• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Pleasure vs hunters in a schooling show?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Pleasure vs hunters in a schooling show?

    I am a complete newbie when it comes to hunters; Horse and I usually stick to just-for-fun stuff like trail riding, weenie eventing, etc.

    Anyway, I might be tagging along to a local schooling show later this month; this particular schooling show is usually all hunter and eq classes, but this year they have a "pleasure" division, with 3 flat classes and a 2' O/F class.

    In general terms, I know eq is about the rider and hunters is about the horse... Can someone explain how pleasure fits in? In the (limited) description in the prizelist, it looks like pleasure is basically the same as hunters, but obviously it's different somehow or it wouldn't be its own division.

    Translation please, for those of you who do this sort of thing on a regular basis... Thanks!
    *friend of bar.ka

    "Evidently, I am an unrepentant b*tch, possible trouble maker, and all around super villian"

  • #2
    Sounds like an oddball local deal as "pleasure" usually refers to flat classes while Hunters jump. When you see "Hunter pleasure" or "Hunter under saddle" it is a flat class for Hunter type horses.

    You need to check with whoever is putting on the show for your local definitions.
    When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

    The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

    Comment


    • #3
      In Pleasure, the emphasis is on manners and suitability to purpose. If your horse appears to be a safe, sane, pleasant horse to hack out on, that's it. The judges are looking for a light contact, prompt transitions, and a nice attitude. Being a nice mover helps, but isn't essential. You may be asked to extend the trot, hand gallop, halt, halt and drop reins, back, dismount/mount from the ground, trot over ground poles, back between ground poles. Obedience is key, but with minimal input from the rider.

      At least that was my experience, in something over 250 pleasure classes in the original Sha Samour's show career. And we won most of them.
      Why do I like most horses better than most people?

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        Originally posted by ShaSamour View Post
        In Pleasure, the emphasis is on manners and suitability to purpose. If your horse appears to be a safe, sane, pleasant horse to hack out on, that's it. The judges are looking for a light contact, prompt transitions, and a nice attitude. Being a nice mover helps, but isn't essential. You may be asked to extend the trot, hand gallop, halt, halt and drop reins, back, dismount/mount from the ground, trot over ground poles, back between ground poles. Obedience is key, but with minimal input from the rider.

        At least that was my experience, in something over 250 pleasure classes in the original Sha Samour's show career. And we won most of them.
        Makes sense. My one concern is that I do always ride my guy with boots (he toes out in front and sometimes knocks himself), which I know is a no-no in hunters. I wonder if I'll get the stink-eye with boots in a pleasure class? (This is a schooling show, mind you. We don't do A-rated anything; that's out of my league/pocketbook!)
        *friend of bar.ka

        "Evidently, I am an unrepentant b*tch, possible trouble maker, and all around super villian"

        Comment


        • #5
          footwear and legwear in pleasure classes is usually a non-issue. Also, generally at schooling shows, such items are a non-issue. We have never had a footwear/legwear problem in any of the pleasure classes I have been in or witnessed.

          Judges really do just look for how 'dead broke' your horse is. and the greater number of deadbroke horses, the more likelihood you will be asked for more (hand gallop, halt, dismount, etc.).

          Usually, also at schooling shows, if you have a legitimate issue and cannot mount from the ground, they usually let you use something like a mounting block - the important thing is that your horse stands to be mounted.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by cnvh View Post
            Makes sense. My one concern is that I do always ride my guy with boots (he toes out in front and sometimes knocks himself), which I know is a no-no in hunters. I wonder if I'll get the stink-eye with boots in a pleasure class? (This is a schooling show, mind you. We don't do A-rated anything; that's out of my league/pocketbook!)
            Since it's a schooling show, I'd ask the question of the gate person, or ask at the secretary's desk if the boots would be permissable. At a rated show, the boots would be a no-no (as they would be in a hunter class).

            Also -- no martingales.
            Why do I like most horses better than most people?

            Comment


            • #7
              Makes sense. My one concern is that I do always ride my guy with boots (he toes out in front and sometimes knocks himself), which I know is a no-no in hunters. I wonder if I'll get the stink-eye with boots in a pleasure class? (This is a schooling show, mind you. We don't do A-rated anything; that's out of my league/pocketbook!)
              I'm going to go with no boots, even for pleasure at a schooling show. I'm sure you can ask, but generally they're wondering what they're hiding. While they're looking at manners and way of going, suitability counts, and a horse that's going in boots might be appear to be unsuitable.
              ---
              They're small hearts.

              Comment


              • #8
                If it is a schooling show, ask management. Boots are no-no in any flat class unless management ok's it.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Admit I am completely in the dark as to the difference between pleasure over fences and Hunter over fences if both are 2' and have 3 o/f and a flat class.

                  Hunters are, really, Pleasure horses over fences. if somebody can enlighten me, please have at it.

