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Help evaluate QH hunter prospects

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  • Help evaluate QH hunter prospects

    Opinions wanted! All 3 geldings are by the same AQHA stallion and would be shown on the QH circuit in O/F classes, but a bit in HUS too.

    1.) 2006 gelding out of a Sonny Dee Bar QH mare, slowly started, but a little on the green side for a 5 year old, hasn't shown, but been hauled to a few shows. On the short side at only 15.3H, but priced quite a bit cheaper than the other 2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07OyHhRsTek

    2.) 2009 gelding out of a TB mare. Currently 15.3H and has had about 20 rides with a colt starter. Current under saddle video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJyoAwT3rhw and at liberty as a yearling http://www.youtube.com/user/scqhgal#p/u/6/n19_HM4E4z4 http://www.youtube.com/user/scqhgal#p/u/9/TaHC99A0OGM

    3.) Another 2009 gelding out of a TB mare. He's 16H behind, 15.2H up front now. Under saddle http://www.youtube.com/user/jaimeltx1#p/u/3/Na8JMQHq2Dc more under saddle http://www.youtube.com/user/jaimeltx1#p/u/1/1mec4-WA_Cw in the round pen http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_Dt7...feature=relmfu

    Last edited by kudabagus; Jun. 22, 2011, 02:43 AM. Reason: fix links

  • #2
    Originally posted by kudabagus View Post
    Opinions wanted! All 3 geldings are by the same AQHA stallion and would be shown on the QH circuit in O/F classes, but a bit in HUS too.

    1.) 2006 gelding out of a Sonny Dee Bar QH mare, slowly started, but a little on the green side for a 5 year old, hasn't shown, but been hauled to a few shows. On the short side at only 15.3H, but priced quite a bit cheaper than the other 2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07OyHhRsTek

    2.) 2009 gelding out of a TB mare. Currently 15.3H and has had about 20 rides with a colt starter. Current under saddle video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07OyHhRsTek and at liberty as a yearling http://www.youtube.com/user/scqhgal#p/u/6/n19_HM4E4z4 http://www.youtube.com/user/scqhgal#p/u/9/TaHC99A0OGM

    3.) Another 2009 gelding out of a TB mare. He's 16H behind, 15.2H up front now. Under saddle http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na8JMQHq2Dc more under saddle http://www.youtube.com/user/jaimeltx1#p/u/3/Na8JMQHq2Dc in the round pen http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_Dt7...feature=relmfu

    Is there a video of them jumping? I scanned through them quickly and didn't see it. Not much I can say about their placing over fences without seeing them over fences. Maybe I missed it!


    • Original Poster

      Unfortunately, no jumping or free jumping videos. The 2nd and 3rd horses are only 2, and the 1st has never jumped. I should have mententioned that in the original. I guess they'll have to be evaluated more as HUS prospects at this point.


      • #4
        You have two videos of nickel and none under saddle of one of the horses (depending which one actually is nickel.)

        Personally, I'd rather go 5 and less training than 2 and overworked already. I've seen tooooo many quarter horses go lame by 5 because of too much work at a young age (don't ask how many I had fail vet checks), so am always leery. I think I liked the 5 year old best, anyway, if it was the first horse. I'm not completely enamored of any of them. Nickel's neck is too thin for my taste, and I'd like to not hear him landing on the ground so hard. When he makes noise like that and you still hear his hoofbeats, you know there's some concussion going on - but from what's up there, he's by far my favorite for AQHA. He looks pretty nice for that. However, I'd also be asking myself what direction the AQHA is going. Everyone claims that they are trying to be more true to USEF standards and using H/J judges. Will horses who look like the AQHA typical horse stop playing in the near future? Hard to tell.
        Originally posted by Silverbridge
        If you get anything on your Facebook feed about who is going to the Olympics in 2012 or guessing the outcome of Bush v Gore please start threads about those, too.


        • #5
          I like the 2006 gelding much more. He has a flatter knee, just a much nicer front end. Not a bad hock, either.
          In the HUS, the judges are going to be looking for a nice flowing movement; that flat knee is what you want.
          The second horse has much more knee action. I wouldn't worry so much about the size of the horse; it's about the movement. Sure, if you end up in a HUS class full of 17 hand 10 movers, you're out of contention, but how often does that happen at a weekend QH show? Not often. I do not do the working hunter, so I can't tell you much about that. Not a bad price on that first horse, but I'd make an offer and see where they meet you.


