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Your Thoughts on Arabian Hunters?

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  • Your Thoughts on Arabian Hunters?

    I was just wondering what you all think of Arabians in the Hunter ring. Personally, I love Arabs! For the most part they all are good, flat kneed movers and they all do their lead changes. If an arabian goes around nice and quiet, head down, gets down the lines and does its lead changes, do you think it would be counted against, in the Hunter ring because it's an Arabian?
    I just want to know your thoughts.

    Caution: Beware the Mare!!

    http://community.webshots.com/user/cashew4ever
    Caution: Beware the Mare!!
    ~Member of \"OMGiH I loff my mare\" Clique
    ~Member of The Blonde Rider Clique
    ~Member of the Mighty Thoroughbred Clique
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    http://community.webshots.com/user/cashew4ever
  • Original Poster

    #2
    I was just wondering what you all think of Arabians in the Hunter ring. Personally, I love Arabs! For the most part they all are good, flat kneed movers and they all do their lead changes. If an arabian goes around nice and quiet, head down, gets down the lines and does its lead changes, do you think it would be counted against, in the Hunter ring because it's an Arabian?
    I just want to know your thoughts.

    Caution: Beware the Mare!!

    http://community.webshots.com/user/cashew4ever
    Caution: Beware the Mare!!
    ~Member of \"OMGiH I loff my mare\" Clique
    ~Member of The Blonde Rider Clique
    ~Member of the Mighty Thoroughbred Clique
    ~Founder of the Appaloosa Lover Clique
    http://community.webshots.com/user/cashew4ever

    Comment


    • #3
      There was a thread on this a few days ago, if I find it, I'll post the link.

      Here it is: Arabs as hunters

      Adult Pony Rider Clique
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      Comment


      • #4
        Please note that I accidentally locked it :X Just sent a message to Erin to see if she'd reopen it for me, though

        Comment


        • #5
          If I remember correctly from the other thread, the general consensus seemed to be that an arab won't necessarily be "marked down" for being an arab, other than for personal preference reasons, but that in general, arabs can't compete with other breeds in hunter classes at A shows because of a myriad of reasons including size, knees, tail set, and movement.
          Many people could remember some fabulous arab cross who did well as a hunter, but I think most people admire arabs when they are doing what they do best: sport horse, endurance, or pleasure.

          Comment


          • #6
            i don't care for full Arabs, but that's just my opinion. never knowingly seen an Arab cross(outside of my leadline pony who is too old to count), so i dunno how they do in hunters.

            ~*~it's all good...and i'm all that~*~

            Comment


            • #7
              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> For the most part they all are good, flat kneed movers and they all do their lead changes. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

              This is sort of a gross generalization. It's like saying that for the most part, all TB's are good racing horses, while in reality, only a select few are.

              Anyway, yes, I think riding an Arabian could be counted against in the hunter ring. The hunters boils down to nothing more than the preference of a judge. If you have a judge that prefers TB's, even riding your WB could be counted against you!

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              • #8
                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> If an arabian goes around nice and quiet, head down, gets down the lines and does its lead changes, do you think it would be counted against, in the Hunter ring because it's an Arabian?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
                You are forgetting a key thing that makes most Arabs unsuitable hunters. The flat stiff jump that most of them have. If the Arab performed like a textbook hunter, then it would take a very narrow-minded judge to not pin it well. Most Arabs however are not like this, they just don't have the COMPLETE package to be an A hunter. Just like TBs don't have what it takes to be successful Western Pleasure or Cutting horses. I don't try to take a TWH and make it a hunter. It just doesn't happen often if at all. Sadly, you can't make a horse (ANY BREED) something that it is not.

                ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
                "Cause I'm hella cool, that's why."
                - Eric Cartman

                Comment


                • #9
                  Most arabs are knocked down because of their stiff jaunty jump, theres not really anything wrong with them they just usually dont have the best jump. If your arab moves nice as well as has a nice jump then theres nothing wrong with that.
                  ~!Founder of the Will Faudree Lovers Clique!~
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                  I LOVE JON!!!!!! and Flip of course and DENNY, LUCKY, Jaybird, Tyler, PT, Peter, Tugboat and more, all the horses that I have lov

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                  • #10
                    Interesting bit: Arabs have 1 less vertebrae than other horses. (Actually, I dunno if this is true or not. I remember reading it somewhere...)

                    Maybe that affects their jumping?
                    peace out
                    ~Calla

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      EDITED

                      [This message was edited by Moudy on Nov. 09, 2003 at 08:30 PM.]
                      If you don't try...how will you ever know you can not do it?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        i have seen full Arabs doing hunters, and i don't like them. i've never seen an Arab X(that i know of), so that was what i was saying i'd never seen. if an Arab is a good hunter, ok, i just don't like the ones i've seen. you don't like TBs, and there's lots of TB hunters that win at Devon and Indoors(In Sync, Caped Crusader, Bucky Dent, etc.). that's fine too. hunters is all opinion.

                        ~*~it's all good...and i'm all that~*~

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          To the best of my knowledge, Arabs are bred for a high arched neck. A top hunter is basically a horizontal horse, who actually lowers his head and neck in front of the jump so that knees and neck meet each other half way.

                          A "well conformed" Arab is just not able to jump as round as other breeds.

                          As for the "Few TB's who can jump".... let me show you several. Then, please feel free to post pictures of the best Arab hunters.

                          PS: Lines are set at 12'6" for 3' horses at A shows.

                          Here is a TB who is good for more than taking off and lathering up.

                          OOPS, this is the only one of the 3 pictures I had in mind that is on the laptop. I will have to add the others later, if people do not post TB jumping pictures in the meantime... Are there some from the Devon page?

                          I look forward to seeing pictures of the top hunter Arabs for comparison.
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                          "He lives in a cocoon of solipsism"

                          Charles Krauthammer speaking about Trump

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Well, hunters has changed a lot over the last 20 years. Hunters used to be about the flatter daisy cutter but since WBs have emerged into the hunter arena, the dressagy mover has become quite liked - now, not at a high level of dressage with a lot of animation - but a more efficient training level or even perhaps to a degree first level 'frame' so to speak. I know a lot of dressage trainers who are paid to put A hunters together on the off-jumping days those horses are training.

                            That said - I have to say there is a vast variation of Arabs out there. The refined Eqyptian Arab would look a little out of place at a hunt show mainly because of size and stride not just build and style of jump. Hunters are wanted to take big long easy strides and flatter jumps so the rider can look good up there. The combinations where the fences are 2 strides apart - the judge wants to see them taken in 2 strides not 6. Most Arabs nowdays are 14-15 hands. I showed dressage on a 15.3 Arab and he had a very full WB type body and we scored extremely well even when judged by judges I knew were biased against Arabians.

                            He was a full Arab.

                            That said, as a kid, I had an Arab/Welsh and and Arab - and my best friend had an Arab/QH. All three of these horses were 14-14.2 in size and we won everything we went to - in A hunters. My Arab/Welsh was perfect miniature classic hunter. My Arab did not poof is tail except when walkign downhills on trails. He jumped super nice and looked more like a QH.

                            So in pony divisions, I think Arabs can fit in quite well. I think it is not a matter of style so much as size.

                            Style can be a factor if the horse really moves "arab-y" but my point too is that there are a vast variation of Arab types - the polish and mountain Arab types are much mroe sporty and the Eqyptian is more little and too Arab-y for anything other than Arab shows (on the most part).

                            -L

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I suppose that if an arab moved nice, went around quietly, and jumped well, it could do ok. But if it had an identical course to a warmblood or TB, WB or TB would pin over it generally. Arabs aren't really bred for their jumping ability and daisy cutting (or nowadays, big, suspended) trot, you have to remember. They were really bred to be endurance horses and dessert trekers in Arabia. Most Arabs I have seen are too hot for hunters, and carry their heads and tails too high. They also ususally have a flatter rump, which makes them poorer jumpers. They are also usually on the small size too. This is generalizing... I'm sure there are some nice Arabs (like the Black Stallion ) out there, but I personally am not a fan of them. no offense anyone... not trying to get people flaming at me again. JIMO.

