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Can we talk about SafeSport?

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  • Can we talk about SafeSport?

    Does anyone else feel this is getting ridiculous?

    https://www.chronofhorse.com/article...REsh8REqo7FR6I
    So now we can’t IM students on Facebook, or text them without CCing someone.
    I was on board for the earlier sanctions as I do feel that we needed something to protect children but this is going over the top.

  • #2
    This is so incredibly stupid and useless
    "Traditions are basically just peer pressure from dead people"

    Comment


    • #3
      These are inline with what I assume schoolteachers follow.

      Comment


      • #4
        I don't feel that the rules are ridiculous. Compliance really isn't that difficult.

        Comment


        • #5
          Thing is, no one really uses email that much because it is a PITA to use on a phone. And FB use has declined.

          What people do these days is text on phone numbers. Easy enough to text mom plus kid. But I bet mom gets ticked off at having to follow multiple texts about what bridle to put on Pookums for the Friday lesson, etc.

          So you will need to forewarn your parents that they will be getting this extra deluge of annoying trivia messages all day every day.

          What about actual phone calls? Those can't so easily be monitored.

          I didn't read the actual rules just the linked article, so these points may all be covered.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Scribbler View Post

            What about actual phone calls? Those can't so easily be monitored.
            I do not see phone calls mentioned.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by trubandloki View Post
              I do not see phone calls mentioned.
              Very interesting.

              Comment


              • #8
                I wonder if they are going to look for someone to make an example of to show that they are serious about these rules...

                Comment


                • #9
                  The article says that they will wait for people to report infractions, and then give the trainer a warning. It does not look like they are going to be monitoring everybody's email.

                  Interesting though that IM is now considered more "risky" than a phone conversation.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The only problem I see is for the under 18 working student. The one at our barn lives away from her family. I’m sure the trainers are wondering about this new rule. Now her mom will be getting all sorts of daily texts regarding horse care daily barn questions. “ can you tack up Dobbins now”. “ vet on his way”. “ Dobbin is getting tried tomorrow.. bath in am”.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      My question from the recent article: how is "adult" defined? I ask because does the 19 yr old still showing as a junior lose the ability to share a hotel room? Also, I couldn't help but think of the journalist that was groomed by the track coach with the help of her riding instructor (I can't remember her name of the name of the film about her experiences). So two adults in collusion with each other...and yet still able to follow the Safe Sport Mandates.

                      Some of this feels WAY too broad. Some seems like common sense.


                      As a non-member at the moment, I guess it doesn't apply to me anyways (which is a whole 'nother ball of wax that no one is addressing - how do we protect kids that are in non-USEF programs?)
                      Keith: "Now...let's do something normal fathers and daughters do."
                      Veronica: "Buy me a pony?"

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Mostly my kids trainer does all contact thru me, so I don’t see much of a hassle with the change. School teachers have been following these same rules for years now.. & I don’t think they gave it a second thought. Just part of the job.
                        No one likes change, so I think that’s what most of the fuss is about. Same as years ago when Jrs had to start wearing helmets with chin straps. Everyone was complaining about that.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          If you want your non USEF discipline or breed show to follow these codes then you probably have to take the initiative to get your organization to adopt these standards.

                          For folks outside of any discipline specific body, well there is no protection. Someone working in horses in a recreational or ranch or farm capacity is just regular folks, and hopefully if an adult in that situation is inappropriate with a child, you can just go to the police like you would with any local creepster.

                          The Safesport rules are trying to address the fact kids in competition are in hothouse environments where dependency on coaches makes it even harder to take action against predatory adults.

                          For kids outside of that pressure cooker, you still need to give them street smart skills and monitor their relationships with adults, both in and out of the family.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            As an educator, we receive yearly reminders from our district, state and administration about the use of social media with children. We are told to NEVER use SM with students or minors. No teacher FB page, no group texts, no snapchat or instagram, nothing.

                            Our barn, with a huge kids program, uses the parents email/texts to inform the kids. There is a barn FB page, that is used for announcements or pictures about the program in general, but no direct instructor to minor students.

                            Honestly, using SM with minors is an open invitation for abuse. Both ways. As a teacher, I am terribly vulnerable to accusations of abuse/contact/etc from students if I use SM with them. I will use my school email to email students--that's public record-- only about assignments. As a trainer/instructor, I'd for sure protect myself by not friending any child under 18 on FB/SM. Even a young adult would be iffy. All it takes is a whiff of suspicion and your reputation or job may be on the line.
                            Proud member of the "Don't rush to kill wildlife" clique!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I don't friend, phone, or text message my college students.

