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pony is 2 coming 3 not 4 coming 5 like we thought

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  • #41
    I think a lot of pony people will start a two year old under saddle lightly for the summer and then turnout until the following spring

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    • #42
      FWIW, like BeastieSlave, when I had my OTTB seen by the vet at 4 coming 5 to see if she needed her teeth done, he looked and said that she was not ready for dental work yet and that her teeth were not mature enough. When I told him that she was about to turn 5 he said, "It doesn't look that way from her teeth." My farrier also commented that she had baby-like feet that did not match her age.

      So, in my case I had hard evidence of her age; however, had I asked the opinion of my vet and farrier, they would have guessed that she was at least a year younger. I did keep her work load lighter than I would have for another horse of the same age but greater maturity.
      Last edited by ZIL; Jun. 28, 2009, 12:40 AM.

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      • #43
        Originally posted by hellerkm View Post
        we do use polos and bell boots on every ride, she is throughbred/morgan cross she looks mature to us, she is filling out nicely. She is not higher in the front or the back, and is starting to bulk up and build muscle.
        Since she is not a "true" pony breed I fear she may get taller than 14.2
        Based from experience we had several "ponies" at our barn have growth spurts around 4-6 years of age (paint,throughbred, crosses etc) and we have three honies around our barn who need to jump the horse height in a few years... oh boy

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        • #44
          I had a similar thing happen as in ZIL's post.

          I bought a 2yo TB gelding. No question that he was two (have his papers, pictures throughout his life, etc.). I had a new equine dentist work on him when he was 4 coming 5 and she said that looking at his teeth she would swear that he was 2 MAYBE 3. His feet also looked extremely babyish (meaning he had those little baby legs and baby feet).

          Doesn't really matter in the long run. My guy is an exceedingly slow-to-mature horse which means that I'm treating him like a 2 or 3 year old even though he's 5 (I figure his musculoskeletal system is as immature as his feet and teeth). But worth pointing out that the owner may not have been wrong.

          And 2 years is a LONG way to be off on a youngster. I could see if your pony was 3 coming 4 (i.e. 1 year off), but how does someone double the horse's estimated age?
          __________________________________
          Flying F Sport Horses
          Horses in the NW

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          • #45
            Well I'm at a loss to understand how anyone can blindly and in total ignorance buy a young pony and not know whether it's 2 or 4. But hey ho it doesn't surprise me and it's not the first time I've come across it. What gobsmacks me though is you mention having broodmareS (plural!)!!! Yet you don't know how to age a young equine by dentition!??!

            Originally posted by hellerkm View Post
            I recently bought my daughter a Large pony, I was told she was 4 coming 5. Fine I can work with that, well we had her feet done the other day ( first time since she has been home) and our vet happened to be there at the same time( checking our broodmares) the farrier asked the vet how old he thought pony was ( he felt her feet were "immature" ) vet says 2 coming 3 , farrier agrees!
            It might have been better just to have a look in her mouth and check her dentition! But hey ho there's no accounting for lack of knowledge!!!

            Now i have a 3 yr old, we will STOP jumping fences, until next summer.
            We are having issues with forward, she likes to REALLY suck back under the kid and then bucks when we push her forward, is this her age or just her personality?
            Or it might be poor riding commands or the fact she's only just been sat on and doesn't know what to do yet. Who knows but it doesn't matter because you just need to let her grow up and start again.

            she is the SWEETEST thing soooooooo sannnnne on the ground and has totally attached herself to my daughter ( comes when called , follows her all over the farm) am I pushing too hard?
            Yes

            should we back off?
            Yes

            I do NOT want to ruin this gorgeous pony, she is a 10+ mover and very tight over fences. we are currently riding 5-6 days a week , is that too much???
            Yes. And you shouldn't be jumping at all. And if it's true she's 2 then no way on this earth do I personally believe she's moving as if she's 10. NO WAY. But then I'm thinking if you don't know basics like how to age a really young horse by it's dentition that you probably wouldn't know that either.
            Last edited by Thomas_1; Jun. 29, 2009, 03:40 AM.

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            • #46
              And if it's true she's 2 then no way on this earth do I personally believe she's moving as if she's 10. NO WAY. But then I'm thinking if you don't know how to age her that you probably wouldn't know.
              I took that phrase to mean she moves as a 10 on a scale of 1-10. It's a common phrase. Doesn't mean she thinks it moves as if it was 10 years old.