                  Oh, any boots on the horse are usually verbooten in any flat class, breed or open and not allowed in the Hunters over fences. Because if he hits himself? That is a fault, isn't it? That is what they are judged on. Not tripping or hitting themselves. Why advertise it if they do with protective boots?
                  When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                  The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The three schooling shows I attend, boots are not aloud. In fact this last weekend, The judge called down to me in the second flat class and told me to tell the rider that she didn't pin because of her bell boots. She didn't see them in the first class because the boots blinded in pretty good and she was judging from upstairs (not as close as the judges stand)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Usually if there is an O/F in the Pleasure division, it's over crossrails, and (in theory) the judge should not penalize trotting the fences, adds on the lines, simple changes, etc. All that is supposed to matter is the horse gets over the obstacles safely and willingly. As in, if there was a log across the trail, would your horse get you to the other side easily and safely. If the prize list says 2', my guess is that it will be smaller, esp. if there are small ponies in the class. Of course, the smoothest trip will win. Just based on what I encountered.
                      Why do I like most horses better than most people?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by ShaSamour View Post
                        In Pleasure, the emphasis is on manners and suitability to purpose. If your horse appears to be a safe, sane, pleasant horse to hack out on, that's it. The judges are looking for a light contact, prompt transitions, and a nice attitude. Being a nice mover helps, but isn't essential. You may be asked to extend the trot, hand gallop, halt, halt and drop reins, back, dismount/mount from the ground, trot over ground poles, back between ground poles. Obedience is key, but with minimal input from the rider.

                        At least that was my experience, in something over 250 pleasure classes in the original Sha Samour's show career. And we won most of them.
                        You really need to ask show management. In my experience when there is an over fences class as part of the pleasure division they look like the hunter classes, except in pleasure no martingales allowed and no deductions for adding strides in the lines if it is smooth. I've never ridden in any pleasure division where boots were allowed on the horses. Or where you had to extend the trot, hand gallop, halt, halt and drop reins, back, dismount/mount from the ground, trot over ground poles, back between ground poles.

                        Although I do agree with this: " The judges are looking for a light contact, prompt transitions, and a nice attitude."

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I do the pleasures with a horse of mine because he just isn't a hunter type mover on the flat and we aren't polished enough yet to do well in the o/f hunters (we need lead changes, and we often add in lines because I am still working on being able to keep him well balanced while allowing/encouraging him to step bigger - he can be hard to balance etc). I do the hunter stuff for experience/mileage/schooling.... but it's fun to do something we are good at, too.

                          No boots, no martingale, no flash.
                          I use a fitted pad.

                          Like other said it's about how mannerly your horse is how pleasant and easy to ride they seem to be.

                          I've never had to extend trot, hand gallop etc. We have had to halt and back up. Never had to dismount/mount.
                          2016 RRP Makeover Competitor www.EnviousBid.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            When it comes to the fun stuff -- extend the trot, hand gallop, halt and drop reins, etc., it really depends entirely on the judge. Some judges will judge pretty much like hunter under saddle and not really ask for anything more than a halt, or maybe back. Others will test the daylights out of you. Kennis Fairfax was one who really put us through our paces, including individual tests. I was actually tested harder at schooling shows than at most rated shows.

                            I had a blast doing Pleasure. The original Sha Samour was as politically incorrect as you get on the H/J circuit -- 7/8 Arab - 1/8 Tennessee Walker. Go figure. He looked like a little, fine quarter horse, until he started to move, and the tail gave him away (EEK! Arab!). But we cleaned up in Pleasure, because he was the genuine article. I used to look forward to being tested, because Sam did have a distinct extended trot, and a true gallop, and he made it all look easy.

                            Just relax, and have fun!
                            Why do I like most horses better than most people?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by findeight View Post
                              Admit I am completely in the dark as to the difference between pleasure over fences and Hunter over fences if both are 2' and have 3 o/f and a flat class.

                              Hunters are, really, Pleasure horses over fences. if somebody can enlighten me, please have at it.
                              Like some have said, and my guess would be, hunters is about the perfect PICTURE-ideal form, legs tucked exactly right, hitting the exact number of strides, etc. It might actually be taking a huge effort for the rider to push the necessary buttons. Pleasure is a pleasurable ride--the rider doesn't need extras (martingales), the horse goes willingly, if not necessarily stylishly, doing the perfect number of strides is not as important as maintaining a comfortable pace and the horse doing what the rider asks without any fuss, speeds up/slows down without making an issue of it--basically, a visible pleasure to ride, with a cooperative horse who might not be the most stylish mover.
                              Author Page
                              Like Omens In the Night on Facebook
                              Steampunk Sweethearts

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #16
                                Interesting, thanks all for the insights. Fortunately Horse and I have been schooling trail obstacles a lot lately-- opening/closing gates, reinback, turn on the haunches/forehand, sidepass over poles, etc.-- and he's getting to be a pro at all that stuff. About the only thing I'm certain we'd fail would be the ground mount-- he's 16.2, I'm 5'3" with hobbit legs; I ALWAYS mount from a mounting block, trailer, tree stump, etc. (He DOES stand for mounting though!)

                                One of the flat classes in this division is a Stakes class (albeit with a tiny payout), so I'm wondering if that means lots of tests... if so, yay! Horse is fine O/F, doesn't have a stop in him, but I'd love to show off all our hard work on the flat this winter.

                                I'd be OK leaving the boots off for a flat class or two, but I really wouldn't want to jump him without them. Guess I'll call the venue next week and ask...
                                *friend of bar.ka

                                "Evidently, I am an unrepentant b*tch, possible trouble maker, and all around super villian"

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  I've never seen a pleasure class over fences. In the flat classes you might see saddle seat horses depending on where you are in the country and you will likely have some wenglish horses (QH and paints doing the breed version of english) as well as regular hunter types.

                                  Comment

                                  Working...
                                  X