Stallion Spotlight

Total Hope-11-18-09-3662

Real Estate Spotlight

46thlane19
  • Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You�re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the Forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it�details of personal disputes may be better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts, though are not legally obligated to do so, regardless of content.

Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting. Moderators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts unless they have been alerted and have determined that a post, thread or user has violated the Forums� policies. Moderators do not regularly independently monitor the Forums for such violations.

Profanity, outright vulgarity, blatant personal insults or otherwise inappropriate statements will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

Users may provide their positive or negative experiences with or opinions of companies, products, individuals, etc.; however, accounts involving allegations of criminal behavior against named individuals or companies MUST be first-hand accounts and may NOT be made anonymously.

If a situation has been reported upon by a reputable news source or addressed by law enforcement or the legal system it is open for discussion, but if an individual wants to make their own claims of criminal behavior against a named party in the course of that discussion, they too must identify themselves by first and last name and the account must be first-person.

Criminal allegations that do not satisfy these requirements, when brought to our attention, may be removed pending satisfaction of these criteria, and we reserve the right to err on the side of caution when making these determinations.

Credible threats of suicide will be reported to the police along with identifying user information at our disposal, in addition to referring the user to suicide helpline resources such as 1-800-SUICIDE or 1-800-273-TALK.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it�s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users� profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses � Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it�s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who�s selling it, it doesn�t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions � Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services � Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products � While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements � Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be �bumped� excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues � Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators� discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the �alert� button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your �Ignore� list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you�d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user�s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 5/9/18)
See more
See less

George Morris on the SS list

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Bluey View Post
    My question is, if SS has been investigating for two years as told and has enough proof to ban as they have, since abusing kids is and has always been against existing laws, was the police notified?

    Such abusers are jailed when found out, as the media reports.
    There are several such stories ongoing right now.
    How come GM is not in jail, or is he?
    I may have missed that in all these pages.
    According to SafeSport policy “All allegations of child physical or sexual abuse will be reported to law enforcement authorities and the Center.”

    I think it’s safe to assume the allegations have been reported, but there are many reasons why the accused may not be in jail, including, but not limited to:

    the statute of limitations is up
    the case is still under investigation
    the victims may not be cooperative with law enforcement

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Bluey View Post

      Sure, I read about those reasons.

      Then, once enough to ban, I would think there is enough to call the police also?

      Obviously not, if this situation is not there, or not yet.

      Thank you for your explanation.
      If you report an incident of sexual misconduct with a minor, SafeSport representatives tell you they need to report it to the police. This doesn't mean the police will act on it; that is the responsibility of the police. Depending on where the alleged abuse occurred, the police may not have the manpower to assign someone, or the parties no longer live in the town/state. The world doesn't operate like TV shows (although sometimes we think it should). If the parties have moved away, what action should the police take beyond filing the report they receive from SS?

      Comment


      • https://www.npr.org/podcasts/510326/believed

        Everyone needs to listen, sorry if it has been posted I couldn't remember. Someone shared on FB and wow, its pretty eye opening to how abuse is covered up.
        Boss Mare Eventing Blog

        Comment


        • Originally posted by skydy View Post

          I thought it was strange that a dressage rider and her attorney husband would get on youtube and do this.
          To be fair, it might been seen as a bit weird we've all written 80 something pages of debate.

          Sometimes I ask myself why I care so much. I don't even live in the US anymore, but used to compete with USEF... I've heard people whisper about loads of people in the horse world and some other sports, and wondered why no one ever took a stand or said anything outside of tongue wagging to other peons. But also having had a predator in my own family (protected by a load of the family and their work for the police).... this sort of thing really touches a nerve.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Soaponarope View Post
            MVP I was referencing why people stand with George rather than why names hadn't been removed. I agree it's a bit too soon to expect his name to be obliterated.
            Oh, I see! I thought you were referring to the article and quote by some Tryon representative with a crafted and defensive answer given to a journalist. Sorry if this was not you and the link was not in you post.
            The armchair saddler
            Politically Pro-Cat

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Irish Ei's View Post
              Leave his name up as a burning reminder to all who choose this business.
              Worse (or maybe just more specifically): What is will mean at this point (or when Morris loses his appeal, if he does) is that this industry as a whole is willing to overlook pedophilia within its ranks. I think this is the reason that Jimmy Williams' named needed to be removed from arenas and awards. There's just no way to have that name signify "great horseman" without the new and recent codicil of his crimes.