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              • #47
                Originally posted by Minuet View Post
                I took that phrase to mean she moves as a 10 on a scale of 1-10. It's a common phrase. Doesn't mean she thinks it moves as if it was 10 years old.
                What Minuet said, it just means she's a good mover, it's an expression here. It sounds like the whole thing was a very laid-back transaction, which doesn't indicate lack of knowledge.
                Somewhere in the world, Jason Miraz is Goodling himself and wondering why "the chronicle of the horse" is a top hit. CaitlinAndTheBay

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                • #48
                  Gosh Thomas1. I usually enjoy reading your posts, but found that last one to be unnecessarily harsh and certainly not helpful to the OP.
                  Quicksilver Farms, LLC
                  "Welsh Hunter Ponies"
                  Welsh Sec. B Stallions and
                  Fancy Show Pony Prospects
                  www.quicksilverponies.com

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                  • #49
                    Personally, I thought Tom right on! How does anyone buy any young horse and not have at least a prelim vet check, which would include mouth, feet, etcetera (doesn't need to be xrays etcetera) - or, if the purchase is done on faith, then where is the sense of anger by the OP that she (he?) was sold a pony that was a full year to two years younger than what promoted and sold?

                    But if the only question asked by OP, ignoring the basic pre-purchase miss or mis-representation of said pony, concerns riding a two year old 5-6 days a week? Then my comment is that it seems/is excessive. Pony or not. Turn the pony out till he/she is three, and start up again.
                    "Her life was okay. Sometimes she wished she were sleeping with the right man instead of with her dog, but she never felt she was sleeping with the wrong dog."



                    www.dontlookbackfarm.com

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                    • #50
                      Originally posted by quicksilverponies View Post
                      Gosh Thomas1. I usually enjoy reading your posts, but found that last one to be unnecessarily harsh and certainly not helpful to the OP.
                      I can't begin to understand why.

                      Buying a pony for a child is (or should be) a pretty big purchase in terms of ensuring you make the right choice.

                      In my opinion children are way too valuable to risk sticking on any old (whoops sorry, I meant young!) thing.

                      Ponies and horses also happen to be pretty important to me too. In my mind/world, they're not to be wasted. I find it deplorable!

                      I wouldn't personally buy any animal without doing a tremendous amount of research and if I didn't know what I was buying, then for sure I'd take someone who did know with me.

                      I remember this poster writing some time ago and expressing her ambition for her daughter and emphasising her disappointment that folks don't bring their own young stock on any more. At the time I thought "how the heck can a little kid produce a pony" and that's why I remembered. She's said here she has brood mares too.

                      I seriously think it's a real shame that someone who is breeding stock doesn't actually know how to go about buying a pony and doesn't know how to open their mouth and see how old they are. What the heck do folks do that buy foals from her. They sure as heck can't be getting much expert help from the breeder.

                      I'm also at a total loss to begin to understand how she thinks her little child can bring the pony on when the adult that's supposed to be responsible for her doesn't even know what she's bought.

                      So she finds out she has a pony that isn't 3 yet and is asking whether she should keep jumping it and if she does will she damage it.

                      Well heck there's not much to say in reply to those questions. If giving the right answer sounds harsh, then perhaps you should consider the circumstances and the questions asked.

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        Agreed. Thanks for your explanation.
                        Quicksilver Farms, LLC
                        "Welsh Hunter Ponies"
                        Welsh Sec. B Stallions and
                        Fancy Show Pony Prospects
                        www.quicksilverponies.com

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          Originally posted by hellerkm View Post
                          Well she will be three in July, ( if the vet and farrier are correct , really who knows at this point??) so I think we will keep riding her, but not on a daily basis.
                          Am I reading this right?? Your vet and farrier were both able to determine not only her age but her birth month based on her teeth alone???
                          Auventera Two:Some women would eat their own offspring if they had some dipping sauce.
                          Serious Leigh: it sounds like her drama llama should be an old schoolmaster by now.

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                          • #53
                            Originally posted by RockinHorse View Post
                            Am I reading this right?? Your vet and farrier were both able to determine not only her age but her birth month based on her teeth alone???
                            mmmmmm...... Well in fact according to the first posting it was by her feet not her teef

                            the farrier asked the vet how old he thought pony was ( he felt her feet were "immature" ) vet says 2 coming 3 , farrier agrees!

