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Can't jump without trainer?!?!? Yes or no?

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  • #61
    I’ve been at a few different barns with variations of this rule. One was absolutely no jumping outside of a lesson, even trot poles or cavaletti. The barn my IHSA team was based out of in college was no jumping outside of a lesson, but we were free to set anything as poles on the ground. My current boarding barn lets anyone jump whenever, as long as there is someone else in the barn or the ring as a safety precaution. This works out well for me, because I’ve learned a ton by setting my own exercises and seeing what works and what doesn’t, and how to work through the less than perfect distances, etc.

    Agree with the previous posters - you need to decide what’s a dealbreaker for you and make your boarding decision accordingly.

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    • #62
      As a trainer and barm manager, NO WAY do I allow jumping whenever!! Your horse, but our place.
      We had a large group of people move in from a barn where it was basically a free for all. And frankly, most of them should not have been jumping without guidance, as their habits were terrible, and the horses were a hot mess. Hah, broken poles are expensive to replace!

      I do allow cantering poles or maximum 1' cavaletti, but it needs to be under a specific set of rules: you must ask if it's going to be ok first. If there are lessons going on,and you will be interfering, then no. If you are not on your own horse, no. If you are alone, no.
      We have 2 other very competent instructor/riders working for us, and none of us will jump alone. It's just not smart. For safety reasons, but also training reasons; sometimes you need someone on the ground to help you work things out. All of us carry a lot of insurance, along with with BO's insurance. If someone got hurt, all of us could be named in a suit, even if the injured party were jumping alone. Why would we risk everything just so somebody can do whatever they want? If you think you're good enough to jump around without guidance, buy your own place

      eta, if you push the boundaries, and break the rules, esp wrt jumping, well, we don't need you in our program. You are putting other people at risk to suit yourself

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      • #63
        Originally posted by TheMoo View Post
        One barn I was at had a new rule sheet posted and I didn’t see it until after I rode and jumped my horse. I felt like a jerk. When I saw the BO I told her about it and she just laughed and said that rule was for one person
        That one person is usually the reason the barns (and their insurance companies) have the rule to begin with When I was a BO 15 years ago, I had a rule that was pretty standard where I came from at the time (busier h/j barn, lots of barn rats), which was under 14 had to have a parent present, and juniors had to wear approved helmets. No restrictions on jumping because it was busy and one or two trainers and/or knowledgeable/trusted boarders or working students were onsite to stop dangerous behavior at all times. These were typical rules for the barns in the area and the times. My barn was smaller, and I did work offsite PT. And yep, I had that one boarder. As soon as the kid turned 14, her non-horsey mom would dump the kid at the barn, sometimes with a friend, and then leave for a couple hours. I looked out a window once and saw the kid on the ground using a dressage whip (mine) to try to beat her mare over a barrel turned on its side while an unknown (and no signed release) other kid was on kicking for all her worth. The barrel wasn't a jump, it was another boarder's who did barrel racing. I ran out of the house and stopped it, kid and mother were pissed because (like the OP) she's THEIR HORSE. Yeah, my rules. Horse had maybe done a couple trot poles to a xrail in lessons. Maybe. They left shortly after, dragging my name through the mud the whole way. Now? If I ever lose my mind and do it again, no juniors can ride on the property alone period, helmets for everyone, no jumping outside lessons. Period.

        Originally posted by scrbear11 View Post
        I don't jump without my trainer.

        I'm an adult ammy with my own farm. I trailer in for lessons.

        My horses are green. I would prefer to jump only while she's supervising. The horses jump once a week (at our lessons). At home we work over ground rails and cavaletti to master whatever we've worked on during our lesson.

        Works for me and my horses. They don't need to jump more than once a week.
        This is close to my current situation, except once my arena is in, I'll probably have the trainer come to me since I already have a full set of jumps. I don't even RIDE without texting two people and giving an estimated quitting time. Don't hear from in X minutes, reach out. No answer? Come out. Horses can be dangerous. All horses.

        COTH's official mini-donk enabler

        "I am all for reaching out, but in some situations it needs to be done with a rolled up news paper." Alagirl

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        • #64
          At barns where the jumps are communal, any adult could jump as long as they owned the horse they jumped, they carried Liability insurance naming the stable and its employees as additional insured, and the adult had medical insurance.There was also very specific releases signed. If the jumps were owned by the trainers, no one could jump unless in a lesson or under supervision of a trainer. Minors were never allowed to jump or even go over poles without being in a lesson.

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          • #65
            Originally posted by sauvignon1008 View Post
            Hi, so I'm switching to a new barn to board my ottb. I've owned her for a little under a year and she is still pretty green however, at my current boarding barn, I'm allowed to jump whenever. Now of course I don't, only maybe a few crossrails every once in a while or to work on position or finding distances in between lessons as I don't think it's good to overjump your horses - we do mainly focus on flatwork however I like having the option. At this new barn though, we aren't allowed to jump unless in a lesson. Not even tiny crossrails. Is this normal? I'm the only boarder as the barn just opened and this is a fancier barn but does this commonly happen? I get maybe for safety reasons, but she is my horse and if one of us gets hurt, that is my fault. She doesn't want the horse to learn any bad habits but I just want to have fun with her and if I do accidently teach her a bad habit, then I can live with that and we will work through it and learn and it's not like we would be jumping 4ft courses. Any advice? Am I over thinking it? Is this common? Thanks!
            As other posters have commented, this rule is quite common, and I think you will find, the more organized and professional the program, the more likely it is that you will run into this rule.

