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  • Originally posted by Horsegirl's Mom View Post

    Thank you for sharing this.

    To answer your question: Yes, I think it would absolutely sway my opinion--and more importantly, the arbitrator's--if the accused didn't testify. In fact, I think it would be a very rare case where the accused could win without testifying.

    It is hard to overestimate the power of live testimony (compared to affidavits), especially to a judge used to presiding over trials where judging witnesses' credibility is everything.

    But I'm not saying providing live testimony would be easy for many victims, and I'm glad you reminded us of this.
    There you have it folks. I mean WTF. I know I’m an asshole but even my jaw has dropped. The “win” is way more important than the person. I can’t even. The only people needing reminding that it’s not easy for the victim is you and Yankee Duchess.

    Comment


    • Keep It Simple, thank you for sharing your experience. I’m so sorry you have first hand knowledge on the subject, but I appreciate your willingness to help educate the rest of us.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Horsegirl's Mom View Post

        Thank you for sharing this.

        To answer your question: Yes, I think it would absolutely sway my opinion--and more importantly, the arbitrator's--if the accused didn't testify. In fact, I think it would be a very rare case where the accused could win without testifying.

        It is hard to overestimate the power of live testimony (compared to affidavits), especially to a judge used to presiding over trials where judging witnesses' credibility is everything.

        But I'm not saying providing live testimony would be easy for many victims, and I'm glad you reminded us of this.
        I don't think providing live testimony is easy for any victim of any crime. And telling anyone about sexual abuse is hard. How many people want to sit in front of friends and describe their consensual sexual experiences? Would you want to sit in front of a stranger and tell them details of events that you don't ever want to remember? How about a room full of strangers? Sitting behind a computer doesn't make it any easier nor does it feel safe, you feel just as vulnerable as if you were sitting next to them.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Denali6298 View Post

          There you have it folks. I mean WTF. I know I’m an asshole but even my jaw has dropped. The “win” is way more important than the person. I can’t even. The only people needing reminding that it’s not easy for the victim is you and Yankee Duchess.

          You act like the "win" is some blue ribbon... I thought the win was getting the accused out of the sport so they could no longer assault minors, thereby creating more victims?
          EHJ | FB | #140 | watch | #insta

          Comment


          • Originally posted by MHM View Post
            Keep It Simple, thank you for sharing your experience. I’m so sorry you have first hand knowledge on the subject, but I appreciate your willingness to help educate the rest of us.
            My pleasure. I sat silent for a long time. Educating people on how the process actually works benefits everyone. Safesport can improve some things, but it a huge improvement over the NGB trying to do it.

            Comment


            • Did you guys all misread my post? The question posed was whether it would sway my opinion if the accused didn't testify. I answered the question.

              I find it hard to believe anyone would fail to draw a negative inference from the accused not showing up to testify...

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Horsegirl's Mom View Post
                Did you guys all misread my post? The question posed was whether it would sway my opinion if the accused didn't testify. I answered the question.

                I find it hard to believe anyone would fail to draw a negative inference from the accused not showing up to testify...
                It is no different than when the defendant does not testify at trial. The accused sits there, they just chose not to be questioned.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Horsegirl's Mom View Post
                  Did you guys all misread my post? The question posed was whether it would sway my opinion if the accused didn't testify. I answered the question.

                  I find it hard to believe anyone would fail to draw a negative inference from the accused not showing up to testify...
                  We respond in the context of you wanting subpoenas to force people to testify and risk being held in contempt of court.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by dags View Post


                    You act like the "win" is some blue ribbon... I thought the win was getting the accused out of the sport so they could no longer assault minors, thereby creating more victims?
                    Which has happened without needing the vicitm to testify.
                    Boss Mare Eventing Blog

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by dags View Post


                      You act like the "win" is some blue ribbon... I thought the win was getting the accused out of the sport so they could no longer assault minors, thereby creating more victims?
                      Did you not read my reply to your question? Did you not understand it? Further more, I mention “win” to a poster who routinely pushes for subpoenas. IE if the victim just can’t because it’s too hard they potentially face jail time for being in contempt of court.

                      Good god.

                      Comment


                      • Safe Sport is about helping victims despite the outcome. NOT about abusers

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Keep it Simple View Post

                          I don't think providing live testimony is easy for any victim of any crime. And telling anyone about sexual abuse is hard. How many people want to sit in front of friends and describe their consensual sexual experiences? Would you want to sit in front of a stranger and tell them details of events that you don't ever want to remember? How about a room full of strangers? Sitting behind a computer doesn't make it any easier nor does it feel safe, you feel just as vulnerable as if you were sitting next to them.
                          Thank for sharing your story.

                          Right until the last minute, I was going to have to testify at my accusers trial too. Before court started, I had to sit and re watch the video of myself at the police station giving my count of what happened to me that morning. Watching myself, huddled on a couch in a blanket, crying, hurt, scared, shocked and trying to pay attention to details I said so that my memory didn't fail me 9 months after my attack at my one chance to put this guy behind bars.

                          Luckily for me, at the last minute he pled guilty. I didn't have to testify, but even thinking about having to do that that day brings me to tears. I was willing to do it so justice could be served, but the entire court process and his arrest was 2 years of absolute hell.

