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Moving back to the states after a very long break

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  • Moving back to the states after a very long break

    I am currently moving back to the states after a very long break down here in Australia. I have a few questions though;

    First of all, I have been riding for 20 years now and I first learnt how to ride in America where I competed on the ponies at a high level. Since moving back to Australia I went onto show jumping, mainly because we don't have a hunter division down here, just hacking (yuck). I would love to get back into the hunters again as an adult, but I'm not sure what I'm eligable for. I'm turning 29 in October, and I would be competing as an amateur. (Although, any clarification on this would be appreciated, I assume its the same rules as here in Aust, but they bear repeating, and I could be wrong)

    Secondly, having said all that, I would also like to continue competing in the Jumper's, and my question here is, can I do both? And could someone please break down the Jumping divisions for me, I have done a lot of reading about this, but its a different system than I am used to, so it gets a bit confusing

    Thirdly, can anyone recommend any really good trainers in the MD/VA area who can undo all the bad habits I picked up on the Australian scene and who would be willing to hold my hand until I get used to how things are done over there again?

    As an aside, Im not a complete moron when it comes to all this, but like I said, the way the Aussies do things is completely different from the way you do them.

    Thanks in advance! (And no harm in asking right?)

  • #2
    You can always compete in hunters and jumpers at the same show. There are divisions at every height for ammy's (max 3'6" (1.07m) hunters/ max 4'7" (1.40m) jumpers) above that and you compete in open divisions which anyone can enter. As far as breaking down the levels to you... how about you give a general height you want to compete? Classes go from 2' to 5' at regular intervals. For specific ammy divisions check out the rulebook on USEF.org (go to competitions then rulebook, then jumpers or hunters) A good trainer will have no problem holding your hand and guiding you through ever step. That is a very american thing in hunter/jumpers so have no fear.

    PS you'll be eligible for everything until you show in a division here that make you ineligible for something else. And even then, for most things eligibility starts over at every show for ammy stuff. A trainer will easily help you with this.

    And I wouldn't put down your riding skills yet, the Aussies are pretty good riders (at least at the international levels)

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      Ahh, thank you very much for that!

      As for heights, I have competed in B Grade here in Australia, but the whole point of me moving back to the states is to go "all the way" so to speak. So thank you for the clarification.

      I've downloaded the rulebook and it has been my "bible" for the past few weeks, but some of the sections and subsections are worded in a way that was slightly confusing. I was scratching my head over a few things (mainly the rules regarding ammys)

      Any other hints tips, or friendly advice would be much appreciated. I want the move to be as smooth as possible (which is kind of impossible considering the magnitude of the actual moving side of things!)

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        come on... really?! 1 response?? Help out a fellow equestrian who is doing a big leap here....

        Name me some trainers;
        Give me some tips;
        Help me out here....

        Comment


        • #5
          no idea about most. the only rule i remember well, is the ammy rule. If you get paid to do something horse related.. you can only ride your own or a (Official) leased horse. Any other horses + money/discounts for horse related stuff = pro.

          Comment


          • #6
            Trainers in MD/VA? There are literally hundreds. It's a hotbed of H/J activity. You can't spit without hitting a trainer. When you know exactly where you're going to be, how far you want to travel and what kind of trainer you want, we can be of help.

            Flyracing said: PS you'll be eligible for everything until you show in a division here that make you ineligible for something else. And even then, for most things eligibility starts over at every show for ammy stuff. A trainer will easily help you with this.

            I can't imagine what that means. There are no pro only divisions, and if you step into pro waters it takes a year of non-pro activity before you can go back to competing as an amateur.

            Welcome.

            Give us more info, and you won't be able to stop the flow from this board...
            madeline
            * What you release is what you teach * Don't be distracted by unwanted behavior* Whoever waits the longest is the teacher. Van Hargis

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              Okay, thanks.

              I haven't decided yet where exactly I will be moving, it all depends on what top notch trainers are in the area. I have narrowed it down to Middleburg and surrounds though. Although Lexington is looking rather tempting. I really have no idea as yet.

