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Hunters- Its not just a "step up" to the Jumper ring!

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  • Hunters- Its not just a "step up" to the Jumper ring!

    I'm sorry, If I hear this comment one more time my head may infact implode (I'd say explode, but that might mess up my coif )

    Every show I go to, the barn manager and trainer both imply that my choices (the AA Hunters and Equitation) are "Not Good Enough" and that I SHOULD be doing the Jumpers. (The Beastie IS an Eq type...but hey, we're winning the Zone in the AA Hunters....so...)

    I AM SICK OF THIS! These kids at my barn (and their respective stage-mothers) think that you only stay in Hunters until you are good enough for jumpers! Its terrible! Why can't they see and appreciate a lovely hunter for what it is? UGH!

    Can I blame a lack of horses on this? For example...our zone is small. We have 5-10 horses in most divisions. When one puts 8 fences together in reasonable order, one wins. Then, its time for jumpers, where tiny children race around, burying their ponies underneath giant oxers and being rewarded by not only the occasional death defying ribbon but ALSO by their trainers? What gives?

    I'm sorry, but the ability to ride a line and get the perfect spot is just as important as the ability to scream around courses and have entirely too many Hallelujah moments...

    (This isn't jumper hate...just a rant. I did the AA Jumpers. I gave up jumper land until I have something to ride around at LEAST the L4's. No point in doing it lower than that in my area)

  • #2
    **SNL is not available for comment - but please feel free to leave a message after the beep. Have a nice day.**
    Last edited by SaturdayNightLive; Aug. 17, 2006, 03:41 AM.
    "Are you yawning? You don't ride well enough to yawn. I can yawn, because I ride better than you. Meredith Michael Beerbaum can yawn. But you? Not so much..."
    -George Morris

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    • #3
      Originally posted by SaturdayNightLive
      **SNL is not available for comment - but please feel free to leave a message after the beep. Have a nice day.**
      I don't get it???

      Comment


      • #4
        I know what you are saying Pirateer.
        Sometimes I think that some trainers stick horse's and client's in the lower level Jumpers as a "cop-out".
        I don't mean all horse's are meant to be Hunter's, nor do I want to cause any flaming or fighting. I am a dyed in the wool Hunter fan. I could watch Hunter rounds all day long.
        http://community.webshots.com/user/cotswoldjr
        http://temp.hillcresttrainingnet.off...m/default.aspx
        [url]
        Starman Babies

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        • #5
          Everybody is an expert after 2 weeks of horse ownership-goes with the territory.

          They obviously know best based on their vast experience

          Perhaps you could point out just how small your particular pond is or that what is true there does not reflect the state of AA show talent in a more competitive area as far as who does what class....or not. It won't make a dent in their notion of how things work in H/J land.

          Just rise above that kind of "advice" and do what you want with your horse.

          Strikes me that those I hear that "step up" comment from moved to the Jumpers because they couldn't win in the Hunters anyway...not your fault you have a fancy horse that can and does find the eight and they don't
          When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

          The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

          Comment


          • #6
            So what about if you have one who jumps a 10 but moves a 5? I can find 8 all day long, but I get NADA in the hack...so I am contemplating the jumpers...the canter is rhythmic and nice, but the trot is average on a good day...the uber-fancy ones spank me every time...

            Best I ever did in a hack was 2nd, but the judge placed MUCH more emphasis on the canter, and going to the right we didn't even trot...

            So I would not be "copping out" of the hunters, right?

            PS...my two year old is going to (hopefully) be my 3'6" horse...but he moves pretty yummy!!!!
            My boys...
            http://community.webshots.com/user/FirstStepBack
            RIP Gem...for you are the greatest...thank you for the inspiration...I will always remember you!
            Gem Twist (1979-2006)

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Not So Practical Horse(WO)man
              I don't get it???
              They know each other, it's a joke.

              Rebecca, as a hunter princess I fully understand what you're talking about.

