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Props for USEF Steward!

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  • Props for USEF Steward!

    I am just returning to the hunter jumper show world after a long hiatus. I've always had mixed feelings about showing and the lengths some go to in their training in the pursuit of prizes etc. I have always chosen to train with people who put horses welfare and well-being mentally and physically above all else.

    This weekend I was at a Rated show in Southern California. I was so pleased to see a USEF steward out and around and engaging in conversations with everyone, answering questions, etc. She was checking tack (shortening an unsafe long martingale for instance), examining bits and insides of horses mouths and dismissing any horse that had bloody spur holes on its sides!!!! I watched 4 or 5 horses not be allowed to compete (ridden by some BNT btw...) because of bleeding sides AND two horses dismissed from their hack classes because of unsoundness!!

    I am happy to see some regulation and oversight going on and that the welfare of our best 4-legged friends is being taken seriously because it really is so important.

  • #2
    I think its disturbing that so many horses had those sorts of issues as a single show, but glad someone stood up for what's right.
    The best sports bras for riders are Anita 5527 and Panache! Size UP in Anita, down in Panache (UK sizing)

    Comment


    • #3
      Be usre to send in a licensed official's evaluation form to let USEF know you think she is doing a good job.

      You can print it out here
      http://www.usef.org/documents/compet...Evaluation.pdf

      and mail it in,

      or fill it in online
      http://www.usef.org/documents/compet...uationFill.pdf
      Janet

      chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        Thanks! People are so quick to send in complaints but rarely compliments!

        Comment


        • #5
          DITTO what Janet said

          file that form to give positive feedback
          _\\]
          -- * > hoopoe
          Procrastinate NOW
          Introverted Since 1957

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by mimimalone View Post
            I am just returning to the hunter jumper show world after a long hiatus. I've always had mixed feelings about showing and the lengths some go to in their training in the pursuit of prizes etc. I have always chosen to train with people who put horses welfare and well-being mentally and physically above all else.

            This weekend I was at a Rated show in Southern California. I was so pleased to see a USEF steward out and around and engaging in conversations with everyone, answering questions, etc. She was checking tack (shortening an unsafe long martingale for instance), examining bits and insides of horses mouths and dismissing any horse that had bloody spur holes on its sides!!!! I watched 4 or 5 horses not be allowed to compete (ridden by some BNT btw...) because of bleeding sides AND two horses dismissed from their hack classes because of unsoundness!!

            I am happy to see some regulation and oversight going on and that the welfare of our best 4-legged friends is being taken seriously because it really is so important.
            If this was a USEF rated show the steward should be reported.
            But for exceeding their authority.
            There are no illegal h/j bits so no reason for a steward to be looking in a horses's mouth.
            Length of the martingale is not regulated and the trainer and the steward may very well disagree on what's correct.
            Bloody spur marks? Really? AT a H/J show the problem is too quiet not excessive spur use. I find it hard to believe that there could be that many horses with spur marks.
            Unsoundness in the hack is up to the judge.

            But if this took place at some backyard show or a local assoc show then it makes sense. At a USEF show, don't believe your story.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by S A McKee View Post
              If this was a USEF rated show the steward should be reported.
              But for exceeding their authority.
              There are no illegal h/j bits so no reason for a steward to be looking in a horses's mouth.
              Length of the martingale is not regulated and the trainer and the steward may very well disagree on what's correct.
              Bloody spur marks? Really? AT a H/J show the problem is too quiet not excessive spur use. I find it hard to believe that there could be that many horses with spur marks.
              Unsoundness in the hack is up to the judge.

              But if this took place at some backyard show or a local assoc show then it makes sense. At a USEF show, don't believe your story.
              ^this
              If you love me let me go....

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by S A McKee View Post
                At a USEF show, don't believe your story.
                And many of us are not surprised.

                Comment


                • #9
                  And I was at a USEF show in So Cal that may have been the same one and observed: a man in the Mod Jr/Am Jumpers with no visible chinstrap on his helmet (it may have been folded up behind the helmet, and he did have a bit of a beard that made it harder to tell that there was no chinstrap) and two grooms leading a horse into the ring for another jumper class and the rider mounting once in the ring. I guess that's allowed with the judge's permission, but I'm guessing he didn't get it because when he went back in for the jump-off they cleared the back gate area, he got on the horse, and the same two grooms got behind him with the rope that they use as a "gate" and more or less herded him into the ring.