              The plan so far is to head over for 3 months to "stake out the situation" but I need a starting point. Hence why I need some names. I would like to be able to travel to these trainers and check out their facilities, take a few lessons and see if I can find someone I click with.

              I understand that most trainers are sharks with an inbuilt money radar (well, at least they are here - and Ive had some dodgy experiences in the states in the past), so if possible I would prefer someone who genuinely wants to stick with me because of my determination to get to the top, and not because they feel they can fleece my pocketbook.

              I do not have to travel to work as I am self employed and work from home. I do not mind commuting to a trainer and I am planning on keeping my horses at home.

              I am looking for a trainer who can take me to the top in Hunter/ Jumpers, but mainly Jumpers. Expense is no issue, my budget is rather... uh, large.

              So, just a list of names for me to start with would be incredibly helpful. Google is not at all useful for this kind of detective work.

              Anything else you want to know, ask. I will try and fill in as many details as I can, but as yet, a lot is still undecided. I will know more when I actually step foot on American soil.

              Comment


              • #8
                Well, if you are planning to move to the Middleburg area (welcome!), and want to mostly do the jumpers, and have the budget, I can't think of anyone that I would recommend more highly than Joe Fargis (unless it would be Katie Monahan Prudent, but she isn't often at her farm here).

                Second would be Kim Prince (a long-time student of Katie), in Hume, and she does both hunter and jumpers, and has a lovely facility. Just like Joe and Katie, she is very demanding, but the results speak for themselves. http://www.kimprince.net/index.html
                Cherry Blossom Farm - Show & Field Hunters, Side Saddles

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  I wasnt aware Joe Fargis was in the area... See?! This is why I need help!

                  Also, another question. Would it be to my benefit to lease a horse for the 3 months Im over there so I can drag it around to all these trainers for trial lessons...?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by flyracing View Post
                    You can always compete in hunters and jumpers at the same show. There are divisions at every height for ammy's (max 3'6" (1.07m) hunters/ max 4'7" (1.40m) jumpers) above that and you compete in open divisions which anyone can enter. As far as breaking down the levels to you... how about you give a general height you want to compete? Classes go from 2' to 5' at regular intervals. For specific ammy divisions check out the rulebook on USEF.org (go to competitions then rulebook, then jumpers or hunters) A good trainer will have no problem holding your hand and guiding you through ever step. That is a very american thing in hunter/jumpers so have no fear.

                    PS you'll be eligible for everything until you show in a division here that make you ineligible for something else. And even then, for most things eligibility starts over at every show for ammy stuff. A trainer will easily help you with this.

                    And I wouldn't put down your riding skills yet, the Aussies are pretty good riders (at least at the international levels)
                    Where it starts getting sticky is in the Amateur Owner divisions and in certain Adult divisions where height of fences might limit you... so you'll need to brush up on that. Sad to say but some trainers are not as knowledgeable about the Ammy/Owner rules as they should be; others are very knowledgeable.. but not to worry you can cross that bridge when you come to it...

                    Welcome back to USA

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by gottagrey View Post
                      Where it starts getting sticky is in the Amateur Owner divisions and in certain Adult divisions where height of fences might limit you... so you'll need to brush up on that. Sad to say but some trainers are not as knowledgeable about the Ammy/Owner rules as they should be; others are very knowledgeable.. but not to worry you can cross that bridge when you come to it...

                      Welcome back to USA
                      Which is one reason I was asking the OP for a general level/height she was going to be competing at seeing as there will a lot of different regulations between showing 3', 3'7", and 4'7"! And as we all know, there is a LOT of rules! If the OP is prepared (riding skills and financially) to buy to one or more AO (4'7") horses and a working hunter (4'), then that would elicit a lot of different info than doing the AA jumpers at 3'7" or the AA hunters at 3'.