          • Original Poster

            I got the links all straightened out; my copy and paste skills have been very off today! Nickel is the 5 yr old. I have also posted an under saddle video of the #2 horse; he is currently in training. Thanks for the responses so far!


            • #7
              My pick would be in this order: #1,#3,#2.

              #1 is the flattest mover with the biggest stride. I think it needs work at the canter to be pushed up through the bridle more and lift its back.

              #3 was a pretty close second just not quite as flat/long stride but I actually liked the canter just a bit better.

              #2 was much shorter strided and all around not my favorite. Also very hard to judge without a canter.

              Just a note though, unless you are trying to get one to also do the paint shows with, I would look at horses with little to no white as that is what usually places at the AQHA shows.
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              • #8
                The first horse doesn't strike me as one that will be atheletic enough to jump, I REALLY like the second one (Rocky), love his natural balance. Incedentally I know his breeder and she is a great gal! Don't like the thrid one at all


                • #9
                  Originally posted by shawneeAcres View Post
                  The first horse doesn't strike me as one that will be atheletic enough to jump, I REALLY like the second one (Rocky), love his natural balance. Incedentally I know his breeder and she is a great gal! Don't like the thrid one at all
                  I agree with Shawnee.....the second horse hands down for an o/f prospect and the reason it looks shorter strided in my opinion is because it only has 20 rides on him and he has no concept of how to stride out, not a bad thing necessarily. <the amount of rides> I would throw him out in the pasture after some more rides and restart for the 3 yr old under saddle futurities and 4 yr old start over fences.
                  I have always owned appendix horses and love them. Ultimate fancy is a top paint horse though.
                  FYI....the 2 yr old 50 k congress masters class in 2010 was won by an AQHA/APHA BMQ breeding.
                  Last edited by Parrotnutz; Jun. 22, 2011, 10:51 AM. Reason: forgot to ad
                  Happily retired but used to be:


                  • #10
                    Number 2 was much freer moving and more suited for the hunters - to me - but I am not a QH person and don't really understand the way they like these horses to move.
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                    • #11
                      #1. The other two are rather steep in the shoulder and it shows in the trot. That isn't going to get better no matter how much training they get. It's not going to help them over fences, either.


                      • #12
                        #2 is definitely my pick. I agree with Shawnee.


                        • #13
                          Personally I would keep looking. I love AQHA horses, have 2, and none of these are fancy enough to be even moderately successful in the HUS. 1 has the nicest trot but a bad canter, the other 2 have too much knee/bad trots.

                          You really need a nice flowing, flat-kneed stride in the trot and canter to be successful at all but the tiniest AQHA shows US. And IME they judge the gaits over fences more than the actual jump -- smoothness of the trip and good movement is at least 3/4 of the battle. A nice jump is candy but you can win without it everywhere but the biggest shows.

                          Plus, 15.3 is really too small for an AQHA HUS horse. They are usually at least 16.2 or bigger, you'll look out of place.

                          Lots of nicer, affordable ones out there these days.


                          • #14
                            I agree with fordtractor. The AQHA breeders in my opinion have bred for fabulous movers. So soft and pretty. I think that the winning USEF horses have tended to get extravagent in front, but a lot of times are not so great behind. Those AQHA HUS horses have those wonderful deep slow hocks.

                            I would buy the prettiest best moving youngster I could afford. Then you have to figure out if you think they can jump. I look for a nice loose elbow and a nice length of leg, front relative to back, in addition to otherwise correct conformation.

                            Maybe Nancy Sue Ryan's website has some nice videos. Or find one of that wonderful moving Coats and Tails (sp???) -- his name is something like that.

                            I would also try to find a youngster that has not had too much AQHA headset training. Just my personal opinion. The HUS horses tend to lower their head and get in their HUS "frame" in response to leg and this is not at all helpful when asking for your hunter round canter.