                          Unless you have been a victim, you have NO idea what it is like to be in that position, and to think someones mental health is not as important as your agenda to get witnesses on the stand talking, well, you are gross to me.

                          Lawyers want witnesses on the stand so they can cut them down, destroy their credibility, and poke holes in their story. Not fooling anyone here.
                          Boss Mare Eventing Blog

                          Comment


                          • Jealoushe big hugs. I know it’s hard. Guys, this should be the focus. Not the poor trainer who acts questionabley

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Denali6298 View Post
                              Safe Sport is about helping victims despite the outcome. NOT about abusers
                              Right, but part of helping victims is ensuring that their case won’t be overturned on appeal.
                              From my perspective, that’s what HLMom and YankeeDuchess are trying to get at.
                              I really don’t think you’re on opposing sides of this issue as much as you think you are.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Jealoushe View Post



                                Luckily for me, at the last minute he pled guilty. I didn't have to testify, but even thinking about having to do that that day brings me to tears. I was willing to do it so justice could be served, but the entire court process and his arrest was 2 years of absolute hell.

                                Unless you have been a victim, you have NO idea what it is like to be in that position, and to think someones mental health is not as important as your agenda to get witnesses on the stand talking, well, you are gross to me.

                                Lawyers want witnesses on the stand so they can cut them down, destroy their credibility, and poke holes in their story. Not fooling anyone here.
                                If you thought the prosecutor's goal was to "cut [you] down, destroy [your] credibility, and poke holes in [your] story," then why were you willing to testify?

                                Comment


                                • Originally posted by Roser123 View Post

                                  Right, but part of helping victims is ensuring that their case won’t be overturned on appeal.
                                  From my perspective, that’s what HLMom and YankeeDuchess are trying to get at.
                                  I really don’t think you’re on opposing sides of this issue as much as you think you are.
                                  Sometimes it’s not just about that. The effort is what matters. The effort means more than the conviction sometimes because for a long time victims were not believed. I’ve seen this route. I know what I speak. Forcing someone is just wrong.

                                  Comment


                                  • Originally posted by Horsegirl's Mom View Post

                                    If you thought the prosecutor's goal was to "cut [you] down, destroy [your] credibility, and poke holes in [your] story," then why were you willing to testify?
                                    Um the prosecutor doesn’t do that if they take the case. Defense attorneys do. Are you really a lawyer because the more you post the more I wonder.

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by Horsegirl's Mom View Post

                                      Thank you for sharing this.

                                      To answer your question: Yes, I think it would absolutely sway my opinion--and more importantly, the arbitrator's--if the accused didn't testify. In fact, I think it would be a very rare case where the accused could win without testifying.

                                      It is hard to overestimate the power of live testimony (compared to affidavits), especially to a judge used to presiding over trials where judging witnesses' credibility is everything.

                                      But I'm not saying providing live testimony would be easy for many victims, and I'm glad you reminded us of this.
                                      I am not so sure that an in depth research into this question would show it to be true that a victims testimony always provides a positive outcome for the victims case.

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by Jealoushe View Post

                                        Thank for sharing your story.

                                        Right until the last minute, I was going to have to testify at my accusers trial too. Before court started, I had to sit and re watch the video of myself at the police station giving my count of what happened to me that morning. Watching myself, huddled on a couch in a blanket, crying, hurt, scared, shocked and trying to pay attention to details I said so that my memory didn't fail me 9 months after my attack at my one chance to put this guy behind bars.

                                        Luckily for me, at the last minute he pled guilty. I didn't have to testify, but even thinking about having to do that that day brings me to tears. I was willing to do it so justice could be served, but the entire court process and his arrest was 2 years of absolute hell.

                                        Unless you have been a victim, you have NO idea what it is like to be in that position, and to think someones mental health is not as important as your agenda to get witnesses on the stand talking, well, you are gross to me.

                                        Lawyers want witnesses on the stand so they can cut them down, destroy their credibility, and poke holes in their story. Not fooling anyone here.
                                        First, I have to say that I’m very sorry for anyone who’s been a victim of sexual assault, and I applaud your bravery in sharing your stories here and especially of being willing to testify against your abuser.
                                        Second, I was recently on the jury in a sexual assault case, and I disagree with your contention that “Lawyers want witnesses on the stand so they can cut them down, destroy their credibility, and poke holes in their story.” That was not at all my experience, and if the defense attorney had acted in such a way (in my case, anyway), it would have been to the extreme detriment of his client.

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by Roser123 View Post

                                          First, I have to say that I’m very sorry for anyone who’s been a victim of sexual assault, and I applaud your bravery in sharing your stories here and especially of being willing to testify against your abuser.
                                          Second, I was recently on the jury in a sexual assault case, and I disagree with your contention that “Lawyers want witnesses on the stand so they can cut them down, destroy their credibility, and poke holes in their story.” That was not at all my experience, and if the defense attorney had acted in such a way (in my case, anyway), it would have been to the extreme detriment of his client.
                                          Well clearly she’s lying then because it didn’t happen in the one case you witnessed. There are a million public stories like Jealoushe. Get a grip. Your one experience doesn’t wipe history.

                                          Comment

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