                      OP I know you said you want to go all the way, but where are you now in terms of training and horse power so we can give you more specifics without having to reword the whole rule book? Once you have a year of showing under your belt, you'll have it pretty well figured out and what was mentioned on a BB before will be long forgotten Even just coming and watching shows once you get here will help make things make a lot more sense. I can really see how reading the rulebook with out knowing some of the jargon and lingo could really make it hard.

                      I also think the reason for low responses is because you aren't very specific about what you want. You will get lots of great answers if you ask specific questions. Example: I want to start out competing at in the one meter hunters and jumpers. What division is that? Can I use the same horse for both? What can I not do once I've entered those divisions?

                      Something like that and people will be really able to help you. Right know you are asking a big open-ended question that would be a big undertaking to really answer. And please know, I am not picking on your post, just trying to explain why you not getting loads of responses in my opinion.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Madeline View Post

                        Flyracing said: PS you'll be eligible for everything until you show in a division here that make you ineligible for something else. And even then, for most things eligibility starts over at every show for ammy stuff. A trainer will easily help you with this.

                        I can't imagine what that means. There are no pro only divisions, and if you step into pro waters it takes a year of non-pro activity before you can go back to competing as an amateur.

                        Welcome.

                        Give us more info, and you won't be able to stop the flow from this board...
                        I think you and I were thinking of different definitions of "division" being that you were thinking of riding as a pro being a division and riding as ammy as being another division.

                        I was referring to a collection of classes held at one height often limited to type of rider (junior, ammy, or open) of the class (commonly called a "division" at shows in the US)

                        In the US you can actually show in Pro divisions all you want and then ride in any ammy division you are eligible for (as long as you are an ammy). Pro/ open divisions are never limited to pro's in hunter or jumpers, but are open to all riders.

                        So, what I was trying to say is: if you ride in the Modified jr/am jumpers held at 1.20m this week, you can ride the same horse in the adult ammy jumpers next week held at 1.10m. However, you cannot compete the same horse in the modifieds and the adults in the same show. So in essence, eligibility "starts over" for each show in many (but not all) cases. That is what I meant.

                        And then of course there is different zone speculations that will effect eligibility. For example, in zone 7 are rider is not eligible for adult ammy jumpers if they have competed in any class at or above 1.25m in the previous 4 weeks before the competition.... see how complicated things can get?? And that's just part of the limitations on one division, in one zone!

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          #13
                          Originally posted by flyracing View Post
                          Which is one reason I was asking the OP for a general level/height she was going to be competing at seeing as there will a lot of different regulations between showing 3', 3'7", and 4'7"! And as we all know, there is a LOT of rules! If the OP is prepared (riding skills and financially) to buy to one or more AO (4'7") horses and a working hunter (4'), then that would elicit a lot of different info than doing the AA jumpers at 3'7" or the AA hunters at 3'.

                          OP I know you said you want to go all the way, but where are you now in terms of training and horse power so we can give you more specifics without having to reword the whole rule book? Once you have a year of showing under your belt, you'll have it pretty well figured out and what was mentioned on a BB before will be long forgotten Even just coming and watching shows once you get here will help make things make a lot more sense. I can really see how reading the rulebook with out knowing some of the jargon and lingo could really make it hard.

                          I also think the reason for low responses is because you aren't very specific about what you want. You will get lots of great answers if you ask specific questions. Example: I want to start out competing at in the one meter hunters and jumpers. What division is that? Can I use the same horse for both? What can I not do once I've entered those divisions?

                          Something like that and people will be really able to help you. Right know you are asking a big open-ended question that would be a big undertaking to really answer. And please know, I am not picking on your post, just trying to explain why you not getting loads of responses in my opinion.
                          It truly is like speaking a different language... I didnt think you were picking on my post, just trying to wheedle specifics out of me (which is fantastic, its making me think).

                          The reason Im asking about all this is because, like I said, I will be heading over for 3 months to suss out the situation and would like to sound reasonably knowledgeable about the show scene over there. Mainly so I don't get taken for a ride by some less scrupulous characters.

