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Judge with chip on shoulder?

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  • #41
    Originally posted by Skip's Rider View Post
    Others have covered show protocol for handling these situations. Aside from that, IMO, this was a teachable moment for your 4-year-old. We should not be creating an artificial world for our kids where everything is rosy. It's like everybody making the team because you don't want any kid to be disappointed. Judge (or steward?) lost his temper. Explain that to the child and say that maybe they were having a bad day. Then move on. If kids never learn to deal with this kind of small stuff, they will never learn to deal with the bigger stuff. They need to learn coping skills -- that's where good parenting or support from good trainers comes in. Of course we want to protect our kids, but we don't need to shelter them from EVERYTHING that's unpleasant.
    Thankyou Skip, you said it much better than i could have. To the OP, people yell in this world, and if she continues to show she will see a lot more. Time to teach the kid how to deal.
    www.tayvalleyfarm.com
    My other home.

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    • #42
      Doesn't look like the OP knows where to go from here...

      Comment


      • #43
        Originally posted by AllisonWunderlund View Post
        OP - I hate to burst your bubble, because it sounds like you're pretty new to all this. When you attend shows long enough, you WILL see:

        Trainers going off on students
        Trainers going off on other trainers
        Owners going off on trainers and riders
        etc. etc. etc.

        It's a high stress environment - especially at that level. If an ill-timed hissy fit is enough to trouble your daughter (and yes, I know she is 4) then maybe you're in the wrong sport.

        Though I've seen some knock down drag outs at soccer games, basket ball tournaments, gymnastic events...have you seen Dance Moms??
        Allison ... you are so right! Nothing like sports and a ribbons to bring out the very worst in people. So, why do we do it? Because we learn to ignore and deal with the misbehavior, feel the adrenaline, and love our horses and sense of accomplishment.

        Comment


        • #44
          Frankly, if the OP does not know the difference between a steward and a judge, and their respective roles, s/he probably should not be accosting anyone at a horse show.

          Also, think of the example you are setting for your four year old child. Are you teaching your child by example to react with grace and resolve under adversity? Or are you teaching your child to moan and groan and complain when things don't fall perfectly into place?

          Points to ponder before the next show.

          Comment


          • #45
            First the judge had no business talking to the trainer in any way shape or form; if the judge had an issue w/ a trainer they should have discussed w/show management. Some local shows do not have a "steward" but might have someone acting in capacity of show manager/steward or it would show organizer(s). Secondly, just as judge was out of line to rant off on a trainer, OP shouldnt have said a word to trainer, but march right over to show office and complain. Thirdly - plenty of shows have a leadline, and then off lead line -generally you lose about 1/3+ of the class after leadline comes off and I've been at some small shows were they allowed attendants to walk/ jog beside the riders off the line - just in case...

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #46
              Wow...what an incredible thread this has turned out to be. Makes me sorry I posted it...Yes we are new to Hunting, and most of you seemingly have been around the block more than us. But a mistake on my part about titles of an official leads to things like liar and backtracking?? Really?? For those that feel that way, you are very jaded and you have my sympathies.

              Comment


              • #47
                Yeah, but I think most people (as many people in this thread are demonstrating) see a problem in your daughter cross entering. I also think the parents of the kids who can't do w/t would think its a little unsportsmanlike also.

                I also agree that talking to the judge was way out of line. You need to let your trainer deal with those types of situations as he/she should be aware of show decorum.

                -Okay, my browser was being a little slow. Yeah, the I don't like that the steward went off on the trainer in front of everyone, but I would prefer to know the whole story behind why. If the trainer was doing something out of line, I would applaud the steward for giving it to him/her. Trainers can take things way to far without respect for the rules and good sportsmanship.

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                • #48
                  I believe that under any circumstances judges, or trainers or anyone should scream at the ingate in front of anyone. They usually would get fined for that. Although that doesn't correct the problem, it is your right to report him. Warning, you will be blacklisted by that judge and he will use it against you and will spread rumors about you with his judge buddies so this is why everyone advises to keep your thoughts to yourself.

                  Comment


                  • #49
                    Originally posted by sammicat View Post
                    Allison ... you are so right! Nothing like sports and a ribbons to bring out the very worst in people. So, why do we do it? Because we learn to ignore and deal with the misbehavior, feel the adrenaline, and love our horses and sense of accomplishment.
                    Thanks sammi - and you are right too. There is enough good that comes from doing the sport that it's worthwhile to ignore these uncomfortable situations. And I am not condoning this behavior at all. I do agree with the posters that it was an opportunity to teach the kid about the right and wrong ways to deal with situations. Sometimes we learn more by witnessing what NOT to do.

                    OP - I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are too new to this to have all the lingo down. Still does not excuse the action. You'll be much better off accepting that you cannot control other people's behavior. You can use these opportunities to raise your daughter to have better manners than others around her may show.
                    "I'm not strange, weird, off, nor crazy. My reality is just different from yours."
                    ~Lewis Carroll

                    Comment


                    • #50
                      If it was, in fact, the steward rather than the judge - why would you say you had never shown before this -steward- before?

                      That makes zero sense, even if you did mix up the roles of the two.

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        Thank you, gumshoe. That excuse doesn't hold much water.
                        "Aye God, Woodrow..."

