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Bruce Burr--USEF suspension lifted?

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  • Bruce Burr--USEF suspension lifted?

    http://phelpssports.com/viewarticle.php?id=10006408

    So is this a scoop that only Phelps has access to?

    Does anyone have any information that CAN be shared?

    Is there an official statement forthcoming from USEF?

    Or is it not true?

  • #2
    I just looked on the suspension list and the only Burr's listed are these two:

    BURR, KELLY ANNE TROY, NY 07/01/1995
    BURR, LEONARD TROY, NY 07/01/1995

    So....I guess its true?

    Comment


    • #3
      Can you summarize the article? The link doesn't work if you are not a member.
      Janet

      chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        Sorry, I am not a member either. Typical of this "insiders only" sport, that such a thing would initially be shared within a clique. Not that I've been paying attention lately, but this is not normally the case the Federation, that I have noticed in the past.

        The irony of so many clients paying a PR firm to to have their news sent only to that firm's paying subscribers is apparently LOST on clients on both sides of that coin. Talk about double-dipping.

        Not expressing an opinion about whether the BB suspension is just/unjust or anything, but if Phelps has access to USEF news prior to members being informed of it by USEF, there is something fundamentally wrong with our NGB.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by JustJump View Post
          Not expressing an opinion about whether the BB suspension is just/unjust or anything, but if Phelps has access to USEF news prior to members being informed of it by USEF, there is something fundamentally wrong with our NGB.
          Yup.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by JustJump View Post
            Not expressing an opinion about whether the BB suspension is just/unjust or anything, but if Phelps has access to USEF news prior to members being informed of it by USEF, there is something fundamentally wrong with our NGB.
            Considering that the USEF is essentially a "phone-in" NGB, it isn't unlikely for Phelps to have full access to news and information before the unwashed masses do, especially with his status as a social butterfly with connections to anyone and everyone in the sport of H/J. That being said, it's not uncommon for people with certain status in the sport to have his personal phone number in their phones. I know three local riders who do, all known riders when they were younger, and they go all over the place and I'm pretty sure from my recollection that one of them is/was a client of his firm.
            Thus do we growl that our big toes have, at this moment, been thrown up from below!

            Comment


            • #7
              The Hearing Committee info for November hasn't been posted on the USEF site yet; perhaps there was an appeal or something? There does not appear to be anything regarding Mr. Burr in the October hearing notices. My guess is that if this info is true, then Mr. Burr would have been advised as soon as the decision was made, and could then share it with his PR firm if he chose to.

              Given the profile of this individual and the impact/circumstances that led to his suspension, you would think the NGB might also publish an explanation more quickly, but it's been a long time since I've felt like the USEF demonstrated much concern for that sort of communication.
              **********
              We move pretty fast for some rabid garden snails.
              -PaulaEdwina

              Comment


              • #8
                I would be shocked if they issued an explanation though I'm sure there is some spin on it that re-directs the guilt or states the test was invalid.
                Thus do we growl that our big toes have, at this moment, been thrown up from below!

                Comment


                • #9
                  I am usually up on all the long term set-downs. Somehow I missed this case.

                  Thumbnail re-cap?
                  _\\]
                  -- * > hoopoe
                  Procrastinate NOW
                  Introverted Since 1957

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by hoopoe View Post
                    I am usually up on all the long term set-downs. Somehow I missed this case.

                    Thumbnail re-cap?
                    I think (although I could be wrong) this was an incident where Jane F. Clark's horse, ridden by Mario Deslauriers, tested positive for cocaine, and Bruce Burr had signed the form as trainer, and took the two-year penalty.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by BAC View Post
                      I think (although I could be wrong) this was an incident where Jane F. Clark's horse, ridden by Mario Deslauriers, tested positive for cocaine, and Bruce Burr had signed the form as trainer, and took the two-year penalty.
                      The above would be good thumbnail recap, correct horse, rider, owner, and trainer.
                      http://STA551.com
                      845-363-1875

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        It sounds like the FEI redefined their "suspension" recommendations giving NF's more flexibility to match the time with the crime.

                        BB has served five months already.

