Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You're responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the Forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it--details of personal disputes may be better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts, though are not legally obligated to do so, regardless of content.

Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting. Moderators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts unless they have been alerted and have determined that a post, thread or user has violated the Forums' policies. Moderators do not regularly independently monitor the Forums for such violations.

Profanity, outright vulgarity, blatant personal insults or otherwise inappropriate statements will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

Users may provide their positive or negative experiences with or opinions of companies, products, individuals, etc.; however, accounts involving allegations of criminal behavior against named individuals or companies MUST be first-hand accounts and may NOT be made anonymously.

If a situation has been reported upon by a reputable news source or addressed by law enforcement or the legal system it is open for discussion, but if an individual wants to make their own claims of criminal behavior against a named party in the course of that discussion, they too must identify themselves by first and last name and the account must be first-person.

Criminal allegations that do not satisfy these requirements, when brought to our attention, may be removed pending satisfaction of these criteria, and we reserve the right to err on the side of caution when making these determinations.

Credible threats of suicide will be reported to the police along with identifying user information at our disposal, in addition to referring the user to suicide helpline resources such as 1-800-SUICIDE or 1-800-273-TALK.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it's understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users' profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses -- Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it's related to a horse for sale, regardless of who's selling it, it doesn't belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions -- Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services -- Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products -- While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements -- Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be "bumped" excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues -- Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators' discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the �alert� button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your �Ignore� list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you'd rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user's membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 5/9/18)
See more
See less

GM is nothing but a bully.

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Originally posted by rileyt View Post
    But for the record, only two of you were brave enough to answer my question. (thank you Perfect Pony and Lucassb, although we'll have to agree to disagree)
    I must be wearing my invisible cloak today.

    Comment

      Original Poster

      Originally posted by sptraining View Post
      Horses and children know when you're fair. They both can take the discipline if they feel that it's justified and when they receive compliments when they deserve them.
      One of the best comments yet, IMO.

      And to Lucassb, I don't believe for a second that he called the girl a dumbell as a calculated teaching method to get her to do better -- let's get real (and if he did, that's a pretty poor teaching method). The fact that he later complimented her is entirely beside the point. I'd say its more likely evidence of a guilty conscience, but I doubt he cares that much.

      Comment


        Originally posted by SaturdayNightLive View Post
        I notice that those of you posting about the "mean" comment he made haven't actually WATCHED the clinic in question. He did call the girl a dumbbell - he told her repeatedly to do something and she didn't do it. Later in the clinic she did something beautifully and he told her that too. I definitely wouldn't call his tone that of a bully.

        And it's easy to mistake tone, especially when you already have your mind made up that "George Morris is nothing but a bully". But you didn't hear him say anything, you read it in an article and then projected your own tone and feelings onto it.

        And these girls aren't that young. They're all pushing 18 and they all knew what they were signing up for.

        If you honestly believe that GM is a bully, then I hope that you never ever try to participate in any other sports. Some of the things I've heard tennis and football coaches say to players who weren't listening would make your ears bleed. GM is a kitten compared to some of them.

        And yes, GM sometimes comments about people's weight. Is it such a crime that he expects people to take their sport seriously? Would you be as offended if a ballet teacher or gymnastics coach made the same comments? Being overweight DOES effect your riding (ask me how I know) and GM has every right to comment on it.
        Much of what GM says is pure theatre, done for effect (look how people rise to the bait) and delivered with a twinkle in the eye, and totally deadpan.

        In the last GM clinic I took part in, a couple years ago at Morven Park, I wound up in the 3-6" session, on horse that was actually pretty green. I had requested the 3' session, but it had filled, and so based on my resume we found ourselves in the advanced group. I nonetheless managed to earn the dunce cap myself after doing a couple hairbrained things (misunderstood his directions, went off course on the flat; brought the whole works to a dead stop by dropping my jacket right on the track we were working on, and in such a place that ONLY GM was available to pick it up?) but I can attest to the fact that GM's theatrics (including the withering descriptions) are not so utterly wounding that one is forever scarred.