                  I suppose that I could have been the helmet police and gone and found a steward but I didn't. But I think that's also something that a judge could have eliminated him for if s/he noticed.
                  The Evil Chem Prof

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by S A McKee View Post
                    If this was a USEF rated show the steward should be reported.
                    But for exceeding their authority.
                    There are no illegal h/j bits so no reason for a steward to be looking in a horses's mouth.
                    Length of the martingale is not regulated and the trainer and the steward may very well disagree on what's correct.
                    Bloody spur marks? Really? AT a H/J show the problem is too quiet not excessive spur use. I find it hard to believe that there could be that many horses with spur marks.
                    Unsoundness in the hack is up to the judge.

                    But if this took place at some backyard show or a local assoc show then it makes sense. At a USEF show, don't believe your story.
                    I agree about the bit checking and martingale issue. However, I have seen horses with bloody spur marks dismissed at a USEF AA show. IMO it isn't done enough because I've seen quite a few horses with spur marks.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by S A McKee View Post
                      If this was a USEF rated show the steward should be reported.
                      But for exceeding their authority.
                      There are no illegal h/j bits so no reason for a steward to be looking in a horses's mouth.
                      Length of the martingale is not regulated and the trainer and the steward may very well disagree on what's correct.
                      Bloody spur marks? Really? AT a H/J show the problem is too quiet not excessive spur use. I find it hard to believe that there could be that many horses with spur marks.
                      Unsoundness in the hack is up to the judge.

                      But if this took place at some backyard show or a local assoc show then it makes sense. At a USEF show, don't believe your story.
                      ^^^^ agree. I call BS.
                      Come to the dark side, we have cookies

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Props to this steward! I seriously think that this is a step in the right direction. More stewards need to be out and about DOING THEIR JOBS, IMO. They don't do this enough and for the person asking WHY they should check a horse's mouth, I say there's all the more reason to! I can honestly say that at the A and AA rated shows that I have been to, I have honest to god NEVER seen a steward there. The one time I saw a steward was when a girl in my row at a show had to get her horse tested after being Reserve Champion in the Large Juniors.

                        Let me put this into perspective. I know this took place in the Dressage ring, but I think that the blood in mouth rule should also be put in place in the Hunter/Jumper ring as well. Look at what happened to Adelinde Cornelissen at WEG. She got disqualified when her horse had blood in its mouth from biting itself. I'm not going to lie when I say that I see both Hunters and Jumpers engaging in activities that could lead their horses to having blood in their mouths, but that is a WHOLE other thing entirely that I won't bother you with.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          There are no illegal h/j bits so no reason for a steward to be looking in a horses's mouth.
                          Length of the martingale is not regulated and the trainer and the steward may very well disagree on what's correct.
                          Also the Judge in hack class would do the dismiss for lameness and then have steward potentially follow up outside of the ring...Steward would not dismiss horse unless obvious lameness or abuse in warm-up prior to class.

                          AGREED....

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by MonterStables View Post
                            Props to this steward! I seriously think that this is a step in the right direction. More stewards need to be out and about DOING THEIR JOBS, IMO. They don't do this enough and for the person asking WHY they should check a horse's mouth, I say there's all the more reason to! I can honestly say that at the A and AA rated shows that I have been to, I have honest to god NEVER seen a steward there. The one time I saw a steward was when a girl in my row at a show had to get her horse tested after being Reserve Champion in the Large Juniors.
                            Just because you haven't noticed tem doesn't mean they're not there. Every USEF show is required to have a steward, usually they blend in because they're sitting in a golf cart next to a schooling ring.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by HunterRider992 View Post
                              I agree about the bit checking and martingale issue. However, I have seen horses with bloody spur marks dismissed at a USEF AA show. IMO it isn't done enough because I've seen quite a few horses with spur marks.
                              The reason I question the spur mark eliminations is because if the violation was serious enough to get the rider eliminated there should be a follow up charge filed with USEF for abuse. I'm not seeing that happen.
                              Abuse is defined in the rules and spur marks are not included in the list. In Dressage blood on the side of the horse WILL get you eliminated.
                              But abuse is one of those things that you know when you see it and may defy definition.
                              There are situations where a show declares an activity as prohibited while USEF allows it. In those cases the show could eliminate the rider but there would be no abuse charges filed because the activity is USEF 'legal'.
                              An example is poling. Legal under USEF rules, illegal in many states and at many facilities. Show can eliminate you but no USEF charge is filed.
                              Another example is number of classes per day. Up to show, no USEF rule to regulate.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by MonterStables View Post
                                Props to this steward! I seriously think that this is a step in the right direction. More stewards need to be out and about DOING THEIR JOBS, IMO. They don't do this enough and for the person asking WHY they should check a horse's mouth, I say there's all the more reason to! I can honestly say that at the A and AA rated shows that I have been to, I have honest to god NEVER seen a steward there. The one time I saw a steward was when a girl in my row at a show had to get her horse tested after being Reserve Champion in the Large Juniors.