                              There is an old retired Arab (30+ years old!) at my barn who did eventing in his younger days, but couldn't jump higher than 3'3" or so... or didn't have the desire anyways.

                              ~*~Nattie~*~
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                              Comment


                              • #16
                                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Moudy:
                                I believe TB's are really only good for running, lathering up and taking off on riders (from my experiences). They are explosive when nervous and for the most part un-trustworthy. Yes, there are the few that can jump.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                Well see there's the problem. You've obviously have never been to or shown at an USAE rated hunter/jumper show (by virtue of having said this statement).

                                Maybe all of the riders on this thread should have clarified that they were referring to Arab hunters having success at USAE A-rated hunter/jumper shows, not open, local, or schooling shows.

                                I have seen Arabs do well at things like 4-H hunter shows (they have a different judging standard).

                                IMHO, Arab hunter shows are significantly different than USAE hunter/jumper shows. Maybe someone here can post more pictures of a 'correct' USAE A-rated hunter.

                                P.S. Can I see any pics of these hunter Arabs?

                                Funny Quotation for July (that week thing was just too hard):
                                "A horse may be coaxed to drink, but a pencil must be lead."
                                ~ Stan Laurel

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Moudy:
                                  We have to do the normal 'hunter' lines (i.e.: 12' increments @ 3' height) no matter what, that is why a hunter, is a hunter...we have to make the lines or not! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                  I'm curious about your shows. Are the lines actually set on the 12'? As LordHelpus already said, at our good A shows the lines are a bit longer (a 6 stride is usually 86-90 feet), does that happen at your bigger shows? What heights do you jump for the hunters? Do you have jumper classes?

                                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I have seen Saddlebreds and Morgans jump as well, and they are awesome, if their conformation and their body is setup for a hunter. I do not think that anyone that is in it for the sport would make any horse jump if it is not structurally made up to. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                  I'm not sure I understand your point here. No one claimed that the horses could NOT jump, just that they didn't do it in good hunter form. I will agree with their statements due to the fact that I have never seen an arabian or pictures of one that did jump in a competitive style for the hunter ring (at its higher levels). I will say that there have been plenty of arabian crosses that have succeeded in the ponies (although no full bloods that I know of), but the pony ring takes a bit of a different look than the horses.
                                  I'm sure you understand that the saddlebreds and morgans are also not considered hunter material, since they also lack many things that go into the 'big picture'.

                                  http://community.webshots.com/user/anallie

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    my computer is being stupid and cant post a link from the devon pages. I am 99% sure that Eminem (katie Polks A/O hunter) is a tb and that horse jumpes AWESOME!!http://www.mustphoto.com/Devon%20200...es/ppage60.htm

                                    k for some reason that wont post as a link...but im pretty sure hes tb...someone correct me if im wrong. (the pic numberon that pic is DVO3-2282)

                                    ~*~"When your horse greets you with a nicker, nuzzles your chest, and regards you with a large and liquid eye, the question of where you want to be and what you want to do has been answered"~*~
                                    ~*~\"When your horse greets you with a nicker, nuzzles your chest, and regards you with a large and liquid eye, the question of where you want to be and what you want to do has been answered\"~*~

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                                    • #19
                                      A/O, USAE lists Eminem as dutch wb. But, nice try

                                      http://community.webshots.com/user/anallie

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                                      • #20
                                        why was i thinking he was tb?
                                        is her other one (the grey) a tb?

                                        ~*~"When your horse greets you with a nicker, nuzzles your chest, and regards you with a large and liquid eye, the question of where you want to be and what you want to do has been answered"~*~
                                        ~*~\"When your horse greets you with a nicker, nuzzles your chest, and regards you with a large and liquid eye, the question of where you want to be and what you want to do has been answered\"~*~

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