        Most of his critiques are delivered in a manner which is calibrated precisely to the tolerance level of the individual they are targeted for. Keep that in mind, and don't project your own feelings into the mix...riders in this bunch know it's a tough kitchen, and are zipped up into their thermal heat shields well in advance. They will all live to joke about it (yes, even though it's on video).

        Lighten up folks, I mean, really...Is the horse dead yet? Or is it only me that can't find a pulse?
        Last edited by M. O'Connor; Jan. 7, 2011, 01:41 PM.
        Inner Bay Equestrian
        www.USSHBA.org
        KERx

        Comment


          Originally posted by trubandloki View Post
          I must be wearing my invisible cloak today.
          Ditto.

          Comment


            Can't help but think that we would all be much better off as individuals, trainers, riders, business people, parents, you name it, if we toughened up, took responsibility for our own growth and excellence and respected the wisdom of those mentors who have walked the walk, regardless of the presentation.

            To be stalled at words looses sight of the big picture. NO ONE teaching today comes close to GM's background, experience and knowledge of the sport. He bridges two worlds of horsemanship and represents the very best of the valuable, never-to-return past glories, systems, basics and correctness. Many horsemen/women are superb communicators and technicians. Many are talented riders who can perform to perfection, but can't communicate. GM has come upon his career and reputation through hard work, committment and focus. Doesn't he admit he was never a natural rider? Don't you think he was hard on himself as a young rider? I know his teachers and mentors were tough on him, but you can be sure he was his own toughest critic.

            Why should he expect any less from those who seek him out? Or those who will carry on his legacy?

            IMO, if you want to be the best you can be, you work with the best, wherever you find him/her. You grow in knowledge, wisdom and personhood; you do not let go of the big picture. To be distracted by words is to lose focus, doesn't it?
            Form follows function, or does function follow form?

            www.clearvisionequine.com

            http://clearvisionequine.blogspot.com

            Comment

              Original Poster

              Sorry if I didn't credit everyone who thinks they replied to the question I asked.

              But, Trubandloki - respectfully, I think there is a difference in saying "She paid for his opinion and got it" and saying "I think its appropriate to call the girl a dumbell." But if you are in the camp of thinking its an appropriate comment, I will gladly make a mental note of it.

              Comment


                Originally posted by M. O'Connor View Post
                Most of his critiques are delivered in a manner which is calibrated precisely to the tolerance level of the individual they are targeted for.
                Exactly.

                He's been doing this for a LONG time. It's not exactly his first rodeo.

                Comment


                  "A trainer is one who teaches a specified skill, while an educator gives intellectual, systematic instruction for particular purposes through development of character and mental abilities."

                  Emotional abuse: "the debasement of a person's feelings that causes the individual to perceive himself or herself as inept, not cared for, and worthless"


                  I personally observed GM doing a clinic and I can his knowledge is great, however, his professionalism is not that which USEF should be endorsing.
                  He does not respect the horses nor the riders.
                  Every professional in the horse industry should adhire to these principals and only those who do so should be endorsed by USEF
                  “Integrity”
                  ‘An uncompromising adherence to a code of moral, artistic, or other values: utter sincerity, honesty, & candor: avoidance of deception, expediency, artificiality, or shallowness of any kind’
                  “Respect”
                  ‘To show consideration for, to avoid intruding upon, to notice with special attention, to regard to consider, to view, treat or consider with some degree of courtesy’
                  “Trust”
                  ‘Confidence; a reliance or setting of the mind on the integrity, veracity, justice, friendship,or other sound principle of another person or thing’
                  www.hartetoharte.org
                  Ask and allow, do not demand and force.

                  Comment


                    But I'm shocked that people are defending this specific instance. Are you? Do all of you really think its appropriate to call someone a dumbell in a public lesson like this? Even assuming the girl rode 50 circles? [And let me clarify... that question has nothing to do with whether the girl should be able to "handle it". Maybe she can... maybe she can't... But that's really not the point. Do you REALLY think its appropriate behavior? Because that's what I'm hearing, and I couldn't disagree more.]

                    Yes, I really think it's appropriate.

