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Disappointed in SMU

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  • Disappointed in SMU

    Fine..... deleted.
    Last edited by 2DaPoint; Aug. 4, 2009, 10:08 AM.

  • #2
    "Iwas pretty ruthless about getting to talk to somebody two years ago, and basically forced an interview upon the person who was in charge of things at that time."


    Wow. I wouldn't hire you either. This is what HR and the Athletic Department is saying about you right now: "You've got to be kidding, it's her again. She was such a know-it-all, pushy, PIA. She refused to go through our appropriate hiring channels and here she is AGAIN." Get a clue: University HR offices DO read each application that is submitted online. It can take up to six weeks for them to get back to potential candidates, and harassing the staff with countless emails and phone calls does NOT advance your cause. If they are interested, they will contact you. And they do not have the time or inclination to respond to every candidate with an evaluation of why you didn't get the job.

    If I were in charge of hiring and found out about this post, you'd be blackballed not only from the SMU program, but any other collegiate position anywhere. Grow up.
    I realize that I'm generalizing here, but as is often the case when I generalize, I don't care. ~ Dave Barry

    Comment


    • #3
      I was pretty ruthless about getting to talk to somebody two years ago, and basically forced an interview upon the person who was in charge of things at that time.


      Seems like they may have a "memory" of you in their files.
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      • #4
        Originally posted by 2DaPoint View Post
        If the position is filled, I would like to know that.

        And then I would like to know the reasons behind why I was not considered as a candidate for the position.

        And I came to COTH to say so because word most certainly gets around on here........
        What is the point of your post? To find out whether the position has been filled? To "bad mouth" SMU? To let others know that you applied and hope others can get info on why you were "not considered as a candidate" (if SMU has indeed already made a choice)?

        I have very rarely heard of anyone being given the "reasons" why that person was not considered to be a candidate for a certain position. In the real world, if you are chosen for an interview, then you will be informed whether you received the position. If there is no interview, there is rarely any communication.

        I agree with Guin. Yikes.

        Comment


        • #5
          There's that memory of the previous experience, and there's another angle to consider. It may not apply in the case of a private university, but I know the state schools are REQUIRED to post notice of open positions and actively solicit applicants. Very often they have already made their decision, and are just going through the motions in order to comply.

          Comment


          • #6
            KD,

            As a friend, you need to delete this post. It's not going to get you any answers and it doesn't reflect on you favorably. I can understand your frustration, but isn't the way.

            Besides, I thought the NCAA coaches weren't supposed to have other clients?
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            • Original Poster

              #7
              Originally posted by cyriz's mom View Post
              KD,

              Besides, I thought the NCAA coaches weren't supposed to have other clients?
              It certainly hasn't stopped other NCAA coaches in Texas who I know personally from doing just that.

              Thanks for the advice.
              KD

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #8
                Originally posted by Windswept Stable View Post
                Seems like they may have a "memory" of you in their files.
                The person with whom I spoke at that time is no longer with the college.
                And my "interview" was, unbeknownst to me, AFTER the other coach had already been hired.
                I found out about the new coach from a member of the team....

                If they have a memory of me, then they should know that I am still very serious about my interest, and that the facility owners where I am still working who have offered to host the team are equally as serious in their interest.

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Mara View Post
                  It may not apply in the case of a private university, but I know the state schools are REQUIRED to post notice of open positions and actively solicit applicants. Very often they have already made their decision, and are just going through the motions in order to comply.
                  Yes, I was told that they are REQUIRED to post the position on their website, and that all applicants must apply on line.
                  I did that.
                  I watched that website like a hawk for weeks after they told me they would be posting it.

                  You know, I haven't actually checked to see if the posting now says "Filled".