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          Are you guys crazy? Do your call moan and complain because someone goes off like that? it is uncivilized behavior and should not be tolerated. And the OP has every right to question it. And she just wanted to know the reason for his behavior.

                          Comment


                          • #53
                            Originally posted by BWW View Post
                            Wow...what an incredible thread this has turned out to be. Makes me sorry I posted it...Yes we are new to HUNTING, and most of you seemingly have been around the block more than us. But a mistake on my part about titles of an official leads to things like liar and backtracking?? Really?? For those that feel that way, you are very jaded and you have my sympathies.
                            Many of us would be new to hunting too. I thought we were talking about horse shows, not fox hunts. My bad...
                            When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                            The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #54
                              At any rate, now that we are past the animosity that my post generated (at least I hope we are - if all you have is a senseless dig, please be an adult and just post nothing), my post was intended to generate some discussion about posters experiences dealing with similar situations. Beyond what was already made clear by many of you (that you would never approach the official like I did), what I would be interested in hearing is your stories and how resolved. After all, I am sure we will encounter some of the same as time goes on. But please spare me the holier than thou stuff...

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                Originally posted by leyla25 View Post
                                Are you guys crazy? Do your call moan and complain because someone goes off like that? it is uncivilized behavior and should not be tolerated. And the OP has every right to question it. And she just wanted to know the reason for his behavior.
                                But at a horse show, it is not allowed to directly approach a judge. This protects the judge from angry exhibitors and can also protect an exhibitor from an angry judge who recently flew off the handle at somebody else. There are appropriate steps in place at a show with a leadline preceeding a Grand Prix-meaning it was a rated show.
                                When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                                The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  Originally posted by BWW View Post
                                  Wow...what an incredible thread this has turned out to be. Makes me sorry I posted it...Yes we are new to Hunting, and most of you seemingly have been around the block more than us. But a mistake on my part about titles of an official leads to things like liar and backtracking?? Really?? For those that feel that way, you are very jaded and you have my sympathies.
                                  Sorry, meant to quote, not thumbs up...
                                  OK, then an honest mistake. But a good learning opportunity for everybody involved... You don't want to be THAT show mom (think Dance Moms). And many competitors take it very seriously. They know the rules and don't take kindly to poor sportsmanship. Trainers tend to be a little more understanding, because you're paying them. To avoid offending judges, stewards, and competitors next time, your trainer should be the one to address any issues. Otherwise, that rant may be directed at you or your daughter next time.
                                  And I do agree this was an opportunity to teach your daughter that she can handle the pressures of showing without Mommy coming to the rescue. Instead she probably thinks it's appropriate to complain.
                                  Born under a rock and owned by beasts!

                                  Comment


                                  • #57
                                    ...are you are trying listen to our advice now??? i don't know if you or the MOD took the comment off but i did see the comment you posted about us being off our meds. who is trying to be "holier than thou" with a comment like that?!?!?!

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      Originally posted by leyla25 View Post
                                      Are you guys crazy? Do your call moan and complain because someone goes off like that? it is uncivilized behavior and should not be tolerated. And the OP has every right to question it. And she just wanted to know the reason for his behavior.
                                      Absolutely. In private, in the office or to the steward, and not within earshot of DD.
                                      Born under a rock and owned by beasts!

                                      Comment


                                      • #59
                                        Originally posted by leyla25 View Post
                                        Are you guys crazy? Do your call moan and complain because someone goes off like that? it is uncivilized behavior and should not be tolerated. And the OP has every right to question it. And she just wanted to know the reason for his behavior.
                                        Yes and USEF will fine for inappropriate behavior regardless if it is an exhibitor,judge, steward or show manager.
                                        Just because it's a show official it doesn't make them exempt from rules or accepted behavior.

                                        http://www.usef.org/documents/rules/...berRulings.pdf

                                        Above is a link to a USEF hearing session.
                                        1) Show management was fined $750 for refusing entries.
                                        2) An exhibitor behaved badly towards a judge. Got a 3 month suspension and a large fine.
                                        3) a judge seems to have mouthed off at the parent of a Jr exhibitor. Judge was fined.

                                        Yes, you need to speak with the steward for permission to chat with the judge. But if the steward is behaving badly see the show manager and file a complaint.
                                        And if more exhibitors would file protests against judges or stewards who think they can be rude as they please then perhaps everyone would behave a bit better.

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          Originally posted by BWW View Post
                                          At any rate, now that we are past the animosity that my post generated (at least I hope we are - if all you have is a senseless dig, please be an adult and just post nothing), my post was intended to generate some discussion about posters experiences dealing with similar situations. Beyond what was already made clear by many of you (that you would never approach the official like I did), what I would be interested in hearing is your stories and how resolved. After all, I am sure we will encounter some of the same as time goes on. But please spare me the holier than thou stuff...
                                          Simple, you go to the office and ask to speak to the steward(s). They can usually get you the correct information regarding any infractions

                                          You can also fill out a show evaluation form available at no charge and, IIRC, on the USEF website. There is a place to address any complaints about judges.

                                          Judge or not, I would not ever walk up to a total stanger who I had observed recently having a temper tantrum and suggest he correct his behavior-that is not a safe thing to do.
                                          When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                                          The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                                          Comment

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