            The horse does indeed belong to you, but if you get hurt, the insurance companies will often take over and you may have absolutely no say in the whole situation. If you get hurt, you'll file medical claims with your insurance company. Your insurance company is completely within their right to pursue claims against the barn. It can cost thousands of dollars for a barn to defend itself against a lawsuit, which will put most barns out of business pronto.

            For many barns it is not worth risking a lawsuit to allow unsupervised jumping. Hold harmless agreements and liability waivers are helpful, but they aren't bullet proof and they certainly don't prevent lawsuits.


            Originally posted by sauvignon1008 View Post
            I'm 17 but I have been riding for 12 years and have trained several horses. The trainer is always on site and lives there so there would always be someone there. I just find it annoying as she is MY horse. I would totally understand if I was leasing her or something... I'm probably over thinking it. Thank's for the reply's!
            As other posters commented, the horse is yours but the property belongs to the BO and they get to set the rules. Often the rules are in place for safety reasons and/or to protect against liability. A BO exercising their rights to promote safety or protect themselves from liability may be an inconvenience but it is often what they need to do to survive.

            Comment


            • #66
              I agree, barn owner makes the rules and boarders should follow them. Especially minors, in this litigious society. Did you know your insurance company can sue on your behalf, without asking for your permission, to recover losses, even if it was totally, absolutely your fault, even if you ignored barn rules?

              Comment


              • #67
                Hi OP,

                This is a common rule (or a rule with some standard variations) for many boarding barns, as I'm sure you've found out through everyone's responses.

                One barn I was at had the "18 and under must ride with a helmet and may not jump outside of lessons. Certified helmet required for any rider doing poles/cavaletti/jumps". Another was no jumping outside of supervision if you were 18 or under (didn't have to be in a lesson, but did have to get permission each time) and came with a height limit (helmets required for all riders at all times at this barn). If you were 18+ you could jump without supervision but did need to get permission each time and came with a height limit. A few riders did have "blanket permission" but those were the exception and not the rule.

                Currently, at a place where helmets are mandatory for all riders in the program, and you may not jump outside of lessons without permission (and come with a height limit) - very similar to barn #2 above.

                Ultimately, the ones I am most familiar with come from a place of having riders who might be well intentioned but aren't the most technically skilled and giving them carte blanche to jump however they want, whenever they want, is not a situation where they make the best choices in.

                On the other hand, in each barn I have been in it is completely possible to be the exception to the rule. If you are competent, make good choices, don't overwork your horse (and don't overface yourself), then I've found that it's pretty easy to have the trainer in charge go "These are the rules that you need to follow, and if it doesn't work out we'll reconvene and assess what will be a better fit."

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by Edre View Post
                  Hi OP,


                  On the other hand, in each barn I have been in it is completely possible to be the exception to the rule. If you are competent, make good choices, don't overwork your horse (and don't overface yourself), then I've found that it's pretty easy to have the trainer in charge go "These are the rules that you need to follow, and if it doesn't work out we'll reconvene and assess what will be a better fit."
                  We have 4 juniors at our barn that lease and they are allowed to jump outside of lessons. However, they are given the max height they can do (which is going to be 2 foot at max!) and if the trainer says no jumping for whatever reason they don't jump. They also don't ride alone. I personally am there with 2-3 them regularly and they follow the guidelines given by the trainer. But only responsible kids/families are allowed to lease in the first place.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    There are no rules about what you can or can not do with your own horse at my barn. The caveat to that being that anything that damages arena footing is not allowed: no loose horses in arena, no wild lunging.
                    It is an adult only barn. If people want to jump their horse without a trainer they are free to do so, and often do. There is no resident trainer either.
                    I personally would not board somewhere that did not allow jumping outside of lessons since that just wouldn't work for me and my schedule.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      My barn has the following rules regarding minors and adults riding without a trainer present:

                      1) All minors must wear a helmet. If jumping adults and minors must wear a helmet. (If you don't wear a helmet and you ride with my trainer she will have words with you)

                      2) Minors may not jump without a trainer present and may not ride without an adult on property

                      3) Adults may jump without a trainer present.

                      #3 has come into play with a couple of young adults at the barn who have been over facing their horses and generally being rude arena hogs. We may have rule #3 revised to no jumping without a trainer present. If I do jump outside of lessons I keep it much smaller than what I do in my lessons, keep the questions easy and something that I was working on during my lessons. I always jump with people around and keep in mind the other riders in the arena.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        My suggestion is to get clarification from the property owner and then possibly keep looking for a barn that fits you. Trying to make a situation work rarely works. Sometimes there is a bit of trial and error to find what type of facility you can and cannot be comfortable with at this juncture of your riding. This also changes throughout your life and will need adjusting. Good luck

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          I've been at barns with the rule and barns without.
                          The barns that have it, it's for insurance purposes.
                          The one I was riding at the most, she said only with a trainer 18and under, 18+ still had to have another adult who has their first aid present.
                          Most places have the rule that you at least have to have another person present when jumping which to me is just common sense.

                          Tbh any barn I've been at that didn't have some sort of rule was very poorly managed. I still live by the I don't jump when alone rule.

                          You can work on position, finding distances and not ruin your horse with ground poles. All horses could always benefit from ground pole or caveletti work!

                          ​​​​

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