                          Like I said earlier, I have competed in B Grade Show Jumping over here which is anywhere between 1.20 m to 1.45 m (depending on the show, your region, etc) but I would like to go further with this (Grand Prix is my current goal).

                          I have been bumming rides off people for the past 10 years. I used to own a OTTB who I trained up to C Grade before she suffered an injury and had to be retired (totally not my fault, the jerk who was trucking her for me was negligent).

                          I haven't been able to progress any further than B grade due to a few reasons. Mainly the fact that I have been riding other peoples horses (and as lovely as my contacts are, they wont let me ride their A grader's for free..) and the shows here are just ridiculously far apart...

                          I want to continue to do the Hunters as well though, as it breaks things up and I genuinely enjoy it and this is where things get a bit foggy for me and it is like speaking a different language... why do the rules change for different heights? And Im totally bamboozled by this talk of Pros competing in Ammy events etc..

                          I plan to have 5-6 top notch horses after the first year with a few on the side to train up and sell. I figured my first year will be the adjustment and training period for me and subsequent years will be for getting down to the nitty gritties of showing.

                          Any other questions, let me know. But some of them I don't have answers for, hence why I'm asking questions...

                          I also think the reason for low responses is because you aren't very specific about what you want. You will get lots of great answers if you ask specific questions. Example: I want to start out competing at in the one meter hunters and jumpers. What division is that? Can I use the same horse for both? What can I not do once I've entered those divisions?
                          Yes, answer that question for me, I will think of a million more over night!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Lucinda View Post
                            I haven't been able to progress any further than B grade due to a few reasons. Mainly the fact that I have been riding other peoples horses (and as lovely as my contacts are, they wont let me ride their A grader's for free..) and the shows here are just ridiculously far apart...
                            Why would this be a problem since you say you have an unlimited buget and are going to campaign 5-6 top notch horses?
                            Auventera Two:Some women would eat their own offspring if they had some dipping sauce.
                            Serious Leigh: it sounds like her drama llama should be an old schoolmaster by now.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              If you tell us which specific parts of teh amateur rules you find confusing, we can probably clarify.

                              Joe Fargis was the first that came to mind for me too, but there are LOTS of top trainers near Middleburg- less so neear Lexington VA.
                              Janet

                              chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #16
                                Originally posted by RockinHorse View Post
                                Why would this be a problem since you say you have an unlimited buget and are going to campaign 5-6 top notch horses?
                                There are personal reasons why I don't have my own horse(s) at the moment, mainly due to the fact that this move is happening very soon and all my resources are going towards it. Besides, what the point in having my own when Im just going to have to sell it again in a few months time? Ive been planning this move for a few years now, and its not feasible to have my own string.

                                I havent always had a large budget (I never said unlimited), quite the opposite in fact (not that that is really any of your concern, but you seem to be questioning me). Fortune (I lie, it was damn hard work) has smiled upon me however and its now possible for me to really start planning this move.

                                I bum rides because, quite frankly, its easier for me, I get experience riding many different horses. It suited me for the time. And when I say "For Free", no money changes hands, I ride these horses because the owner may be in a bind, or they have come down sick and cant compete etc etc. I havent been fortunate enough to get a ride on an A grader (and trust me, its not from lack of trying)

                                As for the travel part of that reason, I do have a job to hold down and most of the big shows are interstate, which means at least 8 hours one way just to get there.

                                Does that adequately explain my situation?

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by Lucinda View Post
                                  .

                                  Does that adequately explain my situation?
                                  NO we want to know more?

                                  Why not the atlanta area we have some great trainers and are so close to many,many shows, such as:

                                  Atlanta, Aiken, Tryon, Brownland, Ocala, Kentucky Horsepark,Gulf Port,Jacksonville,Tampa just to name a few.

                                  Some of the best hunter trainer are also in our area, besides the jumper trainer.

                                  And not as pricey as Middleburg in terms of real estate, you can but a beautiful farm here for alot less.
                                  http://community.webshots.com/user/summitspringsfarm

                                  Comment

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