              The AHSA/USEF has a bit of a history of tolerating "bad" until the reek is so bad that the public at large might know about it. That's true for the bans of past horse-killing pros; that's true for some pretty big horse drugging cases. I don't think the GHM issue and this cultural/political moment will allow the USEF to maintain that impervious, elitist "meh... we will do what we want to in our club, public perception be damned" stance that it has enjoyed in the past.
              The armchair saddler
              Politically Pro-Cat

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Synthesis View Post
                The whole situation hurts my heart and my head

                Do I stand with George? No, I stand with those who stand up as survivors.

                Do i I regret what I learned in his clinic when I had the opportunity to attend as a rider and watcher? No, he is a master horseman and teacher. That experience has been priceless in my development as an adult rider.

                Would i I attend one again now? I don’t think I even know the answer

                How do I balance a wealth of knowledge against the disclosure (not whispers) that he has done some very bad things? How do I process that the very things that make him such a skilled horseman and teacher also helped him do the things he has been investigated as doing?

                We all have lost. The survivors, GM, the equestrian community, all of us have lost and there are no winner here. My heart breaks for all.
                There are plenty of good trainers that have not molested children and have not been abusive to horses or humans over the course of decades. GM has destroyed the lives of the people he abused. They are dead or in jail or convicted felons with kiddie porn problems.

                I don't know how supporting George Morris or attending a clinic in the future could even be a question.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Dorito View Post

                  According to SafeSport policy “All allegations of child physical or sexual abuse will be reported to law enforcement authorities and the Center.”

                  I think it’s safe to assume the allegations have been reported, but there are many reasons why the accused may not be in jail, including, but not limited to:

                  the statute of limitations is up
                  the case is still under investigation
                  the victims may not be cooperative with law enforcement
                  Today's news in New York is that they are suspending the statute of limitations on old molestation claims, victims have one year to file! I wonder if other states will follow suit and if this will allow more victims of GM to come forward.
                  Last edited by BAC; Aug. 12, 2019, 10:50 AM. Reason: spelling

                  Comment


                  • There is a new bill that is planned to be introduced tomorrow that increases the accountability of the NGB. They determined NGB turned a blind-eye to abuse for too long.
                    https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...vMh8HmbrCasns4

                    Comment


                    • Apologies for another long ramble but I'd like to touch on a bit of a perplexing subject and that is the question of the parents.

                      Many of the stories here have to varying degrees described the parental lack of involvement and protection regarding abusive events that took place with their kids, in some cases actively dismissing them. I can only speak for my own parents and the middle class era that they raised their family in, the 60s and 70s, and not for the purpose of finding excuses, but to try to understand the psyche of that time.

                      They are both deceased now but in so many ways I remember my parents as loving, worldly, knowledgeable people. My siblings and I were raised in a household with lively interesting dinner conversations and encouragement to explore life to the fullest.

                      But I also recall them abiding by some suffocating societal constraints that frustrated me to no end. As an example, I remember my Mom telling me once to wait (turning into weeks!) to bring a new friend home 'from that newly arrived, slightly more well off family up the street..' until the new couch they'd been saving for was in place in our house.

                      As I grew older my mother began confiding in me (I can still smell the cigarettes, sitting on the back porch with her as she chain smoked) about an incident with my brother. She swore me to secrecy of course.