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Mara View Post
                    There's that memory of the previous experience, and there's another angle to consider. It may not apply in the case of a private university, but I know the state schools are REQUIRED to post notice of open positions and actively solicit applicants. Very often they have already made their decision, and are just going through the motions in order to comply.
                    Yes, often this is the case, and I would suspect that it applies here. Often the decisions are already made when the job is posted. We have have "emergency" positions, however, where that posting requirement can be waived. It applies if the job becomes vacant too close to the beginning of the semester and must be filled before the semester begins. In that case, the administration can waive the formal search process and just go ahead and hire someone.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Guin View Post
                      She refused to go through our appropriate hiring channels and here she is AGAIN." University HR offices DO read each application that is submitted online. It can take up to six weeks for them to get back to potential candidates, and harassing the staff with countless emails and phone calls does NOT advance your cause. If they are interested, they will contact you. And they do not have the time or inclination to respond to every candidate with an evaluation of why you didn't get the job.
                      I did go through the appropriate hiring channels.
                      On the advice of several very savvy business people, I followed up my application, resume, and cover letter with conservative phone calls and conscientious emails.
                      Since I had already had some casual communications with the woman with whom I "interviewed", I chose to press that suit.

                      I didn't get that excited this time. Just the on-line application, and a few brief follow up emails.
                      It's been well over six weeks.

                      My point is that even big corporations have the very standard, "Thank you, but, NO." form letters that they send out to the rejects.
                      Even a reject letter would be appropriate at this point.
                      Then I CAN stop making an a$$ of myself with my continued efforts.

                      Fine, blackball me, but TELL ME SO.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        As someone seeking a job in the "real world" of business, I have received a communication of some sort for each position that I have interviewed for or applied for. I would think SMU could extend a similar interest.

                        Sometimes the more hungry you are for it, and the harder you push, the further it pushes you away from what you want.

                        I'm a big believer in everything happening for a reason. While it sometimes sucks for us that we don't get what we want, in the grander scheme of things we can sometimes see the benefit of NOT getting what we originally wanted.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by 2DaPoint View Post
                          My point is that even big corporations have the very standard, "Thank you, but, NO." form letters that they send out to the rejects.
                          Even a reject letter would be appropriate at this point.
                          Did you have a formal interview? If not, then a rejection letter is not considered "very standard."

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            Originally posted by elctrnc View Post
                            What is the point of your post?
                            To find out whether the position has been filled?
                            To "bad mouth" SMU?
                            To let others know that you applied?
                            Question number 1: Maybe.... Sure..... Yes!
                            Question number 2: Not the entire college, no, just their particular hiring protocol.
                            Question number 3: Well, sure, there's that.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Oh, and FYI, I work for a university, but not this university, and am familiar with their hiring practices. You rarely hear anything if you're not short-listed for an interview. Not particularly courteous, but in this job market, unfortunately all too common.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by 2DaPoint View Post
                                This is the most publicly on-purpose thing I have ever posted on here.

                                Oh, I have said plenty of accidentally public things on here, but this time I'm being quite purposeful in my statements.

                                SMU is looking for a Coach for their Equestrian Team. Again.

                                I have applied for the position. Again.

                                I really reallly want the job. Again.

                                I applied two years ago, too, when they were looking for their first "real" NCAA Coach.

                                I have Collegiate riding AND Coaching AND Administrative experience to add to my "normal" skills and experience as an Instructor and Trainer in Hunter/Jumper and Dressage.

                                I was pretty ruthless about getting to talk to somebody two years ago, and basically forced an interview upon the person who was in charge of things at that time.

                                Because, let me tell you, their Public Relations department, or Human Resources department, (or whomever) was, and continues to be, positively inaccessible and evasive.

                                This time around, I have done all that was officially asked of me in terms of applying on line, etc., have followed up with emails to both the Director of the Athletic Department and his second-in-command, but have otherwise chosen a more demure tactic.

                                Return emails from those gentlemen, one of which was an automated out-of-office reply, said they should be well under way with the hiring process by mid-July.

                                Consequent attemtps to remind them of my interest, and to offer further information on my credentials, have met with complete silence.

                                Even if I am the poorest choice on the planet for the position, (which I can assure you I am not), shouldn't SOMEBODY have returned my attempts at communcation by now?

                                I guess I am just shocked that an acedemic and athletic power-house like Southern Methodist University would have such an inadequate correspondence protocol.

                                Especially since they are looking to hire someone that is a bit out of the ordinary when it comes to experiences and skill sets within the Collegiate Athletic world.

                                Like I said, I'm very disappointed because I really want the opportunity to present my case to the Athletic Department in person.

                                If the position is filled, I would like to know that.
                                And then I would like to know the reasons behind why I was not considered as a candidate for the position.

                                And I came to COTH to say so because word most certainly gets around on here........
                                Wow.

