telling me that they think I'm wrong.

                            By no means am I condoning the form that is rather common in the hunter world, I was just pointing out something that I found rather interesting.
                            Last edited by supershorty628; Dec. 13, 2009, 06:13 PM.
                            http://www.youtube.com/user/supershorty628
                            Proudly blogging for The Chronicle of the Horse!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Serah View Post
                              And I this is the exact reason why professionals need to be held accountable for their "style" of riding.
                              And how exactly would it be possible to do this, since hunter classes are judged on the HORSE?

                              I see very few (if any) junior and amateur riders copying the style of riding described here, so I really don't see that it's doing the sport any harm. I agree that some of the still photos that show up in various places are shocking to look at (how do they stay on?), but I've seen those same professionals ride entire courses in person, and it doesn't distract me from appreciating how incredibly beautiful those horses look going around the ring. And I'm smart enough to know that even though they can get away with riding that way, there's no way I could ride around like that without my face hitting the dirt. So I don't do it. You probably shouldn't either. Problem solved!

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                [edit]

                                I too hate to see riders throwing themselves all over the front of the horse - it is poor lazy riding!
                                Last edited by Moderator 1; Dec. 13, 2009, 12:38 PM. Reason: reference to deleted commentary

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  I can't stand watching people who ride like Ryan Roy. Obviously she must get the job done but how the judge looks past her riding to see the horse is beyond me.

                                  She gave a clinic in my area and for atleast a year people copied her "I look like I'm going to fall off at any second god forbid if my horse trips" equitation.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    So how about I come to the board as an "oldbie" and post my opinion of the OP?

                                    Caylei seems to have an opinion about everything- from racing, to pony hunters, to equitation, to, apparently, GP jumpers, she knows her stuff. Unfortunately, not everyone has had the pleasure of interacting with her on an "everyday" basis.

                                    It would seem that Caylei's claim to fame is getting 10th in the small/medium green pony hunters at Pony Finals when she was 16/17 years old, showing against kids half her age. That information can be verified via usef.org. Also, one only need check her website, CRAPhotography...

                                    I think it's bizarre for someone with so little concrete experience to be critiquing a professional who's obviously had so much success in the ring. You wouldn't catch me dead criticizing a crest release because I use it all the time, and because I'm small potatoes compared to those who use it successfully. If I were the OP, I'd attempt (for once) to take a lesson in humility, and attempt to learn from my own shortcomings. It's a shame her last thread about her "latest auction rescue" got deleted- funny how she can turn a $1000 auction buy into a $15,000 show horse in 2 weeks time...also something that can be verified via advertisements she placed on the internet...

                                    Anyway, my full name is at the bottom of my post, so anyone that wants to call me a troll is free to track me down.
                                    Here today, gone tomorrow...

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Confusion...

                                      FrenchFry, are YOU 'iEquitate'?

                                      Either way, I don't personally care how much concrete experience the OP has. She brings up a valid point and one that has been discussed at great length on this board, more than once. I'll also say that I don't care WHY in hell you feel the need to pick on her personally and publicly, only that it comes across in a very tasteless manner.

                                      As to the original topic...

                                      I dislike the exaggerated, distracting equitation of some of the pros and IMO it detracts from the overall picture. No judge worth their salt is going to be fooled by such a thing, and kudos to the ones that can look past it and still see a nice horse and winning round.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by FrenchFrytheEqHorse View Post
                                        So how about I come to the board as an "oldbie" and post my opinion of the OP?

                                        Caylei seems to have an opinion about everything- from racing, to pony hunters, to equitation, to, apparently, GP jumpers, she knows her stuff. Unfortunately, not everyone has had the pleasure of interacting with her on an "everyday" basis.


                                        It would seem that Caylei's claim to fame is getting 10th in the small/medium green pony hunters at Pony Finals when she was 16/17 years old, showing against kids half her age. That information can be verified via usef.org. Also, one only need check her website, CRAPhotography...

                                        I think it's bizarre for someone with so little concrete experience to be critiquing a professional who's obviously had so much success in the ring. You wouldn't catch me dead criticizing a crest release because I use it all the time, and because I'm small potatoes compared to those who use it successfully. If I were the OP, I'd attempt (for once) to take a lesson in humility, and attempt to learn from my own shortcomings. It's a shame her last thread about her "latest auction rescue" got deleted- funny how she can turn a $1000 auction buy into a $15,000 show horse in 2 weeks time...also something that can be verified via advertisements she placed on the internet...

                                        Anyway, my full name is at the bottom of my post, so anyone that wants to call me a troll is free to track me down.
                                        MEOW!! That is one catty post - who cares what she has or hasn't done - she raised a very valid point. If you can't treat people with some respect it is better that you doon't post anything.

                                        Comment

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