                      For a couple of years when the family was younger and before buying their own home, my parents had rented a house on a farm and had commuted to work from there. This was a large, old, established farm family, well respected in the community, with extended members throughout the area and several sons of their own.

                      One day my brother, 7 or 8 at the time had come home sobbing and had finally broken down to my mother and father about some ongoing incidents of a sexual nature with the older teenage farm boys. Horrified, my parents simply said this .. stay away from those boys. That was it. No more discussion, other than the later divulgement to me on the back porch. No confronting the important farm family, no police, no scene, no counselling for my brother, just a quick notice given that they would be leaving at the end of the lease.

                      In the following years we kids all went about our lives and my brother grew into a wonderful, amazing, but troubled human being. After my Mom and Dad's passing, and after a lifetime of fighting drug and alcohol abuse, he heartbreakingly took his own life.

                      My parents were both decorated WW2 veterans. My father was part of the armada that stormed the beaches of Normandy on D-day. They both went on to lead successful adventurous lives. But neither could find the will or the courage to break through the steely walls of society's expectations at that time and stand up for my brother. They instead fell into line and followed the unwritten rules of the day, to 'hush' about sexual abuse, to sweep it under the rug.

                      My mother agonized for years (to me only) about the horrific events of my brother's childhood, and the only strange solace she seemed to take was that she believed he didn't remember them. But because it was never discussed in our family that part of the story will remain an unknown.

                      With regards to the equine industry, to those who are not abusers but think this is all overblown, that it will die down, that life is about to get a little bumpy and then go back to normal, let me tell you there's a reckoning coming. The truth will out in the end.

                      Time to step up, get behind the survivors and land on the right side of history.
                      Last edited by ohmyheck; Aug. 12, 2019, 12:20 PM.
                      One touch of nature makes the whole world kin.
                      William Shakespeare

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by omare View Post
                        And the sherman act appears to only prohibits unreasonable retrictiion on commerce. Assuming such a ban is a restriction and it is challenged under that Act, the purpose of ss on its face is reasonable one would argue. While laws may not always be drafted so as to avoid conflict w other statutes and the Consitution, it was most likely all considered in the drafting of this bipartisan bill.
                        Not a legal scholar or nuthin', but can one argue that the Sherman Anti-Trust Act, written in 1890 or so and dealing with entities like Standard Oil in a very, very unregulated economy.... with just as much poverty being created for the many as wealth was being created for the few was:

                        1. Never written with the intention of keeping pedophiles from the kind of commerce that inherently involves contact with children?

                        2. Is not the right instrument to be used for interpreting the relationship between an organization like the USEF (which is compelled by SafeSport) and its professional members?

                        As I understand it, (I think), it's a big of a heavy lift to reframe the precedent or "interpretive habit" of deciding that a past statute written for some other purpose and extended to a new and present case isn't the right legislative arena or lens for handling this new one.

                        Sorry I haven't written more clearly. I'm not sure I understand the legal reasoning enough to do better. Again, sorry! But I think it's worth considering the legal basis for all this.
                        The armchair saddler
                        Politically Pro-Cat

                        Comment


                        • It will be interesting to see if the junior division numbers are affected, so as to reduce the possibility of future SS allegations.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Mardi View Post
                            It will be interesting to see if the junior division numbers are affected, so as to reduce the possibility of future SS allegations.
                            Sorry, I don't understand what you're saying. Can you explain what you mean?
                            "Facts are meaningless. You can use facts to prove anything
                            that's even remotely true."

                            Homer Simpson

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Synthesis View Post
                              The whole situation hurts my heart and my head

                              Do I stand with George? No, I stand with those who stand up as survivors.

                              Do i I regret what I learned in his clinic when I had the opportunity to attend as a rider and watcher? No, he is a master horseman and teacher. That experience has been priceless in my development as an adult rider.

                              Would i I attend one again now? I don’t think I even know the answer

                              How do I balance a wealth of knowledge against the disclosure (not whispers) that he has done some very bad things? How do I process that the very things that make him such a skilled horseman and teacher also helped him do the things he has been investigated as doing?