                                I can totally understand being disappointed about not getting a job you thought you were well qualified for... but whatever your riding/training skills are, to be honest I think they've very likely been overshadowed by a fairly incredible lack of tact and appropriateness.

                                By your own admission, you circumvented their published application process and behaved "ruthlessly" to force an interview with the decision maker at the college when the job first became available. Unsurprisingly, it did not work - people don't want to work with someone who behaves that way, particularly in academia - and now you are being publicly critical of their lack of personal response and failure to adhere to what you consider the appropriate correspondence protocol. I think what you've done here is actually the opposite of what you intended - you've made it clear that SMU made a reasonable decision in passing you over.

                                In addition to teaching and training, remember that a coach is a representative or ambassador of the school they serve. To function successfully in such a position, you would need to demonstrate a great deal of professionalism and maturity that would model appropriate behavior to students (not to mention potential sponsors, donors etc.) You've done pretty much the opposite.

                                Plenty of us have had the experience of putting forth a lot of effort to apply somewhere without getting much in the way of an acknowledgement ... that is just an unfortunate reality of the hiring process. Many, many places - particularly those that offer positions that have a lot of prestige attached to them - simply receive too many applications to be able to respond personally to each one of them. Doesn't mean that it isn't a bummer to the applicants, but it's a business reality. Unless you are one of the final candidates competing for a position, hiring firms do not usually give you a critique on why you did not get the job...and sometimes even the unsuccessful finalist doesn't get that feedback either. Hiring firms aren't career counselors. Don't take it personally, and try not to advertise spite.

                                Saying something like, "I am really disappointed I didn't get an interview for this job. I really felt my 20 years of experience producing winning junior riders that went on to be happy, well adjusted adults would have served the program well, and supporting such a great university program would have been a dream come true..." might have made someone take a second look.

                                Berating the hiring managers in public for not bowing to your demands ... not so much.
                                **********
                                We move pretty fast for some rabid garden snails.
                                -PaulaEdwina

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  I was pretty ruthless about getting to talk to somebody two years ago, and basically forced an interview upon the person who was in charge of things at that time.
                                  Even a reject letter would be appropriate at this point.
                                  Then I CAN stop making an a$$ of myself with my continued efforts.
                                  You do know that a lot of places don't send rejection letters, right? Some just don't have the staff or time to bother. Sure, that's unfortunate, but it's the way it is. I don't think I've ever gotten a rejection letter from a job that I formally interviewed for.

                                  You'd probably do better to stop "making an a$$" of yourself by badmouthing prospective employers on a website that you know darn well will be read by tons of people. It looks crazy and makes you look look a bad risk to hire, even for other employers. The horse community is small.
                                  ---
                                  They're small hearts.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Looks like they announced this just yesterday.

                                    http://smumustangs.cstv.com/sports/w...d_haley00.html

                                    I can sympathize because I was in a similar situation with my dance and was strung along by the head dancer for months. In frustration I vented on a public forum that touched off a series of some not-too-nice e-mails. She was (and still is) a close personal friend and our relationship recovered. It wasn't her choice, it was the management's choice. She was mearly the messenger.

                                    I've auditioned several times since only to be turned away on a lame excuse. I can completely relate to being "black-balled" as I'm sure my past experience keeps me away and now that I see how they have treated their dancers, I'm happy that dust has formed on my costumes!

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by 2DaPoint View Post
                                      Yes, I was told that they are REQUIRED to post the position on their website, and that all applicants must apply on line.
                                      I did that.
                                      I watched that website like a hawk for weeks after they told me they would be posting it.

                                      You know, I haven't actually checked to see if the posting now says "Filled".
                                      looks like someone should have done her homework before they went ballistic on a forum in the wee hours of the morning.

                                      i was almost disappointed that you deleted what promised to be a tirade. glad someone copied it so i could enjoy.

                                      yes, COTH is a small world, and if you have any sense you should beg "lucasb" to delete that post. your diatribe certainly might follow you as you attempt to move up the ladder.

                                      Comment

                                      • Original Poster

                                        #20
                                        and there you have it

                                        Originally posted by zahena View Post
                                        Looks like they announced this just yesterday.

                                        http://smumustangs.cstv.com/sports/w...d_haley00.html
                                        Thanks for all the educational replies.

                                        Comment

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