                    Top level sport; rising level athlete aspiring to master level being taught by the top master in our sport.

                    Did not do as they were told.

                    Wastes time of other paying clinic members, auditors and coach by not following instructions.

                    He called her a dumb bell. Hardly character crushing. And do we know how the rider feels about the scenerio? Somehow I doubt she's as upet as you are about it.

                    So we'll have to agree to disagree that a rising level seriously competitive athlete in a masters class being taught by *the* master of this sport is going to be crushed by this or that the master coach needs to be kinder/gentler in his approach. His approach put him at the very top of this sport and then created a new level above that, a level only he is on in regards to both accomplishments and results. Is he God? Lordy no. Is he the best of the best? Absolutely according to his resume.

                    As stated before..it's a sport. Treat it like a sport and you produce athletes. If you want kind and gentle, stick to Midget Football where everyone gets s trophy and everyone is there for fun. If you want to be really serious and go for the top levels...the coaching gets tougher. The Midget Football coach Stuart Smalley creates completely different athletes than say...Mike Ditka in the NFL did.

                    Though his comments in his recent riding pictorial in PH were a bit milder towards himself, than they would have been to a mere mortal sending in the same picture, and he defaults to using age and falls as a reason for his position. In his "clinics" where riders send in a picture, he does not allow the same liberties.
                    Well, to be fair:
                    1) He has already proven himself as a rider, he's not critiquing someone learning
                    2) Even at his age he can still get on a very fractious horse and have it going correctly in very little time...after asking the rider less 1/3 his age to get off.
                    3) Turning 73 this year...at this age your body simply cannot do the things it did 50 years ago. Same with someone who has eaten footing more time than they can count.
                    4) GM knows function over form when it gets to the point that your body can no longer physically attain the 100% correct looking form. But he's still got the function part down cold.
                    5) If a rider in/near the same level of proven accomplishment as he has sent in a photo for critique, he'd probably not ding them on form as much as he would someone much less accomplished.
                    You jump in the saddle,
                    Hold onto the bridle!
                    Jump in the line!
                    ...Belefonte

                    Comment


                      ROFLMAO!!!!!!! touche!
                      www.shawneeacres.net

                      Comment

                        Original Poster

                        Originally posted by findeight View Post
                        And, rileyt, you really think GM is a moron?
                        I understand where you got this impression, but no, that is not what I meant. I was speaking generically (as in, no one should fall to pieces just because some idiot calls them a mean name).

                        I acknowledge that the man knows more about horses than I will probably ever know.

                        But I do think he's a first rate jerk.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by rileyt View Post
                          Sorry if I didn't credit everyone who thinks they replied to the question I asked.
                          No one would care one way or the other if you did not make some dramatic statement about how only two people were willing to answer.

                          I was saying I find nothing wrong with GM calling her a dumbbell. From what it sounds like she was not listening and not trying to do was she was instructed. Dumbbell is not the word I would pick, mine might not have been so nice.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by rileyt View Post
                            One of the best comments yet, IMO.

                            And to Lucassb, I don't believe for a second that he called the girl a dumbell as a calculated teaching method to get her to do better -- let's get real (and if he did, that's a pretty poor teaching method). The fact that he later complimented her is entirely beside the point. I'd say its more likely evidence of a guilty conscience, but I doubt he cares that much.
                            You are entitled to your opinion and we can agree to disagree. I think you're letting your overall opinion of GM color your view of this specific situation.

                            I will point out that it did work, and he got her to execute the exercise correctly ...after he got her attention, so to speak. So you might not like his approach, but it was effective, which is the point of a clinic like that. The riders are there to learn, to step their skills up a notch or two, and to become better riders.

                            Not a prayer that he had a guilty conscience; in fact, that is pretty hilarious. He is quite clear that he believes that if you can't take the heat, people... get out of the kitchen!

                            (yes, a direct quote from an earlier session.)
                            **********
                            We move pretty fast for some rabid garden snails.
                            -PaulaEdwina

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by rileyt View Post
                              But I do think he's a first rate jerk.
                              Luckily for you, it's easy enough to avoid him.