                              We all have lost. The survivors, GM, the equestrian community, all of us have lost and there are no winner here. My heart breaks for all.
                              It's pretty easy for me: I don't reward unconscionable behavior. Full stop.

                              Look, I haven't been in a spot where I desperately needed the help of Paul Valliere or where George Morris was the only horseman who could help me. But I think it's part of being an adult to take the action I can to defend my values. So there is no weighing the pros and cons in my mind. I am clear about that stopped wildly unethical behavior (or doing my part in that) trumps my wanting to get something related to my sport. I'll find another way or I'll go without. But I won't co-sign killing horses for insurance money or molesting children so that I can have fun. Not a hard decision.
                              The armchair saddler
                              Politically Pro-Cat

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Keep it Simple View Post
                                There is a new bill that is planned to be introduced tomorrow that increases the accountability of the NGB. They determined NGB turned a blind-eye to abuse for too long.
                                https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...vMh8HmbrCasns4
                                The way that the NGBs get bonuses for winning medals and get hurt for funding when they don't is likely a big part of the problem. It doesn't seem like the bill addresses this and I think it would go a long way to promoting more ethical behavior. Understand it's not just that money is nice, but those funds end up supporting basic functions - ie people - and so you add to the obvious dilemma, "if I report this, and we don't get a medal because of that, who here in the office will have to be laid off?" When you have a clear cut case of abuse, the answer should still be obvious, but as we've noted here, often it's the frog-in-boiling-water problem - all they have is an inkling, a rumor, maybe not clear evidence that Something's Not Right. Building a funding bonus metric that is say based on a new criterion - maybe grassroots participants, maybe elite participants, maybe accident-free hours of sport, whatever - could help change a lot.

                                Also, for what it's worth, the count of posts per page is configurable. For me we're only on page 42.
                                If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket

                                Comment


                                • Originally posted by mvp View Post

                                  It's pretty easy for me: I don't reward unconscionable behavior. Full stop.

                                  Look, I haven't been in a spot where I desperately needed the help of Paul Valliere or where George Morris was the only horseman who could help me. But I think it's part of being an adult to take the action I can to defend my values. So there is no weighing the pros and cons in my mind. I am clear about that stopped wildly unethical behavior (or doing my part in that) trumps my wanting to get something related to my sport. I'll find another way or I'll go without. But I won't co-sign killing horses for insurance money or molesting children so that I can have fun. Not a hard decision.
                                  I would quadruple like this if I could. And every trainer who has stuck up for him with morale outrage about the safesport process is off my clinic/trainer list as well.

                                  Comment


                                  • Originally posted by mvp View Post

                                    Not a legal scholar or nuthin', but can one argue that the Sherman Anti-Trust Act, written in 1890 or so and dealing with entities like Standard Oil in a very, very unregulated economy.... with just as much poverty being created for the many as wealth was being created for the few was:

                                    1. Never written with the intention of keeping pedophiles from the kind of commerce that inherently involves contact with children?

                                    2. Is not the right instrument to be used for interpreting the relationship between an organization like the USEF (which is compelled by SafeSport) and its professional members?

                                    As I understand it, (I think), it's a big of a heavy lift to reframe the precedent or "interpretive habit" of deciding that a past statute written for some other purpose and extended to a new and present case isn't the right legislative arena or lens for handling this new one.

                                    Sorry I haven't written more clearly. I'm not sure I understand the legal reasoning enough to do better. Again, sorry! But I think it's worth considering the legal basis for all this.
                                    none of that is very relevant to how it is used now, repeatedly, to regulate the processes of associations. the law consists not just of statute, but of the precedent that evolves over time. Much has happened since that law was enacted, as you say. The Sherman Act has been used to do all sorts of things that were never imagined at the time. So have many other statutes. Even bigger, who would have thought when the original Constitution was enacted that it would do a great many of the things that it has done, starting with substantive due process onward? For one example, that gay marriage is a constitutional right, or that you couldn't have prayer in schools? That they weren't envisioned at the time doesn't make those rulings wrong or invalid. We have a common law system, it is set up with the capacity for change and evolution.