                            And I can't remember the markings exactly, but I would avoid white knees if I were looking for a HUS horse, and especially one white knee and one not.
                            Last edited by ToTheNines; Jun. 22, 2011, 01:48 PM.
                            Rest in peace Claudius, we will miss you.


                            • #15
                              The problem is that RARELY do you find a horse that does both the O/F and the HUS and wins at both in QH showing., The HUS horses are so "specialized" that, if you get one that is winning, it likely will not be able to have enough pace or bring its front end up enough to jump well! Not to mention you will be dropping a TON of money for the HUS winner! Now if you are showing novice, or even ammie a solid, decent moving horse will get you some ribbons, and you have the EQ, O/F. hunter hack and other things to show in as well.


                              • #16
                                I too agree with shawneedAcres actually. I like #1 best for movement for HUS, but for his age he is small and has no neck whatsoever, and I am not sure how he would jump. I would personally pick #2 out of the bunch, he moves well enough to do the QH and open H/J shows and looks better suited to jumping. I actually didn't like #3, not as much jump to his step, shorter stride IMO.
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                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by fordtraktor View Post
                                  Personally I would keep looking.
                                  This. I didn't really love any of the three.
                                  We couldn't all be cowboys, so some of us are clowns.


                                  • #18
                                    Horses 2 & 3 would be hard to evaluate as under saddle candidates for me because they are so young and just getting started ( if I read correctly) . They are still growing, very narrow in build , and very down hill at this point. I did like #2 though.


                                    • #19
                                      Flash , Im with you too. I don't really love any of them.

                                      Ive had a few HUS horses that have gotten going very very well over fences. With the babies/greenies you really need to see them free jump and how they handle an obstacle in front of them. They are NOT usually bred to do the fences (most are being bred to do the HUS) so you really are just looking for something that just "happens" to be in there as well. I looked at a whole slew of greenies this spring, and the last one I looked at was the fanciest one on the flat. He DID NOT pick up his legs to jump a jump. Poor thing... def. would not EVER try to get him to actually jump anything while I was on him.

                                      You want to look for a nice uphill canter either way, this is something that is RARE in the HUS, but VERY nice HUS horses will have a great canter. Its just hard to find because everyone seems to breed and train for that giant trot, and a nice big slow canter is very hard to train and ride when the HUS horses seem to trend on the "slower" side.

                                      Heres a prospect that I have now. I dont have any video of him jumping, but hes been free jumped and is awesome!

                                      This one I picked up as a 5 year old that was broke on the flat, and had just been popped over a couple simple jumps by his QH "dad".
                                      http://youtu.be/YLnhNQzqHNk (first jumping show)
                                      This is him 3 years later

                                      Cute little horse that mostly did the HUS, but has done a little bit of fences.

                                      And this one placed in one of the young horse classes at the congress in HUS. He became a superstar over fences. We showed him when he was just starting his jumping career.

                                      All of these guys are very different types, but they are lovely jumping and good moving horses too. I think its very hard to train these guys to do fences and HUS at the same time, because they really need to have different ways of going for each class. The really bright/smart ones can do it, but I also dont think its fair to tune one up for the HUS, and then rev. it up and make it jump around all at the same show. It took all of them a little while to get into the groove of jumping. They all were really smart and willing horses with good minds though. Don't discount the horse's personality and brain just cause its not a fantastic mover.


                                      • #20
                                        Depends on whether you want to have a hunter over fences who also does HUS, or a HUS horse who can also do the fence classes. It's definitely possible to do both, and we've had horses that were very successful at both, but if it doesn't turn out that way, which would you rather do?

                                        I like #1 for a HUS horse and #2 for a hunter over fences. Don't really like #3 at all (I'm big on the trot and I wasn't impressed). If you want to do the hunters, I'd go with a youngster who still has a free-flowing, forward canter. In our experience, it's been alot easier to take a horse with a forward canter and teach him to come back a bit for the HUS than it is to take one who has been in that HUS frame for several years and get him to free up and do the step.

                                        I'd get a youngster with the best canter you can find, who you know can make the step, and at least a serviceable trot, instead of getting a more experienced horse who isn't the best mover.

                                        If you want #2, snatch him up quick before he gets any more rides in that training fork....
                                        Cowboy up.