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #54
                              Well, since I started out asking for HELP, I will end with this. I have admitted that I did NOT do a prelim vet exam. I purchased this pony through a friend, we liked her attitude and the way she moves and were well aware of the fact that she was very green. Papers say 4 with her birth DATE Set in July,( realize this makes her adjusted birth date on Jan 1) farrier and VET happened to be at the farm on the same day ( for different reasons) when farrier looked at her FEET he thought she was younger, vet then looked at her teeth and said 2 coming three.
                              My questions addressed the fact that she has a tendency to "suck back" at times, and I was wondering if it could be because of her age and the amount of work we were doing. the general consensus seems to be that her age could be playing a part in that. And that riding 5-6 days a week is too much. I agree and we are changing the plan.
                              To be totally honest we have two babies on our farm right now and I have NO idea how many teeth they have in their mouths! I don't look, unless they are not eating or have some other issue that might involve their mouth I am not in the habit of checking their teeth. Ignorant you say, I don't think so.
                              I have no ill feelings toward the seller, if I choose NOT to do the prelim vet exam than pony's age is my issue not hers she has papers stating ponys age and birthday. That is what she went by. She regularly buys pony's and turns them around quickly I think she only had her a month if not a bit less.
                              I was NOT upset or worried about how old the pony is NOW , I simply wanted to know if the issues we were having could be DUE to her age and how to go about making another plan for her. MAny of you have addressed that fact and I appreciated the help. Like I stated in another post we send our babies off at 2-3 to be broken they stay most of the summer and then come home in the fall, we don't do much with them over the winter because we don't have an indoor ring and it gets cold and the footing can get hard. So when we start them back in the spring they are older and we put them to work 5 days out of the week.
                              I hope this explains my "ignorance", to those who helped thanks very much, to those who posted to call me stupid, you have renewed my thoughts that the horse world is pretty much full of a lot of NOT so nice people.

                              And my daughter is 12 turning 13 , not a little child IMO, I have little children who are 2 and 5 and guess what I have NO idea how many teeth they have at this moment either should I count them???

                              And if you read my posts I have said that my Parents own our farm and breed hunters, I ride, help out, feed, clean stalls, ect my mother is the breeding expert, I bet she does know how many teeth our babies have at this point. I use WE in statements because it is a FAMILY operation, we all do our part, my sons work there everyday but they dont' know how many teeth the babies have either, my dad is there for EVERY birth bet he could not tell you either, does that make him ignorant? no, it does not. we all have our parts to play, I teach the younger kids and ride the 3 and 4 yr olds after they are broke, when I have time , right now I am busy helping my daughters and nieces so I don't have much time to ride. I think that people who judge others tend to be a bit harsh, my questions came from the perspective that we have already started doing all of these things and I felt we might need to back off and wanted others opinions.
                              I do know this I will never ask another question. I will sit around and read but this will be my last post.
                              Kim
                              If you are lucky enough to ride, you are lucky enough.

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                Originally posted by hellerkm View Post
                                To be totally honest we have two babies on our farm right now and I have NO idea how many teeth they have in their mouths! I don't look, unless they are not eating or have some other issue that might involve their mouth I am not in the habit of checking their teeth. Ignorant you say, I don't think so.
                                I'd love to know how you check what to bit with and whether a bit is in the correct position or a young pony ready to bit at all or to ride. Second thoughts, I'm thinking you don't if perhaps you never even take a look inside a mouth.

                                I hope this explains my "ignorance",
                                Yes you explained it beautifully .

                                And my daughter is 12 turning 13 , not a little child
                                yeh right. Nearly a teenager. We all know what a pain they can be. So of course it doesn't matter what sort of pony you buy her! Though in fact I recall when you told us you bought her that she was a little small for that child and so was going to your 5 year old.
                                Last edited by Thomas_1; Jun. 29, 2009, 03:42 AM.

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  Originally posted by quicksilverponies View Post
                                  Gosh Thomas1. I usually enjoy reading your posts, but found that last one to be unnecessarily harsh and certainly not helpful to the OP.
                                  I have to agree. Thomas, what bee bit you this morning? As someone who purchases A LOT of ponies on a regular basis to do resales on, I honestly have to say I have NEVER checked any of their teeth before purchasing!! Gasp! Sorry, it was just never high priority on my list...conformation, temperament, movement, jumping style and the cute factor were! Many of the ponies we purchase are grade ponies, the rest papered Welsh Ponies. I've never had a pre-purchase exam done on them. Often, I'll do my own quick little exam and sometimes a few flexations. But if I'm buying a pony for $1,500 or under to do a resale and they are moving sound and haven't been started under saddle, etc., I don't waste any more of my profit by doing an unnecessary pre-purchase exam. But, I've also been in the industry for 20+ years and know when I need to walk away from a purchase.

                                  That being said, as soon as we get them home, I always run them into the vet to get their teeth floated and wolf teeth pulled before we even attempt to get them started under saddle.

                                  What on Gods green earth does having broodmares and foals have to do with being an expert in equine dentistry? Honestly! Some may find it easy to age a horse by looking at their teeth, but for a lot people, it takes a book open to the right page and lots of checking back and forth between mouth and book. Not everyone is an expert on teeth....that includes some veterinarians!