                                    Comment


                                    • mvp I should probably also point out that the Sherman Act, in particular, has always been subject to a great deal of interpretation. On its face, it makes illegal "agreements in restraint of trade." Technically speaking, it was quickly determined that ANY contract, even a very legitimate one, restrains trade. So it was a short and rather immediate step to reading that as "unreasonable" restraints of trade, because Congress surely couldn't have meant to outlaw all contracts. And we all know how what is "reasonable" is subject to a LOT of interpretation! You can see why the law is a bit of a muddle and covers a very wide range of activities.

                                      Comment


                                      • Do we have a consolidated list of pros that are supporting GM on their special FB page? I'm busy pruning my FB friends list of the ones I know about.

                                        I lost respect for RD when I met him in Germany at a show just before the Seoul Olympics. He was very rude to folks who apporached him to show their support of him. Not a "big name" yet and was having regular meltdowns at shows because he was having trouble with the stress of showing.

                                        MW was caught in Aachen with plastic splinters in his horses splint boots when the ring steward checked them and he was barred from competing. No respect for him either.

                                        I know it was just a matter of time before someone set up a legal defense fund for GM. The histrionics of the pros supporting him is amazing. They need to educate themselves before they decide SS is awful.

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by Keep it Simple View Post
                                          There is a new bill that is planned to be introduced tomorrow that increases the accountability of the NGB. They determined NGB turned a blind-eye to abuse for too long.
                                          https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...vMh8HmbrCasns4
                                          The more I learn about the depth of the gymnastics cover-up at the highest levels, the more worried I become about what lies beneath at the USEF headquarters. I've been listening to a lot of gymnastics podcasts the last month (can you tell I have a long barn commute?) and the USAG is in a LOT of hot water. They almost lost their USOC certification over the winter; I had no idea. I really fear we may be next on the chopping block if we don't get our act together as a sport.

                                          For those of you wondering why some of us care so much, for me it's multifaceted.

                                          First, and most importantly, I care about keeping vulnerable people safe. That means survivors of all stripes, kids/teens, adults in situations where it's easier for people in power to take advantage of them (grooms/working students/assistants, etc.)...and on. So many of us use the barn as a refuge—those of us who capable ought to do what we can to ensure it's as safe as possible. I want to show survivors that we care about them and believe them, and I want to show abusers that there is no place for their predatory behavior in our community. Taking a public stand in this case is a small way to contribute to that goal, but small actions can add up to big results.

                                          Second, I care about the sport's longevity. We will not survive if we continue to make excuses and look the other way on the subject of abuse. The world is changing (for the better, in my mind) and we will absolutely get left in the dirt if we don't change with it. I forget where I read this but the phrasing stuck with me—in the 50s and 60s, young girls saved horse sports in the US. Society went through a massive shift then too, and horses as livestock became pretty much obsolete. But girls fell in love with the animal and the sport shifted to accommodate, and that's what allowed it to survive. If we want future generations to be able to enjoy this sport, we have to make cultural changes.

                                          If we stay on the track we've been on of making excuses for abuse or even just "run-of-the-mill" inappropriate behavior, USEF will get kicked out of the USOC eventually. US kids won't get to experience the awe of watching our best horses and riders competing on the biggest international stage there is. Parents will stop wanting to bring their kids to lesson barns, in the same way that many are steering their kids away from football or gymnastics now. We're hanging by a thread as it is; we can't afford to add another black mark against ourselves.

                                          This will get worse before it can get better. We're at the beginning of the reckoning, and there will be many more "old" reports coming out. How we as a community respond to the early revelations will dictate whether those currently being abused feel like they can come forward or not.

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X