                                Let me put this into perspective. I know this took place in the Dressage ring, but I think that the blood in mouth rule should also be put in place in the Hunter/Jumper ring as well. Look at what happened to Adelinde Cornelissen at WEG. She got disqualified when her horse had blood in its mouth from biting itself. I'm not going to lie when I say that I see both Hunters and Jumpers engaging in activities that could lead their horses to having blood in their mouths, but that is a WHOLE other thing entirely that I won't bother you with.
                                The problem with this is you are incorrect about what a steward is responsible for. While you may think they should do various tasks what matters is the rules, not a mistaken POV.
                                As noted by others every USEF show has to have a steward. A and AA shows may have more than one steward plus schooling supervisors.
                                The steward interfaces with show management, not the exhibitor UNLESS the exhibitor wants to clarify a rule. Then the steward gets involved.
                                You mention seeing a steward after a horse was declared Res Champion and had been selected to be drug tested.
                                Typically the steward is not involved with the testing process. The USEF assigned technicians contact the exhibitor or the trainer as the horse leaves the ring.
                                If the exhibitor is behaving badly and not cooperating the steward can get involved in order to file a charge against the exhibitor ( sometimes unsportsmanlike behavior).

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by S A McKee View Post
                                  The reason I question the spur mark eliminations is because if the violation was serious enough to get the rider eliminated there should be a follow up charge filed with USEF for abuse. I'm not seeing that happen.
                                  Abuse is defined in the rules and spur marks are not included in the list. In Dressage blood on the side of the horse WILL get you eliminated.
                                  But abuse is one of those things that you know when you see it and may defy definition.
                                  There are situations where a show declares an activity as prohibited while USEF allows it. In those cases the show could eliminate the rider but there would be no abuse charges filed because the activity is USEF 'legal'.
                                  An example is poling. Legal under USEF rules, illegal in many states and at many facilities. Show can eliminate you but no USEF charge is filed.
                                  Another example is number of classes per day. Up to show, no USEF rule to regulate.
                                  Absolutely wrong. Manual poling is expressly prohibited by USEF rules. Here is a guide to what you can and cannot do while jumping at a USEF sanctioned horse show.

                                  https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...6R4nZhjMBLmGaQ

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by tricolor View Post
                                    Absolutely wrong. Manual poling is expressly prohibited by USEF rules. Here is a guide to what you can and cannot do while jumping at a USEF sanctioned horse show.

                                    https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...6R4nZhjMBLmGaQ

                                    Manual poling is expressly forbidden for JUMPERS (JP103.1), EVENTING (EV111.2), and HUNTERS (HU102.k and HU Appendix A.17) . But according to GR 432 it is permitted (bamboo only) for other disciplines.

                                    Which other disciplines would be interested in poling, I do not know.
                                    Janet

                                    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      So I had a steward "dismiss" me, however it was actually the judge that did the dismissal and communicated it through the steward. I have a horse that is a loud breather, and this particular judge determined him to have an "unsoundness" due to his "roaring."

                                      When I wasn't called back for the jog, the judge sent the steward over to me to let me know why.

                                      I thought it was a very appropriate action on the judges part, as I would have been very confused as to why I was not called back when I had some very excellent trips. That's not to say I wasn't upset as I was VERY VERY VERY upset, but it is the judge's call. I have shown this horse under many different judges in the 4 years I've had him and this is the only time I've been spun out. He definitely can be a loud breather, especially on hot days, but to each their own.

                                      That said, it was NOT the steward who did the dismissing, it was the judge. Appearances from the outside may have looked different.

                                      I have never been to a rated show when there wasn't at least one steward there, they do typically blend in as they are horse people. Or you might think they are office staff.
                                      My adventures as a working rider

                                      theworkingrider.blogspot.com

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                                      • #20
                                        I am not sure I would be too tickled pink if the steward randomly started adjusting my martingale.

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