              A lot of people in the lower level jumpers are there because their horse can't do the hunters (or they can't do the equ) - the lower level jumpers tend to be a "catch all" - you get people who are legitmate jumper riders training young horses, then you get horses that can jump but aren't pretty and don't pin anywhere else so they fly around the course and hope they don't pull rails.

              I'm a hunter fan - I think at the lower levels a good hunter round can be much harder to put together then a good jumper round - anyone can run at the fences, getting your stride/spots/making it look pretty is much harder!
              Sarah ( & Regal)

              what doesn't kill you makes you stronger -
              unless it breaks your heart first

              Comment


              • #8
                O good, so I'm not the only one that gets it!

                It's become the new cool thing in my area to "graduate" to the jumpers. It really is a different discipline than the hunters, in my opinion anyway. I have done both, and they are really different. For a hunter rider to go in the jumper ring, yes it's difficult, because it's a different ride, a different feel, and different objective...but it's just as difficult for someone that does the jumpers all the time to try and get a nice round in the hunter ring.

                There is a lot to be said about a rider that can consistently get a perfect round in the hunters. Just because the hunters moves slower, does not mean it's less complicated.

                I remember when I first started the jumpers. Everyone at the barn was saying "o wow, the jumpers? That's such a big step, that is fantastic!" and after the first show "you won your division? O wow, that is incredible!"

                I only did the jumpers instead of the hunters like I had been doing because my OTTB was crazy and green and it was pointless to take her into a hunter ring. She had been in training for a year and needed some show experience, and loooved to jump, so we did the 2'6" jumpers for a year...then we started training to do the junior hunters which I think is far more competitive.

                Now a bunch of the "kids" from the barn are venturing into the jumpers...and they even talk about it as graduating...when in reality, I think most of it is that they just don't have the patience or will to put in the effort required to be really successful in the hunters. And what is scary is that a lot of them don't understand that there is a lot more to the jumpers than running around a course...it takes a lot of work to get your horse to the point that they are so super responsive to your aids and balanced that you can be safe.

                and all this time, I thought I was the only one rolling my eyes...
                Strong promoter of READING the entire post before responding.

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                • #9
                  Oh...what is it they say to compliment a really, really great Jumper round at the top levels-like Grand Prix??

                  Oh yeah, I remember.
                  "He made it look like a HUNTER round"

                  I rest my case.
                  When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                  The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by findeight
                    Oh...what is it they say to compliment a really, really great Jumper round at the top levels-like Grand Prix??

                    Oh yeah, I remember.
                    "He made it look like a HUNTER round"

                    I rest my case.
                    SA-WEET!!!!

                    Love that...and SO TRUE!!!! Can't COUNT how many times I've heard that!
                    My boys...
                    http://community.webshots.com/user/FirstStepBack
                    RIP Gem...for you are the greatest...thank you for the inspiration...I will always remember you!
                    Gem Twist (1979-2006)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I totaly understand! I've ridden jumpers a little bit and honestly, I just like doing the hunters better. I like the precision of it all and the beauty of it (it's like dancing to me). Hunters aren't for everybody and neither are jumpers.

                      Just because I choose not to ride the jumpers doesn't make me a lesser rider, I just don't have any desire to "move up" to the jumpers. I spent the better part of my junior years as one of two hunter kids at a jumper barn (and I was the ONLY pony hunter). I always got asked that when I aged out of the ponies if I was going to get a jumper....um, nope, I prefer to stick in hunter land.

                      I did some minor jumper dabbling on both my pony and my trainer's horse in the Childrens' Jumpers and I just didn't like it. I found it overwhelming. It's just not my cup of tea and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. When I can aford a horse of my own again, I want another hunter. That's where my heart is and that's where it always will be.

                      Of course, now I ride a pony for a dyed in the wool dressage rider who thinks that hunters are one of the most lowly forms of riding ever. Somehow me riding in the jumpers a few times came up in coversation and that suddenly legitimized me as a rider to her (because seeing how I handle her greenbean runaway pony wasn't proof enough). Instead of just being a hunter rider (said as a total insult), now when she introduces me to people she always tacks on that I did the pony jumpers as if that balances out the fact that I spend most of my time in hunterland (now mind you, this is not entirely correct...I aged out before Pony Jumpers truly existed but I did my pony in some 2'6" puddle jumpers a few times...I just don't have the heart to keep correcting her).