                              Comment


                                And to Lucassb, I don't believe for a second that he called the girl a dumbell as a calculated teaching method to get her to do better -- let's get real (and if he did, that's a pretty poor teaching method). The fact that he later complimented her is entirely beside the point. I'd say its more likely evidence of a guilty conscience, but I doubt he cares that much.
                                So now you know exactly how he thinks and what he means at all times? And that there's no way over half a century being at the very top levels and almost as long being a top level coach he'd have learned and implemented a calculated teaching method? And that after tens of thousands of clinic riders and students that he can't read a person and tailor a lesson or comment directly to them?

                                Seriously????

                                So your assumption is that he felt guilty and doesn't really care much....*sigh*...wish I had a career where I cared so little I was still doing it full time at the age of 73.

                                We get it, you obviously loathe the man. You're not going to listen to a single point or opinion with an open mind. Fine, no big deal. I'm sure both you and George will sleep fine tonight anyway.

                                And please add me onto your list that does think calling someone a very mild dumb bell when they ignore a direct instruction perfectly fine.

                                I doubt the actual rider called a dumb bell cares 1/10 as much you do about this whole thing. She didn't get to Master Class level by being a jackwagon crybaby. She knew she was going to hear from the very best and she knew what his methods were like. Big kudos to her for getting there...takes a buttload of work and talent to get there. And nope, just getting there doesn't make you immune from being called a dumb bell. Dollars to donuts she, like every rider that's ever shown mid to top levels, has ridden oout of a show ring and had her personal everyday trainer ask her, "What were you thinking in there you dingbat?"
                                You jump in the saddle,
                                Hold onto the bridle!
                                Jump in the line!
                                ...Belefonte

                                Comment


                                  I've seen people who are paying a LOT more than the kids in this group get called MANY worse things than "dumb-bell," by trainers with not a FRACTION of the skill and experience of GM, btw...

                                  No one seems to start threads about how horrible THOSE trainers are....
                                  Inner Bay Equestrian
                                  www.USSHBA.org
                                  KERx

                                  Comment


                                    [QUOTE=rileyt;the man knows more about horses than I will probably ever know.

                                    But I do think he's a first rate jerk. [/QUOTE]

                                    Obviously. Get over yourself.
                                    Form follows function, or does function follow form?

                                    www.clearvisionequine.com

                                    http://clearvisionequine.blogspot.com

                                    Comment


                                      To answer riley's question- no, I don't think what GM said was inappropriate. He didn't curse, he didn't bring up any irrelevant issues (race, gender, religion), and apparently after she did it correctly he praised her. I suppose he could have simply asked her "do you think you are above following instructions or are you just not intelligent enough to follow them?". Personally I would rather be called a dumbell.

                                      Everyone at that clinic was well aware of what was expected of them. Not following directions at that level us unacceptable.

                                      Comment


                                        But I'm shocked that people are defending this specific instance. Are you? Do all of you really think its appropriate to call someone a dumbell in a public lesson like this? Even assuming the girl rode 50 circles? [And let me clarify... that question has nothing to do with whether the girl should be able to "handle it". Maybe she can... maybe she can't... But that's really not the point. Do you REALLY think its appropriate behavior? Because that's what I'm hearing, and I couldn't disagree more.]

                                        Yes, I feel it is appropriate. They signed-up for a public clinic and worked hard to qualify for it. The fact that is public is what makes it so great -- the average person can watch and learn from these great riders and GM. I love that it is public and an enjoying every minute!

                                        Would you agree with the statement more if it was not a public clinic? I would think not. So public or not -- is not the issue.

                                        And to quote GM himself, "This is horse riding, not tiddlywinks." So, if you are letting demeaning statements take away from your ability to learn, you are losing out on a lot of lessons throughout life. It is not always the delivery that teaches, but the receptors interpretation.

                                        Comment


                                          Welcome to the real world. People talk like that and much worse everyday out in corporate America. This clinic gives the riders a great chance to toughen up and learn how to shrug it off and go on! I am not saying I like it or agree with it, but its a fact of life... no time like the present to learn it.

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X