                                  Give the bloody lady a break! She simply came on asking for advice and got thrown to the wolves. Can't say I would come back on here for any further advice if I was her. And with all of the years I've been in this industry, bred, shown, stood stallions, purchased oodles of horses and ponies over the years, we also came home with a pony once that was supposed to be three years old and then ended up finding out the darn thing was a two year old once the registration papers had been transfered and arrived in the mail!! Very mature looking pony with a great attitude. So, I guess you're going to have to string me up too! Like the OP, it was a fabulous little pony and there was no way I wanted to give it back, due to his young age and having to sit on him for another year. That pony ended up turning into the very famous Jumpin' Jack Flash who is now showing out on the US East Coast pony hunter circuit.
                                  www.DaventryEquestrian.com
                                  Home of Oldenburg, Westphalian & RPSI approved pony stallion Goldhills Brandysnap
                                  Also home to Daventry Equine Appraisals & Equine Expert Witness www.EquineAppraisers.com

                                  Comment


                                  • #57
                                    I totally agree with Tracy.

                                    I had two ponies arrive at our farm from a very well know trainer. She bought them thinking they were 4 yr olds. They were w/t/c/ swapping leads and jumping a full course. When she got their welsh papers they turned out to be TWO YEARS OLD. She turned them out in my pasture for the next year so they could grow up.

                                    I think a good question was asked but I think some of the answers were neither helpful nor productive. Frankly I do not like it when our members act in such an ill manner.
                                    Sandy
                                    www.sugarbrook.com
                                    hunter/jumper ponies

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      gotta ask -

                                      many of you have lately posted that it might be common practice for folks selling ponies to lie about their age? And to lie on their papers? I guess I am aghast at this practice - not attacking the OP - but good golly, just a shrug of the shoulders that the four year olds are really just two ?
                                      Given my budget for young horses, those babes would be sent right back to seller and my money would be back in my pocket. I think this is what got me riled - but since it doesn't rile the OP and certainly not some of you - then it is only my opinion, which is what we all post here after all!
                                      "Her life was okay. Sometimes she wished she were sleeping with the right man instead of with her dog, but she never felt she was sleeping with the wrong dog."



                                      www.dontlookbackfarm.com

                                      Comment

                                      • Original Poster

                                        #59
                                        Originally posted by Thomas_1 View Post
                                        I'd love to know how you check what to bit with and whether a bit is in the correct position. Second thoughts, I'm thinking you don't

                                        Yes you explained it beautifully .

                                        yeh right. Nearly a teenager. We all know what a pain they can be. So of course it doesn't matter what sort of pony you buy her! Though in fact I recall when you told us you bought her that she was a little small for that child and so was going to your 5 year old.

                                        HOw dare you even ASSUME that ALL teenagers are a PAIN,?? I happen to live with 4 teenage boys and one daughter who will be one soon and I don't consider any of them to be a PAIN, the boys all have fulltime jobs, the older ones pay rent, the younger ones have EXCELLENT grades, and as for my daughter she is one of the NICEST young ladies I happen to know. You have NO right to attack my family.
                                        Kim
                                        If you are lucky enough to ride, you are lucky enough.

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          Originally posted by hellerkm View Post
                                          [/COLOR][/COLOR]
                                          HOw dare you even ASSUME that ALL teenagers are a PAIN,?? I happen to live with 4 teenage boys and one daughter who will be one soon and I don't consider any of them to be a PAIN, the boys all have fulltime jobs, the older ones pay rent, the younger ones have EXCELLENT grades, and as for my daughter she is one of the NICEST young ladies I happen to know. You have NO right to attack my family.
                                          Don't be a prat!

                                          I was being sarcastic.

                                          It was me who asserted that children are precious and wayyyyy too valuable to go irresponsibly getting a pony without due regard of it's age or what it has or hasn't done. To anyone with half a brain cell that might have been a clue that I actually like children AND that includes teenagers. To help you get a clue, I happen to think your "explanation" and reasoning that your child was nearly 13 so it wasn't a risk putting it on a 2 year old without knowing was absolutely feeble and absurd.

                                          Riding is a risk sport. In my opinion you don't go sticking children on horses you've not done adequate research on. Whether the child is 2, 5 or 12. I'm of the view that when you buy a child anything the responsible adult does all and everything they possibly can to ensure it's safety. Horse riding is a risk sport.

                                          Whilst I said earlier that I'm not surprised that novice owners don't know the specifics of aging equines, I'm gobsmacked that those breeding stock and buying it to produce and sell to other people (I was going to say suckers!) don't even bother about knowing let alone learning to find out. What a sorry situation just buying up stock with total disregard of what they are and what they might have done and be and then setting them on their way to children because they look cute.

                                          It's a parental responsibility to ensure your children are safe so don't go giving me lectures on teenagers and good parenting!
                                          Last edited by Thomas_1; Jun. 29, 2009, 03:49 AM.

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