                      So that was rambly, but no you're not alone on this at all!

                      ETA:
                      Oh...what is it they say to compliment a really, really great Jumper round at the top levels-like Grand Prix??

                      Oh yeah, I remember.
                      "He made it look like a HUNTER round"

                      I rest my case.
                      OOH, good point Findeight! You never hear someone compliment a good hunter round by saying "He made it look like a JUMPER round" now do you?!? That'd pretty much be an insult!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        For many trainers, it is more of a challenge to successfully prepare a hunter to go to the ring than a jumper. (Obviously this is not a slam on the jumpers; I recognize that *properly* preparing a jumper is also an art.)

                        At the lower levels especially, taking horses to the jumper ring, where they can be a bit inaccurate, get away with big adjustments or flying around on a wing and a prayer - AND - possibly still get rewarded for a "bad" ride that happens to leave the jumps up... it adds up to an easier, "more rewarding" effort than trying to take one to the hunters where the ride needs to be smoother, and the horse needs to have more innate fanciness to get those ribbons.

                        I am also a HP living in a jumper-oriented barn. My trainer periodically makes comments about how easy it would be for me to show my horse in the jumper ring with the other clients. He would definitely prefer it - mostly because it would be easier to get ME to that ring!! And my horse has plenty of scope to do it, having done the 1.3m classes in Europe as a young horse. HOWEVER, I much prefer the hunters and wouldn't want to waste my horse's pretty, slow-off-the-ground hunter jump, or have to chase him around the jumper ring for time. I looooooove his comfy loping canter and have no desire (nor big enough spurs, LOL) to get him into the bigger gear that would be required for a fault free jumper round.

                        Not to mention I like all the dressing up

                        It's your horse. Do what you want.
                        **********
                        We move pretty fast for some rabid garden snails.
                        -PaulaEdwina

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Worth repeating.....

                          Originally posted by findeight
                          Oh...what is it they say to compliment a really, really great Jumper round at the top levels-like Grand Prix??

                          Oh yeah, I remember.
                          "He made it look like a HUNTER round"

                          I rest my case.

                          She said it all.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I am another AA rider...

                            who *sometimes* gets encouraged to try the jumpers. But I love the hunters and learn so much every single time I show. I want to learn to be competitive in the adult eq. ring too.

                            I just don't have the mind set for the jumpers-I get frazzled just looking at the jumper jumps at our local C shows and would feel "claustrophobic" in the ring! And my horse would be so up in the presence of all those jumps it just wouldn't be fun. I love seeing him braided, I love my clothes, I love trying to find eight, and while I appreciate the beauty of watching my trainer riding in the jumpers, I know I love watching her because she rides so softly and effectively and makes it look huntery.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I agree that people use the low level jumpers as a "cop out". It has become an end to itself instead of a stepping/learning division. It's a place to put horses that are untalented or too hot or for whatever reason they fail as hunters. It's also a place for riders who don't have to be accurate or good in the tack or heck...do more than steer to whatever jump the trainer is screaming out next unlike the hunter or equitation rings where that just doesn't fly. And to make matters worse--those types of rides (crowd gasping, arms waving, yanking, kicking, ya-hooing, trainer yelling) are generally rewarded with a top ribbon if horse/rider make it to the end defying death yet again. Thus encouraging that lovely riding style cause "that's what wins" & to many people all that is important is the mighty blue ribbon. Which for what horse showing costs nowadays I can see why people want to be rewarded for what they are spending.

                              Something you'll notice though is those riders rarely ever move up to the next division (from 3' to 3'6" for example) or if they do, they no longer are as successful (unless they change their riding style, but some do) which most then tend to quit altogether as it's frustrating to go from being the big winner to never getting in the jump-off or even making it around the 1st course.

