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#metoo and Jimmy Williams

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    #21
    Originally posted by fordtraktor View Post

    There was an extensive thread on it in the Eventing forum and COTH mods repeatedly deleted the name from posts. Quite a few posters named the accused, all deleted. The accused sounds litigious so I don't really blame them but it is disappointing to have that "policy" then discarded when the accused is deceased.
    COTH may answer for themselves, but in that case it wasn't their article and thus they weren't a party to the reporting. The article also didn't mention the name. It was just that posters on the forum put together enough pieces to add the new information of the name. Agree with the choice or not, I don't think it was about the accused being deceased per se.
    If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket

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      Original Poster

      #22
      Originally posted by poltroon View Post

      COTH may answer for themselves, but in that case it wasn't their article and thus they weren't a party to the reporting. The article also didn't mention the name. It was just that posters on the forum put together enough pieces to add the new information of the name. Agree with the choice or not, I don't think it was about the accused being deceased per se.
      i agree with you to a point by they could have done some journalism and decided then. Not obvious they did anything. This is a BIG DEAL given the person involved.

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        #23
        It's very sad to see some of the comments on the COTH Facebook page in relation to this article. Attacking the victims. And people wonder why women and girls still don't come forward with their stories of abuse.
        "Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can?" Sun Tzu
        Semantics

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          #24
          Originally posted by Laurierace View Post
          I think most of us can relate to the lengths we would go to have horses in our lives. I am glad we seem to have finally come to the point where this sort of thing will not be tolerate. Thank you COTH for taking a stand by printing this article. One of the best pieces I have ever seen you publish.
          Agreed. When I see things like this it always makes me think of the hard working kid who doesn't come from money but is promised the opportunity to ride and show nice horses..let's hope the awareness helps stop these situations more often. Kudos to everyone for speaking out.

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            #25
            That was a very well written and researched piece. Kudos to COTH for digging in and doing the work to get that published.
            ~Veronica
            "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
            http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/

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              #26
              I thought the article was very well written, and the women who spoke up were very courageous.

              Comment


                #27
                I don't know why I read the comments section on Facebook. Those lucky enough to have not experienced it telling others they just need to suck it up.
                Only two emotions belong in the saddle: One is a sense of humor. The other is patience.

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                  #28
                  I had an initial reaction of sadness (he really was an amazing trainer), anger, and concern about naming him after his death. After reading the article, I think COTH gave him as fair a chance to defend himself as they could, with comments from Susie, and the story from Alan Balch...neither of which painted him as innocent....in fact, they added fuel to the fire in my opinion.

                  Originally posted by vineyridge View Post
                  The response from the adults who knew of his proclivities was to chaperone whenever possible and to caution girls not to be alone with him. He continued to be a "respected" trainer in the local horse world; that is to say that he was not shunned or ousted from positions of prominence.
                  I feel like that was always the answer, because past a certain age, girls became sexual objects. There was a different definition for 'pedophile' and inappropriate conduct. We all knew who to stay away from in the 80s.

                  I'm pretty disturbed by the FB comments on the article. Holy crap are there some women with blinders on....
                  Keith: "Now...let's do something normal fathers and daughters do."
                  Veronica: "Buy me a pony?"

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                    #29
                    Well-written, well-researched, and heartbreaking to read. Bravo to those women for the courage to speak up.
                    A Year In the Saddle

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                      #30
                      A trainer I used to work for was one of his former students. This is so sad for all the victims. I don't know if she was one, as I have been out of contact with her for many years now

                      Comment


                        #31
                        Originally posted by vineyridge View Post
                        I'd be interested in knowing just how many young riders from the 1960s and 1970s did not, at some point, have similar experiences with older horsemen. In my teenaged years, there was a local man who seemed to have been known for inappropriate behavior with young, female riders. The response from the adults who knew of his proclivities was to chaperone whenever possible and to caution girls not to be alone with him. He continued to be a "respected" trainer in the local horse world; that is to say that he was not shunned or ousted from positions of prominence.

                        There was also a local gay trainer with the same reputation for inappropriate behavior with young riders who was treated the same way by the local riding community. IIRC, he had a lot of young, female riders to train and coach because he was considered "safe".
                        It was not just in that era. I was a teenager in the early 00's and was preyed upon and molested by my trainer's SO. I was 13 and he was in his 60's.
                        Fils Du Reverdy (Revy)- 1993 Selle Francais Gelding
                        My equine soulmate
                        Mischief Managed (Tully)- JC Priceless Jewel 2002 TB Gelding

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                          #32
                          Originally posted by dani0303 View Post

                          It was not just in that era. I was a teenager in the early 00's and was preyed upon and molested by my trainer's SO. I was 13 and he was in his 60's.
                          I'm so sorry that happened to you.