                        Much needed re-definition as, the way I read the ruling under which Mr. Burr was originally suspended for two years, it applied to all FEI disciplines thus excluding Hunters and Equitation. Had Urico been a Hunter it is quite possible there would have been no suspension whatsoever or USEF would have followed their own guidelines.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          BB suspension never made any sense.
                          If it was an 'FEI' suspension then the rider is the person responsible, not the trainer.
                          If it was a suspension under USEF rules it would be the longest suspension EVER (except for horse killing scandal)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            What S A McKee said. There has been ongoing question over the length of the suspension, as it did not fit either Organization's previous punishments.
                            Laurie

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              A little off topic.. but why on earth would you give a horse cocaine?
                              Draumr Hesta Farm
                              "Wenn Du denkst es geht nicht mehr, kommt von irgendwo ein kleines Licht daher"
                              Member of the COTH Ignorant Disrepectful F-bombs!*- 2Dogs Farm

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by lauriep View Post
                                What S A McKee said. There has been ongoing question over the length of the suspension, as it did not fit either Organization's previous punishments.

                                Entirely aside from this specific individual, I wonder if the USEF will ever reach the conclusion that the current length/severity of punishments doesn't seem to provide much in the way of deterrence? Especially since the next big item on the committee's agenda should be the Carolina Gold issue. In that case, people were clearly told it was illegal, then a test was developed and samples retroactively tested back to the date the substance should have cleared. If there was ever a moment to get serious and make an example of people, this looks like that moment. But if they are willing to back track on penalty duration on this issue, I admit, I'm less optimistic that will happen...
                                Your crazy is showing. You might want to tuck that back in.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  There was a rule change for 2012,

                                  GR409 Equine Drugs and Medications , No Banned Substance Provisions .
                                  1. This rule applies only to FEI Banned Substances and Methods.
                                  2. For all Federation Equestre Internationale (FEI) recognized disciplines, Articles 2 (what constitutes
                                  a violation), 3 [proof of violations (except 3.1 and 3.2.3)], 4 (banned substances and methods),
                                  8.2 (principles of fair hearing) and 10 (sanctions) of the FEI Equine Anti-Doping rules govern.
                                  Those Articles are incorporated by reference as if fully set out herein and can be found at www.fei.
                                  org or the Drugs & Medications tab at www.usef.org. GR404 Responsibility and Accountability of
                                  Trainers applies to this rule. BOD 1/23/11 Effective 12/1/11
                                  When I asked "what does that really mean" I was told that it meant that
                                  If a horse competing in a USEF competition in an FEI discipline
                                  tested poeitive for a drug banned by both USEF and FEI
                                  the USEF suspension period would follow the FEI guidelines.

                                  It sounds as if that is what happened here.

                                  There WAS a rule change proposal, from someone at USHJA, wanting to change this rule, saying it was unreasonable. But the proposed rule change seems to have been withdrawn, as I can no longer find it.

                                  Originally posted by S A McKee View Post
                                  BB suspension never made any sense.
                                  If it was an 'FEI' suspension then the rider is the person responsible, not the trainer.
                                  If it was a suspension under USEF rules it would be the longest suspension EVER (except for horse killing scandal)
                                  Janet

                                  chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    If they are following FEI rules, does that mean they would suspend Mario?

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by Janet View Post
                                      There was a rule change for 2012,



                                      When I asked "what does that really mean" I was told that it meant that
                                      If a horse competing in a USEF competition in an FEI discipline
                                      tested poeitive for a drug banned by both USEF and FEI
                                      the USEF suspension period would follow the FEI guidelines.

                                      It sounds as if that is what happened here.

                                      There WAS a rule change proposal, from someone at USHJA, wanting to change this rule, saying it was unreasonable. But the proposed rule change seems to have been withdrawn, as I can no longer find it.
                                      Did you have a point?
                                      FEI rules define the rider as the PR, not the trainer.
                                      Why would BB be suspended under FEI rules?

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by S A McKee View Post
                                        Did you have a point?
                                        FEI rules define the rider as the PR, not the trainer.
                                        Why would BB be suspended under FEI rules?
                                        Yes, I had a point which you apprently missed.
                                        "the USEF suspension period would follow the FEI guidelines."

                                        To expand, if it was not sufficiently clear-

                                        If a person is charged, under USEF rules (it is the TRAINER that is charged under USEF rules), for a drug violation in an FEI discipline, the LENGTH of the USEF imposed suspension will be guided by the "FEI guidelines" rather than the "USEF guidelines".

                                        Using the FEI guidleines for the length of the suspension does not, in any way, affect the USEF rule that it is the trainer considered responsible.

                                        They are not"following FEI rules". They are following "FEI guidelines" for the length of the suspensionn.

                                        At least, that is what I was told when I asked the outgoing D&M chair.

                                        The text of the rule itself is almost incomprehensible (at least to me) which is why I asked in first place.
                                        Janet

                                        chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

                                        Comment

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