                              eta: this is not insulting anybody that chooses to stay in lower level divisions (whether it be hunter or jumper). I totally understand if somebody wants to to or has no desire to move up. This is about the riders that are in those divisions because they are flat out scary & their trainer rather than teaching them better or insisiting they need to improve just finds a low division to stick them in so they can horse show too.
                              "I'm not crazy...my mother had me tested"

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Many years ago, I showed in both AA and AO hunters (depended on how accurately I could get myself to ride), and occasionally played in the jumpers to keep my horse's mind fresh.

                                At one show, I was in a low, schooling-type jumper class, maybe 3' to 3'3'". I muddle around and did OK, and watched bunches of kids and AAs go screaming around, pulling rails, yanking horses mouths. And then Kevin Babington came in on a young horse - this was back before he was well known or had moved up to international stuff. He put in a beautiful, smooth, lovely round, using his turns brilliantly to save time without ever rushing his horse. Needless to say, he beat everyone by several seconds, and showed that if you're going to do jumpers, do it by riding correctly.

                                And I've realized since then that I do belong in the hunter ring - the challenge of finding eight fences smoothly is plenty hard, and plenty fun too!
                                "She still had all of her marbles, though every one of them was shaped funny and rolled asymmetrically."

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                                • #17
                                  I have heard that before too. I am an absolute hunter princess and would never switch to jumpers. I am a very timid rider and going a nice slower pace is fine with me. I am also a perfectionist and since in hunters you are supposed to make your round as perfect as you can, I love it. I give a lot of credit to jumpers because there courses look very difficult and they go so fast. I would seriously die if I had to go that fast. Lol so I am and always will be a hunter princess!

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    I love the hunter ring never want to do the jumpers even if my horse isn't perfect. My trainers is always telling me I would do well in the jumpers but I am not interested. I finally got a nice hunter prosect and am anxious to do the baby greens next season. I did not get to do any showing this year because horse was injured although thankfully he is OK now. I can hardly wait for sext spring, way to far away!

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      It takes A LOT less time to prepare a rider to be competitive in the weenie jumpers than in the 3' hunters. In the world of immediate gratification, little work with big rewards, and ribbons handed on a silver platter, of course more people are pointed in the direction of the low-level jumpers!

                                      That being said - I just myself a jumper and I can't to get in the show ring. However, I will gladly get my arse whooped by a neophyte in the mini jumpers while I conservatively and accurately (hopefully) find the jumps like the hunter rider I am. I don;t know if I'll ever have the balls to go fast, but I figure that as the jumps get bigger, if I can still ride a clean round, I'll get a chunk of the prize money.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by AC & Ty
                                        So what about if you have one who jumps a 10 but moves a 5? I can find 8 all day long, but I get NADA in the hack...so I am contemplating the jumpers...the canter is rhythmic and nice, but the trot is average on a good day...the uber-fancy ones spank me every time...

                                        Best I ever did in a hack was 2nd, but the judge placed MUCH more emphasis on the canter, and going to the right we didn't even trot...

                                        So I would not be "copping out" of the hunters, right?

                                        PS...my two year old is going to (hopefully) be my 3'6" horse...but he moves pretty yummy!!!!
                                        Knew a horse exactly as you describe that was purchased for about 300k and had NOOOOOOOO trouble being champion at his shows. And, this is in the VERY competitive So Cal area...

                                        There are usually at least 3 over fences classes and 1 US... Do the math. Champions aren't made in the hack.

                                        AND, I find it REALLY interesting that shortly after the HUGE uproar over a thread that "bashed" hunters, now we have a thread bashing jumpers???

                                        I'm sorry, but the jumper ring is NOT made up of failed hunters. Bad riding exists everywhere...

                                        If Hunters really floats your boat...? GREAT!!!! Communicate that to your trainers and be confident in your choices. Don't resort to this...

                                        JMO,
                                        Seb
                                        Aca-Believe it!!

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