                              I do discuss assignments and problems like missed classes from my campus email.system, and I keep those messages for several years. Anything contentious, i cc the department head.

                              I keep the office door open when we meet.

                              My students are from 18 to mid 20s with some returning adults. But even so, the rules about bring the adult in power hold. Plus really really I do not want them ever texting me at midnight in a panic.

                              The situation of the working student is interesting. Perhaps trainer could have a shared system of some kind where the messages are viewable by other adults connected to the barn.

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #16
                                I just think these rules are way too broad and going to end up hurting a lot of people, mainly the kids. There are already teens posting on Facebook about how difficult this will make their lives and may end up making it so they can’t ride.
                                Many kids depend on a trainer in their lives. I have seen countless kids who’s parents couldn’t give a **** about them, and the trainer steps in to make things happen. For many kids, that trainer may be more a parent to them then their own parents.
                                Case in point; a lovely girl I know who has worked her butt off since she was a young teen to ride. She worked an after school job and catch ride horses to get in ride time. She mucked stalls to earn lessons. Before she was 16, her trainer drove her to the barn. She worked hard, every day, to ride and show. Her parents didn’t care what she did.
                                When she graduated from high school, we went to her graduation as a barn to cheer her on. Her parents couldn’t bother to show up. With these rules in place, who will support her and other kids like her? I know she isn’t a one off.

                                Also, what about the 21 YO assistant trainer who is friends with the 17 YO students?
                                I get that it would be really creepy and a possible abuse situation to have a 15 YO student in a hotel room with a 55 YO trainer. But do we really need SafeSport to tell us this? Has it come to the point where we need to punish everyone, including the kids, because of this? Can we not just use common sense, do the training, have a good report system in place, and reassess in a few years?

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by TooManyBays View Post
                                  Many kids depend on a trainer in their lives. I have seen countless kids who’s parents couldn’t give a **** about them, and the trainer steps in to make things happen. For many kids, that trainer may be more a parent to them then their own parents.


                                  I get that it would be really creepy and a possible abuse situation to have a 15 YO student in a hotel room with a 55 YO trainer. But do we really need SafeSport to tell us this? Has it come to the point where we need to punish everyone, including the kids, because of this? Can we not just use common sense, do the training, have a good report system in place, and reassess in a few years?
                                  That first kid is exactly the kind of young person vulnerable to predators. We do need SS to tell us this. How is it a punishment to include another adult in the communication loop?
                                  A helmet saved my life.

                                  2017 goal: learn to ride like TheHorseProblem, er, a barn rat!

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by AllOverFarm View Post
                                    The only problem I see is for the under 18 working student. The one at our barn lives away from her family. I’m sure the trainers are wondering about this new rule. Now her mom will be getting all sorts of daily texts regarding horse care daily barn questions. “ can you tack up Dobbins now”. “ vet on his way”. “ Dobbin is getting tried tomorrow.. bath in am”.
                                    The parent is preferred but It can be any other adult. So the trainer and the assistant trainer can be the group.
                                    *****
                                    You will not rise to the occasion, you will default to your level of training.

                                    Comment

                                    • Original Poster

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Bristol Bay View Post

                                      That first kid is exactly the kind of young person vulnerable to predators. We do need SS to tell us this. How is it a punishment to include another adult in the communication loop?
                                      Maybe I am just way off base here. I just feel that limiting friendships between trainers and students on the chance that it may be unhealthy is sad. I felt the previous regulations were enough for now.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by TooManyBays View Post
                                        Also, what about the 21 YO assistant trainer who is friends with the 17 YO students?
                                        I get that it would be really creepy and a possible abuse situation to have a 15 YO student in a hotel room with a 55 YO trainer. But do we really need SafeSport to tell us this? Has it come to the point where we need to punish everyone, including the kids, because of this? Can we not just use common sense, do the training, have a good report system in place, and reassess in a few years?
                                        The 21-17 age gap could just as easily be a recipe for trouble. In my non-horse life, when I was sexually assaulted, it was by someone I trusted who was just a few years older. So if we're able to make it more difficult for people to get into dangerous situations, why wouldn't we?

                                        As others have said, these rules are status quo for people who work with youth in other fields. I am a staff member at a university and we have strict rules about codes of conduct when anyone interacts with a student — and there are still problems in higher education, as I'm sure you all know.

                                        I'd rather err on the side of caution than set up a situation where a young person winds up becoming a victim because it's too much of a hassle to follow these guidelines.

                                        Comment

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