                          It's an unfortunate fact that this kind of behavior has gone on for so long around horses, and elsewhere. Probably just about everyone has either experienced it, or known someone who experienced it.

                          I hope we can do better going forward, now that it's being taken more seriously.

                          Comment


                            #33
                            The fear that others would defend my now deceased attacker kept me silent. I approached COTH about a story after me too blew up. He is dead. ................ attacked me in a feed stall at the Branchville Horse Show eons ago. I heard about others over the years. I knew some younger ( much) girls who he groomed. We all never said a thing. Right now I am staring at post reply thinking, I'm not in the business anymore..... Should I? CAN I ? Posting this without a name. GUTLESS woman.....I will do this. It hasn't stopped. The shows are a Petrie dish. Barney Ward. I am Sarah Hochschwender.
                            Last edited by fair judy; Apr. 5, 2018, 08:13 AM.

                            Comment


                              #34
                              I was really impressed with this article, it was clearly very well researched and the author strove to be as impartial as possible.

                              It's really disheartening to see that this abuse happens time and time again, and also to see the sorts of comments that are being posted on facebook. Being a good trainer (or producer, or chef, or politician, or anything really) doesn't automatically make you a good person. My only hope is that the increased publicity and awareness of harassment, assault, and abuse give those being abused the strength they need to speak up. Long term I sincerely hope that this sort of thing becomes less common, but I don't know that it will ever go away.

                              Comment


                                #35
                                Originally posted by RugBug View Post
                                ....past a certain age, girls became sexual objects.

                                Comment


                                  #36
                                  Originally posted by JenEM View Post
                                  Well-written, well-researched, and heartbreaking to read. Bravo to those women for the courage to speak up.
                                  Agreed... Reading this and all accounts provided is just gutwrenching.

                                  ..and for those reading, who have not spoken up - I'm with you.

                                  #metoo
                                  "i'm a slow learner, it's true."

                                  Comment


                                    #37
                                    I think the article was delivered judiciously, but frank. I'm so glad that it was well received and has opened a conversation regarding sexual abuse, rather than an argument.

                                    Kudos to COTH for taking the time to develop their platform.

                                    Ever sorry for those who have endured ANY sort of abuse.

                                    Comment


                                      #38
                                      In case anyone still wondered why victims stayed silent for so long...

                                      If I understand the article correctly, circa 2016 the USEF discovered CREDIBLE allegations of MULTIPLE occurrences of sexual assault by JW. Instead of publicly denouncing him or even publicly admitting that this was the reason why, they quietly removed his name from one of their awards. When asked why, they STILL did not credit the allegations or disclose that this was the reason. They instead continued sweeping it under the rug.

                                      This was not 1950 or 1980... this was TWO YEARS AGO. TWO YEARS AGO the response to credible allegations of this type was to quietly disassociate without giving so much as lipservice to the victims.

                                      And that's why victims remain silent. They think they won't be believed or taken seriously. Why would they? After decades of reporting... the USEF just blacked out his name and continued on as though that was a sufficient response.
                                      ~Veronica
                                      "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
                                      http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/

                                      Comment


                                        #39
                                        Originally posted by fair judy View Post
                                        The fear that others would defend my now deceased attacker kept me silent. I approached COTH about a story after me too blew up. He is dead. ................ attacked me in a feed stall at the Branchville Horse Show eons ago. I heard about others over the years. I knew some younger ( much) girls who he groomed. We all never said a thing. Right now I am staring at post reply thinking, I'm not in the business anymore..... Should I? CAN I ? Posting this without a name. GUTLESS woman.....I will do this. It hasn't stopped. The shows are a Petrie dish. Barney Ward. I am Sarah Hochschwender.
                                        Hugs to you. You are brave.
                                        Jennifer Baas
                                        It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. (Aristotle)

                                        Comment


                                          #40
                                          Originally posted by RugBug View Post
                                          I'm pretty disturbed by the FB comments on the article. Holy crap are there some women with blinders on....
                                          It really irks me when the defending comments come up. It upsets me to the core.

                                          Consider yourself lucky if you have never been through it. I do not understand how women can judge other women (who were kids at the time) in such a way.
                                          Last edited by Jealoushe; Apr. 5, 2018, 01:05 PM. Reason: upset too many people

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